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am i the only one who thinks this is bad news? that means M series chips wont be powerful enough anytime soon
It’s really not a matter of speed. The M1 bests most Xeon and Epyc models in terms of single core performance. Heck an i9 of the same generation will best a Xeon in single core performance. The value proposition of a Xeon is in parallel performance - having dozens of cores to run dozens of threads in tandem. If rumors are to be believed then Apple’s already made test chips scaled up to this level that will likely blow Xeons out of the water performance-wise.

The Mac Pro represents a unique challenge for the M series not because of power but for other reasons. Pro users who buy this machine expect to be able to customize the hardware to their needs - adding GPUs, memory, storage, networking etc. as needed. Contrast that to the M series’s SoC design, such as memory that’s integrated directly into the package. A Mac Pro user can stuff up to 1.5 TB of RAM into their machine if they need it. Apple isn’t going to want to produce dozens of possible memory configurations for this much of a niche market, so they need to figure out a different memory model to allow for upgradable RAM. The M1’s GPU uses tile based deferred rendering, a rendering model no other GPU on the market supports. Apple needs to either figure out if they want to build dedicated GPU expansion cards that also use this model or allow the use of Immediate Mode Rendering GPUs instead.

Given how small the market is for the Mac Pro it makes sense for Apple to focus on M1X MacBook Pros, Mac Mini, and iMacs first, as this will cover the much larger prosumer and some of the professional market and be more than enough power for those users.
 
I’m not extremely well versed in Intel’s chipset and motherboard socket compatibility, as a current Mac Pro owner is there any chance in hell I can swap one of the new Ice Lake processors in? If not, and this would be extremely extra but I’m curious, would it be possible to swap the motherboards?

I have the 16-core, it’s no slouch but I was considering swapping in the 28-core as .R3D video files eat those 16 cores like they’re not even there. I assume an equivalent chip from Ice Lake would be faster and more efficient…
Socket numbers are different so looks like a no, but i would like to know as well. Anyone? Bueller?
 
They will, but it'll still take Apple more time to develop a home-grown solution that can match a 32-core Xeon with 128GB of RAM and four dedicated desktop GPUs. I would wager that the next Intel Mac Pro revision will be the last Intel Mac Pro.

128GB of RAM won't cut it if they want to retain the pro market. It'll need to be 1TB+
 
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This rumor flies in direct contravention to Tim saying Apple would be completely transitioned to AS by 2022.

Of course the statement leaves a lot open to interpretation, but it is definitely an interesting development, given that no other Intel-based hardware has been released so far.

Next year is going to be really really interesting for Apple, product-wise.
If the transition is completed by November of 2022, it will be completed on time. So, Apple still has over a year and a quarter to complete things on time.
 
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I highly doubt this considering apple said Rosetta 2 will be dead within two years.
Apple never said that.

They said that all of their products would be using Apple Silicon in 2 years. (That is either from June 2020 or November 2020 depending on what you count as the starting point.)

That doesn't mean that they will not be selling any Intel machines. The Mac Pro line, in particular, has a lot of people doing work that requires the XEON+DGPU workstations that they sell now. It's not clear how long they will continue to sell to that market but it is a high margin business and supporting them is strategically important for that market.
 
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Mac is no longer a major part of Apple's business. It generates less than 10% of their revenue. In the best of times, scientific research is on the periphery of Apple's vision for the Mac and now, as Mac occupies a rather ancillary role to the iOS-centred ecosystem, scientific research is the farthest thing on their minds. The profit simply isn't there to justify the investment. What you describe as lightweight work is really Apple's core business—digital services, that is.

Apple has never catered to the niche under Cook and they most likely won't go down that road again.
I simply don’t see any way Apple can compete with Linux anyways as it has risen to prominence inside the scientific community. At some point in the early 2000s, Apple had a good foothold in that market, but most researchers and scientists seem fairly adept at writing their own softer for their particular niche and Linux gives them access to a vast array of free OSS software that can be forked and modified at will. Yes, macOS can compile OSS software, but where can you rebuild an old Mac as a Linux box the way you can repurpose an old PC with your distributor of choice and have a usable system for your research and testing purposes? Apple
just doesn’t do that sort of thing. Finally, that Linux box can run Windows in a VM for use with standard apps a university or company might require. NeXT was the last time Apple had a real foothold in the science and research markets. ;)
 
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You must be insane to buy a machine this expensive knowing that software support will drop in 2-3 years. It only makes sense that if you buy it you will me like 20x-30x its price within the next 1-2 years to justifying.
 
You must be insane to buy a machine this expensive knowing that software support will drop in 2-3 years. It only makes sense that if you buy it you will me like 20x-30x its price within the next 1-2 years to justifying.

Insanity is buying a machine this expensive and trying to keep it operational as a desktop for a decade. 2-3 years should be more than enough time to see a huge return on your initial investment and be in need of its replacement in order to stay relevant. If you can do competitive work on this machine 5 years from now, you could do competative work on a MacBook Pro or iMac today. These machines are consumable tools, not decorative fixtures to be ogled and passed down to your grandkids.
 
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I thought Apple was transitioning within 2 years to Silicon. Soooo either Apple lied or this is a lie.
You do know we encountered COVID and chip shortages right? Did Apple lie, or did COVID and the chip shortage delay some things? Which is the more likely answer?
 
Insanity is buying a machine this expensive and trying to keep it operational as a desktop for a decade. 2-3 years should be more than enough time to see a huge return on your initial investment and be in need of its replacement in order to stay relevant. If you can do competitive work on this machine 5 years from now, you could do competative work on a MacBook Pro or iMac today. These machines are consumable tools, not decorative fixtures to be ogled and passed down to your grandkids.
I used a 2010 Mac Pro until 2019 iMac. Only advantage the 2019 iMac had was HEVC video editing. For h.264, both systems were roughly the same performance.
 
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Good news, it means that macOS could potentially come to Intel chips in many future releases, my 2020 Air will love that as well as the Intel Hackintosh community which I am happy to be part of.
 
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Insanity is buying a machine this expensive and trying to keep it operational as a desktop for a decade. 2-3 years should be more than enough time to see a huge return on your initial investment and be in need of its replacement in order to stay relevant. If you can do competitive work on this machine 5 years from now, you could do competative work on a MacBook Pro or iMac today. These machines are consumable tools, not decorative fixtures to be ogled and passed down to your grandkids.
this.
Over a 2 -3 year period a mac pro to my studio is a very small percentage and then is a tax offset. Those not in business see it as a huge expense, but the reality is you buy the tools you need to grow a business and earn money.

TBH though I am not that interested in a mac pro [mainly due to xeon]. All I need is fast single core performance and an amazing gpu. I am hoping a mac mini pro will suffice but isnt likley,.
 
Apple already has an existing relationship with Intel so it doesn’t make sense for them to switch vendors now this late in the transition. Additionally, AMD chips don’t have native Thunderbolt support. While it’s possible for OEMs to build Thunderbolt into an AMD motherboard by adding a controller chip it’s not as elegant of a solution as what Intel offers. Mac Pro users are more likely to have heavy duty Thunderbolt setups than consumer or prosumer/base professional users.
I have a Threadripper Pro with TB3 support that works quite well (eGPU's, docks, external NVME's). In a sense, non-Apple TB3 implementations are MORE flexible because they aren't constrained to what Apple thinks a "Pro" is or what they should be using (need/want nVidia/CUDA? Apple says "FU!").
 
I simply don’t see any way Apple can compete with Linux anyways as it has risen to prominence inside the scientific community. At some point in the early 2000s, Apple had a good foothold in that market, but most researchers and scientists seem fairly adept at writing their own softer for their particular niche and Linux gives them access to a vast array of free OSS software that can be forked and modified at will. Yes, macOS can compile OSS software, but where can you rebuild an old Mac as a Linux box the way you can repurpose an old PC with your distributor of choice and have a usable system for your research and testing purposes? Apple
just doesn’t do that sort of thing. Finally, that Linux box can run Windows in a VM for use with standard apps a university or company might require. NeXT was the last time Apple had a real foothold in the science and research markets. ;)
Exactly! Apple has a very, VERY narrow definition of what they consider a "Pro user" to be. What really annoys me is that Apple actually has been using nvidia GPU's/accelerators to train their AI stuff, but no Nvidia for MacOS. Apple could easily be the adult in this situation and make it happen, but I guess both Nvidia and Apple will just be petulant children about this, instead of making compatibility a thing.
 
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Maybe following Apple down whatever path they choose is not the best choice. I use windows on the latest Intel, AMD, and NVIDIA architectures, whichever is best for business at purchase time, instead of Apple -- When I would rather use macOS just because I like it more. It makes business sense to use the technologies that facilitate good work and happy customers. When that isn't an Apple product, which it hasn't been for some time and will continue not to be Apple for the foreseeable future, it would be rather self defeating to choose an Apple product. That seems like a simple thing to me.
 
I hope this is just a rumour, as if its true that means that even Apple is not sure about the future of Apple Silicon. Furthermore, Apple advertising Apple Silicon to be better option than the Intel (x86) based options kinda seems weak.
 
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Maybe following Apple down whatever path they choose is not the best choice. I use windows on the latest Intel, AMD, and NVIDIA architectures, whichever is best for business at purchase time, instead of Apple -- When I would rather use macOS just because I like it more. It makes business sense to use the technologies that facilitate good work and happy customers. When that isn't an Apple product, which it hasn't been for some time and will continue not to be Apple for the foreseeable future, it would be rather self defeating to choose an Apple product. That seems like a simple thing to me.
This is the same conclusion I came to. It was self defeating to stay using apple hardware when there were so many better pro options available in PC's. I really do love using a mac for work, however it was restricting my output.
Suffice to say my PC workstation has totally delivered. Its a pure tool to earn $$$
 
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