Icaras
macrumors 603
I really like Windows 10 the best compared to all the past versions of Windows, but I still don't love Windows in general lol 😉
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4k retina iMac 21.5"
- Thread starter Ice Dragon
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I really like Windows 10 the best compared to all the past versions of Windows, but I still don't love Windows in general lol 😉
I don't know. I been a crazy Apple fan since late-2009. Started with an Apple 2 back in 1983, and was off and on Apple user before that with a few multi-year stints with Amiga, and Windows machines. And lately I despise the way Apple is treating the Mac. If they don't update the 27" iMac with a Skylake i7 and a much more powerful GPU in October I'm moving to a HP with Windows 10. But if that new Surface Book has a 4GB GPU I may just buy that instead. I think Microsoft is getting the spark that Apple seems to have lost. Apple has become too much of a consumer company rather than a computer company. I'm waiting for them to come out with coffee makers and toasters.
When the 27" iMac had only 2560x1440 there was an option for a 4GB GPU. That was possibly a good gaming machine. Now with 4 times the pixels to push around, but with no increase in hardware to keep up with pushing all those extra pixels I'd say the most powerful current iMac is a dog compared to the old iMac. And we'll be waiting a few years for it to catch up and equal the performance of the previous one. The iMac probably needs at least an 8GB GPU and I don't see that happeneing.
Someone, possibly Apple, has brainwashed you into believing that the measure of a GPU is graphics memory. It's not.
I can live with Broadwell, but I really hope that the new 21.5" iMac will have TB3 and support eGPU's.
Crosscreek
macrumors 68030
No it doesn't.
I agree. Old design is tired and with the new technology I believe as you there will be a total redesign from the ground up.
The 2016 iMac with Skylake will be the one to wait on.
Hmmm.
Now this is my opinion but iMacs don't generate anywhere near as many headlines as the iPhone/iPad range and far fewer leaks.
When the old MacPro was left to wither and die on the vine I don't recall many industry pundits getting anywhere near the dust bin design of the new MacPro.
I don't recall anyone predicting that the RiMac would be a 5K display. A few were going for 4K but that was about it from what I can remember.
The point is that I think it's quite plausible that Apple have been able to keep a very tight lid on any updates to the iMac range.
I would agree that if there were major changes to the case then that may be harder to keep under wraps which suggests to me that we are talking evolution rather than revolution.
The addition of TB3 or USB-C wouldn't necessarily mean a full redesign, just minor changes to the back panel, and that won't be the side you spend most time looking at. 🙂
Now this is my opinion but iMacs don't generate anywhere near as many headlines as the iPhone/iPad range and far fewer leaks.
When the old MacPro was left to wither and die on the vine I don't recall many industry pundits getting anywhere near the dust bin design of the new MacPro.
I don't recall anyone predicting that the RiMac would be a 5K display. A few were going for 4K but that was about it from what I can remember.
The point is that I think it's quite plausible that Apple have been able to keep a very tight lid on any updates to the iMac range.
I would agree that if there were major changes to the case then that may be harder to keep under wraps which suggests to me that we are talking evolution rather than revolution.
The addition of TB3 or USB-C wouldn't necessarily mean a full redesign, just minor changes to the back panel, and that won't be the side you spend most time looking at. 🙂
AlifTheUnseen
macrumors regular
Well, rumour has it they are designing and, ehm, building Apple cars… and the time is well-chosen - with all these VW clients, irritated and distrustful - let their iPhones direct them to the next Apple car. Total platform integration, including homekit, with garagekit expansion!
🙂 :-(
aussiemom
macrumors member
Hopefully these will ship with the new iMacs, or maybe be upgrade options:
http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/18...keyboard-revealed-in-apples-os-x-10-11-1-beta
http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/18...keyboard-revealed-in-apples-os-x-10-11-1-beta
aevan
macrumors 601
Don't take this the wrong way but you don't really understand how computer graphic works. 5K display doesn't need more than 2Gb video RAM to run UI and apps smoothly. For gaming, yes, the bigger the textures, more RAM you need, but even that doesn't have much to do with screen resolution, but the texture resolution instead. Since texture resolution has nothing to do with screen resolution, 2 or 4 Gb video RAM can be less than enough on a game even on a 1080p screen and could be more than enough for an 8K game. It comes down to texture sizes. And when it comes to rendering in such high resolutions, video RAM won't help you if the processing power of your GPU is not good enough to do it. Today even a GeForce 980 would have trouble running any demanding game in 5K, and forget about it on a mobile GPU. So, basically, even if you had 8Gb RAM on any video card used in iMacs, you STILL wouldn't be able to run games at 5K. At the same time, for OS X and apps, 2Gb is absolutely enough (I speak from personal experience) for 5K. You can run games just fine at 1080p and even 1440p.
So, basically, no, the iMac 5K doesn't need more than 2Gb/4Gb of video RAM in any practical sense. One day when they can put a strong enough GPU to run games in that resolution (and that GPU all but doesn't exist today, even among full desktop cards) then yes, more video RAM would be put to good use.
Apple put enough RAM in iMacs to run everything smoothly. The base iMac 5K screams in El Capitan. Seriously, it's silly fast. The only reason they even mention video RAM is to have some easy to understand (but ultimately wrong) metric for people to choose a card. For gaming, the M295X can run games with higher res textures and at higher resolutions, so 4Gb is reasonable. 8Gb would be a total overkill for that (or any) mobile GPU. The same way, 2Gb is enough for an M290X.
Also, while Microsoft is getting better and the new hardware is great, claiming that somehow Apple is falling behind is completely wrong, especially if you base that assumption based on video RAM or what you think is adequate hardware. Apple is making some of their best Macs yet. They are literally pushing the technology forward. 5K, USB-C, photo alignment, scissor switch keyboards, haptic feedback - they are moving things at an incredible pace - in fact, while Surface Pro 4 and Surface Book are great, Microsoft is actually catching up and using things like screen tech, trackpad tech, industrial design, etc. that Apple has been using for years now. The main reason MS is getting better is because they are looking more and more like Apple.
aevan. You are right. I do not understand very well so thanks for that detailed explanation. That almost puts my mind at ease as I am heavily invested in Apple and really don't want to move to Windows. That said...even though my understanding of how video cards work (and the corresponding VRAM requirements) is wrong, is it then safe to say that the newest 27" Retina iMac with the i7/4GB VRAM option can equal (or surpass) the gaming performance of the previous non-Retina 27" iMac with the i7/4GB VRAM option?
Also my friend has the most powerful tricked out (i7/4GB VRAM) 27" Retina iMac and he says the System Preferences->Display Control Panel has no way to set the Resolution down to 1080p or 1440p. It is locked at its full Retina resolution. Is this so?
Um, no.
You might have to hold the option key down, when selecting the "Scaled" option. Apple doesn't want your screen to look ugly, so it's hidden by default.
Plus, games tend to have their own resolution controls. I can play "Call of Duty 1" at 800 x 600 if I want, and I don't.
aevan
macrumors 601
I would say that it can easily match or even outperform the gaming performance of the previous non-retina 27" at the same resolutions. In some benchmarks it is faster, in some slower - but in reality, you will play modern games at the same (high) settings. Wait - it's a brand new iMac and it can only "match" the last year's model? Well, yes - in gaming. If you look at gaming, than it just matches the last gen and that's it. However, where the new iMacs shine are pro apps, using OpenCL, like Adobe apps. There, the new GPU is, in some tasks, up to 45% faster. And you get a faster CPU.
Just don't ask around these forums - you'd get the impression the new iMacs explode or something when you start a game. Just take a deep breath and don't worry about it - the 5K iMac will run games really well, even the base model (I played a lot of next-gen games in 1080p and 1440p with no problems - the M290X is basically a PS4 GPU) Still, note that the iMac - any iMac, really - is not a machine designed with gaming in mind. For that money you could get a beast of a gaming PC.
Not true. First, you can set several resolutions that Apple provides in their 5 presets which is fine for most people. However, if you hold ⌥ when you click on Scaled, you get all the resolutions you'd normally get.
Thanks again. I am mostly concerned about performance in gaming and game development for iOS, tvOS, OSX, and Windows using Unity. I don't really care about the performance in pro apps, using OpenCL, like Adobe apps. But like I alluded to, all my dev/graphics tools are for OSX. If it weren't for that I'd move to a new Windows machine with an monster GPU...to both play and develop games as Unity also runs on Windows.
I just wish Apple would come out with a gaming/dev targeted desktop or tower that was future-proof and fully upgradeable with new GPU cards like in the pre-iMac days. But I know such expandability would vastly decrease the reliability and introduce compatibility problems because of having to support various video cards/drivers.
clovehitch
macrumors member
I tend to believe the 2015 15" MBP *upgrade* was not a one time scenario. Apple's Mac division is not moving quite fast enough, and they will adopt any of these type of tactics to keep the numbers moving. 21.5" iMac retina w/ Broadwell?
what apple wants to put in its imacs are four core processors with iris pros--perhaps with an optional gpu of some sort
do any of the released skylakes fit the bill?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skylake_(microarchitecture)
do any of the released skylakes fit the bill?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skylake_(microarchitecture)
Or they'll be all for the Retina iMac.
M380 base riMac
M380X better riMac
M390X best riMac
M395X best riMac BTO
For the 21.5 inch riMacs I think Intel graphics...
The trick is just to live 3 years behind in gaming! Ever played Skyrim? It's great! Just finished it ;-).
Torchlight II
Diablo III
Transistor
Portal II
Bastion
Mass Effect 1-3
Divinity: Original Sin
Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor
Oddworld: New'n'Tasty
...just some to get one started 😉