1st Ever Dualcore Athlon 64 X2 Benchmarks...Watch out G5

jiggie2g

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Apr 12, 2003
491
0
Brooklyn,NY
well last night I came across this , the 1st benchmarks for the new Dualcore Athlon 64 X2 , comes in 4800+ (Dual 2.4ghz 1MB+1MB L2), 4600+(Dual 2.2ghz 1MB+1MB L2) , 4400+(Dual 2.2ghz 512k+512K L2) , 4200+(Dual 2.0ghz 512K+512K L2).

Here are the Cinebench #'s http://www.elitebastards.com/#news9950 and here

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http://www.hwupgrade.it/articoli/1193/index.html&langpair=it|en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools


as you can see the 4800+ just massacared the super hyped Pentium EE 840 dual 3.2ghz w/HT and 1MB L2 per core. These number also come amazingly close to the Dual 2.5ghz G5's Cinebeanch score on barefeats http://www.barefeats.com/macvpc.html

These Processor are expected to be on sale by Late June and are going 2 kick ass. can't wait till I see OC'd results. Apple had better come up with something Quick or else it will lose even more in the performance segment.

If AMD sell's the 4600+ for Under $500 Apple and Intel will be screwed. as most people will just get it for the 1MB L2's and OC it up to 2.7-2.8-2.9ghz since thats what the new Venice core Athlon 64's seem to be hitting.
 

Dont Hurt Me

macrumors 603
Dec 21, 2002
6,056
6
Yahooville S.C.
Very sweet and if you are lucky enough to have a socket 939 machine you could just pop one of these very fast chips into your machine and have a screamer. Wow It could peg those monitor refresh rates in games. 75+ FPS at 1280 x 1024 in everything would be nice.
 

jiggie2g

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Apr 12, 2003
491
0
Brooklyn,NY
Dont Hurt Me said:
Very sweet and if you are lucky enough to have a socket 939 machine you could just pop one of these very fast chips into your machine and have a screamer. Wow It could peg those monitor refresh rates in games. 75+ FPS at 1280 x 1024 in everything would be nice.

Yeap , I am running an Athlon XP 2400+@ 2.2ghz(3200+ speed) , but I have a Socket 939 DFI Lanparty UT NF4 Ultra-D(SLI Modded) on my shelf waiting to De-Virginized by this cpu.
 

Mav451

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2003
1,657
0
Maryland
The rumor mills saying that NDA is lifted on the 21st...which is when your major sites can release their bench/reviews of it.

I'd be keeping an eye on Tech Report/Xbit/Anandtech/[H]/PcPer for updates over the next week...
 

plinden

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2004
3,969
3
How much is it expected to cost? I see the Athlon 64 4000+ single core is $525 - $874 on pricegrabber. (I know the $874 price is ridiculous - although I'm a Mac fan and the next computer I get will be a Mac, I will still need a PC and expect to build my next one myself. I'm genuinely interested in this)
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
21
UK
whats going to happen to the fx? the fx is the fastest AMD chip available so i'm thinking the fx-57 will be a dual core 2.6GHz monster.
 

Mav451

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2003
1,657
0
Maryland
plinden said:
How much is it expected to cost? I see the Athlon 64 4000+ single core is $525 - $874 on pricegrabber. (I know the $874 price is ridiculous - although I'm a Mac fan and the next computer I get will be a Mac, I will still need a PC and expect to build my next one myself. I'm genuinely interested in this)
The 4000+ is really the same as the FX-53.

Both are:
  • 2.4Ghz
  • 1MB L2 cache.
  • Socket 939 (which means you can use any kind of DC ram, not registered, for those who haven't been aware of the changes since the Socket 940 FX-51).

The difference lies in the locked multiplier. The 4000+ can only go down (12x and down), while the FX-53 is completely unlocked both up and down. Generally, this means that OCing with the 4000+ will be memory bound, while on the FX-53 is it vcore/memory bound (your choice though).

Of course, if you don't give a damn about OCing in general, just take the 4000+ since AMD likes to gouge people when they buy FX-series chips (keeping prices $800+).
 

Mav451

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2003
1,657
0
Maryland
Hector said:
whats going to happen to the fx? the fx is the fastest AMD chip available so i'm thinking the fx-57 will be a dual core 2.6GHz monster.
Probably will work em down to (multiplier-locked) 939 equivalents. AMD doesn't want to just "lower the price" for the FX, otherwise they will lose significantly on the profit margins. Kinda like how Intel (somehow) convinces people to buy their $1,000 EE series CPUs, AMD wants to do that with their $800+ FX-series.
 

calyxman

macrumors 6502a
Apr 17, 2005
610
0
Very interesting. AMD has been kicking tail in the permformance category and it would be nice if Apple would dump the Power PC and switch to AMD.

I'd like to see this stuff get into the Notebook market in the coming year. I have a new notebook on its way but it will only sport the Sempron 3000+. In a year down the road I'd like to have a notebook with a dual core processor.
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
21
UK
a new cpu would have to be about 4 times faster at the same cost and heat output for apple to switch architectures and show groth potential which x86 dose not, the G5 still beat the dual core 2.4GHz athlon, albeit by a small margin it still got beaten.

apple has a major G5 update to pull out of it's hat you can be sure of that, apple dosent give out it's hardware to toms hardware before it's released :(
 

wdlove

macrumors P6
Oct 20, 2002
16,570
0
That Anthlon still won't have the ease of use of a Mac. Windows run like Windows.

An update from Apple is due momentarily, we need to give them a chance to produce.
 

jiggie2g

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Apr 12, 2003
491
0
Brooklyn,NY
Hector said:
a new cpu would have to be about 4 times faster at the same cost and heat output for apple to switch architectures and show groth potential which x86 dose not, the G5 still beat the dual core 2.4GHz athlon, albeit by a small margin it still got beaten.

apple has a major G5 update to pull out of it's hat you can be sure of that, apple dosent give out it's hardware to toms hardware before it's released

What 5 Points on Cinebench , you guys are really petty. Not to mention that the G5 is clocked 2.5ghz vs. 2.4ghz , the G5 also has a 1.25ghz FSB vs. 1ghz. Not making excuses but i call this a virtual tie as 5 point out of over 640 is with in the margin of error for most benchmark, meaning when the numbers are that close the results will vary from test to test. I bet if the guy running the test put some OCZ or Corsair 2-2-2-5 DDR3200 ram it would bump that Athlon another 15-20 points.

Either way those Dual G5's have lost thier only advantage in Multitreading. plus you are talking about a $3000 G5 vs. what maybe a desktop thats cost $1000-1300 less. I expect the 4800+ to sell for about $700 at 1st then drop in about a month or two.

But if you think 5 points is worth an extra grand or so be my guest , me personally i'd put that money towards the purchase of a new Dell 24in Widescreen Monitior. :D

Plus you guys haven't forgotten the final detail , do you really think the Geeks that buy this CPU are gonna run this baby at stock speeds anywayz. I can already see guys running this bitch at 2.7-2.8 ghz on Air / 3.0-3.2ghz prime stable with water.

Here's my Dual core Cooler kit :

http://www.coolermaster.com/index.php?LT=english&Language_s=2&url_place=product&p_serial=RL-MUA-E8U1 / EBU1&other_title=+RL-MUA-E8U1 / EBU1+AQUAGATE Mini R80 / R120


P.S. 4 Times the performance and same heat at the same Price LOL , I think you and Apple are having Delusions of Grandeur.

As far as growth Potential it's been nearly 2yrs now for the G5 to show it's true colors and I must say i'm not impressed. It's going on a year since the 2.5ghz G5 was released and now we hear of a minor 200mhz increase and lack of PCIe to add further insult a Vanilla 9600 card. Yeah Hector REAL GROWTH POTENTIAL. :rolleyes:

Apple Might as well make a Blue Gene Mini , or Power Mac Power 5 while thier at it along with other vaporware. Face it's the G5 was a noble effort on apples part to get back in the game but IBM has become thier new Motorola(and we all know what happened with them). It's time to declare the G5 as a failed experiment b4 IBM finishes off the job Motorolla started , that puttin Apple in the grave.

Since you work for Apple , how bout you and Darth Vader use the Force to get Apples whole computer platform off it's ass.
 

Mav451

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2003
1,657
0
Maryland
Eh...as much as Coolermaster (well used to) make good cases, I've had mostly noisy experiences with their heatsink/fan combos. And its not to heart-warming to see reviewers criticizing the noise levels of the radiators.

Then again, the only W/C setup i have heard and seen is the noiseless blue tower based one. Don't remember who makes it off the top of my head tho...
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
21
UK
the AMD has a bi-directional bus so it's more like 2GHz dual channel ram and the benefit of two die's being right next to each other

cine bench has always been an app that favors pc's the g5 dose allot better in other things like after effects and bryce.

clock for clock in some benches the athlon wins and in some the g5 wins, a 100MHz speed advantage is nothing major for AMD.

the g5 has scaled well, stop being stupid and look at the facts.

overclockers are a minority, we dont give a ****, ALL my macs are overclocked in some way but i dont go round saying much much better they are overclocked than a pc that cost the same as them when they came out.


(zlaman makes the reserator btw mav, inovatec make passive WC stuff too but it way expencive)
 

jiggie2g

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Apr 12, 2003
491
0
Brooklyn,NY
Hector said:
the AMD has a bi-directional bus so it's more like 2GHz dual channel ram and the benefit of two die's being right next to each other

cine bench has always been an app that favors pc's the g5 dose allot better in other things like after effects and bryce.

clock for clock in some benches the athlon wins and in some the g5 wins, a 100MHz speed advantage is nothing major for AMD.

the g5 has scaled well, stop being stupid and look at the facts.

overclockers are a minority, we dont give a ****, ALL my macs are overclocked in some way but i dont go round saying much much better they are overclocked than a pc that cost the same as them when they came out.


(zlaman makes the reserator btw mav, inovatec make passive WC stuff too but it way expencive)
Excuse me I thought the G5 was bi-directional because it also used HyperTransport.

The G5 scaled well with Water cooling , that's cheating and in fact is simply overclocking. crap if we are gonna trade blows with water cooling I will personally post my results in Cinebench as soon as I get my Dualcore CPU come June/July(Whenever Newegg gets them). I'll water cool also except I will be hitting 3.0ghz or 3.2ghz and u can see Cinebench scores in the mid 700's or even break 800.

you gotta wonder why they are only bumping the G5 to 2.7ghz, very fishy. Where's the PCIe. Radeon 9650 256MB DDR ..LOL

All I will say Apple had better get thier act together this year cuz in 2006 the floodgates will open. AMD with introduce Socket 1207 w/ DDR2 667-800mhz , Virtulization(AMD Hypertreading).

Intel will Introduce it's DC Pentium M(Yonah)65nm fab it will also run DDR2 667mhz. I'm sure Intel will also Kills the P4 goodbye and replace it's desktops with Pentium M.
 

calyxman

macrumors 6502a
Apr 17, 2005
610
0
jiggie2g said:
Excuse me I thought the G5 was bi-directional because it also used HyperTransport.

The G5 scaled well with Water cooling , that's cheating and in fact is simply overclocking. crap if we are gonna trade blows with water cooling I will personally post my results in Cinebench as soon as I get my Dualcore CPU come June/July(Whenever Newegg gets them). I'll water cool also except I will be hitting 3.0ghz or 3.2ghz and u can see Cinebench scores in the mid 700's or even break 800.

you gotta wonder why they are only bumping the G5 to 2.7ghz, very fishy. Where's the PCIe. Radeon 9650 256MB DDR ..LOL

All I will say Apple had better get thier act together this year cuz in 2006 the floodgates will open. AMD with introduce Socket 1207 w/ DDR2 667-800mhz , Virtulization(AMD Hypertreading).

Intel will Introduce it's DC Pentium M(Yonah)65nm fab it will also run DDR2 667mhz. I'm sure Intel will also Kills the P4 goodbye and replace it's desktops with Pentium M.
Any word whether AMD will be using dual core in the notebook market? I think some manufacturers use socket 939 in their notebook line (including HP).
 

plinden

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2004
3,969
3
jiggie2g said:
I expect the 4800+ to sell for about $700 at 1st then drop in about a month or two.
What are you smoking? AMD's current fastest CPU (AMD Athlon 64 FX-55) is $816 on newegg, and $1 cheaper OEM. You really think they're going to sell their dual cores for less?
 

rt_brained

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2002
554
0
Creativille
Someone oughtta create benchmark software to test how quickly viruses and spyware take over computers running these chips. I'll bet those new AMD chips running Windows will wipe the dual G5/OS X systems off the map in that regard.
 

Mord

macrumors G4
Aug 24, 2003
10,091
21
UK
jiggie2g said:
Excuse me I thought the G5 was bi-directional because it also used HyperTransport.
nope it uses an elastic IO bus the IO uses HTT


jiggie2g said:
The G5 scaled well with Water cooling , that's cheating and in fact is simply overclocking. crap if we are gonna trade blows with water cooling I will personally post my results in Cinebench as soon as I get my Dualcore CPU come June/July(Whenever Newegg gets them). I'll water cool also except I will be hitting 3.0ghz or 3.2ghz and u can see Cinebench scores in the mid 700's or even break 800.
the watercooling is not required it's just to reduce noise the g5 is far quieter than most pc's and apple did not want to loose the quietness with the g5, the 2.5GHz 970fx uses the same amount of power as a 2GHz 970 just in a smaller area, still far far less heat than any p4 and a little less than most AMD's

jiggie2g said:
you gotta wonder why they are only bumping the G5 to 2.7ghz, very fishy. Where's the PCIe. Radeon 9650 256MB DDR ..LOL
that rumors is BS and 9650 was a typo no such card exists.

jiggie2g said:
All I will say Apple had better get thier act together this year cuz in 2006 the floodgates will open. AMD with introduce Socket 1207 w/ DDR2 667-800mhz , Virtulization(AMD Hypertreading).

Intel will Introduce it's DC Pentium M(Yonah)65nm fab it will also run DDR2 667mhz. I'm sure Intel will also Kills the P4 goodbye and replace it's desktops with Pentium M.
thats the thing AMD will in the future, they are open about there plans apple is not say AMD owns when they acctually come out with the goods.
 

plinden

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2004
3,969
3
rt_brained said:
Someone oughtta create benchmark software to test how quickly viruses and spyware take over computers running these chips. I'll bet those new AMD chips running Windows will wipe the dual G5/OS X systems off the map in that regard.
Remmber, Windows is not the only OS you can run on x86 machines.

My ideal setup would be, 12" iBook for my wife, 15" PowerBook with VPC for the few PC programs I need for me (it would also play Medal of Honor, SimCity4 and Civ 3 fine), and a Linux box for CPU and hard drive intensive tasks like Java compilation.

For all that, I wouldn't need a dual core AMD.

Anandtech has an interesting view of user experience with dual core CPUs when using Windows (http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2388&p=15)

Hyperthreading and dual core CPUs avoid the dreaded lockup that you get with Windows trying to do too much at once. Even when using single threaded applications dual core helps. Since Linux and Mac OS X have better multithreaded operation (I've never had my very low spec Linux machine lock up like my non-hyperthreaded PCs do), multiple cores won't help them in the same way.
 

~loserman~

macrumors 6502a
jiggie2g said:
All I will say Apple had better get thier act together this year cuz in 2006 the floodgates will open. AMD with introduce Socket 1207 w/ DDR2 667-800mhz , Virtulization(AMD Hypertreading).
If Both Intel and AMD made processors that were 2 to 3 times as fast as the PPC970 series it wouldn't affect Apples sales at all.
Of course this is tongue and cheek because it won't ever happen anyway.


Apple enjoys the most loyal installed base of users in the industry PERIOD.

They will continue to keep their sub 3% market share regardless of what happens in the PC world.
 

calyxman

macrumors 6502a
Apr 17, 2005
610
0
No offense but I don't think taking their user base for granted should excuse Apple from introducing better stuff at competitive pricing. And if Apple was so content with its 3% market share then there wouldn't be a need for a switch campaign or an effort to take the mac platform mainstream. Why else would they be aggressive in opening more and more retail stores? Do you think Apple will sit tight with a 3% market share and be happy with recurring business from mac loyalists? That's not how you grow your company.

Example: The most powerful notebook Apple has on the market is a G4 and the system costs well over $2000 if not close to $3000. That's inexcusable, even with the thermal challenges presented by the G5 the bottom line is PC notebook manufacturers are already coming out with more Powerful Pentium M and Athlon 64 proessors. Apple needs to respond. You may not see any reason for them to act, but I sure did and because of it, I decided against buying another mac.

If they want to keep their 3%, fine they can have it. I won't be part of it much longer.
 

rt_brained

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2002
554
0
Creativille
jiggie2g said:
If AMD sell's the 4600+ for Under $500 Apple and Intel will be screwed.
Right. And remember the 1930's when Germany used HYDROGEN, despite its volatility because it was much cheaper than the much more stable HELIUM?

AMD+Windows = Hindenburg+Hydrogen.
 

rt_brained

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2002
554
0
Creativille
plinden said:
Remmber, Windows is not the only OS you can run on x86 machines.
No, but Windows is the OS the overwhelming majority of x86 users use.

How many of the "gamers" who come to MacRumors to tout the latest and greatest AMD or Intel chips use something other than Windows as their primary OS?

They can't even use IE anymore. They're living in a house of cards and they know it.
 

plinden

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2004
3,969
3
rt_brained said:
Right. And remember the 1930's when Germany used HYDROGEN, despite its volatility because it was much cheaper than the much more stable HELIUM?

AMD+Windows = Hindenburg+Hydrogen.
Well, as it turned out, Germany used hydrogen because the US had cornered the market on helium and wouldn't sell them any. Not sure how that works into the analogy.