12" powerbook too small after a while?

[attic salt]

A little off topic, but I need help from the graphics gurus...

I just got my new PB and right now it's only running with 512MB RAM, but I do plan to go up to 2G as soon as possible.

My question is...

I was working on a file last night in Photoshop that is 36in wide x 24in high and 400 ppi...the thing was taking FOREVER to do anything on the Powerbook...on my dell at work it was faster...so I'm a little upset because I didn't expect the PB to be slower, but could this be a result of the low RAM? Would increasing that make it run faster?

😕 Please help!

 

[mcgarry]

How good in "real life work" is the Gfx Go 5200 and how much better is the ATi Mobility 9700 😕
Also what is the difference between a normal gfx 5200 and a "Go" 5200/ ATi "mobility" series is it just the names or 😕

I'll pile on to what dferrara said with some more detail that may or may not be helpful ...

Here's one review of the Go5200. Note that their tested version uses only 32MB VRAM, and the testing site lists some other caveats and conditions that may not apply to the PB. I don't know how trustworthy this site is, but at least it's something. Also check out various tests on www.barefeats.com and www.macspeedzone.com for comparisons of the Go5200 and the 9700 as used in the computers we're talking about here.

The general consensus seems to be that while the 9700 is clearly superior by most performance metrics we can throw at it, the aged Go5200 is not all that out of place in a notebook the size of the 12" PB. I have not looked a lot at this, so I could be wrong, but many if not most of the small-ish 12" PC notebooks I've seen still don't even have dedicated GPUs, or have only 32MB VRAM. So compared to other notebooks its size, the 12" doesn't lag too much, at least on paper, in graphics performance. But compared to almost everything larger, the opposite is probably true.

 

[mcgarry]

thanks... that helps. So here's what it comes down to for me: Right Machine/Not Quite Right Software vs. Right Software/Not Quite Right Machine (And mcgarry when I say 'right' and 'not quite right' I dont mean for everybody I mean subjectively for me)

and... um... I'm a dude... 😎

No problem, that's the only "right" that matters!

And seriously, the HD speed difference could make up for a lot of the FSB/CPU gains of the P-M in this particular case. I/O can be a much bigger bottleneck in many cases, of course it all depends on what you're doing.

 

[Southbridge]

No problem, that's the only "right" that matters!

And seriously, the HD speed difference could make up for a lot of the FSB/CPU gains of the P-M in this particular case. I/O can be a much bigger bottleneck in many cases, of course it all depends on what you're doing.

hey man... this is for you:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4170591.stm

😛

yeah... but the HD speed only matters when you're loading, copying or saving stuff... not when the program you're using is already in memory

 

[mcgarry]

hey man... this is for you:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4170591.stm

😛

yeah... but the HD speed only matters when you're loading, copying or saving stuff... not when the program you're using is already in memory

whoa wow wait ... some people, somewhere, like some product, made by some company? Stop the presses! This is amazing news!

I know, I'm being a dork about this, it's just I personally don't feel this stuff should have any influence on people's decision as to what computer to buy. Of course, I realize it does. These are computers, tools, machines, after all, and whatever cultural significance someone chooses to attach is entirely up to them. It's so supremely subjective, I just don't think it really has anything to do with what anyone can say to anyone else about buying a particular computer or not. But if this stuff interests you, I know, I should just give it a rest. Sorry for making a big deal out of it, for taking the bait. I won't mention it again in this discussion, and I hope you'll join me, but of course that's totally up to you.

as for the 2nd part, yeah, like I have said all along, it depends on what you're doing.

 

[Southbridge]

whoa wow wait ... some people, somewhere, like some product, made by some company? Stop the presses! This is amazing news!

I know, I'm being a dork about this, it's just I personally don't feel this stuff should have any influence on people's decision as to what computer to buy. Of course, I realize it does. These are computers, tools, machines, after all, and whatever cultural significance someone chooses to attach is entirely up to them. It's so supremely subjective, I just don't think it really has anything to do with what anyone can say to anyone else about buying a particular computer or not. But if this stuff interests you, I know, I should just give it a rest. Sorry for making a big deal out of it, for taking the bait. I won't mention it again in this discussion, and I hope you'll join me, but of course that's totally up to you.

as for the 2nd part, yeah, like I have said all along, it depends on what you're doing.

you're really offended by the whole marketing aspect huh? Thats interesting... Ok... no more. I was just kidding with posting the link.

ok... I'm off to compUSA.

 

[mcgarry]

Well, by this thread's standards, this is on-topic, so why not post it:

I just used a friends's Vaio Z1 for a while. Yes, it is an older model, but it does have a P-M at 1.3 GHz, FSB at 400MHz, and 1MB L2. The CPU speed is nearly identical, numbers-wise, to my PB, and the FSB and Cache are of course better. Also, his had only 512MB RAM installed, and mine has 768.

My time on it left me wondering why this Vaio felt so dog-slow, and by a LOT, not just slightly. By the numbers, it should have at least felt as good as my PB. And mine doesn't even have the faster HD. We weren't doing anything intense on it, some file copying between partitions, a little iTunes playing, nothing really unusual at all. But this thing was struggling perceptibly, choppy and halting at every task, and launching apps--even just IE-- took forever. General system use was painful. Trying to do more than one thing at once sent the computer lurching.

Also, on a minor note, the speakers on my PB sounded a lot better and more clear to me than those on the Z1, playing both speech and music. Having the third speaker might help, and could be important to some people, though personally I think most use will be when plugged in to a nice set of powered speakers. Still, it's worth mentioning that the PB's built-in speakers are pretty good for their size.

I suspect the spyware/virus program he has running may have been a drain. But we were on a public campus network, so it's probably wise to have it on. Of course they are unnecessary on my PB, and that may translate to a real, tangible advantage even in terms of everyday speed, but that is just one of so many factors to consider when talking about performance.

My point is NOT that because of this experience I will leap to the conclusion that P-M laptops are slower than G4-- I don't at all believe that to be the case. My point, as I've been saying all along about these speed comparisons, is that there are so many variables involved, and we are not talking about anything near test conditions, in my example, or in almost anything you'll find at CompUSA. Different experiences can get different results, and what works for you can be totally different than what works better for others.

Southbridge, I sincerely hope you enjoy your new computer, whatever it is. For the legwork you've put in researching your purchase, you deserve nothing less.

 

[Southbridge]

Goddamnit! I still cant decide. I started out at CompUSA and now I'm here at the Soho Apple Store posting this on a 12" PB... okay... hypothetical question... (maybe I should start a new thread) If you had to give up one of the following three qualities in a laptop what would it be:


1) Portability/Size/Battery Life
2) OS
3) Screen Quality

You can only choose 2 of the 3.

 

[mcgarry]

Goddamnit! I still cant decide. I started out at CompUSA and now I'm here at the Soho Apple Store posting this on a 12" PB... okay... hypothetical question... (maybe I should start a new thread) If you had to give up one of the following three qualities in a laptop what would it be:


1) Portability/Size/Battery Life
2) OS
3) Screen Quality

You can only choose 2 of the 3.

Personally, I think 1 is inherenly important to a laptop. If I'm getting a laptop, that has to be a priority, to some extent. 2 is very important to me, as it affects everything I do with the computer in at least some way. You never turn off the OS, within reason. 3 is the least important to me because I have a monitor I can hook up at home for stuff that needs more space (that has turned out to be incredibly rare). My PB functions as a portable desktop replacement, which sometime means just a desktop. I also think screen quality, like everything else, can be subjective. I've played with the X-Brite screens and such (at Best Buy, no less) and wasn't that impressed. I wanted to turn them down in a way that I couldn't, but that's just a personal taste thing, and probably has to do with me not being used to them and maybe not even knowing how to adjust everything about them properly.

 

[Southbridge]

Personally, I think 1 is inherenly important to a laptop. If I'm getting a laptop, that has to be a priority, to some extent. 2 is very important to me, as it affects everything I do with the computer in at least some way. You never turn off the OS, within reason. 3 is the least important to me because I have a monitor I can hook up at home for stuff that needs more space. My PB functions as a portable desktop replacement, which sometime means just a desktop. I also think screen quality, like everything else, can be subjective. I've played with the X-Brite screens and such (at Best Buy, no less) and wasn't that impressed. I wanted to turn them down in a way that I couldn't, but that's just a personal taste thing, and probably has to do with me not being used to them and maybe not even knowing how to adjust everything about them properly.

this wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that you have a 12" powerbook would it?

no... you're right though...

to pose my questions a little differently:

Is it easier to get used to a computer that is a little bulkier and whose battery doesnt last as long?

Is it easier to get used to a computer where the OS is not as engaging?

Is it easier to get used to a computer where it doesn't have the greatest screen?

 

[mcgarry]

this wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that you have a 12" powerbook would it?

no... you're right though...

Well, of course it does. Of course what my priorities are in a laptop has something to do with what I bought: how else did I decide to buy it, even when compared to other Macs? Just as whatever you buy will, in your opinion, suit your needs and priorities best.

 

[h0e0h]

i'm using the 12" right now and for what im doing (adium x, and forums) i seem to have more than ample space. In your list of 3 though, i would definatley say that number 3 is the least important to me. The most important wouldn't even be size, but simply battery life. Then the OS, then the size. Think about the battery. Being a college student always on the go, especially w/ my PB right next to me, the battery life is more than important. And when i say right next to me, one time i made my GF ride in the back seat because my PB was riding shotgun as i was burning a DVD (for a project that i was on my way to present) and playing iTunes through my stereo. There's my take... good luck man

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

Anyone know why the 12 inch pb gets hotter than my 12 inch ibook?? Seems odd.

 

[h0e0h]

Anyone know why the 12 inch pb gets hotter than my 12 inch ibook?? Seems odd.

if i were to speculate its because that aluminum is a better conductor of heat than plastic...

 

[mcgarry]

Anyone know why the 12 inch pb gets hotter than my 12 inch ibook?? Seems odd.

yeah, like h0e0h said; it's the same reason you can't use the iBook in true clamshell mode -- the plastic does not have the same conductivity qualities.

Check around on the product pages of some high-end external HDs. You'll note that a lot of them are aluminum encased, and tout their heat-dissipating qualities. Some of that's marketing, sure, and trying to match other designs, but there is certainly some truth to it.

On the other hand, I don't think the difference is that major, though my experience with G4 iBooks is minimal. My PB doesn't get that hot compared at least to most PC laptops with which I have experience, although to be fair I almost never use it directly on my lap. The spot that I've noticed gets the warmest is on top, by where the power cord plugs in, and obviously I don't normally have a need to be touching it there.

Also, yeah, maybe just that there's more going on in the PB: faster stuff, etc.

 

[h0e0h]

The spot that I've noticed gets the warmest is on top, by where the power cord plugs in, and obviously I don't normally have a need to be touching it there.

Also, yeah, maybe just that there's more going on in the PB: faster stuff, etc.

Where my 12" gets the hottest seems to be where the display and the keyboard connect. I don't know why I was touching it, but i was curious after about 4 hours of heavy and continual use and i found that that, and right where the HD seems to rest are the 2 warmest spots.

 

[Jsmit]

I believe the PB actualy stays cooler inside, because as heOeh said the aluminum conducts the heat away. I would rather the term warmer than hotter since the latter PowerBook revisions never actuaaly get hot.

For a laptop, I would say the screen has to be the least important of the three qualityes you listed... perhaps why I also chose the 12" PB.

I would then give up a little portabily in order to get the OS I wanted. When you enjoy one OS over another the way I enjoy OS X or Windows, you will sacrafice a lot forit.

Are refering to the 15" PB when talking about portability, since the Sony and 12" PB to be about equal in regards to portability? In regards to battery life of the 15" PB remember the batteries are hot swappable meaning you can put the PB to sleep and swap the battery with a fully charged one, then wake it up andyou are where you started. The 12" does not have this function. Only problemis you have to lug that extra battery around.

 

[h0e0h]

since i started using the iCurve though, the temperature (to the touch) has seemed to decrease significantly. I highly recommend it... i mean it's only 30 bucks from jr.com and i can easily store my vid camera and cardreader under it. I love it, and i love the bluetooth keyboard from apple that i purchased to accompany it. You really should give it a shot.

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

if i were to speculate its because that aluminum is a better conductor of heat than plastic...

The vents on my ibook are huge. Theres one in the back and its a big rectangle of vents. the pb seems like it has smaller vents.

 

[mcgarry]

The vents on my ibook are huge. Theres one in the back and its a big rectangle of vents. the pb seems like it has smaller vents.

Maybe, the PB itself is also a bit smaller; more importantly, the entire length of the hinge has a vent under it, I don't think you can tell from the pix on the website, but maybe you have seen this. It spans more than half the width of the back of the PB. In any case, since its case conducts-- rather than blocks-- heat, it might not need as many vents. That's why it can operate fully closed, but the iBook needs the kb area to vent still more.

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

Maybe, the PB itself is also a bit smaller; more importantly, the entire length of the hinge has a vent under it, I don't think you can tell from the pix on the website, but maybe you have seen this. It spans more than half the width of the back of the PB. In any case, since its case conducts-- rather than blocks-- heat, it might not need as many vents. That's why it can operate fully closed, but the iBook needs the kb area to vent still more.

Thats so strange. I never feel any heat from my keyboard. 😕

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

I didnt want to start a whole new thread for this. So ill just ask it here. My friend has a ti pb 1gh, and he just recently went to the apple store and got a whole new case!? I didnt know this was possible. He said he got it because the paint was chipping. He paid like 300 bucks i think. Can you do this for the aluminum pb to? Isnt there a lot involved in replacing the whole case of a pb?

 

[jackieonasses]

Thats so strange. I never feel any heat from my keyboard. 😕

But it happens. Okay? The argument on what gets hotter is definitely a tough question to answer. Just use the program "Temperature Monitor" to give a good basis on everything. Every one of your posts has something to do with ibook vs. powerbooks and heat.


The newest of the Powerbooks has MUCH better heat dissipation and the fans come on much less.


kyle

 

[CaptainCaveMann]

But it happens. Okay? The argument on what gets hotter is definitely a tough question to answer. Just use the program "Temperature Monitor" to give a good basis on everything. Every one of your posts has something to do with ibook vs. powerbooks and heat.


The newest of the Powerbooks has MUCH better heat dissipation and the fans come on much less.


kyle

And every single one of your posts is bad mouthing somebody else for their post. Get a life dude and stay off my nutz. 🙄

 

[Southbridge]

ok guys. I bought a laptop. I'll tell you about it later.