Toggle sidebar Toggle sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

12" powerbook too small after a while?

I personally find 1024x768 to be just about right for a 12" screen.

The plus for other laptops are better quality screens... I LOVE Sony's xbrite technology and wish Apple would update the screens and video cards on the PBs. Not to mention the 1.7 Pentium M puts a G4 1.5 to shame in both speed, FSB, and battery life. Unfortunately, the Sony S360 won't run OSX. So I'll stick with the 12" PB for now. 🙂

Too bad Freescale couldn't hurry it up with the 667mhz FSB G4 dual core chips (around 2.0 ghz would be nice). Add that to a newer ATI video chipset with 128mb and a better quality 12" display, Apple would have a real winner. Of course FW800, a PCMICA slot and 2 dimm slots would be welcome too. While were at it, throw in a backlit keyboard. Do you think they could fit all of that in there? Heh 🙂 Design it in a carbon fiber case, make it the same foot print, but only 1" thick, double the battery life and take a pound off the weight. Keep the price at $1699 as well. Hahah.
 
If you want a Mac notebook with better resolution than you should start looking at the 15" again. If you don't care if your next computer runs a Windows or Mac OS, then by all means get the Sony.

BTW: by saying the resolution "sucks" you are insulting a lot of peoples 'books on this forum. Not a way to make a lot of friends. I realize you didn't mean anything by it but it still hurts. 😉 No one mentioned the resolution to you for two reasons: 1) it is pretty comparable to the rest of the industry 2) you, yourself gave a link to the PowerBooks home-page and the tech specs, including resolution, are just one click away once you are there.

Oh and to answer the original question: No the screen does not feel to small after almost 6 months. I mostly use the iLife apps, Mail, Safari, Final Cut Express (a little cramped), Excel, and BZFlag.
 
h0e0h said:
first of all cavemann, you need to slow your roll cause its easy to piss people off in here. Secondly, if you don't like the answers you're getting, don't argue about them, just go somewhere else for them. and last, i've had my PB for almost a month and when it leaves my desk or my iCurve i put it in a PowerSleeve from Radtech.us and then in my padded bag. I don't have any scratches or dents in it anywhere. I'm a college student and my iPod is beat to hell and back... but for some reason my PB seems to be still in pristine condition...
Click to expand...
Ohhhhh im scared. Seriously lame. I dont care if i piss you off or anyone else for that matter. But anyway lets not get personal, back on topic. 🙂
 
I owned a 12" of the previous revision, and to be honest, I always thought the screen was too small, and was really not happy with it. I recently made the jump to a 15" PB of the newest revision and I am very happy with the screen, however, you do give up a lot for that nice big resolution. The battery life isn't as good on the 15" which is a big deal when i spend all day on campus. I used to not even bring my power adapter with me for my 12", now i can't leave home without it. So add on that extra pound of weight that the 15" adds, plus the weight of the power adapter, and you have your new travel weight. If you think that the screen is too small now, it will get worse as you use the computer more. Also, the 12" is not nearly as bright or vibrant as the 15" screen. Just keep all that in mind.

I'd say if you're going to be getting a computer as your MAIN computer, get the 15". If you already have a desktop, go for the 12", as it makes the best damn supplementary computer you could ever want. I had a desktop with my 12" and they made a very dynamic duo, but now that i own a 15", i almost never touch my desktop, which makes me sad. (waste of money to have two computers when i only use one.)
 
Jsmit said:
If you want a Mac notebook with better resolution than you should start looking at the 15" again. If you don't care if your next computer runs a Windows or Mac OS, then by all means get the Sony.

BTW: by saying the resolution "sucks" you are insulting a lot of peoples 'books on this forum. Not a way to make a lot of friends. I realize you didn't mean anything by it but it still hurts. 😉 No one mentioned the resolution to you for two reasons: 1) it is pretty comparable to the rest of the industry 2) you, yourself gave a link to the PowerBooks home-page and the tech specs, including resolution, are just one click away once you are there.

Oh and to answer the original question: No the screen does not feel to small after almost 6 months. I mostly use the iLife apps, Mail, Safari, Final Cut Express (a little cramped), Excel, and BZFlag.
Click to expand...

well... It kinda sucks that I can't get an honest opinon. Everybody is like Apple is the best Apple can't do no wrong... Powerbooks are the greatest EVER. blah blah blah. I admit they're good computers but are people afraid to criticize Apple?

No... the 12" screen is really pretty sad when you compare it to the 15". But the 15" is too big to be lugging around everywhere. Apple needs to make something inbetween which isnt the low-end Ibook, which is no good either...

I think my most important criteria in a laptop are manageable size, a good screen, and OS in that order...

12" is a great size, but the resolution is bad. 15" has a great screen but its too big...

the 13.1" Sony has a great screen and great size, but the OS is not as good...

🙁
 
Southbridge said:
well... It kinda sucks that I can't get an honest opinon. Everybody is like Apple is the best Apple can't do no wrong... Powerbooks are the greatest EVER. blah blah blah. I admit they're good computers but are people afraid to criticize Apple?

No... the 12" screen is really pretty sad when you compare it to the 15". But the 15" is too big to be lugging around everywhere. Apple needs to make something inbetween which isnt the low-end Ibook, which is no good either...

I think my most important criteria in a laptop are manageable size, a good screen, and OS in that order...

12" is a great size, but the resolution is bad. 15" has a great screen but its too big...

the 13.1" Sony has a great screen and great size, but the OS is not as good...

🙁
Click to expand...

In that post, while I agree with it, is contradicting yourself. You said the OS is not as good [as an Apple], but before that you said you can't get an honest oppinion because everyone says 'Apple is the greatest' - which is true as this is an apple based site...

But to the technical stuff...

...I happen to think that Apple should make an inbetween screen, like a 13.x" screen - would sell well...

...but the PowerBook at 12" is great - especially when the price of CRTs has gone down so much. If you buy the base powerbook at $1,499 and a 20" CRT for like under $100, you have spent a little over sixteen hundred on an amazing system...
 
Southbridge,
It's hard to give you what you're looking for, from what I can tell. Anyone can say "a 1 GHz G4 is slower than a 1.5 GHz G4" because those are easily acknowledged facts based on basic specs. Similarly, we can say "a 12-inch screen is smaller than a 15-inch screen." But when you say things like (not exact quotes) "this keyboard is poorly designed" or "this screen sucks," those are subjective comments that cannot be proven or disproven. You are perfectly welcome to hold those views, but I'm not sure how you can turn around and be surprised when people offer contrasting views that are equally valid in their personal experience. Those are, for the most part, "honest opinions" even if they're not identical to yours. Why you think they're not "honest," I don't know.

A resolution cannot be inherently "bad" or "sad"-- we've been over this, the 12" PB has a perfectly normal resolution for its size-- it can only be larger or smaller than another resolution screen to which you are comparing. Different people like/need different sized screens. A 15" laptop can be "too big" for you, but not for someone else. Someone saying the 15" is just right for them is not necessarily them being a rabid fanboy, that might actually be their experience. And so on ... an iBook is "no good" for you, but perfect for many people. When someone says they like their iBook, they have not had too much Kool-Aid ... they might just be telling you how they honestly feel. You want facts, we can do that; you want opinion, we're doing that too.

You've asked a lot of questions and received a lot of answers. From what I can tell, most of them have not said "apple is the greatest EVER" or anything of the sort. I'm not trying to speak for everyone else, this is just my impression. I, for one, have tried my best to answer many of your inquiries, and I do not think mine contained any "apple can do no wrong"-stuff. Correct me if I'm mistaken about this. I even said you should get a Sony if the PB screen/keyboard don't suit you, and I wasn't just being rhetorical, I meant it. But this is a Mac-board, so you can't be too surprised to find people here that like Macs. Even so, despite your claim to the contrary, in my experience I think you can find some of the mosty piercing and meaningful criticism anywhere of Apple and their products right here on these boards, often in this forum ... there's even some in this thread.
 
a couple years ago i had a 15" notebook computer with 1024x768, you'd think i was blind but that was the standard years ago.

as far as the 12" res being "bad", it depends on what you consider "good"
do you want less or more pixels. in terms of size of objects on screen, i think the 15" is almost directly representational to the 12", it has about as many more pixels as it does screen space to put the pixels on.

i love the 12", i owned the Rev A and now i've got a Rev D. they are great for portability, and when i need the extra screen space i can always DVI it up to the LCD 17" at 1280x1024.

mcgarry is right in that there is no good or bad, its all preference.
 
Southbridge: enjoy your Sony laptop, it is clear that you wont be happy with Apple alternatives. I want to try to convince you to stay with an Apple, but they don't have the right product for you. Sony does though,it has everything you want but the OS.

CaptainCaveMann: I am glad to hear you got your notebook. How is it treating you? Good, I hope.
 
ok... ok... look I'm sorry because I'm just a little frustrated with this whole thing... I'm just looking for the ideal notebook and I'm just not quite finding it, so its kinda pissing me off...
 
Southbridge said:
ok... ok... look I'm sorry because I'm just a little frustrated with this whole thing... I'm just looking for the ideal notebook and I'm just not quite finding it, so its kinda pissing me off...
Click to expand...

I have a 12" and this is my take. If you will be using photoshop the most out of all your applications, you need to think about what palettes you use. To me, with 1024x768 you gets me the very basic essentials: History/Actions, Layers/Channels, Info/Colors/Swatches. You can fit all that on your screen in one palette row and still have decent room for your actual image you are working on. If you personally need to see more palettes at a time go with the 15" but you are sacrificing some of that portability.

All Apple programs function flawlessly in 1024x768 (even final cut pro to an extent), but when you need to do the hardcore stuff (sitting down for longer than 1.5 hours) hook it up at home to a real monitor, and have all your palette locations saved and, "boom" you don't have to move everything around.

The 12" has the EXACT same size keyboard as the 15" so I don't know if you are worried about your hands being "cramped" but thats really not an issue between the 2.

All in all the 12" was designed as an ultra-portable, if you are looking for just a "portable" and you don't care about battery being shorter, and you want the extra 256x86 pixels, go for the 15". PERIOD.


Edit: Oh yeah, i've had my 12" for 1.5 years and have only had 2 people ask to trade their 15" AI books for mine 🙂 I will be honest in saying that there have been times that i said "i wish my screen was bigger" but their have been thousands more times where i said "i am so glad this is so portable."
 
yeah... I'm still impressed with the Sony... It really comes down to do you get the best performing machine or do you get a Mac... I get a sense that Apple is really good at software but not at hardware, while PC's are the opposite...
 
Southbridge said:
yeah... I'm still impressed with the Sony... It really comes down to do you get the best performing machine or do you get a Mac... I get a sense that Apple is really good at software but not at hardware, while PC's are the opposite...
Click to expand...

Again, saying something is the "best performing" is not quite a fact in this case. "Faster FSB speed" is something we can say, for example, but there are just too many variables to make something the "best performing" overall not just for you, but for anyone else. "Best performing" can also be true in a specific context like "best performing at this particular photoshop render I like." But even then, it's usually not that simple except in some very obvious cases. Speaking BROADLY, there is not a serious hardware difference between these two laptops; any sort of task this Vaio can do, the PB can do too. Furthermore, that Vaio you mentioned lacks some features of the PBs that could be very important to some people even if not to you, the OS is just one of them (albeit a huge one for me at least).

So what I think it "really comes down to" is what laptop will serve you best: your needs, your desires, your budget. If that's the Sony, nothing says you have to get a Mac, so go ahead and get the Sony.
 
mcgarry said:
Again, saying something is the "best performing" is not quite a fact in this case. "Faster FSB speed" is something we can say, for example, but there are just too many variables to make something the "best performing" overall not just for you, but for anyone else. "Best performing" can also be true in a specific context like "best performing at this particular photoshop render I like." But even then, it's usually not that simple except in some very obvious cases. Speaking BROADLY, there is not a serious hardware difference between these two laptops; any sort of task this Vaio can do, the PB can do too. Furthermore, that Vaio you mentioned lacks some features of the PBs that could be very important to some people even if not to you, the OS is just one of them (albeit a huge one for me at least).

So what I think it "really comes down to" is what laptop will serve you best: your needs, your desires, your budget. If that's the Sony, nothing says you have to get a Mac, so go ahead and get the Sony.
Click to expand...

no... like for example on a website like http://www.heavy.com which has rich media and flash the Sony just performs these tasks smoother and quicker. Also the screen has better resolution so it looks a little nicer... I'm talking versus the 15" 1.5Ghz powerbook of course... So I think in terms of hardware the vaio performs better. Now software is a different mattter... but I'm still trying to find reasons to buy a Mac. When it comes down to it OS is only one component of the overall picture of the computer...
 
whatever man, looks fine on my PB, don't see any problems or sluggishness. I haven't been there in a long time, and the last time I had a PC and accessed it I was on a Pentium II (if I remember correctly), so that's not really a fair comparison. But anyway, it's all context, who knows how much RAM each test machine has, which browser you use, all sorts of variables. You cannot factually state that the Vaio simply "performs better," period-- maybe in the context of a specific battery of tests or tasks or whatever, but just to state it outright as the result of viewing one website in far-from-test conditions is sort of silly. You CAN accurately say "The Vaio performs better at task x," and so on, and to be fair, that's probably what you meant. That was my point. Plus, this is not just about OS or software, aslegit as those points are. Check the specs, there are quite a few things the Vaio can't even do that the 15" PB and even the 12" can. They are different computers and how they perform depends on who you are and what you do.
 
mcgarry said:
whatever man, looks fine on my PB, don't see any problems or sluggishness. I haven't been there in a long time, and the last time I had a PC and accessed it I was on a Pentium II (if I remember correctly), so that's not really a fair comparison. But anyway, it's all context, who knows how much RAM each test machine has, which browser you use, all sorts of variables. You cannot factually state that the Vaio simply "performs better," period-- maybe in the context of a specific battery of tests or tasks or whatever, but just to state it outright as the result of viewing one website in far-from-test conditions is sort of silly. You CAN accurately say "The Vaio performs better at task x," and so on, and to be fair, that's probably what you meant. That was my point. Plus, this is not just about OS or software, aslegit as those points are. Check the specs, there are quite a few things the Vaio can't even do that the 15" PB and even the 12" can. They are different computers and how they perform depends on who you are and what you do.
Click to expand...

yeah the Mac performs fine, but the Sony performs better. And I mean smoother, I mean quicker... Plus the screen looks better than the powerbook. I mean the only way to prove it is for you to go to CompUSA and see it yourself. I spent 2 hours yesterday looking specifially at the two. I spent like 3 hours today, and I'll go tomorrow and spend some time before making a final decision. The vaio... which runs at 1.7ghz and 400 fsb clearly is a better machine... I mean speaking of hardware.

See... when PC's talk about their computer the first thing they talk about is their hardware. When Mac users talk about their computer the first thing they talk about is the OS. But software and hardware are like ying and yang in a computer. The ideal computer would be Mac OS with PC hardware... But that'll never happen.

So why would I buy a Mac? I think it comes down to do I want to buy into the Mac way of thinking or not. Do I want to consider myself part of the hip, edgy and artsy crowd and get a machine thats good but not quite as good? I mean it's a tradeoff. It really is about identity and which group do you want to belong to. Thats the ultimate decision on whether to get a mac or PC... Are you in or are you out?
 
Where to begin with these ridiculous generalizations ...

Again, whatever man, if you think this is all about identity and being "edgy," I really can't help you. I thought I was making a good effort to help, but I guess not. It's like you didn't even read my last post. Just get whatever you like; if it's better for you, better it is.
 
mcgarry said:
Where to begin with these ridiculous generalizations ...

Again, whatever man, if you think this is all about identity and being "edgy," I really can't help you. It's like you didn't even read my last post. Whatever, just get a Sony.
Click to expand...

but you can't deny it. Thats the heart of the Apple marketing strategy. Image. You can't really believe that Image of a macuser has nothing to do with it... I mean I know I'm talking about a really sensitive subject, but why not bring it out into the open? Apple has a powerful marketing scheme going on. Lets just admit it. Do they have a good product? Yes. But if nothing else Steve Jobs is a brilliant marketer and salesman.
 
Southbridge said:
The vaio... which runs at 1.7ghz and 400 fsb clearly is a better machine... I mean speaking of hardware.

See... when PC's talk about their computer the first thing they talk about is their hardware. When Mac users talk about their computer the first thing they talk about is the OS. But software and hardware are like ying and yang in a computer. The ideal computer would be Mac OS with PC hardware... But that'll never happen.
Click to expand...


That's the typical PC user's response to apple's seemingly "low" processor speed, when in all actuality i believe that the g4 in the powerbooks would blow that sony away. Case in point... I have a dell laptop that actually belongs to my dad that he bought in may. It was one of the fastest at the time @ 2.6GHz (400 FSB) w/ 512mb DDR. My powerbook is 1.33GHz w/ the same 512mb DDR. The day he opened it up i installed microsoft office, photoshop 7, and AVID (a digital editing package). I opened up Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Outlook, photoshop, and avid. Then i opened up Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Entourage, photoshop, and Final Cut Pro HD on the mac. While all that was up and running I opened the calculator on the PC and AIM on the powerbook... and BAM... bluescreen on XP. The powerbook didn't suffer any crashes or anything... so don't let that processor mumbo jumbo crap get in your face... because its truly like comparing APPLES to oranges...

Oh, and since this "match made in heaven" with a PCs hardware and Apple's OS will never happened... have you ever sat down at the g5 dual 2.5GHz with 2 gigs of ram on dual 23" Cinema displays? Obviously not if you don't think there can be a combination of braun w/ the "untouchable PC hardware" and the brains of OS X...
 
h0e0h said:
That's the typical PC user's response to apple's seemingly "low" processor speed, when in all actuality i believe that the g4 in the powerbooks would blow that sony away. Case in point... I have a dell laptop that actually belongs to my dad that he bought in may. It was one of the fastest at the time @ 2.6GHz (400 FSB) w/ 512mb DDR. My powerbook is 1.33GHz w/ the same 512mb DDR. The day he opened it up i installed microsoft office, photoshop 7, and AVID (a digital editing package). I opened up Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Outlook, photoshop, and avid. Then i opened up Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Entourage, photoshop, and Final Cut Pro HD on the mac. While all that was up and running I opened the calculator on the PC and AIM on the powerbook... and BAM... bluescreen on XP. The powerbook didn't suffer any crashes or anything... so don't let that processor mumbo jumbo crap get in your face... because its truly like comparing APPLES to oranges...
Click to expand...

I dont think it is... A computer is a computer. They both have generally similar structures inside. Why should it be different? I'm thinking that OS X might be better at resource management than XP, where XP might do one thing at a time really well, but multiple things not as well, where a Mac with OS X although it might not have the processing speed, can allocate the necessary resources better. Again... thats the mark of the OS and not the Hardware, and I agree OS X is better than XP.
 
Southbridge said:
but you can't deny it. Thats the heart of the Apple marketing strategy. Image. You can't really believe that Image of a macuser has nothing to do with it... I mean I know I'm talking about a really sensitive subject, but why not bring it out into the open? Apple has a powerful marketing scheme going on. Lets just admit it. Do they have a good product? Yes. But if nothing else Steve Jobs is a brilliant marketer and salesman.
Click to expand...

Deny what? That Apple markets their products? Yeah, MS, Dell, and Sony do nothing of the sort. Whoever needs to spend $2k on something to feel "edgy" is beyond me ... whatever, more power to them, I thought we were taliking about computers here.

This is so silly. I hope this thread gets wastelanded. Too much moss on this stone.
 
mcgarry said:
Deny what? That Apple markets their products? Yeah, MS, Dell, and Sony do nothing of the sort. Whoever needs to spend $2k on something to feel "edgy" is beyond me ... whatever, more power to them, I thought we were taliking about computers here.

This is so silly. I hope this thread gets wastelanded. Too much moss on this stone.
Click to expand...

ok... I think I touched a nerve. Lets just forget about it.
 
h0e0h said:
That's the typical PC user's response to apple's seemingly "low" processor speed, when in all actuality i believe that the g4 in the powerbooks would blow that sony away.
Click to expand...

Um, sorry... no.

Great example of a Mac user being blinded by the facts. He "believes" the G4 is faster... you keep believing, man! It won't change the 'marks.

That Sony has a Radeon 9700, faster FSB, it's lighter, has a better display... and are you ready for this? A 2 MB L2 CACHE! Comparing the 12" PB to this machine is somewhat of a joke. In performance, the Sony will kick the PB in the nuts. In design, the PB makes the Sony look like an ugly toaster oven.

I love Apple, but Southbridge, I think you're right about the whole Apple "image" thing, and the hardware/PC software/Mac thing. Most of us have a bias though, and you've realized that.

Just decide what you will be happier with.
 
I always find that when I use a PC, I have to be conscious not to ask the computer to do to much. I tend to ask them to do much and they hang, often. I have been having much better luck now that I have trained myself to use one program at a time in Windows. Maybe you have better luck on Windows. On the Mac, I don't have worry. Because of this, I get more work done on my 1.33 GHz PowerBook then my Bosses 3.something GHz Pentium 4 Compaq Desktop (in the interest of full disclosure: I have 1.25 GB RAM to his 512 MB RAM).

I was at the Apple Store today, and you are right, the keyboards just don't feel as nice until you are sitting. It is strange.

You are also right, Macs really are about the software. The software is probably the number 1 reason to get a Mac. However, I don't see the big difference in hardware that you see. PC don't inherently have better hardware. That said, it might still be the better hardware for you.

I switched to a Mac back in 2001. OS X was not the driving force behind my decision (I admit it, I didn't even know about it when I made my decision). Back then the software was fine but not the dominate reason it is today. I pulled my PC off the web before popups, spy-ware, etc were the problem they are day, I never had to worry about them). I just liked the form factor of the old CRT iMacs (it also fit my budget). That being said, I stayed because of the software.

Do you have a Mac now? You have PCs now right? I don't think you can fully appreciate the importance of the software on a Mac.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back