I never said. " Why can't British people make good phones". I said that British people shouldn't complain that a phone designed and engineered by an American company doesn't work as well in Britian as it does in America, especially when no British companies make a viable alternative. American companies do make good cars, and lots and lots of people buy them - in other countries too. True, we have nothing that matches a Ferrari, and so we're happy to purchase products like that from the global economy, even when we have to pay a bit extra to make them legal to drive here, because they were designed with the roads and laws of Eurpoe in mind first. That's my only point. Ferraris were made with European roads and smog laws in mind first. To be driven in California requires extra expense that take time to accommodate. Sometimes those products won't work at all in America for a time. We understand that. We wait. We pay extra, or whatever is needed. My objection is to the attitude which seems to me to be entitled and irresponsible. Ok, all done.
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Wow. Apple Maps is a disaster.
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I never said. " Why can't British people make good phones". I said that British people shouldn't complain that a phone designed and engineered by an American company doesn't work as well in Britian as it does in America, especially when no British companies make a viable alternative. American companies do make good cars, and lots and lots of people buy them - in other countries too. True, we have nothing that matches a Ferrari, and so we're happy to purchase products like that from the global economy, even when we have to pay a bit extra to make them legal to drive here, because they were designed with the roads and laws of Eurpoe in mind first. That's my only point. Ferraris were made with European roads and smog laws in mind first. To be driven in California requires extra expense that take time to accommodate. Sometimes those products won't work at all in America for a time. We understand that. We wait. We pay extra, or whatever is needed. My objection is to the attitude which seems to me to be entitled and irresponsible. Ok, all done.
Right... you have to wait until the car is usable. Apple released maps here while they're still rubbish.
That's a good counter. They probably relied too much on an automated system which is why it's such a cluster in the rest of the world.
I don't think that's relevant to my point. Many of the criticisms with Apple Maps stem from the (legitimate) problems that they have in countries outside America. My response was that Apple is an American company, prioritizing map accuracy in America first (but not exclusively). To that, someone responded that Apple products are made in China.
The relevant point is that the functionality and design of Apple's products are created in America. The components and assembly that makes that American designed functionality possible come from global sources. But the issue of Map inaccuracies has to do with the design and engineering, not the components or assembly.
My point is only that even though those inaccuracies are real and should (and will, I believe) be fixed, Apple, as an American country is reasonably entitled to focus on accuracy and services within America first.
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No, I don't see this as a good counter. iOS 5 devices which use Google Maps are still available globally. You could've waited until it was usable. A Ferrari that isn't street legal in California may still be purchased. And if I buy one, I shouldn't complain to Ferrari that I can't drive it legally yet.
The complaints about map accuracy were well known prior to iOS 6 or iPhone 5 release, as this very forum demonstrates. Apple didn't force it's maps on people. It provided an OS upgrade that people chose to take advantage of. There are problems, but they will be corrected with time, just as was the case with Google and any other mapping company. Is is Apple's initial release. Perhaps a lack of perfection should've been anticipated? And some patience extended.
You're legally incorrect.
Corporate law requires Tim Cook to maximise Apple's shareholder value. As a company with over 60% of revenue earned overseas, that means that he should be focussing on international sales first.
Here's the thing. Apple is a massive company which tops customer satisfaction surveys all over the globe. How could anybody possibly anticipate that updating to iOS 6 would take a perfectly functioning maps app and replace it with a far less desirable one, with a plethora of features and information missing? The iOS 6 beta was not a final product so even that couldn't have made anyone 100% certain of how the final maps app would be.
Apple does not offer a way of rolling back to a previous software version.
There's also the fact that I do like some of the other iOS 6 features and use them extensively, such as shared photo streams.
I'll reiterate what I said earlier. I love the iPhone and even the iOS 6 update, just not maps. I can like some parts of a product and complain about other parts. Deal with it.
Well, I doubt if the shareholders would be happy if the situation were reversed and the BEST of Apple Maps were in England, while the worst problems were over the SF Bay Area...
That is a good point. You can't go back from iOS 6, which should probably become an option that Tim Cook offered if he genuinely saw Maps as broken as he said he did. Or at least offer the old Maps App with Google maps in the App Store for free for, say, a year until they can fix Apple maps.
I personally haven't had any problems with the maps, traveling in a number of cities and rural areas around America since its release. But I know others have problems. I think Apple is doing its best to fix those problems. They'll have to prioritize and fix the ones they see as most critical first. That won't necessarily mean most critical to any particular user - but to Apple's own marketability and image overall. That may well mean they focus on American maps before European or Asian maps.
Nope... you're confusing shareholders with you. Shareholders want value to be maximised... and that's best served by Apple making all it's global customers happy.
indeed. but value doesn't just include units sold. Public perception will be worse for Apple if Maps are worse in America than oversees.
I'm sorry, but if 1/3 of my customers were n one country and the other 2/3 were spread around the world, I would probably spend a greater portion of my resources making sure that 1/3 was happy.
Well, let's see what Forbes - the best known US investor's magazine has to say:
The new maps are cr*p
the most dangerous flaw is clearly the broken mapping App, Apple Map, that replaced the excellent Google (GOOG) App available on earlier iPhones
After $30 Billion Mistake, Can Tim Cook Manage Apple?
Could An Exclusive Google Maps Be Android's Killer App?
Yep, Apple is definitely winning shareholder hearts and minds in the US!
Closed Friday at $652, down from around $700 when iOS6 was first released.
Loss of $44bn in market cap (up from the $30bn quoted in the headline above).
In summary:
Apple maps suck(for many, for some ok)
Apple concedes that maps suck and provides competitor alternatives
Apple maps will get better
Apple should have stayed with Google until Apple maps get better(debatable)
Apple hates Google. Google hates Apple.
Moderator please close this thread... yawn.
Apple maps suck(for many, for some ok)
Apple concedes that maps suck and provides competitor alternatives
Apple maps will get better
Apple should have stayed with Google until Apple maps get better(debatable)
Apple hates Google. Google hates Apple.
Moderator please close this thread... yawn.
Exactly. The "30 billion" dip is nothing compared to the fact that the stock has doubled since Cook took over the reigns. The shareholders care about that more than the dip. Apple is the most valuable company in the world. Even if Maps is an abject and utter failure (which it's not - it's just immature and needs fixing) - Apple can surely weather that storm. This is a lot of what frustrates me; how grossly overblown people's reactions are. Overblown just in terms of Maps itself - it's not nearly as bad as so many of these malcontents think. Certainly not as bad as the ridiculous rhetoric that is spewed. Rhetoric that isn't equally applied to any other company who has stumbles and blunders. And the reactions are overblown relative to Apple and its products as a whole. Maps is an important product, to be sure. But it's not the only product. And it will be improved and polished.
And in 6 months, the rhetoric will have all died down, and people will go on happily enjoying their Apple products, and the shareholders will roll their eyes as they look back at yet another unjustified outcry over a "horrible" Apple "disaster". It's just history repeating itself. Certain well-respected analysts predicted the original iphone would be an unmitigated failure and cost the company billions. Others have wailed and moaned that Apple's ceasing to use floppy disks or serial-ports was a horrible miscalculation that would sink the stock. Others have complained that not using Adobe Flash would be the death-nell of the iPhone and iPad. They were wrong, and Apple pressed on. Some critics were correct - MobileMe and Ping were flops. Oh well. You can't win 'em all, and Apple presses on. Overall, what they do they do well, and they learn from their missteps, and they fix things that are broken. Maps wasn't their best product released. But the outcry of so many, that it's a "Disaster" is silly, as is the belief that this may well lead to the company's downfall.
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You're right. I concede to this statement as more reasonable. Over and out.
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With all due respect, you live in the US and you've already said that the maps are good for you, so what do you know about whether issues are overblown or whether outcry is unjustified? It's easy to say something is overblown when the product works fine for YOU.
If you had maps where streets were labelled wrong, thousands of POIs were missing, entire towns were out by a few miles, train and tube stations missing, then I think you'd be pretty pissed too.
Not sure what you're trying to contribute to this thread really.
Oh, I KNOW I said over and out... but...
Let me just turn that one around. You live in the UK, and you've already said that the maps are lousy for you, so how do you know that your experience is representative of the whole? It's easy to say something is a "Disaster" when the product doesn't work well for you.
That's what I want to contribute. The possibility that this perspective that Maps is an unqualified "Disaster" across the board - may be an overreaction by a very vocal minority, very much fitting a long-standing pattern of outcries over Apple products in the past.
And by saying "Go buy a British smartphone", it was never my intention to slander or disrespect England or any of its fine citizens. (Though, the food is bland, to my taste) My intention was to simply say, "Look, if a company in another country makes a product that works better in their country than it does in yours, don't complain, especially if no companies in your country are doing any better" Sorry if anyone took that personally. It wasn't meant as a slap at England or English people.
Let me just turn that one around. You live in the UK, and you've already said that the maps are lousy for you, so how do you know that your experience is representative of the whole? It's easy to say something is a "Disaster" when the product doesn't work well for you.
That's what I want to contribute. The possibility that this perspective that Maps is an unqualified "Disaster" across the board - may be an overreaction by a very vocal minority, very much fitting a long-standing pattern of outcries over Apple products in the past.
And by saying "Go buy a British smartphone", it was never my intention to slander or disrespect England or any of its fine citizens. (Though, the food is bland, to my taste) My intention was to simply say, "Look, if a company in another country makes a product that works better in their country than it does in yours, don't complain, especially if no companies in your country are doing any better" Sorry if anyone took that personally. It wasn't meant as a slap at England or English people.
It's a disaster for me and lots of other people in the UK, but I'm not the one making sweeping statements here.
You're the one saying that the outcry is unjustified because the maps are okay for you.
We're getting nowhere here, you're not making sense.
Well, I'm trying to suggest that it's similar to past experiences where the outcry was unjustified. I'm not trying to be just myopic, and base an opinion on my own singular experience. I'm trying to look at the big-picture beyond this forum and the news outlets that love to make a big deal because of forums like this. Already on this forum, there is a poll suggesting that 70% of users think that Maps is "Fine" or "Good" - ie, has minor issues, but is largely usable. Another 21% have major problems (which, admittedly, is too big a number for Apple to ignore), and 9% claim it's utter rubbish. That last category, I believe, is reactionary and non-objective. They are the ones who are basing their general opinion of the product as a whole on their own experiences. They are the ones who named this thread with the blanket statement, "Wow... Apple Maps is a DISASTER". I surely didn't say, "No, it's not a disaster for anyone. It's perfect and flawless". I'm suggesting that with its admitted flaws, it's likely not nearly as bad as the press its getting, which is more owing to the kind of reactionary outcry we've seen so often in the past. It's happened so many times in the past. To ignore it this time around seems to me to be not sensible.
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I've noticed a problem when reporting incorrectly positioned POIs.
When it asks you to move the pin to the correct location the map changes to satellite view. This is a really stupid idea when the satellite maps are so poor you can't recognise anything.
When it asks you to move the pin to the correct location the map changes to satellite view. This is a really stupid idea when the satellite maps are so poor you can't recognise anything.
What other way is there to base an opinion? If maps suck for me and I find a mass of missing information near me and the places I visit, then I'm not going to say that the maps are good just because somebody else has a good experience with them, am I?
And like other people say - maps fail if they are largely inaccurate, even in places that don't affect you at the current time. You don't need to use maps to travel to your local shop, it's going to be an area that you're unfamiliar with where you would rely on maps. This is when they will let you down.
There are ENTIRE TOWNS that are miles away from where they should be. There are towns with incorrect names. There was a large park in Ireland that was labelled as an airport.
The negative press is wholly justified - at least in the UK, which, as far as I am aware, is exactly where most of it is coming from.
Why would all of these media companies and blogs criticise maps and why would Tim Cook apologise if it was all blown out of proportion? They are awful in their present state. Tim Cook clearly recognises this as he even suggested that people use a competing product until they improve! They've even added a category to the featured section of the app store for people to download other apps.
If you type in "Apple Maps" on Google it brings up mainly scathing criticism from users and media/blogs alike.
There is a problem and trying to downplay it in any form is silly.
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I've noticed a problem when reporting incorrectly positioned POIs.
When it asks you to move the pin to the correct location the map changes to satellite view. This is a really stupid idea when the satellite maps are so poor you can't recognise anything.
View attachment 367134
I noticed that, Google does it the same way
They should let you switch between views. Sometimes it'd be easy to do it on vector maps if you know one shop is next to another existing POI.
I noticed that, Google does it the same way
At least with Google Maps there's sufficient detail to recognise the place where you are trying to place the drop pin...
Yes please, after 125 people still complain Google maps are gone when the webapp is good for about everything you could need.
I bet if Apple adds the original Maps app in 6.1 people would still find reasons to complain.
In that instance yeah
I tried one yesterday and it was very blurry (although not as bad as the one you posted).No. People are complaining because key functionality has been removed from their expensive phones without any way to restore it or upgrade back to 5.1. If the old maps app were restored, people would be happy.