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10.2.4
- Thread starter jelloshotsrule
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They still do.
iBook 800 640MB RAM:
I had to reset mouse/monitor config, as well as re-arrange icons on the dock. I don't use iChat, so why was the icon put back on the dock?
Minor annoyances, took 2 min to fix.
XBench says not any faster. I tend to agree.
I have to agree...
I will have to give Apple credit for doing a lot of improvement in the speed of OSX over the past couple of years. I remember when my iMac DV struggled with it and now it runs pretty darn good and pretty snappy. I think a lot of people give Apple a hard time for forgetting people who are running their older hardware, but I have to admit in the case of OSX this has not happened. Sure when I see a little improvement someone with a Dual G4 sees a lot more, but I am very happy with the way 10.2.4 runs on my iMac and iBook.
Now the question is, for us people that run older G3 Macs, when is a good time to stop updating? I know at some point all the gains we made will be lost when the OS becomes more complicated for the processor to run. I am not saying that the new machines made when the OS comes out will be slow, but there will be a point when it is no longer optimized for older Macs. Anybody want to care to guess? I am guessing the last update that will benefit older G3's is the 10.3 and 10.3.x. I think once we move beyond that, it will become more complicated and just like in the days of the classic OS we will be stuck at that point. Not all bad since we will still have a good version of OSX that will last as long as the computer is functional.
I will have to give Apple credit for doing a lot of improvement in the speed of OSX over the past couple of years. I remember when my iMac DV struggled with it and now it runs pretty darn good and pretty snappy. I think a lot of people give Apple a hard time for forgetting people who are running their older hardware, but I have to admit in the case of OSX this has not happened. Sure when I see a little improvement someone with a Dual G4 sees a lot more, but I am very happy with the way 10.2.4 runs on my iMac and iBook.
Now the question is, for us people that run older G3 Macs, when is a good time to stop updating? I know at some point all the gains we made will be lost when the OS becomes more complicated for the processor to run. I am not saying that the new machines made when the OS comes out will be slow, but there will be a point when it is no longer optimized for older Macs. Anybody want to care to guess? I am guessing the last update that will benefit older G3's is the 10.3 and 10.3.x. I think once we move beyond that, it will become more complicated and just like in the days of the classic OS we will be stuck at that point. Not all bad since we will still have a good version of OSX that will last as long as the computer is functional.
Originally posted by Shadowfax
edesignuk posted this (he was quoting someone else here. )
If you set boot-args to "-v", you will get a verbose startup, which will tell you everything you ever wanted to know about what goes on in the startup.... from setting up your swap file to mounting the drive to your video card kernel extension... so set this up, reboot, and watch... if you see "Radeon 8500=using AGP" or something like that, you're out of luck. if you see something else, well, chances are...
there is an easier way to do this, but i don't know what it is. don't forget to set the boot-args back to "" unless you like the verbose start (i do
That's a bad place to play. . . you could just hold down I think either just the "V" key on start-up. . . or maybe it's command and V. I'm not sure but that'll do the job.
I could be wrong but i think this is it for jag, Puma is on the horizon and so is the 970. I think os9 will be history in puma and you will see osx sparkle on the 970. I expect all this this summer or just before christmas at the latest along with a new powermac design. I am expecting something big from apple this year in the powermac. If its just more of the g4 bumps then ill just keep waiting before i get my next machine. ( after some primal screaming of course! )
P
paulc
Guest
Verbose Mode
Hold cmd-v at startup to stgart in verbose mode.
And everytone, be very, very careful when you see people posting terminal commands starting with "sudo." Type one key wrong and you could wipe your drive, corrupt the kernel and/or do major damage.
Hold cmd-v at startup to stgart in verbose mode.
And everytone, be very, very careful when you see people posting terminal commands starting with "sudo." Type one key wrong and you could wipe your drive, corrupt the kernel and/or do major damage.
Downloaded it overnight and now my 640mb iBook 500 seems to be a tad snappier overall -- though I haven't tried any apps yet to see if they crash.
---
I won't upgrade this machine with Puma. Still need os9 for a few things, particularly the SmartDisk 2700 slide scanner which operates from a Photoshop 7 plug-in. (And no, I don't usually use PS7 under os9, but I discovered that after PS installed, the os9 version was also on the machine.)
And a few games, like the Marathon series.... speaking of which (click here).
---
I won't upgrade this machine with Puma. Still need os9 for a few things, particularly the SmartDisk 2700 slide scanner which operates from a Photoshop 7 plug-in. (And no, I don't usually use PS7 under os9, but I discovered that after PS installed, the os9 version was also on the machine.)
And a few games, like the Marathon series.... speaking of which (click here).
samba gone for windows
hi,
since i updated to 10.2.4, I cannot connect anymore via samba to my windows machines.
That's to say: connect to server gives me smb://x.x.x.x and I can mount any of them on the desk once, but as soon as I click it to open, the icon disappears and it doesn't show anything of the directories I shared on the windozes.
Trying to connect to the PCs again gives me a
"error -5000". Retrying a copuple of times gives me a black screen with the announcement in 4 languages (included japanese or chinese) that I have to restart my computer by holding down power for several seconds.
I still can connect to windows via ftp and I can see al the files if I want. I also can see in the browser all my websites on the apacheserver on windows.
Never had any problems with samba in older builds.
No problems with connecting from windows to the mac via 'networklocations', the browser or ftp. It even works faster than before.
Anybody with these troubles out there?
hi,
since i updated to 10.2.4, I cannot connect anymore via samba to my windows machines.
That's to say: connect to server gives me smb://x.x.x.x and I can mount any of them on the desk once, but as soon as I click it to open, the icon disappears and it doesn't show anything of the directories I shared on the windozes.
Trying to connect to the PCs again gives me a
"error -5000". Retrying a copuple of times gives me a black screen with the announcement in 4 languages (included japanese or chinese) that I have to restart my computer by holding down power for several seconds.
I still can connect to windows via ftp and I can see al the files if I want. I also can see in the browser all my websites on the apacheserver on windows.
Never had any problems with samba in older builds.
No problems with connecting from windows to the mac via 'networklocations', the browser or ftp. It even works faster than before.
Anybody with these troubles out there?
help from anyone
I feel a bit pathetic to bother your folk with this and this may not be the right thread upon which to do this.... But I am SO frustrated with reading all about the continuing enhancements with 10.2 (.x) (I leave out the points when saying it by the way "tentwofour" for example ) as I am still unable to install it from the disc I bought ages ago.
everytime I try I get the multi-lingual screen of death, grey and indicating a kernal panic.
And yes, I 've removed all external devices, and yes, I'm removed any extra ram and yes, I've done everything suggested, but still no joy.
The final suggestion was to wipe my 4 partitions, reformat the lot and start from scratch.
I am resolved to give this a go, but first a. has anyone tried this and will it work?
and b. having archived most things I can on to CD, I am down to system 9, my applications and system tenonefive. What is the best way to archive what's left (I don't had a DVD drive, and I don't have an extra Hard Drive) but I am networked (to non-OS X machines). I want to try and do it without causing huge headaches when I put everything back.
So do we think this palaver will fix it? Can it done relatively painlessly? And if, no, to the first question what else can I try?
I'm running a pre-quicksilver G4 500Mhz, 10GB tower, which runs OS X fine, more or less. I used to get kernal panics quite a lot, not so much now.
Help, pretty please.
thanks
I feel a bit pathetic to bother your folk with this and this may not be the right thread upon which to do this.... But I am SO frustrated with reading all about the continuing enhancements with 10.2 (.x) (I leave out the points when saying it by the way "tentwofour" for example ) as I am still unable to install it from the disc I bought ages ago.
everytime I try I get the multi-lingual screen of death, grey and indicating a kernal panic.
And yes, I 've removed all external devices, and yes, I'm removed any extra ram and yes, I've done everything suggested, but still no joy.
The final suggestion was to wipe my 4 partitions, reformat the lot and start from scratch.
I am resolved to give this a go, but first a. has anyone tried this and will it work?
and b. having archived most things I can on to CD, I am down to system 9, my applications and system tenonefive. What is the best way to archive what's left (I don't had a DVD drive, and I don't have an extra Hard Drive) but I am networked (to non-OS X machines). I want to try and do it without causing huge headaches when I put everything back.
So do we think this palaver will fix it? Can it done relatively painlessly? And if, no, to the first question what else can I try?
I'm running a pre-quicksilver G4 500Mhz, 10GB tower, which runs OS X fine, more or less. I used to get kernal panics quite a lot, not so much now.
Help, pretty please.
thanks
from slashdot:
Re:Much faster -- Mails not the only thing... (Score:5, Interesting)
by Rouxfus (567556) on Friday February 14, @12:02AM (#5299816)
I think the post-update speed bump most people percieve is due to re-starting and getting rid of their swap files. Whenever a unix system starts swapping memory out to disk it's gonna slow down. I keep an eye on the number of swap files - when it goes from one to two, I re-start machine, uptime be damned - once there's more than one swap file the system gets -s l o w- in my experience.
The easiest way to track the number of swap files is to use the "Go To Folder" command in the Finder's Go menu, and type "/var". Drag the "vm" folder to the right side of the dock (bottom if the dock is oriented vertically). Now you can click and hold on that folder in the dock and the pop up dock menu will show you the swap files. Another way is to run Memory Stick.
Re:Much faster -- Mails not the only thing... (Score:5, Interesting)
by Rouxfus (567556) on Friday February 14, @12:02AM (#5299816)
I think the post-update speed bump most people percieve is due to re-starting and getting rid of their swap files. Whenever a unix system starts swapping memory out to disk it's gonna slow down. I keep an eye on the number of swap files - when it goes from one to two, I re-start machine, uptime be damned - once there's more than one swap file the system gets -s l o w- in my experience.
The easiest way to track the number of swap files is to use the "Go To Folder" command in the Finder's Go menu, and type "/var". Drag the "vm" folder to the right side of the dock (bottom if the dock is oriented vertically). Now you can click and hold on that folder in the dock and the pop up dock menu will show you the swap files. Another way is to run Memory Stick.
Works Fine - So Far
I Installed 10.2.4 through Software Update - Probably the best way to get any Apple upgrade sonce FTP always gets overloaded.
So far so good, I have noticed certain slight improvements in response mainly in the finder but also in a few Apple iapps etc...
Any Audio users notice improvements in Cubase SX using Core Audio? There were quite a few bugs here and there - I am still awaiting my Cubase SX dongle that I have leant to a friend.
I have not really noticed any significant improvments in games : MOH, Jedi Knight 2...
Tibook 1ghz
512 ram, Radeon 9000
I Installed 10.2.4 through Software Update - Probably the best way to get any Apple upgrade sonce FTP always gets overloaded.
So far so good, I have noticed certain slight improvements in response mainly in the finder but also in a few Apple iapps etc...
Any Audio users notice improvements in Cubase SX using Core Audio? There were quite a few bugs here and there - I am still awaiting my Cubase SX dongle that I have leant to a friend.I have not really noticed any significant improvments in games : MOH, Jedi Knight 2...
Tibook 1ghz
512 ram, Radeon 9000
@Fruzz:
That Cubase SX issue really sucks. Cubase was the only reason for me to keep a full installtion of OS 9 on my harddrive. I purchased Cubase SX right after it was available just to find out that it is unusable with my configuration (M-Audio-Hardware and Cubase SX don't get along, causing CPU usage spikes that freeze the system for a fraction of a second once in a while). Steinberg still didn't fix that porblem. With all other programs my M-Audio stuff just works fine under Mac OS X!
M-Audio says it is a Cubase problem and doesn't offer a new driver. In their opinion the drivers are "perfect" and meet the CoreAudio specifications. And Steinberg still didn't provide an update that solves the known issues so far. So I'm still stuck with Cubase VST 5.1... and shelled out the money for the update for nothing months ago...
I couldn't install 10.2.4 so far, because I am not in my Home-Office the whole day, but I am pretty sure that the update doesn't change anything considering my problems with Cubase SX.
groovebuster
That Cubase SX issue really sucks. Cubase was the only reason for me to keep a full installtion of OS 9 on my harddrive. I purchased Cubase SX right after it was available just to find out that it is unusable with my configuration (M-Audio-Hardware and Cubase SX don't get along, causing CPU usage spikes that freeze the system for a fraction of a second once in a while). Steinberg still didn't fix that porblem. With all other programs my M-Audio stuff just works fine under Mac OS X!
M-Audio says it is a Cubase problem and doesn't offer a new driver. In their opinion the drivers are "perfect" and meet the CoreAudio specifications. And Steinberg still didn't provide an update that solves the known issues so far. So I'm still stuck with Cubase VST 5.1... and shelled out the money for the update for nothing months ago...
I couldn't install 10.2.4 so far, because I am not in my Home-Office the whole day, but I am pretty sure that the update doesn't change anything considering my problems with Cubase SX.
groovebuster
Installation issue
Okay, the update seems to be solid but I did run into an interesting issue when it installed. I had 300+ megabytes free on my OS/X partition and when I tried to install the update it said it needed 327 megabytes for the selected installs!!! A 40 MB install needs 327 megabytes? I removed the development stuff and the install then went fine since I now had ~800 MB free. For the particulars I am running a Rev A iMac, yes that's right, OS/X on a 233 mhz G3 but it does work okay. So, if you think your G3 500 is an issue try it on a Rev A and yes I am upgrading very soon.
Anyone else see this?
Okay, the update seems to be solid but I did run into an interesting issue when it installed. I had 300+ megabytes free on my OS/X partition and when I tried to install the update it said it needed 327 megabytes for the selected installs!!! A 40 MB install needs 327 megabytes? I removed the development stuff and the install then went fine since I now had ~800 MB free. For the particulars I am running a Rev A iMac, yes that's right, OS/X on a 233 mhz G3 but it does work okay. So, if you think your G3 500 is an issue try it on a Rev A and yes I am upgrading very soon.
Anyone else see this?
Re: help from anyone
My coworker had similar problems with her G4 500 Tower. Reinstalled Jaguar about five times... changed out the RAM, removed devices, etc. to no avail. Even brought it to the Apple Store, and they did nothing (except spill Sprite on her tower casing!).
Then I stumbled upon an Apple Knowledge Base article about updating the firmware for her machine. Once she did that, the machine ran Jaguar perfectly. She hasn't had any problems since.
If you haven't updated the firmware for your machine, I'd say with certainty that that is the problem. If you have already updated it, sorry for wasting your time.
-Alex
My coworker had similar problems with her G4 500 Tower. Reinstalled Jaguar about five times... changed out the RAM, removed devices, etc. to no avail. Even brought it to the Apple Store, and they did nothing (except spill Sprite on her tower casing!).
Then I stumbled upon an Apple Knowledge Base article about updating the firmware for her machine. Once she did that, the machine ran Jaguar perfectly. She hasn't had any problems since.
If you haven't updated the firmware for your machine, I'd say with certainty that that is the problem. If you have already updated it, sorry for wasting your time.
-Alex
for grouse
you could buy a 2nd hard drive. use that as a seperate Jaguar partition, as well as another general data partition to keep your other stuff uncluttered.
40GB drives are cheap, as well as being faster than your 10GB, most likely.
or
you can zip the data that you don't have on CD and transfer to another machine on the network. if you have a linux machine... you can scp it over no problem.
you could buy a 2nd hard drive. use that as a seperate Jaguar partition, as well as another general data partition to keep your other stuff uncluttered.
40GB drives are cheap, as well as being faster than your 10GB, most likely.
or
you can zip the data that you don't have on CD and transfer to another machine on the network. if you have a linux machine... you can scp it over no problem.
grateful
Thanks both of you.
Do you know if 7up works instead of sprite?
But seriously folks, I'll try the firmware thing, but do you know which version, when I looked up 4.4.8 on apple's site, it said it was for "mirror drived Power Macs only" whatever they are?!
I think I currently have 4.28F1, if that's the right thing.
And thanks for the second drive idea, someone else mentioned that, I'll just bite the bullet and do that, especially if it's faster.
thanks again... I'll let you know if it works, to help others in a similar pickle.
Thanks both of you.
Do you know if 7up works instead of sprite?
But seriously folks, I'll try the firmware thing, but do you know which version, when I looked up 4.4.8 on apple's site, it said it was for "mirror drived Power Macs only" whatever they are?!
I think I currently have 4.28F1, if that's the right thing.
And thanks for the second drive idea, someone else mentioned that, I'll just bite the bullet and do that, especially if it's faster.
thanks again... I'll let you know if it works, to help others in a similar pickle.
Re: Re: Well...
Agreed. No speed improvement. Slower Boot Time and Login.
Darwin is now up to 6.4
Agreed. No speed improvement. Slower Boot Time and Login.
Darwin is now up to 6.4
Re: Re: Re: Well...
The slow boot should only be the initial restart after install. All normal restarts and cold starts should be much quicker then that initial reboot. If not it's time to do a fresh install of the system requiring a reformat of the drive.
The slow boot should only be the initial restart after install. All normal restarts and cold starts should be much quicker then that initial reboot. If not it's time to do a fresh install of the system requiring a reformat of the drive.
oops
on second glance I now realize I'm still runnin the 8500 drivers. The reason I thought otherwise was because when I checked "driver info" in a couple of games it said ATI 9000. But I did realize that ATI now has the 9000 drivers for mac up on their site, have been there since the middle of january, being downloaded right now. just go to ATI and click on find a driver, you'll find it.
on second glance I now realize I'm still runnin the 8500 drivers. The reason I thought otherwise was because when I checked "driver info" in a couple of games it said ATI 9000. But I did realize that ATI now has the 9000 drivers for mac up on their site, have been there since the middle of january, being downloaded right now. just go to ATI and click on find a driver, you'll find it.