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I always have high hopes for Apple updates, but I'd have to say "Nay" on all of those. Anything logical would make this a viable product in the market place, and Apple wouldn't go and do something silly like that. Larger HDD update...... maybe the base model to 80gb (since from Apple that would be a $100 drive) and that's it.

I have to laugh.

Sorry, I don't need another device in my entertainment setup, meaning without a Blu-Ray (or the ability to play from disc at all) it was dead from the get go. I do not have one, even among the die hard fanboi types, friend who has this device. Several looked but all wrote it off for the same reason, well that and it only came in white.

It does not matter its small, its another set of cable connections and essentially a useless one at that. About anything I can down load I can burn to DVD and play.

1080p is a must as well. 720p and supporters who claim that is all anyone needs are just trying to justify buying a cheap TV. The real money is in big television and 720p doesn't cut it.

More storage, 40gb... lol roflmao... I guess there really were three reasons it was DOA.. oh, less I forget you can $100 more for 120gb more. This thing makes time capsule look reasonably priced.

It must have its own DVD (blu-ray thank you), must have choice of color, and have more onboard storage. Otherwise its a foo foo toy.
 
Remote storage?

It would be really nice if you could utilize the USB port on the Apple TV to plug in an additional hard drive, for more storage. I wonder what's the possibility of this ever happening, especially if Apple releases new, higher capacity ATVs? It would be nice if our old Apple TV's could not be made instantaneously obsolete (capacity-wise at least) by them doing so.
 
picked a new release at random from ITunes, Quantum of Solace. Same price for HD as it is from Amazon for the Blu-Ray. A good Blu-Ray player is $250 or $299 for the PS3. and with BD i don't have to worry about running out of space, backing up my movies or any of the other ridiculous things i have to worry about keeping my movies on hard disk.

if they add BD to it and keep the price around $250 i'll buy it instead of the PS3 since i don't care about games
 
You make an excellent point. I think your points are spot on as well about the season pass model offering a larger discount and the cost of the unit needs to be 199 or less. I need to have my iMac running 24/7 for my wife's business anyway, so streaming doesn't bother me at all. I can see though that most people are not in this boat and many people don't even have a desktop anymore.

I think additionally that the App store will come to ATV. This will increase the popularity 10 fold and bring games and social networking apps to the living room (via Apple, I know they are already there by other means.) Lastly, I think it only makes sense to make the hardware capable of 1080p. As many people have said, HD home movies are more and more coming in 1080p, so making it possible to watch those on our fancy TV's is only logical.


I agree supporting 1080p content and higher frame rate 720p content would be nice and is a logical upgrade. I feel my wife is a good social barometer of sorts on what the general consumer wants and she has mentioned several time about apps or widgets for the apple tv. Simple things like a clock, weather, or sports score ticker would be cool. More advanced things such as social network integration or even small games would make a big impact as well and with the rumored social aspects of itunes 9, who knows. I guess we will all know in a week.
 
Realistic vs unrealistic

Here are my thoughts on what is realistic and unrealistic to expect:

1. The current drives in the Apple TV are 2.5 inch ATA Drives. If memory serves, 2.5 inch drives are available in a max of 1 TB (e.g. a Google search shows Toshiba just announced a 1TB drive in a 2.5 inch form factor on 9/1/2009, WD announced something similar about 3-4 weeks ago). So, a 1TB drive in the Apple TV is POSSIBLE, but a 2TB drive seems VERY unlikely given the sizes involved. If it were redesigned for a 3.5 form factor that might be different.

2. Caching is important even if you are streaming. So, eliminating the drive or making it a smaller SSD seems to me quite unlikely. Larger drives allow more content to be cached. Fast-forwarding, rewinding while streaming isn't as good as when it is cache.

3. Blu-Ray. Would be nice, but Steve Jobs was complaining about the licensing issues in the last year. If they got those resolved, maybe. But the cost addition is a concern. Plus the additional size involved. Seems unlikely.

4. Built into a TV? Seems unlikely. TVs should last a lot longer than the AppleTV in terms of relevance and power. Maybe some type of bundle so you could upgrade the AppleTV portion more frequently, but I can't see it being built in.

5. Ripping a DVD is different from a CD for a number of reasons, particularly licensing. Look at the fight that RealNetworks is in. It would be nice, but I don't see it happening.

Consequently, it seems more likely to me:
1. RAM capacity boost
2. HD size boost (I'd like 2TB or 1TB, but 750GB/500GB/320GB seems MUCH more likely. Maybe 1TB. But 160GB as the entry level at least for a while.
3. CPU speed boost.
4. Software feature update. Browsing? Maybe, but that can be painful, see seven below.

What I'd like to see too:
5. 1080p - most likely of these "like to see" items.
6. Dual tuners so I can get rid of the 3 TiVos. BUT has to support CableCard. Even CableCards aren't perfect, but without ease of use (e.g. IR blasters) it is a huge hurdle and not something you want for your grandmother or mother. Not likely I don't believe.
7. Access to the App Store - that would be a nice thing, but control (e.g. multi-touch vs remote etc) becomes an issue. Maybe something with the iPhone and iPod Touch as controllers via Bluetooth or WiFi. But that opens up games etc to the AppleTV. More likely than Blu-Ray and DVR, I think. To me this seems to make a lot of sense, but it depends on if Apple wants to position the AppleTV as any type of non-portable gaming system. Perhaps they do, but I think it would be a surprise if so given how little attention has been paid so far. Hope that changes.

I have a 4TB RAID on my Mac Pro (4 x 1.5 TB drives in RAID 5) to feed 3 AppleTVs which work pretty nicely together.
 
Hello Geek Comrades. Long time lurker, first time poster.

I've been hoping for an update to Apple TV for ages so hopefully we'll see one next week.

I won't buy one though unless it has PVR and dual tuners. I'd love to get rid of my Virgin Media cable box and replace it with an apple TV to pick up British freeview, or for it to work with Virgin or Sky. At the moment AppleTV doesn't really do anything that my ps3, cable box or iphone hooked up to the tv and amp doesn't do, so it has to replace one of the boxes under my telly before I consider buying one.

The option of renting or subscribing to tv shows alone is a non-starter. What about news, sport, one-off documentaries?

If Apple won't provide the solution themslelves they could open up an app store and allow apps to use the USB port, that way Elgato could provide the tuner. It could work like the PS3's tv thingamyjig. A huge HDD is essential. I don't want my mac on all the time to stream media across to it.

The talk of a bluray drive seems highly unlikely, Apple want us weaned off physical media. The option of ripping DVD's straight from Itunes is never going to happen.

Thats my two cents anyway.
 
Here are my thoughts on what is realistic and unrealistic to expect:
7. Access to the App Store - that would be a nice thing, but control (e.g. multi-touch vs remote etc) becomes an issue. Maybe something with the iPhone and iPod Touch as controllers via Bluetooth or WiFi. But that opens up games etc to the AppleTV. More likely than Blu-Ray and DVR, I think. To me this seems to make a lot of sense, but it depends on if Apple wants to position the AppleTV as any type of non-portable gaming system. Perhaps they do, but I think it would be a surprise if so given how little attention has been paid so far. Hope that changes.

I have a 4TB RAID on my Mac Pro (4 x 1.5 TB drives in RAID 5) to feed 3 AppleTVs which work pretty nicely together.

I had very simular thoughts about the hardware upgrade, but I think given the billions of downloads from the app store this success story might be able to be re-produced via the ATV this one is more likely to be true, esp given the remote control vie the iphone.
The last update which wasn't that long ago gave me touch screen remote for my ATV and that works great.
However games on a large size screen have got to be of a higher quality surely? also this means it will start competing with the likes of the PS3 and x-Box so how powerful can they make an ATV?
Certainly the streaming of video's and picture backups and veiwing has been a huge success in our home, most friends are really envious of our film library. I now can't wait to see what APPLE bring :)

I have a new 1.5 TB mirrored raid in a Readynas duo with it's own itunes server feeds all the macs and ATV in the house, that seems to be working really well now it's setup and have no worries about a disk failing.
 
I have to laugh.
It does not matter its small, its another set of cable connections and essentially a useless one at that. About anything I can down load I can burn to DVD and play.

I think you really don't understand the point of an Apple TV. This is a way to have all of your media on your big TV and connected to your sound system in a simple and well organized package/interface. Tell anyone with even a moderately sized media collection to start burning dvds and they will laugh at you. Haha! See that was me laughing at you.

Though, its not hard to tell from your signature that you are stuck in the past.
 
Just scrap it once and for all

I know there is a vocal minority who think this device is great, but Apple really needs to scrap :apple:TV. It's a failure aka hobby just like that boombox they released years ago. they should either add the functionality to the AEBS or Time Capsule as a bonus or just scrap it completely.

:apple:TV's limited functionality and exhorbitant pricing makes it DOA from the bat.

In order to make it more attractive users have to hack/modify the software which totally undermines the supposed simplicity and elegance.

PS3, xbox pricing has dropped and does the same and more

Despite what apple proponents think, physical media like blu-ray is doing well and prices keep falling

On Demand provides the same service as :apple:TV with less headache since most need cable for internet as well as the shows and sports unavailable on iTunes

Your better off spending a couple more bucks and getting a mac mini for an HTPC

Did i mention it's white and doesnt blend with any other home theatre components?
 
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I hope they do upgrade the appletv. I have noticed that the stock of appletvs in my local Apple Store have been extremely low lately. No 40GB models and only a handfull of 160 GB models. Interesting. I look forward to what is on the horizon for the appletv.
 
Compared to other HTPCs the UI on the apple tv is great. I have a wdtv due to the fact that it plays mkv, 1080p flawlessly but the UI is painful and I had to setup up wireless with an open source mod.

IF they have the following I would buy one

1. More formats, including avi and mkv (unlikely as quicktime x doesn't even play avi)

2. Streaming content, hulu especially. Don't make me install boxee

3. access to USB drives, again don't make me mod it

4. Cheaper price. 200 is reasonable

All this isn't going to happen though
 
late in the life of the original xbox Microsoft would buy larger than advertised capacity hard disks and only show the advertised capacity of 20GB or so. Apple might be doing the same thing
 
I use my ATV daily and am looking forward to an update, no matter how small it is. I just want Apple to show us that they still have some sort of interest in the product. The remote app on my iPhone was an example of a small, but useful update. I want more!

My predictions:
1. Definitely no Blu-Ray (increases cost and takes sales away from iTunes)
2. Definitely no DVR (again, hurts iTunes sales)
3. Bump in HD capacity (although I don't need it b/c syncing/streaming is good enough for me. I do recognize that larger HDs are a must for some people though)
4. Software upgrade (better UI, new features, USB, widgets)
5. Hardware upgrade (current hardware is old, upgrade will be 1080p capable even though iTunes probably won't sell 1080p content for a few years. The extent of the hardware bump depends on #6 below...)

Long Shot:
6. App Store! (Don't think for a second that Apple hasn't thought about this! iPhone app store is a huge success that makes them millions. This would be their way of getting into the gaming console business. Maybe they could even sell ATVs at a loss and have some serious hardware in there, banking on sales through their app store.)
 
Here are my thoughts on what is realistic and unrealistic to expect:

1. The current drives in the Apple TV are 2.5 inch ATA Drives. If memory serves, 2.5 inch drives are available in a max of 1 TB (e.g. a Google search shows Toshiba just announced a 1TB drive in a 2.5 inch form factor on 9/1/2009, WD announced something similar about 3-4 weeks ago). So, a 1TB drive in the Apple TV is POSSIBLE, but a 2TB drive seems VERY unlikely given the sizes involved. If it were redesigned for a 3.5 form factor that might be different.

If you mean ATA, as in IDE, then the largest capacity that is widely available is 500 GB. SATA is much more likely.

Consequently, it seems more likely to me:
1. RAM capacity boost
2. HD size boost (I'd like 2TB or 1TB, but 750GB/500GB/320GB seems MUCH more likely. Maybe 1TB. But 160GB as the entry level at least for a while.
3. CPU speed boost.
4. Software feature update. Browsing? Maybe, but that can be painful, see seven below.

What I'd like to see too:
5. 1080p - most likely of these "like to see" items.
6. Dual tuners so I can get rid of the 3 TiVos. BUT has to support CableCard. Even CableCards aren't perfect, but without ease of use (e.g. IR blasters) it is a huge hurdle and not something you want for your grandmother or mother. Not likely I don't believe.

All of the above are highly likely.

I'd go with a 2 GHz or better Pentium Dual-Core, 512 MB RAM, and nVidia ION. Tuner is a must.

I'd even make the thing configurable. Choose RAM, GPU, HDD/SSD size, TV tuner or not (if so, how many; up to three.), optical drive or not (if so, DVD or BD), etc.
 
Reading through the thread it's clear people want the ATV to be all things. However, some expectations are more realistic than others:

Tuner - The sheer problem of making a different ATV for every different TV/cable system means this won't happen. More likely is Apple opening a port to allow 3rd party manufacturers (such as elgato) to produce add-ins with this function (so Apple doesn't have to get involved when they go wrong).

Blu-Ray - It's all down to the accountants here. Putting in a DVD drive makes no sense as everyone already has a DVD player so it's BluRay or nothing. Adding Blu Ray would immediately see an increase in the number of boxes sold and probably a slow increase in content sold as people try out the downloads. But this would take time and loose rental sales in the short term. It's not impossible (imagine if iPods lost the ability to play MP3s when the iTunes store sold AAC/MP4)

Processor - I don't know why people want atoms or other intel chips - this isn't a computer, it's a media player. ARM chips are smaller, dissipate less heat and use less power than the laptop parts and if it's true that the new ARMs can playback 1080p content, then putting two of these chips in (for future codecs, programmable openCL-type stuff and running a built-in version of itunes and decoding) would probably use much less power than the current setup. The reduction in space would probably allow a bigger hard drive too...

Storage - This one is up in the air. Obviously putting in a 400-500GB drive would make people happier, but then it would simply move the roadblock a bit. There NEEDS to be some kind of server. Since the ATV and AEBS/TC are always on anyway it makes sense to use them to serve out videos, music, photos etc to macs, iphones etc. However, in order to hold a household's full library it's going to need a minimum of 500GB storage at which point the ATV starts to look a bit small. Apple could go to a stackable design or allow swappable drives, but I don't think that's practical (look how hard it is to change a mac mini drive). So I think there will be a storage bump to 120/160GB and 500 GB. It's not enough for a lot of people, but it's a start.

Software - The main way around the storage problem is the software. At the moment you can stream content from a computer running itunes, but as has been pointed out that means having a computer on 24/7 and hoping no one needs to move the computer if it's a laptop. As I've pointed out above, trying to fit complete libraries onto the device isn't easy, but if the processor gets a boost and some more ram, why not have an optimsed "server" version of itunes running ong the Apple TV - thus you can link to network drives etc and the ATV will work without a computer/itunes combination...because it IS the "computer/tunes" combination. The authorisation could be as simple as writing a code to a text file on the drive as is done with the current itunes/ATV on-screen code and it would save a lot of hassle. It could even mean that an ATV "Core" with no hard drive (just buffering space) could be released for people that just want to stream - simply specify a network drive (on NAS, Airdisk or computer share) and all purchased content is stored in that location for streaming back later. All rented content is stored in the 16GB or so flash. Also, to complement the airtunes functionality, how about being able to stream videos from ATV to ATV for homes with more than one?

Subscriptions - Will come once the deals with the content providers are sorted.

Power - With a power sipping ARM setup, hopefully the power useage will go down. Also I hope there's an option to specify an auto sleep timeout (ie, if just sitting on a menu with no music for 10 mins, go to sleep).

Content - is king. More selection, earlier rental windows and multiple languages/commentary/subtitles. There's the outside chance (and it's very outside) that Apple could figure out a way to "replicate" a DVD experience by including bonus features that are either downloaded on the fly (eg trailers) or can be (if chosen) with the film. Widgets are more likely than Apps - no HULU or additional codecs cos that's not how Apple works. Simple games are possible, but would need an iphone/ipod as a bluetooth controller (wifi is too laggy) and the increased resolution compared to the portables' screens mean simple graphics.

In Summary, Apple haven't announced to us what they want AppleTV to be. It didn't work as an itunes extender. It's had more luck as that plus a rental box, but they haven't openly said where it's going. They've hinted at it's use as a means to playback your own films (by adding multiple language/subtitle support which hasn't been used by itunes films), a media server by adding airtunes functionality and even eeked more power out of it (and I still believe we've got as far as we can with the current hardware).

I'm sure this is coming, but probably not all at once and Sod's lawy says we simply get a storage bump, but those Crofton/7300Go/40GB ATA drives must be starting to get rare/expensive.
 
Processor - I don't know why people want atoms or other intel chips - this isn't a computer, it's a media player. ARM chips are smaller, dissipate less heat and use less power than the laptop parts and if it's true that the new ARMs can playback 1080p content, then putting two of these chips in (for future codecs, programmable openCL-type stuff and running a built-in version of itunes and decoding) would probably use much less power than the current setup. The reduction in space would probably allow a bigger hard drive too...

ARM isn't happening. The :apple:TV OS is already OS X-based. Moving it to ARM would be a huge undertaking. And Open CL is already in OS X, no port needed.

Storage - This one is up in the air. Obviously putting in a 400-500GB drive would make people happier, but then it would simply move the roadblock a bit. There NEEDS to be some kind of server. Since the ATV and AEBS/TC are always on anyway it makes sense to use them to serve out videos, music, photos etc to macs, iphones etc. However, in order to hold a household's full library it's going to need a minimum of 500GB storage at which point the ATV starts to look a bit small. Apple could go to a stackable design or allow swappable drives, but I don't think that's practical (look how hard it is to change a mac mini drive). So I think there will be a storage bump to 120/160GB and 500 GB. It's not enough for a lot of people, but it's a start.

My vote's for large HDD/SSD+server. Server is easy enough. I literally wrote the (sort of) book on it.. Pick up a PM G4 or even G3 for ~$60 and at 60 GB HDD should suffice. Pop on Tiger, but most already have it. Total -- $200 or less. (In my case, way less -- free. Got the G4 for free and had a 40 GB HDD to add for a total of 100 GB of storage.) Large HDD for DVR stuff, whether it be internal, or connected via USB.

I'm sure this is coming, but probably not all at once and Sod's lawy says we simply get a storage bump, but those Crofton/7300Go/40GB ATA drives must be starting to get rare/expensive.

They're not getting rare as long as some large company is buying them. But I know they're expensive.

So, as I've stated before, 2 GHz Pentium Dual-Core (not very expensive. You could probably get one for $70.), 512 MB RAM, large HDD, and nVidia ION hardware-wise would get the job done and then some. Of course there'd be 1080p as well and Blu-Ray, and everything else I've mentioned. Maybe some fancy-pants Dolby surround sound crap (I haven't the foggiest idea what the best output and codec is).
 
Give us a 1TB and 2TB models please in the form of an iTunes server that hooks to the TV. 40GB model is just ridiculous with today's HD content and the general size of people's libraries.

Are we finally going to see Apple transition the Apple TV from a "hobby" to an actual proud product with some huge innovation?

iTunes Media Server! That's where it's at! I've built my own (hardware RAID, attached to iMac). Can stream throughout the house, and even over the internet.

But a 2TB Hardware RAID (0, 1, 2, 4, 5, whatever) iTunes media server (hooked up to a UPS) would be sweet! Rig it up to stream to your iPhone/iPod Touch over Mobile Me, and you've got a sale.

In addition, hook up to your TV to display 1080p movies/photos/tv shows/music. Give me eSata to grow it as I need, USB to plug in an elGato, and the ability to extend it with 3rd party plugins, and I'd put around $600 into it. Not really any more, or I might just as well buy a mac Mini and just configure it all myself.

But Apple won't do this, or really anything like it, so I guess I can stop dreaming now...
 
ARM isn't happening. The :apple:TV OS is already OS X-based. Moving it to ARM would be a huge undertaking. And Open CL is already in OS X, no port needed.

But large amounts of OSX already run on ARM. We're all assuming here that the ATV will grow closer to a Mac Mini, but now that Apple have a good basic infrastructure for low-power ARM media devices, why can't it go in exactly the opposite direction?

My vote's for large HDD/SSD+server. Server is easy enough. I literally wrote the (sort of) book on it.. Pick up a PM G4 or even G3 for ~$60 and at 60 GB HDD should suffice. Pop on Tiger, but most already have it. Total -- $200 or less.

Not including the electricity hit of running a full spec computer vs an ultra-low power device.

Either way, that sells to geeks. What Apple needs is a solution that Joe Public can understand. To me, all this makes the AEBS the better target.

AppleTV: just works out of the box. Add the wireless hub and with zero changes, you can have all your Macs, AppleTVs, and Airport Expresses sharing one common media library.
 
Why I like it and what would make it better

I've had an AppleTV for a year or so now. I understand why it isn't for everyone, but can't understand why some people think it's a complete failure. Also, it doesn't have to be hacked to make it useful to many people.

Here's how I use it and what I like about it now:
- I've converted all my DVDs using Handbrake to the Apple Universal format. This gives me instant access to all my movies (especially useful for my kid's movies) via AppleTV at home and iPods/iPhone in the car or anywhere. I have the 160GB model and most everything fits (I stream some of the less frequently watched movies). It's easy enough that my young daughters can use it and they don't get finger prints and scratches all over physical media.
- I can listen to all my music through my home stereo without having to hook-up my computer or an iPod to the stereo. i can use all my existing playlists and the interface is easy to use (not perfect, but pretty darn good).
- I sometimes watch video podcasts or YouTube.
- I sometime rent movies via iTunes. Easy although not cheap.

These updates would make it more enjoyable/better:
- Allow streaming from a NAS and/or using a USB external drive. This makes more sense to me than offering different size HDD. Introducing a Home Media Server with RAID would be the ultimate to me. It could be used to store the whole household's media in a centrally managed, safe storage. iTunes should be modified to allow (as an option) Macs and PCs (especially notebooks) to be treated like iPods where you choose what media you want to synch (store locally) from the Media Server.
- Lower the price of rentals by about a buck to make them more competitive with the likes of RedBox and NetFlix.
- Enable more IR codes to allow programming a universal remote to do things like: put it in standby directly, go directly to My Music or My Movies, etc. They can still ship the cute little remote, but allow those of us with universals more flexibility.

These updates would make me buy more (both hardware and media via iTunes):
- Improve hardware to enable 1080p and higher bitrate 720p
- Make it run cooler/ use less energy (why is it so damn hot?)
- Expand ITMS to subscription model for TV shows and movies. Allow many pricing options like subscription by show, subscription by channel/studio, or all access subscription for one monthly fee, or even insert targeted ads in for a lower fee. I think there are a lot of ways to get networks and even local stations on-board by inserting ads they sell into the shows or sharing the extra fees if people opt for no ads. i don't even really think live sports are out of the question for streaming (even a slight delay would be OK with me as I time-shift most things anyway).
- Add an IR repeater and functionality to Remote app to enable iPhone/iTouch to act as universal remote for whole media system.
 
Agree.

I have 2 AppleTVs and besides using iTunes and such, I watch almost everything else off of my 4TB HP MediaSmart Server anywhere in the house wirelessly and love the flexibility.

let me ask you a simple question: how do you manage your iTunes library on a media server sitting in front of a usual mac/pc? Is iTunes able to sync your personal music to the media server?

Just want to know the technical background, because I toy with the idea of setting up a central iTunes media device.

Do you can please go more into detail?
 
let me ask you a simple question: how do you manage your iTunes library on a media server sitting in front of a usual mac/pc? Is iTunes able to sync your personal music to the media server?

Just want to know the technical background, because I toy with the idea of setting up a central iTunes media device.

Do you can please go more into detail?

I've written a guide. It'd probably be even easier with the HP Mediasmart server, as its got some iTunes server-type stuff. Check it out. IMO, the EX485 is the best value.
 
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