2011 MacBook Pros Crashing Under Load?

[cmaier]

No no no no I will not get any Macbook pro to apple do a press release or its on their web site .

And people at the store say yap man the problem is fix dude come get my Macbook pro .

I'm not going to the store with guy or girls looking at me like I'm from Mars and have to do a properties check at store to see the leatest fix.

Furthermore I'm going to give it some more days to make sure it is 100% fix with the latest update.

My feeling forget about the Macbook pro and just get the Macbook that I know will work no problem and have them up it to 4 GB RAM and get 500 GB hard-drive .Next year when other new Macbook pro come out get it and trade it in on the new Macbook pro on ebay.


I can see if I was getting 15' or 17 's but just getting 13' i5 what all the headache just get Macbook have them up it to 4 GB RAM and get 500 GB hard-drive .

You don't make any sense. You believe there is a bug, yes? Apple didn't press release the bug. Yet it existed.

And the very same people who first publicized the bug, how to reproduce it, etc., are now saying that the bug has been fixed.

 

[Reticent]

First post on this thread

Long time watcher, first time poster on this thread.

I have loved my MBP since I bought it, until I began to loathe it when I had GPU issues. 15" 2.2. Loved it until Civ V started crashing on me (second day I owned it).

I have returned my macbook three times. I am on my fourth computer, and the returns have all been done through the genius bar. I was having various issues, but all of them stemmed from the discrete GPU.

I ran the yes > /dev/null & this morning. Locked up. Then I installed 10.6.7. Ran the yes > /dev/null & until I cared to stop. The fans were running full blast and I had easily entered 40-50 of them. Nothing froze. I've been playing Civ V all night, making sure to quit when things start to slow down and the fans are running just to check it out. Nothing, no freezing.

10.6.7 fixed the problem. Though it should be noted that I am running gfxCardStatus and switching to the discrete GPU for Civ V.

Either way, 10.6.7 fixed my issues completely. I've read some bad reviews for the update, but I have not personally run into any of those problems.

I'm not trying to discount any issues anyone else is experiencing. I'm just adding my experience to this discussion. And someone can go ahead and rip on me if they want, that seems to be what many people do on this thread...

 

[Koinu]

No Joy With 10.6.7

yes, there is a fix for it. Nearly everyone who had problems seems now to have none. The tests which used to always reproduce the problem no longer do (for most). For the the few still having problems, there might actually be a hardware issue that needs fixing.

http://mbp-freeze.wikispaces.com/ :

Greetings,

I think the "(for most)" part here is critical... And it does make me refrain from asserting that there IS a fix yet...

After installing the 10.6.7 update, I thought everything was fixed... I couldn't force the system to crash at all with the same methods that reliably had caused an issue before -- but remember, some systems (including mine) did not crash ALL THE TIME with the tests -- there was an element of randomness to the problem.

Anyway, I thought it was "solved", so I started the process of re-transferring my data to the new machine -- fourteen hours after applying the update, I was just about ready to pull the switch -- and start using the new machine exclusively. Then, I tried a simple software installation -- of a product which had successfully installed on the new machine the first time around, but which I removed after the instabilities played up and I reformatted everything. 5 minutes into the installation, the same problem emerged -- things started hanging, the machine slowed to a crawl with application after application ceasing to respond until everything was locked. In other words, with nothing much happening on the machine, doing something that should never, ever cause a machine to hang, it simply locked up.

I see no difference in this behaviour before and after the update, although I do admit the update seems to have made a difference (and clearly, for many, it is moving the machine from "unusable" to "tolerable" -- I'll hold judgement on the "rock solid" rating for a few weeks)...

I thought it had been solved, based on bashing the machine for 12 hours to try to make it fail (and not succeeding -- maxed CPUs, videos, graphics switching, networking, disk transfers, all with no 3rd party software in the mix except for a single temperature monitor (which didn't create any issues while the machine was running through the tests)). I was wrong, and it failed, yet again, doing a mundane installation task.

It goes back tomorrow, and I will be getting a new machine shortly.

I do hope the problem has been solved for everyone else and mine is an anomaly (but from the other thread where we have been discussing this at length, there appear to be more "anomalies" than just mine)...

Best,

Scott

 

[nec207]

You don't make any sense. You believe there is a bug, yes? Apple didn't press release the bug. Yet it existed.

And the very same people who first publicized the bug, how to reproduce it, etc., are now saying that the bug has been fixed.

Because I look for source than a message board or some one saying the problem is fixed .You are no apple rep ?You are no source .


And as rule I never buy any thing defected I know about😱😱 with out the company say yap we found the bug this is the cause and here is the fix.

If I'm going to go to store buy new Macbook pro and take it home and no good have to download update than may or may not fix all problem and apple not telling anyone what the problem is I will stick to PC the fun road of being IT person 24/7.

Those days are long gone . If apple is going to be like windows I will stick to Linux.One thing I hated about windows is every week you have to download security patches , fixes and updates for all the sloppy programmers.

 

[z3cko]

Greetings,

I think the "(for most)" part here is critical... And it does make me refrain from asserting that there IS a fix yet...

this is exactly the point. while our two test machines here do not fail with the known reproductions of a freeze, they already froze on us four times (one did freeze 3 times, the other one once since 10.6.7 update).

of course, the freezes are not reproducible anymore, but random freezes do still exist! also, we are still waiting for replacement because the Macbook Pros get really hot and loud (fan noise).

I can really suggest to everyone who still has issues after the software "fix" to send back their machines to apple, because there definitely are hardware issues as well - maybe they are already sorted out with new orders/arrivals, time will tell.

 

[ztrafe]

69c on me 2011 MBP 15 2,2 i7 (100%cpu). I am happy. I most have a very well build mac 🙂 😀

 

[sotomsays]

🙂

69c on me 2011 MBP 15 2,2 i7 (100%cpu). I am happy. I most have a very well build mac 🙂 😀

Me too....my cpu is 49-53c surfing the web and or random stuff like mail. (when its idle ive seen it as low as 34c but i have not been looking too much for the lowest number) I put the system under what i thought would be heavy load ( minecraft, light room 3, cs5, mail, firefox, photobooth, iphoto, adium, and a 1080p trailer.) my cpu peaked at 89C. i changed the automatic switching also on and off every 15 minutes...nothing....initially i thought my cpu was running hot...but compared to the intel macbooks, macbookpros and imacs in the past, it seems to be running cooler than most...ON AN AVERAGE....I spoke to a "Tim" (a mac specialist) over the phone at apple, and he said "my macbook pro will get upto 118c." he didnt seem to worried about 89c.

http://www.intelmactemp.com/list

all i want to know is you hear all these horror stories, but apple sold millions of 2011 macbook pros, is it just a few hundred? I want to know who ISN'T expirencing this problem.

Every computer FREEZES, But if its a Hardware problem, Thats one thing....it seems like its just a bad kernal or something and software drivin...no need to worry IMHO.

 

[kukrisna]

all i want to know is you hear all these horror stories, but apple sold millions of 2011 macbook pros, is it just a few hundred? I want to know who ISN'T expirencing this problem.

Every computer FREEZES, But if its a Hardware problem, Thats one thing....it seems like its just a bad kernal or something and software drivin...no need to worry IMHO.

Well said. I agree that computers randomly freeze, though I can see how in this instance, it's rather vague as to whether the freezing is random or actually computer related (post-fix). And yeah, I also agree that perhaps forums magnify the real situation.

 

[nec207]

Well said. I agree that computers randomly freeze, though I can see how in this instance, it's rather vague as to whether the freezing is random or actually computer related (post-fix). And yeah, I also agree that perhaps forums magnify the real situation.

Read here http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1020&tstart=0

Some people are still having problems after the update.

 

[cmaier]

Read here http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1020&tstart=0

Some people are still having problems after the update.

That's because a small number of machines actually have hardware issues or other software issues caused by installing other software. See http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1050&tstart=0. This is true of any Mac (or any PC). Some small percentage of the hardware is faulty.

The specific problem that this thread is about no longer occurs. Even the people here who are posting about still having problems, do not have THE problem. For example, there is someone here who says the OS upgrade didn't fix his problem, but when he freezes up, his mouse cursor does not move - that's a DIFFERENT problem than the problem that was affecting every single MBP 15/17.

 

[nec207]

The 13' uses the Intel HD Graphics 3000 and both 15' and 17' use Intel HD Graphics 3000 and AMD Radeon HD 6xxxM .I was reading on other web site that may be the problem has it is trying use both .


The problem is only the 15' and 17'.The 13' does not seem to have had any problems.

 

[netcastle]

I just experienced this issue for the first time (been using the machine for just under a month now) when connected to an external display and, using gfxcardstatus, I switched from discrete to integrated. At that very moment everything froze on the screen except the mouse. Now I know that the integrated probably isn't meant to drive an external display so I am unconcerned (I just disconnected and rebooted), but I wonder if maybe the problem has something to do with switching from one to the other.

Also, anyone notice that the graphics seem slightly herky-jerky on an external display after the latest update?

 

[cmaier]

I just experienced this issue for the first time (been using the machine for just under a month now) when connected to an external display and, using gfxcardstatus, I switched from discrete to integrated. At that very moment everything froze on the screen except the mouse. Now I know that the integrated probably isn't meant to drive an external display so I am unconcerned (I just disconnected and rebooted), but I wonder if maybe the problem has something to do with switching from one to the other.

Also, anyone notice that the graphics seem slightly herky-jerky on an external display after the latest update?

This is likely not the same problem. Using a hack to override the OS at a low level to change GPUs, you should expect the occasional hiccup.

 

[netcastle]

This is likely not the same problem. Using a hack to override the OS at a low level to change GPUs, you should expect the occasional hiccup.

You're probably right.

I reverted back to 10.6.6 because it seemed like the graphics were a lot less smooth after the update, but now I'm not so sure. Maybe I'm being nit-picky.

 

[cmaier]

You're probably right.

I reverted back to 10.6.6 because it seemed like the graphics were a lot less smooth after the update, but now I'm not so sure. Maybe I'm being nit-picky.

At least on my 2011 17" MBP, the graphics are perfectly smooth and fluid. You may just need to reinstall.

 

[netcastle]

At least on my 2011 17" MBP, the graphics are perfectly smooth and fluid. You may just need to reinstall.

Full reinstall instead of a restore? I was hoping to avoid this. But, can't hurt I guess other than a few hours of lost productivity.

 

[nec207]

I just experienced this issue for the first time (been using the machine for just under a month now) when connected to an external display and, using gfxcardstatus, I switched from discrete to integrated. At that very moment everything froze on the screen except the mouse. Now I know that the integrated probably isn't meant to drive an external display so I am unconcerned (I just disconnected and rebooted), but I wonder if maybe the problem has something to do with switching from one to the other.

Also, anyone notice that the graphics seem slightly herky-jerky on an external display after the latest update?

Do you have the 15' and 17' ? The 13' does not seem to have this problem only the 15' and 17'

 

[blue22]

one source of the problem seemed to be the Thermal Paste coating???

Temperatures hitting 90C? That's a thermal trip, not normal operation.

I've done 2-day Minecraft map renders, as well as 4-hour HandBrake encodes (man this thing is fast!), and my CPU and GPU temperatures never exceed 65C. Granted, I've set my fans to be a bit more aggressive with Fan Control.

This sounds like poor thermal paste application ala the iFixit teardown, than just drivers. Drivers may be a part of it, but drivers aren't going to result in 25C higher temps than what should be seen.

This has nothing to do with graphics drivers, it has everything to do with build quality and using way too much thermal paste on the CPUs/GPUs, which spikes the tempertures to impossible levels, causing the CPU to stop working in order to protect itself.

I really wanted one of these machines, but I can't possibly buy one if the build quality is so poor.

Exactly what the new 2011 MBPs are experiencing is what I experienced multiple times on my 2007 iMac 2.4 a few years back while playing in new content areas of WoW - Burning Crusade.

The problem is related to the GPU that is running entirely too hot. The Radeon Mobility HD 2600 in my iMac would "lock up" in certain circumstances when there was high demand of the GPU. When the unit "locks up", the screen freezes, music still plays, background services are still available, but you cannot do anything but watch your cursor move around the screen.

I ended up installing SMC fan control for a quick fix, but eventually tore down the iMac and replaced the thermal paste on the CPU/GPU with Arctic Silver when I upgraded the hard drive to a 1TB WD Caviar Black.

Haven't had a problem since! With all the thermal paste iFixit discovered, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it was acting more like an insulator around the GPU die.

From the iFixit teardown of the new MBP:

"Holy thermal paste! Time will tell if the gobs of thermal paste applied to the CPU and GPU will cause overheating issues down the road."

http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/MacBook-Pro-15-Inch-Unibody-Early-2011-Teardown/4990/2

I bet its another thermal paste issue - like the original Macbook pros. 🙁

Have the machine in my sig, have photobooth open, have 8 yes > /dev/null & running and machine is fine, temps only get to 84C or so... It is running as I post this. This is NOT happening to all machines, this is likely due to (as said before) piss poor thermal paste applications - we all know the CPU's will throttle/shutdown before they melt themselves, my guess is that is what is happening here.

I'm surprised there isn't more talk about the gobs of thermal paste being applied. This seems to be largely a product of lousy manufacturing ie. improper application of thermal paste. It would explain why its inconsistent and some but not all are seeing the freezing issues.

Doing a software/firmware fix that throttles back the CPU/GPU is a bit of a lame fix, if the lousy manufacturing is causing the problem.

Given the inconsistent replies about the reproducibility of this problem I would say that this was about quality control in manufacturing. Many of us don't have this problem. It's unfortunate that some of you do, but my guess is that only a small percentage of 2011 mbp owners are experiencing this.

Even BMWs have their share of issues. That's life in the luxury world.

Now 6 machines from our office, 2 were replaced and the replacements do the same. Also stopped by the apple store, 3 there froze as well. Considering the numbers of machines that are having issues this seems bigger than the usual issues. Also a lot of the faults are intermittent, and some people reporting are using the base 2.0 systems which may be less susceptible. Mine was fine until handbrake and CINEMA 4D both killed it. Since then no faults even though I've been pushing it hard.

And if BMW has issues they usually do a recall..

Apple does recalls... usually after 1-2 years (by then most Apple users have bought new hardware.)

If I had to guess it would due to the loads of thermal paste Apple has applied during manufacture. My machine has had no issues with thermals since I reapplied the thermal paste on my machine.

If the overheating issue was caused in part by the potential of thermal paste being overly applied, then what are the steps that Apple will most likely take to address this specific problem? Or do we have to wait for a so-called "Rev. B" to arrive in stores?

Worse case scenario, if a MBP owner elects to "re-distribute" the thermal paste applied to the system themselves (using the iFixit thermal paste application) will this necessarily void your Apple warranty, even if this is known to be the problem caused by poor quality build by Apple? Even more importantl, will this approach actually prove effective in curbing the problem so many are experiencing with their new MBP's?

 

[blue22]

Some solutions thus far...

I haven't had any real trouble w/ my 2011 MBP 15" 2.2Ghz... and I often run under moderate-to-heavy load (executing high transaction rate JEE apps across multiple VMs for debug + verification testing). So, when I tried the "yes > /dev/null" test documented on the mbp-freeze wiki, I was surprised it froze up the computer almost immediately!

I'm happy to report, though, that after resetting the NVRAM/PRAM and also the SMC - I'm able to run all 3 proposed recreate scenarios from the wiki, simultaneously, without issue.

Hopefully other people have as much luck as I did -- just wanted to post it, to put some glimmer of hope out there for those of you planning to run home and test your machines later today.

(Note: I don't believe this is fixing it for everyone, but it did great for me... and even though I never encountered the crash before under normal usage, I'm glad to know it's now not reproducible)

I did some more tests and now I believe the issue is caused by the firmware controlling the fans not working properly.

First, I open photo booth (this is to activate the discrete graphic card) and do six "yes > /dev/null &" in terminal, the computer freezes within five seconds. Reproducible every time. The UI does not respond to anything. Just to make sure, I always have music playing in the background, and the music would continue to play, even change songs.

Next I use smcFanControl to force both of the fans to operate at their maximum speed, then repeat the above test. Now I couldn't freeze my computer any more, even with twelve "yes > /dev/null &" in terminal. I tested this for up to ten minutes and not a single freeze (considering without the fan speed tweaked the freeze occurs within seconds).

No the computer does not freeze in Windows in Bootcamp either, even when playing very demanding games for extended periods.

2.2 i7 6750 MacBook Pro

yes > /dev/null &
for a total of 8 times, once per logical core
Discrete 6750M running

My MacBook Pro FAILS

yes > /dev/null &
for a total of 8 times, once per logical core
Discrete Intel HD Graphics 3000 running


My MacBook Pro PASSES

So I'd say its a software issue hopefully....
The last day in my 14 day return window is in 2 days.....

Hmmm I really like this MBP but if this could be more than a software issue maybe I should return it now........... ****


UPDATE:
After installing the 10.6.7 update for 2011 MacBook Pros :

yes > /dev/null &
for a total of 8 times, once per logical core
Discrete 6750M running

My MacBook Pro PASSES

yes > /dev/null &
for a total of 8 times, once per logical core
Discrete Intel HD Graphics 3000 running


My MacBook Pro PASSES


So it looks like Apple have sorted this issue out very quickly, I am very happy that I don't have to return my newly purchased MacBook Pro.

🙂

Engadget claims 10.6.7 fixes the problem. Any trip reports?

Hi All,

I have tried to reproduce the problem with 10.6.7 with the test recommended by wiki; the mac (MBP 2.2 15" 2011) doesn't flinch. The fans spin up, but otherwise everything is stable. Previously (10.6.6), it was freezing right away.

For those that have updated their 2011 MBP's to 10.6.7 have your issues been resolved?

 

[blue22]

some still having problems after update; faulty hardware?

FWIW I have an '11 MBP 13" i5. No major prob but FireFox 3 often causes the graphics to break up. Doesn't happen in any other program. I upgraded to the Firefox 4 RC and no prob there. My previous MBP 13" C2D had no prob, so I blame the Intel graphics. We can all agree Intel graphics are horrible.

The freeze can't be reproduced in Windows so how can this be about build quality?
Right, It can't. It's software one way or another.

That is not entirely true. Even it is a hardware problem (and I have no idea whether it is or not), it could very well be that the MacOS driver is more optimized or tries to utilize a certain feature of the cpu/gpu that makes the hardware fail where the windows driver doesn't.
While it may be possible to circumvent the issue with a software patch (ie disabling that specific call) one could still think of it as a build/hardware problem, since the functionality should have been there.

T.

These lockups/freezes don't happen only during a heavy load.

My 15" 2.2 i7 freezes whenever it uses AMD gpu, no other conditions needed. Just like that.

I use the gfxCardStatus tool and work with Integrated Only option and it works 100% right 100% of the time, no issues here.
When I use Dynamic Switching or Discrete only - it is an instant freeze and nothing can help it then but a hard reset

In my case also Windows 7 installed via boot camp assistant is affected, leaving the gpu driver not usable and crashing the video all the time

I bet on firmware/driver issue and hope for a working fix

Usually when you're one of the first batches of people to buy a new item launch, you have a good chance of running into these kinds of issues. I guess the risk you have to take to have the latest and greatest before most other people do.

So much for that old phrase that "Macs just work" 😛

It sounds like the issue is when the OS has to switch graphics chips which could very well be a driver issue with the new AMD GPU's and the new style Sandy Bridge GPU's, AMD/ATi has never had as good of driver support as nVidia. I wonder if the problem occurs in Windows or Linux. I hope it's simply a driver issue or their could be a recall.

... After installing the 10.6.7 update, I thought everything was fixed... I couldn't force the system to crash at all with the same methods that reliably had caused an issue before -- but remember, some systems (including mine) did not crash ALL THE TIME with the tests -- there was an element of randomness to the problem.

...

I see no difference in this behaviour before and after the update, although I do admit the update seems to have made a difference (and clearly, for many, it is moving the machine from "unusable" to "tolerable" -- I'll hold judgement on the "rock solid" rating for a few weeks)...

Read here http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1020&tstart=0

Some people are still having problems after the update.

That's because a small number of machines actually have hardware issues or other software issues caused by installing other software. See http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1050&tstart=0. This is true of any Mac (or any PC). Some small percentage of the hardware is faulty.

The specific problem that this thread is about no longer occurs. Even the people here who are posting about still having problems, do not have THE problem. For example, there is someone here who says the OS upgrade didn't fix his problem, but when he freezes up, his mouse cursor does not move - that's a DIFFERENT problem than the problem that was affecting every single MBP 15/17.

Generally speaking, I do hope it's just a software bug that needs fixing, then that would mean there are less "bad apples" out there hardware-wise. But since some are still reporting problems after the OSX 10.6.7 update this is still a bit of a stressor to figure out how to fully resolve already.

 

[cmaier]

Generally speaking, I do hope it's just a software bug that needs fixing, then that would mean there are less "bad apples" out there hardware-wise. But since some are still reporting problems after the OSX 10.6.7 update this is still a bit of a stressor to figure out how to fully resolve already.

The folks still reporting problems (a very small %) either have real hardware problems (the symptoms vary from the originally-reported problem, in most cases), or other software issues.

 

[nec207]

The problem has been fixed read here http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2768351&start=1065&tstart=0

When i went to the apple store before the update, i could trigger this crash on EVERY machine. Every person i talked to on the irc could trigger this crash. Every machine i have had the issue.

After the update it's a completely different story. The crash is no longer possible. I can't make it happen on any machine i own, any floor model at the apple store. I have a friend who lives in california who went to HIS apple store and he can't trigger it on any of the floor models.


And if you still paranoid get 13'' it never had problem it was only the 15'' and 17 ''.

My take on it do to a driver problem.When people had problem it did not crash under windows 7 that mean it is not a hardware problem or overheading.

And it was crashing under load and the temp was not high thant means it was not overheading.

 

[z3cko]

there are REAL hardware issues

we recently received two replacement machines after hours and hours with apple care. (two weeks of waiting though) -- the new machines have NO ISSUES AT ALL, while the old machines get too hot and freeze randomly. so this looks like a real hardware issue - if you still got a problem with your macbook pro, let it be replaced by apple!

 

[serenesam]

"We can't ignore the throttling problem either. Under very heavy use, the small power supply is overwhelmed and the CPU temperature reaches a very high 97°C. Whether this causes problems in the long run remains to be seen. Luckily, most users will rarely bring such a high level of stress upon the hardware." - http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review...-GHz-quad-core-glare-type-screen.50346.0.html

 

[djsound]

Until Apple says it is fixed, it is not fixed.