Will you buy MBP in 2018 or wait for intel to deliver ice lake on time? (Was intel punctual lately?)

[afir93]

Is the 2018 out already? Has the keyboard issue been fixed on the 2018? I'm ready to buy if this is the case.

Not out yet, but many people (including me) are expecting an announcement at WWDC next month. I'm in a similar boat as you – the giant (compared to previous generations) performance leap from Coffeelake and the hopefully addressed keyboard issues, together with hopefully a price adjustment here in the EU, would make the wait very much worth it.

 

[leman]

Is the 2018 out already? Has the keyboard issue been fixed on the 2018? I'm ready to buy if this is the case.

How would you know if the keyboard has been fixed? You'd need to collect statistics on hardware failures for a while to be sure. Extrapolating from data we have I guess that around 2-4% of 2016/2017 laptops suffer from the keyboard problem in the first year, for earlier models it is around 1-2%...
[doublepost=1526048340][/doublepost]

. I'm in a similar boat as you – the giant (compared to previous generations) performance leap from Coffeelake

The performance leap is not as impressive as some might think and many users won't notice it. Its just Kaby lake with two cores slapped on top of it. If your workflow can utilise multiple cores — great, you'd see somewhere between 20-40% improvement. But single-core performance is the same from what we've seen so far.

 

[jerryk]

How would you know if the keyboard has been fixed? You'd need to collect statistics on hardware failures for a while to be sure. Extrapolating from data we have I guess that around 2-4% of 2016/2017 laptops suffer from the keyboard problem in the first year, for earlier models it is around 1-2%...

Exactly. That is why I will not be a day one buyer of the 2018. I will wait a few months, hang out in the forums and see what issues pop up, and if the keyboard breaks. If I do jump in I will buy AC+.

 

[ls1dreams]

I really want to get rid of my ancient MBP, but there are a few reasons I'm hesitant to jump on the 2018:

1. Want to make sure the keyboard is fixed
2. Apparently spectre/meltdown fixes won't be completely in hardware yet
3. AV1 hardware decoding won't be ready until probably 2019 or 2020

Hmmmmmm
[doublepost=1526048702][/doublepost]

How would you know if the keyboard has been fixed? You'd need to collect statistics on hardware failures for a while to be sure. Extrapolating from data we have I guess that around 2-4% of 2016/2017 laptops suffer from the keyboard problem in the first year, for earlier models it is around 1-2%...
[doublepost=1526048340][/doublepost]

The performance leap is not as impressive as some might think and many users won't notice it. Its just Kaby lake with two cores slapped on top of it. If your workflow can utilise multiple cores — great, you'd see somewhere between 20-40% improvement. But single-core performance is the same from what we've seen so far.

The leap is pretty huge on a 13" MBP that will double the cores, especially for these like running xcode.

 

[afir93]

How would you know if the keyboard has been fixed? You'd need to collect statistics on hardware failures for a while to be sure. Extrapolating from data we have I guess that around 2-4% of 2016/2017 laptops suffer from the keyboard problem in the first year, for earlier models it is around 1-2%...
[doublepost=1526048340][/doublepost]

The performance leap is not as impressive as some might think and many users won't notice it. Its just Kaby lake with two cores slapped on top of it. If your workflow can utilise multiple cores — great, you'd see somewhere between 20-40% improvement. But single-core performance is the same from what we've seen so far.

Hence my "compared to previous generations"-qualifier

I'm aware that ~40% in multicore performance might not be that impressive compared to the yearly CPU advancements in for example iPhones or iPads where we have gotten these numbers for a couple years now. But some of Intel's previous generations only had a speed improvement that was closer to 5%, so having a performance increase of 40% or even more is 800% as much of an improvement. So in comparison to previous generations, that's a pretty big leap.

Also regarding your other question that was directed at the other person you're responding to: I'm pretty sure that we'll get some hints of whether or not Apple has done something about the keyboards in the 2018 models a few weeks after release.

If it's a "bigger" advancement, then Apple themselves might advertise it (as in, call it a butterfly keyboard v3 and advertise how it's better or less failure-prone, without admitting that the old keyboards weren't so reliable of course). Then there's stuff like the iFixit reports which will show us if and how much has changed about the keyboard from a technical perspective, and then of course there will be the reports of reviewers/testers/users of their experiences. If we don't get any "my MBP 2018 keyboard failed, what can I do?"-kind of threads in the weeks and months following release, then I'd say that's a pretty good sign that Apple has finally fixed the issue.

 

[KensaiMage]

Is the 2018 out already? Has the keyboard issue been fixed on the 2018? I'm ready to buy if this is the case.

Wait till this year's wwdc.

 

[maflynn]

1. Want to make sure the keyboard is fixed
2. Apparently spectre/meltdown fixes won't be completely in hardware yet
3. AV1 hardware decoding won't be ready until probably 2019 or 2020

For points 2 and 3, I think we're still a number of years off.

 

[ls1dreams]

For points 2 and 3, I think we're still a number of years off.

Ya, I think realistically we'll see the spectre fixes in 2019 and av1 decoding in 2020. Who knows though - av1 team got specs in the hands of hardware guys very early this time, so maybe we'll luck out.

I kinda hate the idea of buying a macbook this year though and then having av1 decode come out just a year later. I keep my laptops for a LONG time. (current one is 2011).

 

[Mackinjosh]

Well let's say they fix it and another problem appears, what then? There are no perfect things in this world.

That depends, the issue I described is actually real. The one you're talking about is fictional. Is this fictional problem going to be as bad as a speck of dusting rendering my computer useless?

 

[kcrossley]

As for me, I will not wait any longer, how about you?

Regrettably, I'm too emersed in the Apple ecosystem to switch. And, as pissed off as I am, Apple is still the best computer in the world, in my humble opinion. The simple fact is, most Apple fans have short memories and Apple knows that. If they impress us in a few months with some really cool cutting-edge technology, all of this will be forgotten.

 

[Cardino]

How would you know if the keyboard has been fixed? You'd need to collect statistics on hardware failures for a while to be sure. Extrapolating from data we have I guess that around 2-4% of 2016/2017 laptops suffer from the keyboard problem in the first year, for earlier models it is around 1-2%...
[doublepost=1526048340][/doublepost]

The performance leap is not as impressive as some might think and many users won't notice it. Its just Kaby lake with two cores slapped on top of it. If your workflow can utilise multiple cores — great, you'd see somewhere between 20-40% improvement. But single-core performance is the same from what we've seen so far.

I think the single-core performance also has a jump. The turbo frequency of 8559u is 4.5G, which equal to i7-7700k.

 

[smirking]

U guys know u can get thin silicone covers for the keyboard right? Maybe that’ll get rid of most issues like noise and bread crumbs......

You wouldn't be able to close the lid if you did that. There is zero space between the keys and the screen. Instead of a keyboard cover, you could just tote around a Bluetooth keyboard if you were that concerned about it. I actually did do that for a while because I couldn't get used to the feel of the keyboard at first. I simply used a different keyboard because I liked it better. Eventually, I got used to the butterfly keys. I like the feel now and am quite comfortable on it. It's not my favorite keyboard, but it gets generally good marks from me (reliability issues aside).

 

[maflynn]

Regrettably, I'm too emersed in the Apple ecosystem to switch

It can be done, but I think you need to enter into a new platform with your eyes open knowing things will be different. Aside from the keyboard issue, the MBP is an excellent machine, though I really don't like a lot of the changes that apple instituted on the 2016, like removing the glowing apple logo, but for precise machining and looks, the MBP is excellent.

 

[awesomedeluxe]

I waited what felt like forever for the mid-2012 retina pro. I knew Apple would eventually ditch the CD drive to put a discrete GPU in a slimmer design, and they ultimately did that and more. It's been a great machine.

I am trying to wait for the next redesign, which I hope will come when Intel's 10nm parts arrive. It sucks, but that will probably be 1H 2020. The current run of machines has been awful. I doubt anything will improve in terms of I/O, but at least Apple might fix their keyboards and battery.

I definitely expected 10nm to come sooner, and was thinking I could live with a machine using Apple's current design. Kind of glad I didn't end up with one of the current models though. If I were buying a machine today, a Dell or Lenovo would be a much better choice!