4GB 'iPod Mini' and 15GB iPod

[wombat2]

The MSRP of the 1.5 GB version is $199.

If you can find it available for order online right now for $100-$140 (30-50 percent off MSRP), I will give you a dollar.

And again - do you really expect the Apple device to even be the same price, much less cheaper than, the Rio device? When has that ever happened in the world's history?

 

[engelb15]

So let me see if I have this right.

"Apple is charging too much. They will fail."

Unless the price comes down, it appears that most opinions is yes.

"Yes, other manufacturers are charging the same thing, for the same specs minus the aluminum case, Apple brand name and iTunes compatibility."

It is only speculated by analysts that ONE other manufacturer "will probably" be charging the same price.

"Yes, it's true, nobody else is offering this product at all. Others are offering Flash players with 1/16th the capacity for $50 less."

There is a huge market for flash players because of the low price.

"But that Rio - I don't care what they SAY the price is, it'll really be cheaper!"

Even if the Rio offically announces the price at $249 (which they have not done yet), it will be all over the web at 10-25% lower than MSRP. Apple strictly prohibits resellers from offering such discounts, that would cut into Apple Store sales. (this is one of the major reasons Dell is not selling iPods anymore)

"And Apple cannot possibly sell anything for more than another company sells the same product for! No, Apple must be cheaper than everybody else!"

Apple has proven they can sell products at higher prices that the competition, but to an ever decreasing minority.

Remember, a superior product does not sell on its own. Microsoft has dominated by marketing an inferior product, just look at what they did to Novell over the last 7 years.

Apple needs to jump on the marketshare they now own in the music market to get as many devices out there as possible, even if they make no profit on it now, they will gain marketshare in other areas that will.

Take this scenerio as an example:
A female CEO of a large corporation recieves a pink Mini an a valentines present from her husband, she loves it. She shows it off to one of the IT geeks who seceretly owns a Mac, but the was afraid to speak out since the corporation is all Windows. He uses that as an in to get the CEO interested in other Apple products..(xServe, Powermacs...etc). Wow, she had no idea that Apple made products they could use. She tels the geek to get an Apple Corporate sales rep in (not sure if they even exist). You just have to get the right person interested and the more devices are out there, the more chance of this happening.......

 

[brywalker]

The MSRP of the 1.5 GB version is $199.

If you can find it available for order online right now for $100-$140 (30-50 percent off MSRP), I will give you a dollar.

Well I am not the one who said 30-50% off, even I think thats absurd, but will 22.5% do?

Rio Nitrus 1.5G for $154.05

As you can see, this is still far better than the 0% discount that Apple allows.

Going by this, if you even lower the discount to 20%, that would still make the 4GB Nitrus *GASP* $200.

 

[nelwd]

Re: UK price...

Originally posted by localhero
I can't believe the pricing. And further I can't believe the UK price of £199???

Why? The pound hasn't been this strong against the dollar for so long.

I love my Mac, and I'm a loyal Mac guy, but this is Apple just bleeding us here in the UK.

Apple have stated that the UK price may change. See the link below

http://media.guardian.co.uk/newmedia/story/0,7496,1118482,00.html

 

[wrigley]

ipod mini

250 bucks? RIDICULOUS!

$50 more for a 15gb ipod? Seems like a no-brainer.

It's not like the new mini ipod is that much smaller than the regular ipod. Remember, we're all used to the ipod by now, but the thing is very compact already.

The mini isn't going to sell at that price. Watch for a significant price drop (price "correction" is more like it) in the coming year after Apple scratches it's head for a while before coming to terms with this pricing blunder.

 

[iMan]

Originally posted by engelb15
Take this scenerio as an example:
A female CEO of a large corporation recieves a pink Mini an a valentines present from her husband, she loves it. She shows it off to one of the IT geeks who seceretly owns a Mac, but the was afraid to speak out since the corporation is all Windows. He uses that as an in to get the CEO interested in other Apple products..(xServe, Powermacs...etc). Wow, she had no idea that Apple made products they could use. She tels the geek to get an Apple Corporate sales rep in (not sure if they even exist). You just have to get the right person interested and the more devices are out there, the more chance of this happening.......

It might just be that this is the way IT deps work wherever you might be, friend, but I actually find this scenario hilarious - it could've happened in Friends or something... 😀
In my reality IT "geeks" actually has a thingie or two to say in this kind of decisionmaking anyhow... and believe it or not, but a lot of them are also becoming fans of the mac (after OS X and iPod that is...)

For all those who argue about the mini failing or not, I believe none of us will really know this until it hits the street, so maybe it's wise to just let that one rest - and concentrate on that frustration that Apple again chooses not to target the "regular joe" in their product innovation.

From my point I think they are doing about everything right though... I also believe the mini is a hit, and the way to build a strong and popular brand is not to slash the prices or introducing low end products. They are setting the stakes high, and as everyone else scrambles to meet the new "threat", Apple will calmly release an $249 8 Gig mini within 6 months - lower the 4 gig to 199 maybe and none of the competitors will know where to sit down, since they are already not making any profits on their already low prices for inferior products, and everyone will want the pods and Apple will earn even more money and Hallelujah... (remember from a total share of 31%, Apple is raking in 55% of the revenue)

For those who thinks Apple is going out of business because of pricing: Apple is just loyal to its strategy and the promise they have made (we are not the "cheap" brand) - and that they will harvest from in the end. There is endless tales of companies that compromises their integrity and ultimately loose everything...

 

[wombat2]

$50 more for a 15gb ipod? Seems like a no-brainer.

Someone who was on the verge of buying a 256 MB Flash player for $199 says:

"$50 more for a 4 GB iPod Mini? Seems like a no-brainer."

Again - YOU may not buy one. That does not mean that NO ONE will buy one.

I chose not to buy an iPod but will probably buy an iPod Mini, as it fits my needs better. I don't really care about $50.

I know some people do care about $50. Also, some people get hung up on capacity even if they listen to only 200 songs in an average month.

My take is, if you NEED more than 4 GB, get the bigger version. But be aware of the factors other than capacity. Most people truly do not need more than 4 GB. I'd recommend that people go to the Apple store and play with the regular and Mini versions and picture how the devices will fit in pockets, purses or whatever. That is going to matter more, in reality, than the missing 11 GB for most people.

The Mini is smaller in comparison with the regular iPod than a 12" Powerbook is in comparison with a 17" Powerbook. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but you can bet that it'll matter to someone.

And the colors will matter to some people, too (although it doesn't to me). I do like the idea of the aluminum case vs. plastic (think Powerbook vs. iBook).

Time will tell how the Mini does. I bet that in six months, there will be people here who are upset that the Mini is selling so well when it doesn't fit THEIR desires for a cut-rate iPod.

 

[Gizmotoy]

I'll be honest, I'm a little disappointed. I posted this on the poll thread, but I thought I'd toss it in here for discussion's sake.

How cool would it have been if the iPod mini's CF hard drive was removeable? HD-based, and flash-based player in the same unit. Joggers could just pop in a flash card (sold separately) they have lyin around. I would have gladly paid $249 for such a device. Best of both worlds, for those that use both.

 

[wombat2]

That would be cool - I'd buy one of those, if the price was right (say $119) - but the capacities will be a lot lower than 4 GB for the next year or so (unless you want to spend crazy money).

CF cards run about $180 on ebay for 1 GB, so the total device cost would be a lot higher, and capacity would be a lot lower.

That said, I'd still be interested, since I have a 1 GB CF card in my camera. And for the price, maybe I'd be willing to use less than 1 GB, say a cheap 256 MB card, if I knew I'd have iTunes compatibility.

 

[Gizmotoy]

Yea, the capacities would be pretty small. Although, that doesn't seem to matter to the thousands of people that buy relatively small flash players. To me, it sounds like the golden opportunity they missed out on: A convertible 4GB iPod that can be used as a flash player with optional CF flash media.

 

[Edot]

I wish it were free!

Show me a device like it for 199 or 159? Also yeah you can find discounted mp3 players on the internet for cheaper than retail, but most people shop at best buy, compusa, the mall at Apple Stores. This will sell well. Apple did research that no one on this forum has the expertise to argue about. We will see how it does at the next SteveNote.

 

[engelb15]

Originally posted by iMan
It might just be that this is the way IT deps work wherever you might be, friend, but I actually find this scenario hilarious - it could've happened in Friends or something... 😀
In my reality IT "geeks" actually has a thingie or two to say in this kind of decisionmaking anyhow... and believe it or not, but a lot of them are also becoming fans of the mac (after OS X and iPod that is...)

Well, iMan, something similar to this actually happened in my world. I was working at a large finance company that has now been around for more than 100 years, I won't name the company but they have since been purchased and sold back off by TYCO International (look into it and you should be able to dig it up). We were a Novell shop and used Lotus for our e-Mail. When Windows 95 came out our President came in just nuts about this new OS. He wanted to know when were were converting and made us bring in MS reps. He showed him NT 3.51 and a told him about NT4 and that it would look exactly like Windows 95. Thats all he needed to hear, we started a conversion less that a year later. I quit soon after that.

Weather you want to believe it or not that sort of thing happens all the time in the real world. Marketing wins over function....always.

 

[wombat2]

Actually, I think a cool, clever, cheap addition would be an SD/MMC card slot. CF is too big, xD and Memory Stick are too proprietary or niche. That would give you some nice options for moving files around between cameras, PDAs and iPods. Alternately, they could add an IR port. But, nothing's perfect.

 

[iMan]

Originally posted by engelb15
Well, iMan, something similar to this actually happened in my world.
When Windows 95 came out our President came in just nuts about this new OS.

Since then a lot of people have gone nuts over W95 😀

Well, back then crazy things happened. I think you'll look hard to find someone converting a whole company by falling in love with an iPod today though - even in your world.
In my world function and practicality always win over marketing... well, I don't rule out marketing completely now - but IT people and CEOs and all are usually quite professional about these things, and choose what is supposed to be better for the company overall. If you think managers are stupid enough to buy systems for thousands of $ just because they like a gadget you are very wrong. Likewise; most IT people are very aware of the mac today (at least the "pro" type) and what it can do. But converting a company has a lot more to it than just switching a box - it is a major investment. Also, if you ran an IT dep you would appreciate all people running same kind of equipment... eases the maintanence and support significantly.

Otherwise I see your point about the pods introducing (and seducing) new people into the mac-world. It happens today and will continue to happen - only not in that dramatic a way 🙂

 

[engelb15]

Originally posted by iMan
But converting a company has a lot more to it than just switching a box - it is a major investment. Also, if you ran an IT dep you would appreciate all people running same kind of equipment... eases the maintanence and support significantly.

Otherwise I see your point about the pods introducing (and seducing) new people into the mac-world. It happens today and will continue to happen - only not in that dramatic a way 🙂

I do run an IT Department now, and have been in Management for almost 14 years and dont claim to have seen it all, but I have seen alot and when a member of the board or someone with a three letter title starting with C (ie...CEO, CFO...etc) wants something a certian way, standards dont mean much.

 

[iMan]

Originally posted by engelb15
I do run an IT Department now, and have been in Management for almost 14 years ... and when a member of the board or someone with a three letter title starting with C (ie...CEO, CFO...etc) wants something a certian way, standards dont mean much.

Well if you call giving in to any weird wishes from CEOs ++ to RUN an IT dept I wish you (and your company) all the luck in the world - you're gonna need it my friend 😉

 

[engelb15]

Originally posted by iMan
Well if you call giving in to any weird wishes from CEOs ++ to RUN an IT dept I wish you (and your company) all the luck in the world - you're gonna need it my friend 😉

I think our discussion has gotten way off topic, but I actuall have never worked anywhere that the "high-ups" did not expect and demand special treatment. Maybe it's just an American thing (I just noticed that you are in Norway). The fact is that most of the time you just have to do what they want or they will find someone who will.

 

[haiggy]

Price

Maybe people will see the cost of the iPod mini and then realize that the 15 GB iPod is only $50 more, and go for it. Thus, more money for Apple and a happier customer. Also, people to who the colours appeal will probably choose that over a 15 GB iPod, because not a lot of people have over 1,000 songs, or they're not very technically educated. 😛

 

[iMan]

Re: Price

Originally posted by haiggy
Maybe people will see the cost of the iPod mini and then realize that the 15 GB iPod is only $50 more, and go for it.

Well, I have been looking to get an MP3 player for a long time. I have been thinking about the iPod, liked the capacity but were unsure about the size. I have looked at others as well, but I really want Apples (if only Apple made recliners...).
I will wait to see and feel the mini, but I am definitely in the market for one. The price is quite ok - and the 50 for the 15 is a no issue (I'd rather go for the 20 then, get the dock and such).
I really believe people are misunderstanding this concept - this is NOT a low end iPod - it is something different than most of us rumourers really expected (and wanted) - it is Hi end and will mostly attract people that won't really consider the iPod in the first place.

Also - the delay for April Worldwide is pondering... it would not coincide with something quite useful for the iPods in general maybe... now, would it...??? 😉

(oops, did it again - got my expectations up there...)

btw Engelb: No Offence! I realized I might actually have sounded a bit.. yeah you know...

 

[engelb15]

Re: Re: Price

Originally posted by iMan

btw Engelb: No Offence! I realized I might actually have sounded a bit.. yeah you know...

Not at all........

 

[pjkelnhofer]

Re: Re: Price

Originally posted by iMan

I really believe people are misunderstanding this concept - this is NOT a low end iPod - it is something different than most of us rumourers really expected (and wanted) - it is Hi end and will mostly attract people that won't really consider the iPod in the first place.

Very well said!

It actually took me a couple of days to realize this. The mini is not a 4Gb iPod. It is a seperate product altogether. Obviously, one of the things that people like about flash players is the smaller size and the mini achieves that with several times more capacity in a slightly smaller box. Not to mention the interface which has always been one of iPods selling points.

I honestly believe if it were feasible Apple would have released a smaller (2Gb) version for less ($199). I would guess there was simply no way to do that at this time.

I still believe we sill see a larger mini (8Gb?) in the near future (6-8 months) and a price drop on the 4Gb.

 

[Dahl]

Re: ipod mini

Originally posted by wrigley


The mini isn't going to sell at that price. Watch for a significant price drop (price "correction" is more like it) in the coming year after Apple scratches it's head for a while before coming to terms with this pricing blunder.

They will probably lower the price just like they did with the other iPods.
The price is not that bad, considering it's an cutting edge digital player.

 

[morningstar]

Originally posted by edesignuk
[off topic]


if MORNINGSTAR == "FEMALE" {

}

😀

[/off topic]

Sorry, dear.

morningstar =/= female.

😛

 

[morningstar]

Originally posted by engelb15
Take this scenerio as an example:
A female CEO of a large corporation recieves a pink Mini an a valentines present from her husband, she loves it. She shows it off to one of the IT geeks who seceretly owns a Mac, but the was afraid to speak out since the corporation is all Windows. He uses that as an in to get the CEO interested in other Apple products..(xServe, Powermacs...etc). Wow, she had no idea that Apple made products they could use. She tels the geek to get an Apple Corporate sales rep in (not sure if they even exist). You just have to get the right person interested and the more devices are out there, the more chance of this happening.......

Even if this scenario were realistic, I think that your example does not help the "we need cheap @ss iPods!" argument. I'm sorry, but I don't think that such a relatively minor price difference would affect the buying habits and gift giving for a husband of a CEO of a large corporation. That's just me. And it seems that is a large part of the market Apple wants to reach. Apple is a (albeit mainstreamed more than usual) designer product. It appeals to people who buy and can afford designer things. And you pay a premium for that (although I think that is immaterial in this circumstance since it really is competitive, and fair, pricing.)

 

[dho]

I am waiting for a surprise apple media event on the 24th where he says this whole ipod mini thing is a huge prank.
:\

well, anybody think their is any chance that we will have a surprise event on he 24th?