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Will Apple fix Canadian prices!?

jonnylink said:
I mean, people had a hissyfit when Apple lowered the price of the iPhone, what would happen when people find out that the exact same computer they bought yesterday just got cheaper? Would Apple be expected to constantly send out credits?
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I think you are wrong there. The real fact is that this time it's currency fluctuation and not Apple's authority on prices. Which means that we should be paying the value of the good the price it is. So yes, in the best world, they should be aware of that fluctuation.
 
flopticalcube said:
I have no problem with Apple's policy, I was replying to IJ Reilly who says Apple just charges the "market" rate. I think Apple Canada's policy of upgrading their prices at product updates is reasonable although some of there prices really need to be adjusted. Many manufacturers have been caught out by the speed of the fall in the US dollar.
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Fair enough. I agree that Apple should look at adjusting their prices. If the people on the phones just had a meeting about this Apple must be aware of the issue and how folks feel. We'll just have to wait and see how it works out.
 
LeKiD said:
I think you are wrong there. The real fact is that this time it's currency fluctuation and not Apple's authority on prices. Which means that we should be paying the value of the good the price it is. So yes, in the best world, they should be aware of that fluctuation.
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I'm sorry, but I really can't tell what you are saying. I usually hate it when people break down a quote sentence by sentence, but that is the only way I can make any sense of your response.

The real fact is that this time it's currency fluctuation and not Apple's authority on prices.
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It seems like you think that Apple's rest of world prices are created by a simple formula like: convert USD to Currency X. When the reality is certainly more complex. So, the rest of world prices, just like the US prices are set by "Apple's authority."

Which means that we should be paying the value of the good the price it is.
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In a free market, the market dictates value. If a company imagines a value that doesn't exist the product will not sell. If people are buying Apple's products at their current prices then the value of those products must be close to what Apple believes.

So yes, in the best world, they should be aware of that fluctuation.
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I am sure Apple has a few smart folks that are aware of fluctuations in currencies, however you seem to have avoided the main question. Demonstrate a practical way for *any* company to compensate for currency fluctuations in another way. Should Apple change the prices of their computers in every country every week? How about every day or every hour? Of course given the new overhead for such a policy (you're gonna need folks working full time on this to get it right) the cost of their products will have to go up in order to maintain a healthy profit margin.

I guess what I am saying in a nut shell is that (if I understand you correctly) you seem to be over-simplifying a complex issue.
 
In general, Apple is slow in updating prices at all of its stores. Why does a Mac Pro cost the same amount now as it did more than a year ago, with no improvement in specs? This situation is considerably exacerbated, however, by the relative change in value of the Canadian and U.S. currencies. Being a company that sells technology, Apple should update its prices at least every 6 months, if not every 3 months. This would also reduce complaints like "I just bought an iMac 1 month ago, and now the new iMac is faster with more RAM and a larger HD for $400 less, Apple owes me a refund!!!"
 
I don't think it's simplifying when our dollar used to be worth 0.70$ US and that it is now worth more than the US$... It did not happen overnight. The matter is that those prices were mainly higher because the CAN$ was worth less... So obviously now... we are over paying!
 
LeKiD said:
I don't think it's simplifying when our dollar used to be worth 0.70$ US and that it is now worth more than the US$... It did not happen overnight. The matter is that those prices were mainly higher because the CAN$ was worth less... So obviously now... we are over paying!
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No, you're not, because you're not paying any more than you were before. This is what I mean when I say that prices are set in the market where the product sells, not where it is made. For example if you buy a product made in China, you are not paying the same as if you bought the product in China. You're probably paying a lot more, and not just because it has to be transported from China. You are paying the market price for that product in the market where you're buying it.

If you think Apple is somehow alone in this, guess again. As we speak, a class action suit has been filed in Canada against GM, charging that GM overprices their products in the Canadian market. The suit is expected to be extended to other car manufacturers. But the fact is, the car makers are selling cars in Canada at the market price for cars in Canada. If they were selling them for above market price, they'd lose market share. If the Loonie remains high, then the car makers might be forced to lower prices. This is called disinflation. It might happen, but not right away, and it probably would not been seen by your government as a good thing.
 
IJ Reilly said:
This is called disinflation. It might happen, but not right away, and it probably would not been seen by your government as a good thing.
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Or deflation;):) However, it would be a somewhat troublesome sign if many products in the market begin to go down; it's usually a sign of recession, or that even more dreaded word: depression.
 
Duff-Man said:
Duff-Man says...they do check and adjust prices, usually when the product is refreshed by sometimes it just happens too - for instance the new iLife and iWork are the same price here as in the USA....oh yeah!
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As is Logic Studio

pain in the gladdin!!!!
 
IJ Reilly said:
If you think Apple is somehow alone in this, guess again. As we speak, a class action suit has been filed in Canada against GM, charging that GM overprices their products in the Canadian market. The suit is expected to be extended to other car manufacturers. But the fact is, the car makers are selling cars in Canada at the market price for cars in Canada. If they were selling them for above market price, they'd lose market share.
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You missed the part of the lawsuit alleging that the auto manufacturers and Canadian dealers have been conspiring to fix Canadian prices at higher than US equivalents for years. If true, this suggests that they were selling them above market price, but losing market share was never a problem because Canadian didn't have the option of going south of the border for better prices (because a high exchange rate and taxes/duty negated the savings). Now that the exchange rate works in our favour, suddenly US auto dealers near the Canadian border have been forbidden by their parent companies to sell to Canadians who have crossed the border looking to find a deal. Oh, and they're also saying that warranties on vehicles bought in the US will not be honoured in Canada. Thus far, GM, Honda, Nissan, and Chrysler have been named in suit.
 
IJ Reilly said:
No, you're not, because you're not paying any more than you were before(...) prices are set in the market where the product sells, not where it is made. For example if you buy a product made in China, you are not paying the same as if you bought the product in China.
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That was sweet and easy in the past... today, most of the consumers are not fools... they know about prices and thanks to the web. Now... if you buy something in China, the economy is pretty different plus the transportation makes it difficult to evaluate your exemple. The matter is that Canada is the close neighbour and it's easier to evaluate the cost. Someone said earlier that because he was in Canada he had to pay handling and transport fees but that if he lived in Hawaii... there was no charge. Well, we are very close, they charge more because they have to! I guess they know what's coming:

"Ed Sutherland - AHN Editor
Washington, DC (AHN) - Apple CEO Steve Jobs has been been subpoened by the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) as part of the government's case against a former Apple legal chief, a report said.

Jobs will be asked about Nancy Heinen, an ex-Apple general counsel who left in 2006. The government alleges Heinen conceiled her efforts to alter a stock-option grant of Jobs, as well as her own option grants, according to the Wall Street Journal.

The deposition likely won't happen until November, according to the newspaper.

On Aug. 16, the SEC issued three subpoenas regarding the case, including Heinen and Jobs. While the SEC would like to limit to 12 the number of witnesses, Heinen's attorneys are requesting 45 witnesses, including a number of Apple executives."
 
I know it doesn't but there's no good explaination besides Apple's greater profit on Canadians...
 
In a falling dollar, importers benefit and exporters suffer. In a rising dollar, importers suffer, and importers benefit. After all, pricing isn't dependant on exchange rates. It's dependant on the market.

If anything, you have a great advantage. Find a friend who lives in New Hampshire, wire him money, and have him purchase an expensive piece of hardware to ship to you. Tax-free and you get to enjoy your buying power leverage.

Or, just take a vacation to the East Coast to do it. With the exchange rate in your favor, it's a good time for foreigners to travel to America. (I'm just a little bitter, since I'm an American planning to take a vacation to Canada, and this exchange rate is going to bite.)
 
ZoomZoomZoom said:
In a falling dollar, importers benefit and exporters suffer. In a rising dollar, importers suffer, and importers benefit. After all, pricing isn't dependant on exchange rates. It's dependant on the market.
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You might want to rewrite that bit. ;)

If anything, you have a great advantage. Find a friend who lives in New Hampshire, wire him money, and have him purchase an expensive piece of hardware to ship to you. Tax-free and you get to enjoy your buying power leverage.

Or, just take a vacation to the East Coast to do it. With the exchange rate in your favor, it's a good time for foreigners to travel to America. (I'm just a little bitter, since I'm an American planning to take a vacation to Canada, and this exchange rate is going to bite.)
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Until you or it hits the border and get dinged for the taxes and/or brokers' fees.
 
scienide09 said:
You missed the part of the lawsuit alleging that the auto manufacturers and Canadian dealers have been conspiring to fix Canadian prices at higher than US equivalents for years. If true, this suggests that they were selling them above market price, but losing market share was never a problem because Canadian didn't have the option of going south of the border for better prices (because a high exchange rate and taxes/duty negated the savings). Now that the exchange rate works in our favour, suddenly US auto dealers near the Canadian border have been forbidden by their parent companies to sell to Canadians who have crossed the border looking to find a deal. Oh, and they're also saying that warranties on vehicles bought in the US will not be honoured in Canada. Thus far, GM, Honda, Nissan, and Chrysler have been named in suit.
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I didn't miss it. I think that charge has little merit, unless they can prove that the auto companies conspired with each other to fix prices, a charge which as nearly as I can tell, isn't even on the table. It would be suicidal for one manufacturer in a competitive market to attempt to keep prices artificially high.
 
scienide09 said:
You missed the part of the lawsuit alleging that the auto manufacturers and Canadian dealers have been conspiring to fix Canadian prices at higher than US equivalents for years. If true, this suggests that they were selling them above market price, but losing market share was never a problem because Canadian didn't have the option of going south of the border for better prices (because a high exchange rate and taxes/duty negated the savings). Now that the exchange rate works in our favour, suddenly US auto dealers near the Canadian border have been forbidden by their parent companies to sell to Canadians who have crossed the border looking to find a deal. Oh, and they're also saying that warranties on vehicles bought in the US will not be honoured in Canada. Thus far, GM, Honda, Nissan, and Chrysler have been named in suit.
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Forgive me, but I think there are other things at play when a warranty is involved. Every country has different warranty standards, and while making Canadians buy from Canadian dealships is probably a factor, I doubt it is the ONLY factor; most likely, it is one of many contributing factors.

As for price fixing, that's usually hard to do for car companies simply because cars are so varried. One can have leather seats, while another may have great gas mileage, etc. It's hard to compare cars as "equals" because of their unique features. Unless one could prove that two or more car companies were pricing very similar cars in very similar ways (which I doubt is the case with the car companies selling in Canada, I think, from what you said, the problem was that the US companies were not properly taking the value of the USD into account), it would be hard to prove price fixing.

IJ Reilly said:
I didn't miss it. I think that charge has little merit, unless they can prove that the auto companies conspired with each other to fix prices, a charge which as nearly as I can tell, isn't even on the table. It would be suicidal for one manufacturer in a competitive market to attempt to keep prices artificially high.
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Very true. Which makes me ask, when did we get on this topic? Weren't we talking about Apple's pricing in Canada?
 
The Ipod prices have dropped to reflect the canadian dollar. A 249 USD Ipod used to cost 299 CDN, now it costs 279CDN.

I realize that it still doesn't reflect a par currency, but you must realize that taxes here in Canada make it much more expensive to conduct business than it does in the states, thus charging a higher price can offset high business taxes.
 
I think Apple just did a price update on most of it's goods... Way to go!
 
CalBoy said:
As for price fixing, that's usually hard to do for car companies simply because cars are so varried. One can have leather seats, while another may have great gas mileage, etc. It's hard to compare cars as "equals" because of their unique features. Unless one could prove that two or more car companies were pricing very similar cars in very similar ways (which I doubt is the case with the car companies selling in Canada, I think, from what you said, the problem was that the US companies were not properly taking the value of the USD into account), it would be hard to prove price fixing.
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I believe the actual problem was that despite the stronger Canadian dollar, for the last while the prices for the same make/model were very different on opposite sides of the border. This difference was too great to be explained just by higher taxes and the like, so there was no visible, concrete reason as to why Canadians were paying thousands of dollars more for the the exact same car. The suggestion was that the companies named in the suit all engaged in this practise in one form or another.

And remember, I did say this was alleged in the lawsuit and that some people believe this is what's going on. I never claimed that these things were in fact happening. I only presented this stuff to balance the barebones information posted by IJ Reilly about the lawsuit.

LeKiD said:
I think Apple just did a price update on most of it's goods... Way to go!
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Yep. The difference is $200 on the base MBP and $100 on the base iMac. Looks like the refurb store refects similar changes.
 
scienide09 said:
I believe the actual problem was that despite the stronger Canadian dollar, for the last while the prices for the same make/model were very different on opposite sides of the border. This difference was too great to be explained just by higher taxes and the like, so there was no visible, concrete reason as to why Canadians were paying thousands of dollars more for the the exact same car. The suggestion was that the companies named in the suit all engaged in this practise in one form or another.

And remember, I did say this was alleged in the lawsuit and that some people believe this is what's going on. I never claimed that these things were in fact happening. I only presented this stuff to balance the barebones information posted by IJ Reilly about the lawsuit.
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The "very different" prices are the result of the plunging US dollar, which is a recent event. The long-term value of the Canadian dollar, and prices of goods in those dollars, are the result of higher rates of inflation in Canada relative to the US over the course of several decades. It's highly unrealistic to expect these differences to be wiped out in a couple of months simply as a result of a change in exchange rates.

If the Canadian dollar does remain relatively high for an extended period, and the prices of imported goods begin dropping significantly, expect to hear concerns expressed about deflation, which is worrisome, because deflation would cause substantial hardships for Canadian manufacturing. In response, expect to see drops in interest rates and concerted efforts to stem the tide of a rising Canadian dollar. This happened in the US only a few years ago, so we know.

I cited the situation in the auto industry as an example of prices of goods being responsive to the markets where products are sold, not to costs of manufacturing or exchange rates on any given day.
 
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