2007 Harpertown Stoakley-Seaburg Motherboard With New Graphics Cards 8-Core Mac Pro

[flappo]

Good for you flappo. I am sure you will enjoy it. People keep using this "next big thing" argument. I KNOW I will never get ahead, the next Mac Pros won't have the 45nm Xeons unless it hits in 08. Which means, I know now that I will be behind if the next Mac Pro is released before years end.

However, the Mac Pro has been stagnant for nearly a year. Waiting for the next update which is most likely months away is not on par with the "next best thing" argument. I simply don't want to buy year+ old technology at year+ old prices today.

If I can get an eight core Mac Pro for the same price I can today, why the hell wouldn't I wait? And don't mock us because you bought last years Mac. It isn't about needing 8-cores or a 1GB video card, it is about knowing what is happening in the market and not being a fool and purchasing it when you can get 8-cores and better video cards. I would call your purchase stupid, to be frank. But hey, you can make your own decisions, just like I can. So instead of sarcastically calling you stupid, I congratulate you on your Mac purchase like I do everyone else who has bought one. I hope this makes more sense to the "next best thing, you're gonna wait for ever, you will never catch up" crowd.

Just to illustrate further. I will use an example of why it is smart to wait. A colleague at work is building himself a nice core 2 duo computer this year. He, like most system builders knows about the Intel price drop coming at the end of the month. So, he waits. Do you know why? Becausr today the Q6600 is anywhere between $450 and $600 (It was on sale at Frys for $300 for the holiday). Do you know what it will be at the end of the month? $266. That is smart. And that is what most of us are doing here.

i'd love to wait , but i'm in a quandry

my dad's imac packed up and he was going to buy a new one

SO i managed to convince him to buy me a mac pro and i'd give him my imac in return , he wanted it asap , so who am i to disappoint the poor old chap ??

not that stupid , am i ?

hahaha

that's WHY i'm not that bothered about some incremental upgrades that may OR may not occur in the next 2-6 months

but if you are , good luck to ya

 

[suneohair]

i'd love to wait , but i'm in a quandry

my dad's imac packed up and he was going to buy a new one

SO i managed to convince him to buy me a mac pro and i'd give him my imac in return , he wanted it asap , so who am i to disappoint the poor old chap ??

not that stupid , am i ?

hahaha

that's WHY i'm not that bothered about some incremental upgrades that may OR may not occur in the next 2-6 months

but if you are , good luck to ya

Well you didn't say who it was for. That is a piece you left out. If you/he wants it right now, thats fine. Some people don't like to wait or don't understand hardware. I just don't understand why people feel compelled to come in here and bash others because they decide to wait. Which is essentially what you did.

And even in that post you did it. You are trying to downplay to upgrades and you are saying i am "bothered." I am not bothered, I am smart with my money. There is a big difference. It isn't the end of the world for me. I just wait. It sucks, but whatever. It is my choice to wait. And your choice to buy outdated hardware

I don't think it is a question of it not occurring, it is a question of when. And these incremental upgrades could be major, I am not going to mention the exhaustive list we already have going.

 

[ob81]

The next Mac Pro update is going to be huge, but I doubt that it will matter to many that are waiting for it, or who have already pulled the trigger. Don't be mad at yourself for wanting to buy now.

 

[flappo]

Well you didn't say who it was for. That is a piece you left out. If you/he wants it right now, thats fine. Some people don't like to wait or don't understand hardware. I just don't understand why people feel compelled to come in here and bash others because they decide to wait. Which is essentially what you did.

And even in that post you did it. You are trying to downplay to upgrades and you are saying i am "bothered." I am not bothered, I am smart with my money. There is a big difference. It isn't the end of the world for me. I just wait. It sucks, but whatever. It is my choice to wait. And your choice to buy outdated hardware

I don't think it is a question of it not occurring, it is a question of when. And these incremental upgrades could be major, I am not going to mention the exhaustive list we already have going.

i aplogise if i seemed like i was trolling you all , if you want to wait , i admire your patience , i really do !!

no doubt i'll be green with envy in a few months and think oh i wish i'd waited


i suppose i can always add the blu ray , new card and cpu upgrades later at a cost if i need to

 

[dartzorichalcos]

i suppose i can always add the blu ray

Here's a Blu-ray drive you can add to your Mac Pro.

 

[suneohair]

True, yo ucan upgrade the CPU later. But at a high cost. Lets say the Mac Pro goes all octo, 2.66Ghz octo at the base model.

Today, I buy the 2.66 quad. I wait a year. The 2.66 quad-core chip might be down to say, $400 (this is very low, I doubt it would happen). Thats $800 I need to upgrade and I can't even sell off my dual-core chips because they are worth nothing.

I have now paid $3300, for a computer I could have possibly waited for and gotten for $800 less.

Same thing with the GPU, it is very expensive to buy them from Apple. I think the X1900 is like what, $400. When you can add the high end card for like $250 when you buy it. Again costing you more.

Sure you can upgrade, but at a high cost. I don't want to pay that cost an I want to make sure I get in on a Mac Pro that is current. Regardless of new stuff coming around the corner, todays Mac Pro is not current for todays prices and hardware. That is why I won't buy.

Good luck though, and no worries.

 

[krunk]

Regardless of new stuff coming around the corner, todays Mac Pro is not current for todays prices and hardware. That is why I won't buy.

QFT. This is the crux of it. When I was a PC user, I preached the mantra of purchasing only last gen hardware and never waiting for the next big thing.

But PC's are a different world. Upgrades are cheap, 'the next big thing' comes in cycles of 6 weeks, and 'last gen hardware' is only 6mths old. And most importantly, the prices actually reflect this cycle.

In the mac world, upgrade cycles are measured in years, last gen hardware can be 2 years old, and upgrades cost a premium. And most importantly, prices do not change.

It should be noted, that if technology itself moved at the snails pace that Mac upgrades occur it would not be an issue. The issue comes into play when technology keeps barreling along while Apple charges a premium for dated equipment.

With all those factors come into account, it comes down to this for us waiters:

Buying 1 year old hardware at top of the line prices makes us feel like a chump. Like we've been suckered to an extent. For us, it's the same feeling someone would get if they bought a 2006 car and found out the lot across the street was selling the same model for a fraction of the cost and the 2007 for what we paid. You still might love the car, but it'd be bitter sweet.

 

[Multimedia]

$700 For A Blu-ray® Writer Is Not My Idea Of Such A Deal

The MCE Technologies Blu-ray Internal Recordable Drive for Apple Mac Pro and Power Mac is a Blu-ray drive you can add to your Mac Pro.

Yes but for $700 ?! I think I'll wait a little longer for the price to get down into the stratosphere before I buy one of those yet. And the 25GB blanks are almost $1 per GB too. I like being an early adopter as much as the next bloke, but this is still way beyond what fell comfortable paying. I recently bought more than 2 Terabytes of Seagate 750GB HDs for $600 (3 for $200 each). I'm going to have to have a very special reason to get into Blu-ray® while it costs this much.

But I agree Apple should be offering it just so they can begin to drive the price down on the street. I wonder what the diffusion time frame will be for Blu-ray® to reach the masses at $99 a drive and $1-$2 a blank?

 

[flappo]

Here's a Blu-ray drive you can add to your Mac Pro.

that's fantastic !!!

thanks a million !!

 

[dartzorichalcos]

I wonder what the diffusion time frame will be for Blu-ray® to reach the masses at $99 a drive and $1-$2 a blank?

I think that's anybody guess. I think Blue-ray will become standard in 2-3 years.
Here's more information about Blu-ray if you are interested.

 

[Wild-Bill]

It should be noted, that if technology itself moved at the snails pace that Mac upgrades occur it would not be an issue. The issue comes into play when technology keeps barreling along while Apple charges a premium for dated equipment.

Well put, krunk.

Buying 1 year old hardware at top of the line prices makes us feel like a chump. Like we've been suckered to an extent. For us, it's the same feeling someone would get if they bought a 2006 car and found out the lot across the street was selling the same model for a fraction of the cost and the 2007 for what we paid. You still might love the car, but it'd be bitter sweet.

Excellent analogy!

 

[flappo]

the only problem is is that apple do their own thing , they don't seem to be swayed by fashion or other things , sometimes they seem to do pretty daft things tbh

that's why it's so tricky buying a mac , nobody seems to know what's coming next . sometimes all this cloak and dagger secrecy is a pain in the ***

 

[krunk]

the only problem is is that apple do their own thing , they don't seem to be swayed by fashion or other things , sometimes they seem to do pretty daft things tbh

that's why it's so tricky buying a mac , nobody seems to know what's coming next . sometimes all this cloak and dagger secrecy is a pain in the ***

Very true. For example, I bought my first mac tower a couple of years ago after recently switching to mac from linux. Still thinking a little too much like a pc owner, I invested in the mac towers since they provided somewhat of an incremental upgrade path. In the first year I owned my mac, apple switched from AGP to PCI-X on all their towers. Making any future hardware upgrades in that category impossible for me.

This happens in PC world too, but it only translates into a motherboard or addon card upgrade. I realized that I'd have to buy an entirely new fully decked out Powermac just to get the possible option to upgrade a component. My entire system was obsolesced because of a video interface change.

6mths after that, they introduce switch to Intel. Within in a span of only 6mths, Apple obsolesced my entire system AND my Arch. I'm not upset or irked at this, I realised that's just how they work. I'm used to making compromises from using Linux as my primary desktop for so long. There were some lessons to be learned along the way. Like never buy anything until you verify it works not just from the product site, but from everyday users.

A lot of these lessons, such as the one above, directly translated into my Apple switch. Some were new. "Never buy at the end of a cycle or your purchase may be obsolescent by the time it reaches your door" and "Even the towers aren't truly able to be incrementaly upgraded" are two that I learned early on.

 

[AidenShaw]

PCI Express (PCIe®), not PCI-X

In the first year I owned my mac, apple switched from AGP to PCI-X on all their towers.

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Early 2005)" had 8X AGP graphics, and 3 PCI-X expansion slots.

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Late 2005)" had a x16 PCIe for the main graphics card, and two x8 PCIe and two x4 PCIe for expansion.

PCI-X is an earlier technology, not an abbreviation for PCI Express.

http://www.apple-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_early_05
http://www.apple-history.com/?page=...le-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_late_05


</pedantic>

 

[krunk]

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Early 2005)" had 8X AGP graphics, and 3 PCI-X expansion slots.

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Late 2005)" had a x16 PCIe for the main graphics card, and two x8 PCIe and two x4 PCIe for expansion.

PCI-X is an earlier technology, not an abbreviation for PCI Express.

http://www.apple-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_early_05
http://www.apple-history.com/?page=...le-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_late_05


</pedantic>

Hehe, yeah I always get them switched...though I do know their different I just stopped trying. However, the little history lesson serves as an even better example on just how flighty Apple is with compatibility.

 

[AidenShaw]

Hehe, yeah I always get them switched...though I do know their different I just stopped trying. However, the little history lesson serves as an even better example on just how flighty Apple is with compatibility.

Yes, on the PC side there's a smoother transition - for example the Intel Bad Axe 2 mobo has 2 PCI slots in addition to 3 PCIe slots....

http://www.intel.com/products/motherboard/D975XBX2/index.htm

 

[RichP]

But I agree Apple should be offering it just so they can begin to drive the price down on the street. I wonder what the diffusion time frame will be for Blu-ray® to reach the masses at $99 a drive and $1-$2 a blank?

Its hard to say, I remember when CD-Rs had a similar price structure, and it took..what..18-24 months before they were cheap enough to be a feasible and cost effective storage medium? Problem with BlueRay is that it is still competing with HD-DVD as the de-facto standard. It has first has to "win out" against the competition, then we will see the prices really fall. (Note: BlueRay will win out, how long before that is "official" remains to be seen..perhaps by christmas season?)

 

[suneohair]

What time do updates get done typically? PST 10:00am? It looks like another Tuesday has gone by...

 

[flappo]

haha

we told ya not to bother waiting

i bet in 3 months time you'll still be waiting for the supposed update !!

 

[suneohair]

Ok buddy.

 

[Multimedia]

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Early 2005)" had 8X AGP graphics, and 3 PCI-X expansion slots.

The "Power Macintosh G5 (Late 2005)" had a x16 PCIe for the main graphics card, and two x8 PCIe and two x4 PCIe for expansion.

PCI-X is an earlier technology, not an abbreviation for PCI Express.

http://www.apple-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_early_05
http://www.apple-history.com/?page=...le-history.com/?page=gallery&model=g5_late_05

I have to admit it's a rare time indeed when I catch you reporting anything with an error in it. But this is that one time Aiden. The video card is in the 16x slot. But there are only a total of 4 slots - only ONE 8x slot:

4. 4x
3. 8x
2. 4x
1. 16x

 

[awmazz]

It should be noted, that if technology itself moved at the snails pace that Mac upgrades occur it would not be an issue. The issue comes into play when technology keeps barreling along while Apple charges a premium for dated equipment.

Are there any retail PCs on the market right now which are both cheaper and more up to date than my recently acquired 8-Core Mac Pro?

Of course the Mac's graphics cards are dated, but the machine itself?

Personally in regards to Macs becoming outdated, I got my first Mac in 1989 (an SE/30 now running OS7.5.5, still on my desk, still working, connected to my ethernet network), and on through the PowerPC changeover in 1994 (the first 6100/60AV now running OS9.1, still on my desk, still working, connected to my ethernet network), then the change from OS9 to OSX, then now to Intel. What you are saying is correct that hardware-wise, Mac hardware has always rarely been upgradeable or backwards-compatible, eg switching from nubus to PCI to AGP to PCI-X to PCIe and then whatever next now renders the previous model isolated and virtually un-upgradeable without the help of third-parties (like Sonnet, Newtek, Asante etc).

But software-wise, through every one of those changes in the last 18 years the situation is the exact reverse and the upgradeability and backwards-compatibilty is awesome, even if every now and then it needs a tiny tweak. I'm running OSX 10.4.8 on a bank of 1999 G3 Blue&Whites. The 1989 SE/30 OS7.5 networking with OSX was only recently broken for the first time ever by the 10.4.8 update. I'm sure there's a fix though... but I digress...

What I'm trying to say is that Apple's OS means Macs have never been a disposable computer, thrown on the trash heap for being 'outdated' as soon as the next bit of whizz-bang technology comes along. What all this discussion about waiting for the next big thing shows to me is that the people waiting intend to be using their new Macs for a long time to come and simply want to get the longest life out of it. Just like with their older Macs. Not to be the first or the biggest or fastest, but to be the longest-lived. Which is a totally different mindset to upgrading PCs I think. The fact some Mac users are waiting for the next big hardware update shows how well the Macs they are currently using are holding up that they can still use them and so are able to wait. Plus, more importantly, they know that even if they don't upgrade their Macs anyway, they still won't be left behind with the next OSX 10.5, which will still work perfectly on their current Macs to improve their current experience anyway.

 

[emeldahay]

I got a MASSIVE need for render speed.

I got my fourth MACPRO on its way - 3 working away nicely now - 8 cores - 16BG in each machine now with a variety of gfx card. I buy all mem 3rd party.

Over next 6 weeks im ordering another eight macpros of same spec. My office aircon is already being pushed harder with three macpros pumping out their lovely hot air. Luckily I got good aircon.

I need render power now - I cant wait. These machines have changed my workflow siginificantly due to their speed, the best upgrades Ive ever made (I continue to use XP64) - My window is closing where I have to purchase these further 8 macpros. I dont have time to read up on things but this thread cought my eye. Is there ANY REAL info on when these new machines will be released?

I wont be bitter if I buy and then the next week apple release these new machines - I cant really hold off the purchases so I got no choice - just would be nice if any dates are known.

 

[awmazz]

12x 8-Core Mac pros - definitely puts you in the power user category! If they start paying for themselves pretty much immediately, there's no financial reason waiting for a performance bump at some unknown time in the near future as it could actually cost you money.

And yes, to answer your question, it is some unkown time in the future. Lots of info on Intel mobos and processors, but no info on the Macs themselves. 2 to 6 months is the best-guess time frame from what I've been reading. Within the next month, maybe a small price drop but that's about it.

 

[emeldahay]

Sort of knew that would be the case - Thye pay for themselves anyhow.

I got 4 30 inch apple on the three I have just now - one dual two singles - the fourth Macpro thats coming shortly I will VNC remotely into to control - the rest will probably be VNC too. I tried Gefen monitor switches previously for apple dispays but found reliability issues and poor customer service. VNC is ok to setup what I need it to do and then let them render.

If your time is money ythen ou have to go for whats available now rather than hold off IMHO. I havent looked back.