Yosemite 'Handoff' Feature Likely Limited to Macs with Bluetooth LE

[freediverx]

Every product that Apple makes is fantastic (well, almost).

The problem is that they go for a very specific target, while completely ignoring others, even ones they did target before.

For example, there are clearly folks that prefer the original iPhone form factor. However, Apple stopped making it, in favor of a new form factor. The fact that it is more popular than ever is good for Apple, but not for those that prefer the previous form factor, for whatever (and valid) reasons they may have.

Imagine now if the iPhone 6 is the 5.5 in and only the 5.5 in.

So it is with the 17 MBP (in reverse). A smaller form factor is not, and NEVER will be, a replacement for those who prefer the larger one, regardless of what Phil Schiller tries to tell us. The fact that we lost a lot of functionality for (pointless) weight saving isn't even the issue. It's the discontinuation of a product customers relied on that is the problem. Apple is not in recovery anymore, but they still act like they are. Good for them, bad for us.

Imagine if Apple, suddenly and without warning, made 11 in MBAir/Pro the ONLY laptop they make. Many would be pissed. Imagine if they suddenly, drastically change your favorite product.

As such, people need to stop trying to justify and defend Apple's position on the screen-size issue, unless they work for Apple. Why? Because Apple's position only benefits them, not (necessarily all of) us.

Ever heard of the 80/20 rule? Apple's philosophy is all about focus. They can't do what they do if they waste time and effort on edge cases.

 

[freediverx]

Originally Posted by DCYorke
Make/receive calls on your Mac using your phone. This is pure WiFi. Your phone will have to be plugged in, otherwise WiFi is automatically turned off. This is linked to your iCloud account to automatically "pair" with your phone.

This is a biggie. Many folks only plug in overnight. It's usually in the pocket, purse, or on a table somewhere.

Big limitation.

This doesn't sound right. An iPhone may turn off wifi by default when sleeping, but it can turn it back on for things like email fetching and background app updates and notifications.

 

[UncleSchnitty]

Has anyone tried to get a Broadcom bcm943224 into some of these older macs? for ~$15 it might be worth a shot

 

[fmalloy]

This doesn't sound right. An iPhone may turn off wifi by default when sleeping, but it can turn it back on for things like email fetching and background app updates and notifications.

Hope so!

That does sound right...

 

[AppleMad98004]

Do both the iPhone and Mac have to have Bluetooth LE? I know my iPhone 4 doesn't have BT LE

You do realize that the iPhone 4 won't be able to run iOS 8 in the first place right? You'll need an iPhone 4S or later.

Take a look at the bottom of the page.

http://www.apple.com/ios/ios8/

 

[JunoonX]

Will using another bluetooth module help?

Will getting another bluetooth module solve this issue? Something like this perhaps?

Update: Couldn't add a link (maybe because I registered to post on this thread). Google any bluetooth usb 4.0 adapter. I'm referring one of those. Would those work? Can a dev confirm?

 

[Osullivan1]

Yes, it's a real requirement. No, a shell script won't enable it.

They are being Apple. They started putting BT 4.0 in their products years ago, before the features required them so that now, when they're putting the features in, a good number of iOS and Macs have the hardware.

The technology behind handoff is the same as AirDrop in iOS and iBeacon. BT LE allows devices to advertise their physical presence without using much power. BT LE is the only technology currently available that offers this.

My iMac (late 2009) runs AirDrop, so I don't understand why it can't run Continuity as well. Plus, surely since the iMac is plugged in, it doesn't matter how much power it uses since it doesn't need to worry about battery life?

EDIT: Actually, in the System Profiler, it says AirDrop isn't supported - but I know for a fact that it is as it's been in my sidebar since it was introduced, and I've used it on occasion too. So maybe it will be supported on mine after all? Guess I'll just have to wait until I get iOS 8 installed (once its stable w/ good battery life) to find out...

EDIT2: Plus, I have the option to "Allow Handoff between this Mac and your iCloud devices" so I'm presuming that means it'll work.

 

[gkpm]

Have the people with external dongles tried this via Terminal?

When you install the external Bluetooth device, you may need to force the system to be able to recognize it and switch the Bluetooth stack to using it. The way to do that is to run the following command in terminal:

sudo nvram bluetoothHostControllerSwitchBehavior="always"

You may need to remove and reinsert the USB module or restart your computer. To verify that you are using the new Bluetooth hardware, check your system information and make sure that your LMP-version is 0x6.

 

[827538]

I would suspect BT 4.0 was chosen over wi-fi for ease of use reasons?
Not everyone has wi-fi enabled on their device, for starters. Some people still use wired ethernet connections in environments where there is no wireless connection.

With wi-fi, you generally have to have an "infrastructure" in place. (At minimum, some sort of wireless router handing out IP addresses to wireless clients that are configured to connect with it.)

Bluetooth 4 will work without the "middle man" of a router necessary. Devices just pair with each other and it works.

* EDIT: I just read one of the messages posted above where AirDrop technology was explained, and obviously it manages to establish a second direct wi-fi connection between two devices, for the purpose of transferring a file between them, regardless of the normal wireless configuration. I didn't realize that's how it was doing things, and that could theoretically be used here too. But that's a complicated enough of a thing so it only works when the Mac has supported hardware in it -- meaning it would limit you to it only working on newer Macs anyway, just like the Bluetooth 4 support requirement does. I still think BT 4 is the more straightforward way to get two devices talking directly with each other.

Fair point, I don't think it's bad to use BT, just when I look at it from my own personal point of view (selfish and narrow I know) I just feel WiFi would have been a more elegant solution.

After reading up on BT I believe it uses a WiFi connection to transfer the data. Tbh I don't really mind, I'm just eager to try it out as it's one of the most interesting additions to a desktop OS that I've seen in a while.

 

[dempson]

My iMac (late 2009) runs AirDrop, so I don't understand why it can't run Continuity as well. Plus, surely since the iMac is plugged in, it doesn't matter how much power it uses since it doesn't need to worry about battery life?

EDIT: Actually, in the System Profiler, it says AirDrop isn't supported - but I know for a fact that it is as it's been in my sidebar since it was introduced, and I've used it on occasion too. So maybe it will be supported on mine after all? Guess I'll just have to wait until I get iOS 8 installed (once its stable w/ good battery life) to find out...

EDIT2: Plus, I have the option to "Allow Handoff between this Mac and your iCloud devices" so I'm presuming that means it'll work.

As I noted earlier, the 10.7-10.9 Mac-to-Mac AirDrop only requires Wi-Fi Direct hardware support, which goes back to 2008-2010 models depending on the family: see the list at the end of Apple's AirDrop support article.

Existing iOS-to-iOS AirDrop uses Bluetooth LE for discovery and Wi-Fi Direct for the data transfer. That means Mac-to-iOS AirDrop will require using Bluetooth LE for compatibility with the iOS implementation, which means it will only be available on Macs which have Bluetooth LE hardware (definitely those which have it built in, unknown yet whether add-on Bluetooth 4 hardware will be officially supported or how easy it would be to hack this support in, if necessary).

This doesn't affect the ability of 2008-2010 and newer Macs to use AirDrop for copying files between Macs: that feature should still be available in 10.10, and will be required if you want to AirDrop between a Mac running 10.10 and a Mac running 10.7-10.9.

 

[827538]

Every product that Apple makes is fantastic (well, almost).

The problem is that they go for a very specific target, while completely ignoring others, even ones they did target before.

For example, there are clearly folks that prefer the original iPhone form factor. However, Apple stopped making it, in favor of a new form factor. The fact that it is more popular than ever is good for Apple, but not for those that prefer the previous form factor, for whatever (and valid) reasons they may have.

Imagine now if the iPhone 6 is the 5.5 in and only the 5.5 in.

So it is with the 17 MBP (in reverse). A smaller form factor is not, and NEVER will be, a replacement for those who prefer the larger one, regardless of what Phil Schiller tries to tell us. The fact that we lost a lot of functionality for (pointless) weight saving isn't even the issue. It's the discontinuation of a product customers relied on that is the problem. Apple is not in recovery anymore, but they still act like they are. Good for them, bad for us.

Imagine if Apple, suddenly and without warning, made 11 in MBAir/Pro the ONLY laptop they make. Many would be pissed. Imagine if they suddenly, drastically change your favorite product.

As such, people need to stop trying to justify and defend Apple's position on the screen-size issue, unless they work for Apple. Why? Because Apple's position only benefits them, not (necessarily all of) us.

Very good point. I am worried that Apple will ditch Intel chips at some point, when that happens I will no longer buy rMBP's. But take the original 3.5" iPhone vs the 4", I had two of the 3.5" variants a 3GS and 4S and I loved them both, but going to the 4" was a pretty good and restrained move as it allowed viewing of 16:9 content without black bars, plus it didn't make it any more difficult to hold.

With the new iPhone dimensions on the horizon I can't help but think that a 4.7" display is about perfect for me but the 5.5" rumours would make for a stupidly large and uncomfortable device to use. Personally I would like Apple to keep the 4" around.

From what I've seen, Apple ditching the 17" Mac is due to sales reasons, so clearly the numbers just weren't there to warrant further development but I can appreciate that some people would find it perfect for their uses. If Apple ditched the 15" display then I would say they've lost it. 17" laptops have always struggled slightly, I remember Dell talking about it. 11" and lower and you might as well buy an iPad. 13"-15" is perfect in my opinion and the reason Apple focuses on that segment. iPad<13 15>poor sales, excluding the 11" Air. By getting rid of low margain product lines it allows them to focus more on their most popular products. But you never know, Apple could surprise everyone and bring out a 17" rMBP.

Out of interest have you had a shot of the 15" rMBP? I was unbelievably pissed when Microsoft rammed Windows 8 down my throat and steadfastly refused to give us the immensely useful and intuitive start menu back. So much so I still use W7 even when I could upgrade to W8 for no cost. So I know what it feels like to be angry with a decision like that - but atleast for Apple I can understand why they did it, while for M$ it was nothing but sheer arrogance and disdain for the power users as it would've cost them next to nothing to implement it as an option.

 

[mainstreetmark]

So Handoff is just the email composing, maps and such? It doesn't include the phone calls that you can take on your mac? That's the feature I really want...

I doubt you can hand off a phone call to the mac. It's nice enough that we can make and receive calls on the mac. I support the further overlap of the iOS/OSX venn-diagram. I'm a bit surprised we haven't had progress on this already. Stocks is a permanent app, but if you want to control your Apple Mac with your Apple iPhone, it's a third-party, money-costing situation.

And personally, I use Airmail, not Mail.app. Excel, not Numbers. I live in a business world troubly associated with MS Exchange and Office.

edit: and another thing, Why can i not use "find my friends" on OSX? The Phone can do it. Wouldn't the very concept of "Hand Off" eventually blur the lines here, too? If apps are able to run parts of themselves in other apps, or on notification center, why not on other Apple devices. Why not a generic "iOS Wrapper" app that OSX can run, that allows your iphone to push an app to this OSX app, via airplay or BT LP, or some other magical mechanism. And vice versa.

 

[thisisdallas]

Yeah, this version of OS X seems like the iOS 7 of OS X updates. Hardly any new features, just new GUI.

I personally loved everything about the iOS 7 release. I'm also pretty pumped for these two releases, but it's still extremely frustrating and sad to know the best feature revealed won't work on over half of current mac's in use.

 

[AXs]

Sorry, I'd rather keep my 17" MacBook Pro instead of dealing with handoff and continuity.

I too like to carry a desktop and walk around.

 

[melendezest]

Very good point. I am worried that Apple will ditch Intel chips at some point, when that happens I will no longer buy rMBP's. But take the original 3.5" iPhone vs the 4", I had two of the 3.5" variants a 3GS and 4S and I loved them both, but going to the 4" was a pretty good and restrained move as it allowed viewing of 16:9 content without black bars, plus it didn't make it any more difficult to hold.

With the new iPhone dimensions on the horizon I can't help but think that a 4.7" display is about perfect for me but the 5.5" rumours would make for a stupidly large and uncomfortable device to use. Personally I would like Apple to keep the 4" around.

From what I've seen, Apple ditching the 17" Mac is due to sales reasons, so clearly the numbers just weren't there to warrant further development but I can appreciate that some people would find it perfect for their uses. If Apple ditched the 15" display then I would say they've lost it. 17" laptops have always struggled slightly, I remember Dell talking about it. 11" and lower and you might as well buy an iPad. 13"-15" is perfect in my opinion and the reason Apple focuses on that segment. iPad<13 15>poor sales, excluding the 11" Air. By getting rid of low margain product lines it allows them to focus more on their most popular products. But you never know, Apple could surprise everyone and bring out a 17" rMBP.

Out of interest have you had a shot of the 15" rMBP? I was unbelievably pissed when Microsoft rammed Windows 8 down my throat and steadfastly refused to give us the immensely useful and intuitive start menu back. So much so I still use W7 even when I could upgrade to W8 for no cost. So I know what it feels like to be angry with a decision like that - but atleast for Apple I can understand why they did it, while for M$ it was nothing but sheer arrogance and disdain for the power users as it would've cost them next to nothing to implement it as an option.

I did give the 15 in rMBP a serious look, but it's not just its screen size:

1) I need the port flexibility (the Expresscard slot is my favorite feature) so I can connect to the myriad of externals I've collected over the years (I love OWC).

2) I need the ability to have large internal drives (I sync with the home iMac, 2TB) for family fotos and videos, virtual machines, and everything else. With a family of 6, you start running out of room fast. I regularly upgrade these. I have 2 750GB in RAID 0 on the MBP, and they're pretty much full as it is.

3) I A/B'd the retinas against my 17 and don't see a large enough improvement to switch. The screen in the 17 is that good. The extra real-estate is useful when running multiple apps as well; everything's nice and readable without being too small, and video on it is great enough for 2 people to watch comfortably.

In all, I like the retinas, but wish Apple would not have discontinued the cMBPs. I just don't buy into this "focus" propaganda. They were outstanding machines before the retinas came out, and they still are. Nothing, and I mean nothing in Apple's competitor's portfolio can match them, still. In my mind, not even the retinas.

It is a purely business-driven decision to cut them: they'd eat into sales (and thus profits) from their more expensive, yet less capable (or rather, differently capable) brethren. So I'll have to wait until pricing and capability catch up (SSDs are still comparatively too expensive per byte).

----------

Ever heard of the 80/20 rule? Apple's philosophy is all about focus. They can't do what they do if they waste time and effort on edge cases.

That is what they said about a smaller iPad or a bigger iPhone. Yet here we are.

I find it amusing that you defend them so vigorously;"waste time and effort."

They wasted it when they built it the first time, and continued to do so for 12(?) years, according to your observation.

Gimme a break. The 17 is unequaled by anything Apple has put out yet; it's a portable iMac, for a reasonable price, 1 inch thin, 6.6 lbs, with every type of connectivity you'd ever need. That is badass hardware. There is NOTHING in the market like it; they still fetch well over $3000 in the after market, used.

It's frustrating, man. Apple has enough freaking money to at least keep it around as a BTO only.

But you're right. They don't want to waste money and effort on their own truly, truly great device in lieu of high-profit-margin appliances. I get how it makes business sense.

But to sell the whole "focus" thing as a positive for us is, well, BS. It is positive…for Apple.

 

[alchemistmuffin]

Stop it. Don't you know you're not supposed to make sense, you're supposed to have a reaction that Apple's implementation is purely about screwing customers with older devices in an effort to force them to upgrade.

Troll.....

It is really hardware limitation in this scenario, and this is due to security. Accidentally handing it off to wrong Mac can mean huge security compromise in terms of data.

Imagine handing off a Word Document that had really sensitive customer data into a random Mac, who happened to be an ID thief.

 

[iHack13]

Btw. I'm not sure if this was pointed out earlier.

But the Image taken from apfeleimer is partly wrong. Especially the Macbook Pros without retina.

The important version is also not the Apple Bluetooth software version but the LMP version. I am not sure if someone has already pointed that out, I searched this thread for Lmp and it didnt find anything.

So LMP v4 stands for Bluetooth 2.1 + EDR

you can look up your Bluetooth version according to the lmp version here:

https://www.bluetooth.org/en-us/specification/assigned-numbers/link-manager


edit: alright . ctrl+f on this page seems to be better than forum search. it was already pointed out

 

[Amazing Iceman]

See, this is exactly what I don't get within the Apple-Community...
"If a Feature does (or even may) have some drawbacks, let's not give the user a choice to use it anyway but flat otu prohibit it."
While I tend to think more along the lines of "Hey, if you turn this feature on, your battery may drain twice as fast. Want to do it anyway?"
(For example that is how the step counter in the withings health app works...with an iPhone 5 or earlyer it has to keep location services on all the time to work propperly and thus trashing battery life to bits...with later phones it works fine without this limitation...but wikthings gives me a choice to accept this tradeoff while they could have just said "well, you want to know how far you have wlaked? Buy the withings pulse!")

Ah, enough ranting for today...sorry

When I first discovered my 2007 MBP didn't support AirDrop, I complained as much or perhaps even more that you have, until I discovered the reasons. With Bluetooth LE is a similar case. Apparently there's more to it that simply battery drain.

Check out post #189 for more information.

 

[ilcorbetz]

Actually, if you take a look today to Yosemite section on Apple website:

http://www.apple.com/osx/preview/mac-and-ios/

you may notice that all these interactions between iOs and OsX:
- Phone
- SMS
- Handoff
- Instant Hotspot

are illustrated with Bluetooth set as ON on the Mac devices but it's actually OFF on the iOs devices (iPhone and iPad).

This could mean NOTHING, but if BT is required on both devices (iOs and OS x) then this is deceptive / misleading advertising.

 

[the1payday]

Actually, if you take a look today to Yosemite section on Apple website:

http://www.apple.com/osx/preview/mac-and-ios/

you may notice that all these interactions between iOs and OsX:
- Phone
- SMS
- Handoff
- Instant Hotspot

are illustrated with Bluetooth set as ON on the Mac devices but it's actually OFF on the iOs devices (iPhone and iPad).

This could mean NOTHING, but if BT is required on both devices (iOs and OS x) then this is deceptive / misleading advertising.

I re-watched the portion of the keynote today, where Craig does the demo of handoff. Bluetooth is turned OFF on both the iPhone and iPad he uses, although it is turned ON, on the iMac he is using (which to be fair, always has bluetooth on anyways, since it requires it for the mouse and keyboard.)

 

[nocturnum]

i remember craigh saying that the iphone could be in another room to receive calls and messages. the range of bluetooth is not that far or is it?

Craigh probably meant those British cardboard houses that actually have no real rooms, even though they have rooms.

 

[nocturnum]

That is what they said about a smaller iPad or a bigger iPhone. Yet here we are.

I find it amusing that you defend them so vigorously;"waste time and effort."

They wasted it when they built it the first time, and continued to do so for 12(?) years, according to your observation.

Gimme a break. The 17 is unequaled by anything Apple has put out yet; it's a portable iMac, for a reasonable price, 1 inch thin, 6.6 lbs, with every type of connectivity you'd ever need. That is badass hardware. There is NOTHING in the market like it; they still fetch well over $3000 in the after market, used.

It's frustrating, man. Apple has enough freaking money to at least keep it around as a BTO only.

But you're right. They don't want to waste money and effort on their own truly, truly great device in lieu of high-profit-margin appliances. I get how it makes business sense.

But to sell the whole "focus" thing as a positive for us is, well, BS. It is positive…for Apple.

I completely agree with your view. I own a maxed out 2011 MBP17 and 2008 MBP17. I am quite sure by now that these will also be the last portable macs I own. I might consider a Mac Mini in the future, should the need arise (if they don't kill it, of course).

Another thing that's quite interesting that a few years ago, I was surfing the web with my PB G3 Pismo that came out in 2000 and was still usable in 2008. I keep this machine now solely as the reminder of how once things were (fully expandable, easy to service, high quality machines).

If people today could only imagine that once:
• you could upgrade the CPU in your laptop for years (pre-G3)
• you could double the battery life in a matter of seconds (G3)
• you could add RAM as you pleased (till 2012)
• you could replace your HDD, keyboard, PRAM battery, internal WiFi card in minutes (G3)
• you could switch from floppy to cd-rom, dvd-rom, zip drive, 2nd hard drive, ... in seconds (G3)
• you could expand your ports via pc card to anything from ethernet, card readers, usb ports, wifi, bluetooth to whatever that was available on the planet (till 2012)
• you could charge your laptop with Apple charger from several generations before your machine (ie. Powerbook Duo charger from 1993 could charge Powerbook G3 from 2000)

Nah, these fanboys today won't get this. Apple is clearly destroying the most loyal part of their user base.

As Tim Cook says ... they are excited and proud (and so are their shareholders).

 

[einsteinbqat]

I can confirm it doesn't work with my 3rd party dongle that does have BT LE (which works with apps like Knock to Unlock and Notifyr)

Did you set it up as the default BT vs the default Mac one?

 

[benjo765]

Guess I'm out - got my 'late 2011' MacBook Pro in early 2012, only two years old

I've got a Mid 2011 Macbook Air. Wanna swap?

 

[brdeveloper]

I didn't find any really useful new feature that makes Yosemite a worth upgrade. Mavericks gave us RAM compression and better battery life. What Yosemite brings to users besides some cosmetic usability improvements?