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2016 Touch Bar...DEAD SSD!!!

CaptRB

CaptRB

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Oct 11, 2016
940
1,015
LA, California
My friend's 13" touch bar suffered a spill accident. I can't blame apple when fluid hits a machine, but what's interesting is that he tried to recover some stuff and took it to Apple. According to him, the spill was minor.

Apple could NOT retrieve anything off of the SSD and could do nothing after it failed to mount using their own device designed to rescue and transfer data.
Data recovery companies said they couldn't do it either.
One data recovery company said they believed they could do it, but wanted 1000.00 for the job.
Cost to repair (I assume full MB replacement) is 750.00.

Now I don't have a problem with this because everyone should back up drives and it's so easy to protect yourself. But know that, if you don't, data recovery may NOT BE POSSIBLE. Naturally this can happen with older machines too. My friends rMBP was the same deal and it had a regular drive in it. Still, I believe that, in the event of a catastrophe, these new machines may be tougher to save.

BACK UP YOUR STUFF!


Cheers,


R.
 
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And if you stream all your media and don't have many files, sync your files with dropbox (or another cloud service). Perfect solution for the lazy minimalist. Plus, you can access them on your other devices.
 
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Should be the same as with earlier models: if the damage is to the SSD, you won't be able to get your data back. If the SSD is unaffected, you should be able to. So I suspect the spill affected the SSD.
 
CaptRB said:
My friend's 13" touch bar suffered a spill accident. I can't blame apple when fluid hits a machine, but what's interesting is that he tried to recover some stuff and took it to Apple. According to him, the spill was minor.

Apple could NOT retrieve anything off of the SSD and could do nothing after it failed to mount using their own device designed to rescue and transfer data.
Data recovery companies said they couldn't do it either.
One data recovery company said they believed they could do it, but wanted 1000.00 for the job.
Cost to repair (I assume full MB replacement) is 750.00.

Now I don't have a problem with this because everyone should back up drives and it's so easy to protect yourself. But know that, if you don't, data recovery may NOT BE POSSIBLE. Naturally this can happen with older machines too. My friends rMBP was the same deal and it had a regular drive in it. Still, I believe that, in the event of a catastrophe, these new machines may be tougher to save.

BACK UP YOUR STUFF!


Cheers,

R.
Click to expand...

I believe in backing data up also. Yesterday, I went and bought a 1TB G-Drive mobile usb-c hard drive for my 2016 MBP just in case something happens and I need things to recover. I'm backing up the laptop now as we speak.
 
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Another reason to backup often. And into 2 places. Backing up to a removable drive you carry will does no good when your backpack contain the computer and backup drive gets stolen.
 
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That's what happens when Apple becomes greedy and soldered the SSD to the logic board so that the former couldn't be upgraded.

Sanpete said:
Should be the same as with earlier models: if the damage is to the SSD, you won't be able to get your data back. If the SSD is unaffected, you should be able to. So I suspect the spill affected the SSD.
Click to expand...

Apple soldered the SSD to the logic board to prevent people from upgrading.

Most likely, the logic board, not the SSD failed.

BarracksSi said:
The way the title reads now, it sounds like the SSD just magically up and died on its own, which you know isn't true.
Click to expand...

The SSD is probably fine.

The logic board failed, but Apple soldered the SSD to the logic board.
 
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tubeexperience said:
That's what happens when Apple becomes greedy and soldered the SSD to the logic board so that the former couldn't be upgraded.
Click to expand...
tubeexperience said:
Apple soldered the SSD to the logic board to prevent people from upgrading.
Click to expand...

Do you know this by ESP, Russian hacking, or some other means?

tubeexperience said:
Most likely, the logic board, not the SSD failed.
Click to expand...
tubeexperience said:
The SSD is probably fine.

The logic board failed, but Apple soldered the SSD to the logic board.
Click to expand...

The SSD has a connector for data recovery.
 
Apple has always wanted to keep the user "out of the box" incorporating the SSD into the Logic Board is just another step. Highly likely also helps Apple reduce on the assembly cost & improve margin etc. There are some benefits such a fewer points of failure, however the downside is data recovery in the event of Logic Board failure, as this case illustrates recovery is not guaranteed.

The bigger question is do you trust others with your data the event of a recovery scenario personally I certainly would want to see the small print and exactly details, prior to proceeding. I would also like to think that Apple has the means to image the encrypted SSD to a new system without any requirement for decryption. Reality moot, as my data is backed up across several differing mechanisms I would be more concerned with how Apple deals with the failed Logic Boards.

If your not backing up start, there's wealth of experience on MR with many more than willing to help, if you not running regular backups more the fool, unexpected things happen, with a high level of variance...


Q-6
 
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Queen6 said:
the downside is data recovery in the event of Logic Board failure, as this case illustrates recovery is not guaranteed.
Click to expand...

This case doesn't illustrate that, though, nor is there any other reason yet to believe that the soldered SSD is any more difficult for Apple to recover data from than any other internal SSD.
 
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I always backup to a network drive. Incremental changes I let backup automatically. Big projects get saved to an external for long term storage or via 'forced' Time Machine backup. It really isn't that hard to do. Tell your friend to get an external hard drive for the next incident.
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Sanpete said:
This case doesn't illustrate that, though, nor is there any other reason yet to believe that the soldered SSD is any more difficult to recover data from than any other internal SSD.
Click to expand...

I concur. I think connecting to the current SSD operates just like the old ones, only via a soldered connection to the board vs a PCIe connection. It's just a new connection. I don't like the idea of the SSD soldered to the board either, but I think even if this was a 2015 model it still would not have been recoverable.
 
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Queen6 said:
Apple has always wanted to keep the user "out of the box" incorporating the SSD into the Logic Board is just another step. Highly likely also helps Apple reduce on the assembly cost & improve margin etc. There are some benefits such a fewer points of failure, however the downside is data recovery in the event of Logic Board failure, as this case illustrates recovery is not guaranteed.

The bigger question is do you trust others with your data the event of a recovery scenario personally I certainly would want to see the small print and exactly details, prior to proceeding. I would also like to think that Apple has the means to image the encrypted SSD to a new system without any requirement for decryption. Reality moot, as my data is backed up across several differing mechanisms I would be more concerned with how Apple deals with the failed Logic Boards.

If your not backing up start, there's wealth of experience on MR with many more than willing to help, if you not running regular backups more the fool, unexpected things happen, with a high level of variance...


Q-6
Click to expand...

Between eliminating the option for most at-home software-based recovery efforts and likely requiring special (possibly even proprietary) tools just to access the hardware, the likely cost could be even more unacceptable over the already high price of recovery (and many times the cost of implementing a solid cloud-based or physical backup solution.) I agree that if someone isn't already utilizing OS X's many generous built-in backup solutions, then that's not being vigilant with safeguarding data.

I'm about to get a 2016, and my concern is more so the higher cost of replacement of the logic board outside of warranty. The 1TB size is a $600 upgrade over the 256GB. Obviously, the SSD now would have to be replaced if the logic board was replaced. I sent Apple an message asking if prices were available for out-of-pocket logic board replacement costs by hard drive size, and how the subsidized pricing would work in regards to the SSD in the event of a logic board failure. If they heavily subsidize the pricing with the return of a working SSD they can then refurbish/resell, that would make me very happy. If not, I can still live with it, but I'd like to know the implications of this change before buying.

I imagine Apple has the tools to transfer a FileVault drive without having to decrypt it, but how accessible such services are could be another story, as could pricing if not within warranty. Now I wish I asked about this too.
 
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I think Apple soldered the SSD on to make the overall package smaller, no M.2 mount with height and space requirements and smaller components, and better connectivity with soldered versus spring clip. And they probably needed the reduce size to fit in the new case.
 
ZapNZs said:
Between eliminating the option for most at-home software-based recovery efforts and likely requiring special (possibly even proprietary) tools just to access the hardware, the likely cost could be even more unacceptable over the already high price of recovery (and many times the cost of implementing a solid cloud-based or physical backup solution.) I agree that if someone isn't already utilizing OS X's many generous built-in backup solutions, then that's not being vigilant with safeguarding data.

I'm about to get a 2016, and my concern is more so the higher cost of replacement of the logic board outside of warranty. The 1TB size is a $600 upgrade over the 256GB. Obviously, the SSD now would have to be replaced if the logic board was replaced. I sent Apple an message asking if prices were available for out-of-pocket logic board replacement costs by hard drive size, and how the subsidized pricing would work in regards to the SSD in the event of a logic board failure. If they heavily subsidize the pricing with the return of a working SSD they can then refurbish/resell, that would make me very happy.

I imagine Apple has the tools to transfer a FileVault drive without having to decrypt it, but how accessible such services are could be another story, as could pricing if not within warranty. Now I wish I asked about this too.
Click to expand...

As stated the SSD being a component of the Logic Board adds another layer of complexity, undoubtedly once out of warrantee, Apple will levy a charge for recovery. The pricing of replacement Logic Boards is simply going to escalate in accordance with the storage capacity. Apple will likely offer a fixed tier price, however significantly more than previous. I rather think the SSD being on the board serves Apple more than the customer at present, equally that's how Apple is falling these days.

Personally I use third party solutions to backup OS X and Microsoft's own for Windows 10, as I prefer to create systematic system images, versus incremental file backup.

Q-6
 
I think the big next thing that apple can do for macbooks, is to make them dust and water resistant
 
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ZapNZs said:
the higher cost of replacement of the logic board outside of warranty
Click to expand...

The OP says the cost quoted is $750. Is that higher than for earlier logic boards? Edit: hard to tell, I guess, as the keyboard and other things may also be involved.

CaptRB said:
So far as he was told, the SSD was NOT damaged, but the logic board was. Apple' data recovery system relies on the logic board to recover the SSD.
Click to expand...

What you friend says is contrary to reports based on information from Apple.
 
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FrancoisC said:
http://www.macworld.com/article/314...ered-on-ssd-has-a-data-recovery-lifeline.html

It was discussed here a while ago :)
Click to expand...

The logic board doesn't need to work, but at minimum it must be able to enter target disk mode.

If it can't, you are SOL.

Sanpete said:
What you friend says is contrary to reports based on information from Apple.
Click to expand...

He heard correctly.

I have had to deal with quite a spills in the past.

Sometimes the logic board needs to be cleaned, but works afterward.

Other times, the logic board has to be sent out for repair.

Obviously, this is aside from replacing the keyboard.

I have never had a case that the SSD failed after a spill.

If they refused the repair, I offered data recovery using a drive enclosure.
 
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