6GB in MacBook (Pro); Yes it works. - 8GB... well...

[DoFoT9]

can somebody explain swap vs. page outs vs. page ins for me? I thought I knew what they all were but now I'm thinking I don't... RAM 101?

I do understand that they all have to do with needing more RAM than you have and therefore writing to the HDD, just don't know the difference between the 3.

haha ok here is a basic run down...

so i take it that you understand the concept of Virtual Memory? VM = physical hdd storage is used as actual "RAM", the computer thinks that it has access to this directly.

there are a number of reasons why virtual memory might be used,
1. a program has been idle for a while - so OSX will "page in" a page file to VM.
2. there isnt enough free RAM to open a program/refresh a program, so OSX will "page in" the least used sections of memory to VM.

so from this we have 3 things.

- page in: when the computer sends some RAM to virtual memory.
- page out: when the computer brings page some RAM from virtual memory.
- swap file: this is a file stored on your computer and is the file that acts as the virtual memory. (this file is located at hdd->private->var->vm i believe). this swap file will normally start off at 0 in size, and will increase as needed until it reaches the size of your physical RAM. in some extreme cases it can go bigger (i have seen 1.5x bigger max).

ive attached an extreme case of page ins/outs (from my own computer , i need more RAM lol).

any questions class?

 

[bsizz234]

haha ok here is a basic run down...

so i take it that you understand the concept of Virtual Memory? VM = physical hdd storage is used as actual "RAM", the computer thinks that it has access to this directly.

there are a number of reasons why virtual memory might be used,
1. a program has been idle for a while - so OSX will "page in" a page file to VM.
2. there isnt enough free RAM to open a program/refresh a program, so OSX will "page in" the least used sections of memory to VM.

so from this we have 3 things.

- page in: when the computer sends some RAM to virtual memory.
- page out: when the computer brings page some RAM from virtual memory.
- swap file: this is a file stored on your computer and is the file that acts as the virtual memory. (this file is located at hdd->private->var->vm i believe). this swap file will normally start off at 0 in size, and will increase as needed until it reaches the size of your physical RAM. in some extreme cases it can go bigger (i have seen 1.5x bigger max).

ive attached an extreme case of page ins/outs (from my own computer , i need more RAM lol).

any questions class?

beautiful explanation. thanks!

I could have sworn my swap was 2x my RAM when I had 2GB... since I've upgraded to 5 it's rarely more than 20mb. Yay more RAM.

 

[mrkgoo]

haha ok here is a basic run down...

so i take it that you understand the concept of Virtual Memory? VM = physical hdd storage is used as actual "RAM", the computer thinks that it has access to this directly.

there are a number of reasons why virtual memory might be used,
1. a program has been idle for a while - so OSX will "page in" a page file to VM.
2. there isnt enough free RAM to open a program/refresh a program, so OSX will "page in" the least used sections of memory to VM.

so from this we have 3 things.

- page in: when the computer sends some RAM to virtual memory.
- page out: when the computer brings page some RAM from virtual memory.
- swap file: this is a file stored on your computer and is the file that acts as the virtual memory. (this file is located at hdd->private->var->vm i believe). this swap file will normally start off at 0 in size, and will increase as needed until it reaches the size of your physical RAM. in some extreme cases it can go bigger (i have seen 1.5x bigger max).

ive attached an extreme case of page ins/outs (from my own computer , i need more RAM lol).

any questions class?

I always understood page-ins/outs as exact opposite to you:

Page-in: Disk to RAM.
Page-out: RAM to disk.

When you run out of RAM, and it needs to send some out to VM, that is a Page out, and why it's a measure of whether you are limited by RAM amount. Things are constantly getting paged-in from the disk to the RAM, hence you always have really high PAge-ins.

 

[ayeying]

I always understood page-ins/outs as exact opposite to you:

Page-in: Disk to RAM.
Page-out: RAM to disk.

When you run out of RAM, and it needs to send some out to VM, that is a Page out, and why it's a measure of whether you are limited by RAM amount. Things are constantly getting paged-in from the disk to the RAM, hence you always have really high PAge-ins.

+1

That's how I understand it also.

 

[DoFoT9]

beautiful explanation. thanks!

I could have sworn my swap was 2x my RAM when I had 2GB... since I've upgraded to 5 it's rarely more than 20mb. Yay more RAM.

no problems. 2x could be possible, im not sure if there is an actual limit but mostly people dont use it heavily enough to hit >2x.

oh, i just checked wiki and it says this with regards to swap file sizes

Between 1.5 or 2 times the installed RAM is a typical number

I always understood page-ins/outs as exact opposite to you:

Page-in: Disk to RAM.
Page-out: RAM to disk.

When you run out of RAM, and it needs to send some out to VM, that is a Page out, and why it's a measure of whether you are limited by RAM amount. Things are constantly getting paged-in from the disk to the RAM, hence you always have really high PAge-ins.

yea you're right! i always get them mixed up. i cant remember if the RAM is the point of origin or the VM!! the main point is that the concept is understood though.

from wiki:

Page in is transferring a page from the disk to RAM. Page out is transferring a page from RAM to the disk.

 

[t0mat0]

Just put in a 4GB DIMM, to get to 6GB. Right Phillips screwdriver, enough downwards force so not to strip the head of the screws, and a few minutes later, out with the hoover to get rid of the dust (8 months accumulates quickly!), and pop the lid back on.
I've seen some say its hard to get the bottom off once you've unscrewed all the screws, but I didn't see it as too hard - could do with 2 hands. Can see why the bottom cover flexes now - is pretty thin!

I'd recommend it as a painless upgrade - Just get the right 00 screwdriver, earth yourselves, and take care with the memory stick handling/removing/installing.

 

[mrkgoo]

Just put in a 4GB DIMM, to get to 6GB. Right Phillips screwdriver, enough downwards force so not to strip the head of the screws, and a few minutes later, out with the hoover to get rid of the dust (8 months accumulates quickly!), and pop the lid back on.
I've seen some say its hard to get the bottom off once you've unscrewed all the screws, but I didn't see it as too hard - could do with 2 hands. Can see why the bottom cover flexes now - is pretty thin!

I'd recommend it as a painless upgrade - Just get the right 00 screwdriver, earth yourselves, and take care with the memory stick handling/removing/installing.

I notice recently my whole case was starting to flex - nearly a quarter inch gap between opposing corners. I took the MBP and bent it over my knew to fix it...

 

[mrkgoo]

Ok, my Gskill 4gb stick arrived and I have it in my 15" 2.4 Ghz early 2008 MacBook Pro. System profiler sees it, activity monitor shows it correctly.

I have it in Dimm 1 (the one on top) - does it matter which slot I have the asymmetry?

 

[ayeying]

Ok, my Gskill 4gb stick arrived and I have it in my 15" 2.4 Ghz early 2008 MacBook Pro. System profiler sees it, activity monitor shows it correctly.

I have it in Dimm 1 (the one on top) - does it matter which slot I have the asymmetry?

Doesn't matter

 

[mrkgoo]

Doesn't matter

Sweet. Now off for some tests!

 

[jjahshik32]

Man I sure can use the 8gb dimms for my 17".

I only have about 5mb-10mb free.

 

[alexitosrv]

Hi everybody,

I also want to have a 6gb in my mbp 4,1.

Currently it has 4gb (2 x 2gb 667mhz), but I'm not sure what are the right parameters to look for in a single 200 pin 4gb module.

I have this options:
(I think the majority are DDR2-800/PC2-6400)

http://www.provantage.com/kingston-technology-ktl-tp667-4g~7KIN90MP.htm

http://www.provantage.com/axiom-memory-solutions-ax16791823-1~7AXM95L0.htm

http://www.provantage.com/axiom-memory-solutions-kx034av-ax~7AXM95L3.htm

http://www.provantage.com/axiom-memory-solutions-tp667-4g-ax~7AXM95L4.htm

http://www.provantage.com/axiom-memory-solutions-pa3670u-1m4g-ax~7AXM95L8.ht

What is you recommendation ?

thanks in advance


alex.

 

[SuperMiguel]

I have a MBP 13" i got it in December 2009, so it the unibody one.. It is the 2.26Ghz i updated the memory to 4GB and now i want to run few more VM's so i need 8GB i see alot of post of people saying that their system get slower with 8gb of ram? is there a fix for this?

 

[ayeying]

I have a MBP 13" i got it in December 2009, so it the unibody one.. It is the 2.26Ghz i updated the memory to 4GB and now i want to run few more VM's so i need 8GB i see alot of post of people saying that their system get slower with 8gb of ram? is there a fix for this?

New Unibody MacBook Pros aren't affected.

 

[sjinsjca]

I have a MBP 13" i got it in December 2009, so it the unibody one.. It is the 2.26Ghz i updated the memory to 4GB and now i want to run few more VM's so i need 8GB i see alot of post of people saying that their system get slower with 8gb of ram? is there a fix for this?

My unibody MBP is 2 months newer than yours and works great with its 8GB RAM, installed by Apple in my case.

I'd expect no problems with your machine if it is spec'd for 8GB.

 

[SuperMiguel]

and right now the cheapest 4gb stick is this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231265 ?

 

[Orecchione]

8gb working on the late 2008 macbook pro 2.8ghz but....

This machine was bought on June 2009. A week after the mid 2009 were released. It was a refurbished unit which might explain it.
Ok let's get started. I am using 1x4gb crucial module & 1x4gb owc module. Why mixing brands? Well by the time I decided to go from 4gb to 6gb, I found on Amazon the 4gb Crucial module for $190 while at Owc it was at $249. 6gb was a good combination for me and my needs. However, it didn't stop me from trying 8gb even knowing that my computer wasn't capable of using them. What was next? Yeah to buy another 4gb module This time I went for something cheaper (Owc's $179) since I wasn't sure if that was going to work.
Ok enough of that and back to topic. 8gb works fine in the 32 and 64 bit kernels. I tested the 32 bit kernel for almost 12 hours with absolutely no problems. I was able to use 7.99gb flawlessly with the cpus fully stressed.
The 64 bit kernel provided the same satisfactory results. The machine felt fast and reliable at all. The only thing I notice different was the temperature. While on the 32 bit kernel the cpu reached up to 85C, on the 64 bit it reached up to 92C
I will keep testing the computer in the next days, but overall, I am pretty sure I will not have problems.
I attached some pictures, and if you want to know more just let me know.

 

[m85476585]

This machine was bought on June 2009. A week after the mid 2009 were released. It was a refurbished unit which might explain it.
Ok let's get started. I am using 1x4gb crucial module & 1x4gb owc module. Why mixing brands? Well by the time I decided to go from 4gb to 6gb, I found on Amazon the 4gb Crucial module for $190 while at Owc it was at $249. 6gb was a good combination for me and my needs. However, it didn't stop me from trying 8gb even knowing that my computer wasn't capable of using them. What was next? Yeah to buy another 4gb module This time I went for something cheaper (Owc's $179) since I wasn't sure if that was going to work.
Ok enough of that and back to topic. 8gb works fine in the 32 and 64 bit kernels. I tested the 32 bit kernel for almost 12 hours with absolutely no problems. I was able to use 7.99gb flawlessly with the cpus fully stressed.
The 64 bit kernel provided the same satisfactory results. The machine felt fast and reliable at all. The only thing I notice different was the temperature. While on the 32 bit kernel the cpu reached up to 85C, on the 64 bit it reached up to 92C
I will keep testing the computer in the next days, but overall, I am pretty sure I will not have problems.
I attached some pictures, and if you want to know more just let me know.

You have a Unibody MBP, which can actually use 8gb (I can't remember if it was officially listed at the time, though). This thread is about the older MBPs.

 

[The Final Cut]

wow that would have be 2x more expensive about a year ago. next gen. MBP might have higher ram standard. prices have fallen/

 

[santos79]

You have a Unibody MBP, which can actually use 8gb (I can't remember if it was officially listed at the time, though). This thread is about the older MBPs.

You're wrong, Matt. Did you read the thread? It's about the first generation of Unibody MBPs, which can reportedly only reliably use up to 6GB.

 

[ayeying]

You're wrong, Matt. Did you read the thread? It's about the first generation of Unibody MBPs, which can reportedly only reliably use up to 6GB.

Actually, the 2.8GHz is a "Custom Order" MBP. There has been reports that "Custom Order" MBPs with a higher CPU has worked with 8GB. Same with the 2.66GHz/2.93GHz MBPs for the 5,1 models also.

 

[m85476585]

You're wrong, Matt. Did you read the thread? It's about the first generation of Unibody MBPs, which can reportedly only reliably use up to 6GB.

It's been a long time since I read the whole thread. I thought it only applied to the pre-unibody ones (which I have), but it looks like you are correct.

 

[dclaremont]

Imac 24" 2.4ghz

Hello. What is the max ram i can install in my Imac 24"?

I was unclear weather 6gb or 8 gb worked.


I currenttly have 2 x 2 GB
Type: DDR2 SDRAM
Speed: 667 MHz


I was going to order 1 of these this from Newegg.

But if 2 will work then my VMware would be much happier!
G.SKILL 4GB 200-Pin DDR2 SO-DIMM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Laptop Memory Model F2-5300CL5S-4GBSQ - Retail


Thanks for any input!
System spces
Hardware Overview:

Model Name: iMac
Model Identifier: iMac7,1
Processor Name: Intel Core 2 Duo
Processor Speed: 2.4 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache: 4 MB
Memory: 4 GB
Bus Speed: 800 MHz
Boot ROM Version: IM71.007A.B03
SMC Version (system): 1.21f4

 

[ayeying]

Hello. What is the max ram i can install in my Imac 24"?

I was unclear weather 6gb or 8 gb worked.


I currenttly have 2 x 2 GB
Type: DDR2 SDRAM
Speed: 667 MHz


I was going to order 1 of these this from Newegg.

But if 2 will work then my VMware would be much happier!
G.SKILL 4GB 200-Pin DDR2 SO-DIMM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Laptop Memory Model F2-5300CL5S-4GBSQ - Retail


Thanks for any input!
System spces
Hardware Overview:

Model Name: iMac
Model Identifier: iMac7,1
Processor Name: Intel Core 2 Duo
Processor Speed: 2.4 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache: 4 MB
Memory: 4 GB
Bus Speed: 800 MHz
Boot ROM Version: IM71.007A.B03
SMC Version (system): 1.21f4

That's the same iMac I have. You can use 6GB. I have 6GB installed in mine.

 

[dclaremont]

Imac 24" 2.4ghz

That's the same iMac I have. You can use 6GB. I have 6GB installed in mine.

Ok great!! Thanks for the reply.

So 2 x 4 gb chips will not work?