What's the value proposition here? $200 is one third of the value of the cheapest Mac Mini or more if you get the educational discount. It doesn't make sense for most to upgrade if they don't get utility from it.
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8gb vs 16gb
- Thread starter ahostmadsen
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I have a 8GB M1 mini, and regret not getting the 16GB.
If you have intentions of keeping your computer for a few years or more, then I vote upgrading.
I've had people around me using 10+ year old MacBook Airs until recently because at the time they got 8GB instead of 4GB. Today it's the very same discussion with the numbers doubled. Get 16GB unless you really are only the very lightest of users and will remain one for the next decade.
Not unless you have specific need, if 8GB was inadequate Apple would shift to 12 or 16 for the base models to remain competitive. OS memory management has improved significantly. If your running VM's or very heavy applications yes, average use just no need.
Q-6
Interesting. Do you know what the 3900X got in single core? I have a gaming PC with a 5900X and 4090 and it is a monster. Windows is much much better now that it was a decade ago (I've considered switching back to it multiple times). It will be interesting to see how my M2 Pro mini compares to that pc in just general usage. My i7 2018 mini has slowed down so much over the past year even with very light usage.
Can't say how long folks' memories are here.
Back in 2014, you could buy a new 2014 Mac Mini with 4gb of RAM (which was non-upgradable).
It would run with 4gb. But just adequately for the time.
As time passed, and the "needs of the OS" increased, the 4gb Minis became hobbled by the low amount of RAM. The level of performance got worse and worse.
Buying an m-series Mac TODAY with 8gb of RAM is like buying a Mini with 4gb back around 2017 (yes, they were still sold until October 2018).
It will run ok ... for now.
But... three... four years down the road...?
Back in 2014, you could buy a new 2014 Mac Mini with 4gb of RAM (which was non-upgradable).
It would run with 4gb. But just adequately for the time.
As time passed, and the "needs of the OS" increased, the 4gb Minis became hobbled by the low amount of RAM. The level of performance got worse and worse.
Buying an m-series Mac TODAY with 8gb of RAM is like buying a Mini with 4gb back around 2017 (yes, they were still sold until October 2018).
It will run ok ... for now.
But... three... four years down the road...?
Has it? In what way? In my book Unix operating systems have been doing a darn good job since the 90s.
That's a bit naive thinking, in my opinion. Apple only cares about the bottom line, which is obvious when you consider the way the new Mac Mini line is priced and configured: $100 less than the previous base model, but $200 extra for a mere 8GB ram. Also notice that the first two models BOTH only have 8GB. If Apple would consider the users' position, they'd have offered the first model with perhaps 8GB, but surely the second one with 16GB. But that would mean most users would have opted for the second model, and that would have been bad for business.
Very smart market thinking and avoids a too-negative response from its users. It also confuses users, because (let's face it) a mere 8GB for such a powerful CPU is somewhat ridiculous and --stated bluntly-- behind the times. It confuses and causes anxiety in any user considering to purchase the new Mac Mini. And that is exactly the reason why this thread (and other related threads) exist.
And anxious uncertain users tend to opt for the more expensive option anyway. In a sense buyers are duped into thinking the base model is a better deal than the previous one (Hey, it's $100 less!), but really many are fooled into spending an extra $100 compared -- because 16GB should have been the base anyway.
It wouldn't be such an issue if the RAM could be upgraded. But it is not (which is a bit of an insult to greener thinking and producing less electronic waste, btw).
But again, great marketing positioning for maintaining an increased stream of revenue.
Make no mistake: there's a lot of cognitive psychology lurking behind the Mac Mini's marketing strategy. The 8GB is a tool to accomplish a very specific mean. And is has nothing to do with any empathy for what would be best for the user.
I could not agree with you more.
First you get the buyer thinking that this is an incredible deal. The buyer gets it in their mind that they want this product. Then when they get down to the details, they get the RAM anxiety, and then opt for an overpriced upgrade. Suddenly, it isn't a total bargain anymore, but the hook has been set.
As expected, the single core performance of the 3900x is 1289 points versus the 1648 points single core performance of the Mac Mini M2 Pro (according to the article).
Better, but still not as great a difference as I had hoped for.
General feel is super snappy on my side, because I installed two very fast M2 drives for the system and work files (3d and video) respectively. And the 3080ti with 12GB and the 128GB RAM that I have installed do help as well.
I work with 3d scenes that eat up ~100GB of RAM. The need for speed and ram is real for me. Rendering with the 3080ti is super quick compared to CPU rendering.
ps the 64GB upgrade cost me ~CAN $300 (around ~$240 US at the time) last year. It's less expensive now.
The question: can we trust Apple when they say 8GB is enough?
My experience tells me not. I am a very light iPhone user (essentially calling and texting) so I always buy the minimum storage iPhone, everything in cloud, offloading apps. And still, every time after a year it runs out of storage. The minimum storage is not sufficient for even basic use.
My experience tells me not. I am a very light iPhone user (essentially calling and texting) so I always buy the minimum storage iPhone, everything in cloud, offloading apps. And still, every time after a year it runs out of storage. The minimum storage is not sufficient for even basic use.
Thanks for responding. A fast SSD makes all the difference. The move from my 2018 mini to the M2 Pro mini will see a massive increase in not only the CPU (1.1k to 1.95k in Geekbench single core) but a more than twice as fast SSD. If I had the patience I would upgrade my PCIE 3.0 NVME SSD to a 4.0 SSD in my gaming pc, but it's by no means slow and has zero impacts on games for now. I will do a full rebuild alongside Zen 5 in 2024.As expected, the single core performance of the 3900x is 1289 points versus the 1648 points single core performance of the Mac Mini M2 Pro (according to the article).
Better, but still not as great a difference as I had hoped for.
General feel is super snappy on my side, because I installed two very fast M2 drives for the system and work files (3d and video) respectively. And the 3080ti with 12GB and the 128GB RAM that I have installed do help as well.
I work with 3d scenes that eat up ~100GB of RAM. The need for speed and ram is real for me. Rendering with the 3080ti is super quick compared to CPU rendering.
ps the 64GB upgrade cost me ~CAN $300 (around ~$240 US at the time) last year. It's less expensive now.
They haven't said that though. Hell they sold the series 3 Apple Watch forever and people could barely install OS updates due to limited storage size.
I have two 13" MBP's (AS & Intel) both have the base 8GB neither have been of issue, nor previous Mac's with them used on engineering projects. 15"/16" 16GB is OK, maybe 32GB, but again I'd need to have a specific use case.
This 17" Windows notebook on the other hand has 32GB to run heavy applications that macOS doesn't run. Right tool for the right job and all.
Still maintain that 8GB is adequate for the majority, equally options exist for upgrades & larger more powerful machines at greater cost for those with greater needs. Apple wont increase the base memory until there's significant market pressure or if it's a requirement and when Apple does expect a price increase.
When in the field don't I think how many resources are being utilised I simply use the machine regardless of platform. The base models are a lot more competent than many give credit for. I learnt a long time ago the most important factor with a notebook is battery life & portability, hence the 13" M1 MBP and here the base models excel...
Q-6
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Apple never said that.
If you go with the idea, "if Apple sells it, so it ought to be enough" then you're in for a bad time.
MacBook Pro came with 128GB storage up until 2018. Apple sold the 21.5-inch iMac through 2021. iPhone 14 Pro with ProRes transfers at USB 2.0 speeds.
You were spot on even though you say you are not a technical person. Maybe you should.
I received my M2 Mini 8/256GB today from Apple. This little guy screams for the asking price of $599. It is even faster than my 2018 Mini. The boot time on my 2018 Mini is 18.41 secs. The M2 Mini destroys that with a Boot time of 10.66 secs. Apps on average open 60% faster. Just one glaring example is Microsoft Edge. On the 2018 Mini it takes around 3.68 secs to load. On the M2 base Mini it loads in 0.72 secs.
Onto memory. You called it and you were correct. On my 2018 i5 Mini once at the desktop from a cold boot I am at close to 7GB of RAM, no problem since I installed 32GB. The M2 uses 3.99GB right from a cold boot. Memory pressure is low with 8 GB. Once I begin to open multiple web browsers it never gets above 6GB as memory begins to compress. As I close apps the memory begins to decompress. What is really interesting is that Memory Pressure tends to stay at around 50% with multiple apps open.
The base M2 Mini is a freaking steal for $599, made even better with an Edu discount. Total cost was $476, can't beat that and it looks to be a little more than twice as fast as my i5 2018 Mini.
I’m hesitating… should I go with 8GB or 16GB. I’m an average user that want to use this Mac for web browsing, YouTube videos and that’s it. I can have an edu discount too.
Don't waste your money, 8GB. I'm also an average user.
But look at what the Verge says. They are usually quite technically competent.From the verge review of the Mac mini
“However, as tempting as the $599 price tag on the entry-level Mini is, we generally recommend getting more than the base 8GB of RAM.”
Apple Mac Mini (2023) review: Mac Studio junior
The Mac Studio is overkill for a lot of people, but this isn’t.www.theverge.com
The thing that's different between my 2018 and M2 Mini is that the M2 Mini sheds memory when idle. The 2018 Mini doesn't tend to shed memory. So i'm usually hovering around 4-4.5GB of memory.
I have an 8GB MacBook, a 16gb Mini, and a 32gb Intel iMac. The iMac is always running out of memory. I run the same workload on the MacBook and never have an issue with memory, and I run a ton of applications, Xcode, Photoshop, etc. The memory doesn't make as much of a difference on a Silicon Mac. If the price was lower I'd get 16gb to play it safe but Apple absolutely screws customers on RAM prices so I understand wanting to save the money.
This is it, more is always better but why pay for more than you need? Unified memory on Apple's SOC is very much a game changer. I think a lot of the criticism comes from those that don't actually own M1/M2 Mac's and therefore only have experience of the Intel platform.
I am and remain very critical of the 2016 MBP redesign for multiple reasons, as it was a disaster for many reasons. Yet the moment I tried the 2020 M1 13" MBP it was an instant purchase as it literally shredded all the Intel Mac's on just a 13" platform!!! with double the battery runtime...
Q-6
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If you think upgrading to 16GB is a waste of 200 bucks, the fact is that choosing 8 GB models is a waste of 600 bucks.
You cannot upgrade the RAM once you purchased a Mac. 8GB configuration had been the default option for MacBook pro-2014. It's not future proved.
You cannot upgrade the RAM once you purchased a Mac. 8GB configuration had been the default option for MacBook pro-2014. It's not future proved.