9to5 calls new Mac Pro at MacWorld "all but certain"

[timestamp]

Well,you apparently have?
Please leave the memo on my desk by morning. Pronto.


Moviecutters thoughts corraborate with my talks/experiences too. Albeit I have to admit,it is relatively narrow containing only movie editing/photography/graphics/layout and music arenas.
Nobody is particulary intrested if the new*omg*MPs come out next week or not.
People are busy working.

The only people to fret about it seems to be around here.

I didn't make the claim that I did. My critique of the Mac Pro is completely independent of the users opinion. If we went by the number of users that are happy with the current computers, and used that data to decide whether to update a computer. No computer would be updated. Which is essentially what Moviecutter was saying.

If we look at the update cycle of other machines, they seem to be updated when new things are available. In which case there was the Clovertown line of Xeons, and now the Harpertown line of Xeons. So there were new things, but no update. So what is it? All the users of the MBP and other Macs simply not happy and thus Apple updates? Or is it just that Apple has decided to neglect the Mac Pro?

You seem to have the answers. And you also seem to be fine with Apple screwing people. Of course we can say, "You don't have to give Apple your money!" but lets be real, people who have invested in the Mac platform don't have much of a choice. And I personally find it rather unfair for the rest of the Mac users to have an easier time deciding on what to buy, since the updates are frequent. While the Mac Pro users are forced into a position where they must buy a machine that has not been updated in 17 months.

So please, tell me how this is "fretting." And please tell me I have no reason to fret.

 

[MovieCutter]

Not to mention, I guess you have spoken with every Pro user out there and gotten their opinion, right? How else could you have such knowledge of these feelings the Pros have... But of course, you will make known that you worked at the mothership and have advanced knowledge in this area. Hell, maybe you even have the real MWSF keynote script.

I didn't make the claim that I did. My critique of the Mac Pro is completely independent of the users opinion. If we went by the number of users that are happy with the current computers, and used that data to decide whether to update a computer. No computer would be updated. Which is essentially what Moviecutter was saying.

If we look at the update cycle of other machines, they seem to be updated when new things are available. In which case there was the Clovertown line of Xeons, and now the Harpertown line of Xeons. So there were new things, but no update. So what is it? All the users of the MBP and other Macs simply not happy and thus Apple updates? Or is it just that Apple has decided to neglect the Mac Pro?

You seem to have the answers. And you also seem to be fine with Apple screwing people. Of course we can say, "You don't have to give Apple your money!" but lets be real, people who have invested in the Mac platform don't have much of a choice. And I personally find it rather unfair for the rest of the Mac users to have an easier time deciding on what to buy, since the updates are frequent. While the Mac Pro users are forced into a position where they must buy a machine that has not been updated in 17 months.

So please, tell me how this is "fretting." And please tell me I have no reason to fret.

Oh my my my, where do I start. Production houses, news facilities, freelance professionals. I talk to these people on a daily and weekly basis. They're all buying or just bought new gear. Not a whisper of "Oh I feel like I'm getting screwed by Apple, I hope they update the Mac Pro soon". No way. They're all "We need what we need now, we don't care about an update because it's not out NOW." You're idea that Mac Pro users are "forced" into a position is ridiculous. The target market for Mac Pros aren't FORCED into anything. You're projecting your own fear, frustration, and arrogance onto the professional market for which you've not demonstrated any credible representation for.

And as far as MacBook Pros being updated, more and more CONSUMERS are buying those because more and more CONSUMERS want dedicated graphics cards, bigger screens, etc. I'd say if ANYTHING, notebook buyers are getting "forced" into buying something. MacBook Pros are being updated more often because of newer technology and increased demand. MBPs are outselling Mac Pros by a HUGE margin and thus require more refreshening and attention. Mac Pros simply don't need that kind of attention.

Is there new tech out there that it can use? Sure. Is Apple feeling pressure from it's target market to update it? No. Will they? Of course. Back in the G5 days, there was incredible pressure to update the Pro desktops. But now with 4-8 Xeon processors, a 4TB internal HDD ceiling, a 16GB RAM ceiling, and 4 PCI-e slots, we're set for a while thanks.

And yes, working inside the mothership DOES give me more insight than you. And yes, working among and inside the target market (high end post production, news, freelance) for the product in question DOES give me more insight.

That being said, if Steve mentions a Mac Pro update at the keynote, I'd be happy to take all my claims back and admit defeat (I'm sure you'd be happy to rub it in my face), but I'd say it's unlikely to get a note at MWSF's keynote.

P.S. Dealing with Apple users and customers for a long time, I've found that about 97% of people don't care when the products are going to be updated. They don't even realize that there could be an update in the next year, nor do they care. They buy when they need it. So if you're WAITING on an update, it's simply because you HAVE to have the "LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME" latest greatest thing available. The updates the Mac Pro is going to get will NOT have a life-altering or earth shattering impact on your user experience. Trust me.

 

[Mike Teezie]

Well,you apparently have?
Please leave the memo on my desk by morning. Pronto.


Moviecutters thoughts corraborate with my talks/experiences too. Albeit I have to admit,it is relatively narrow containing only movie editing/photography/graphics/layout and music arenas.
Nobody is particulary intrested if the new*omg*MPs come out next week or not.
People are busy working.

The only people to fret about it seems to be around here.

Well, I'm a photographer, busy working AND needing a new machine really badly. I just can't drop that kind of coin on two year old hardware!

I would agree with your assesment most pro's aren't pouring over rumors.

This is MacRumors though, and it's safe to assume everyone here is an enthusiast. The noise from people like me is bound to be a little louder.

 

[orangejuice]

Well,you apparently have?
Moviecutters thoughts corraborate with my talks/experiences too. Albeit I have to admit,it is relatively narrow containing only movie editing/photography/graphics/layout and music arenas.
Nobody is particulary intrested if the new*omg*MPs come out next week or not.
People are busy working.

The only people to fret about it seems to be around here.

Nah not true at all, I know plenty of professionals in the design/audio business who, might I add, do not read this website at all, and are quite worried about the way that the Mac Pro is being handled by Apple.

For me even a mild/moderate speedbump over my current Mac Pro would justify the expenditure, as they say time is money.

 

[MovieCutter]

I don't understand this rage at Apple in the sense that they're trying to "screw" their customers and that they are forcing people to buy something that won't perform EVERYTHING people want them to. I mean, I'd love an update too. But like I said, ANYTHING that Apple does to the Mac Pro isn't going to affect overall performance more than 10-15%. And I can bet a lot of you clamoring for updates and saying Apple is screwing you aren't using 100% of your resources...hell, the APPS aren't even using everything the CURRENT Mac Pro has to offer. Apple isn't trying to screw anyone, they aren't neglecting things. They have their priorities and they'll get to the Mac Pro in a matter of weeks now that the tech is available in quantity. Just chill out yo.

 

[OnePumpChump]

Oh my my my, where do I start. Production houses, news facilities, freelance professionals. I talk to these people on a daily and weekly basis. They're all buying or just bought new gear. Not a whisper of "Oh I feel like I'm getting screwed by Apple, I hope they update the Mac Pro soon". No way. They're all "We need what we need now, we don't care about an update because it's not out NOW." You're idea that Mac Pro users are "forced" into a position is ridiculous. The target market for Mac Pros aren't FORCED into anything. You're projecting your own fear, frustration, and arrogance onto the professional market for which you've not demonstrated any credible representation for.

And as far as MacBook Pros being updated, more and more CONSUMERS are buying those because more and more CONSUMERS want dedicated graphics cards, bigger screens, etc. I'd say if ANYTHING, notebook buyers are getting "forced" into buying something. MacBook Pros are being updated more often because of newer technology and increased demand. MBPs are outselling Mac Pros by a HUGE margin and thus require more refreshening and attention. Mac Pros simply don't need that kind of attention.

Is there new tech out there that it can use? Sure. Is Apple feeling pressure from it's target market to update it? No. Will they? Of course. Back in the G5 days, there was incredible pressure to update the Pro desktops. But now with 4-8 Xeon processors, a 4TB internal HDD ceiling, a 16GB RAM ceiling, and 4 PCI-e slots, we're set for a while thanks.

And yes, working inside the mothership DOES give me more insight than you. And yes, working among and inside the target market (high end post production, news, freelance) for the product in question DOES give me more insight.

That being said, if Steve mentions a Mac Pro update at the keynote, I'd be happy to take all my claims back and admit defeat (I'm sure you'd be happy to rub it in my face), but I'd say it's unlikely to get a note at MWSF's keynote.

P.S. Dealing with Apple users and customers for a long time, I've found that about 97% of people don't care when the products are going to be updated. They don't even realize that there could be an update in the next year, nor do they care. They buy when they need it. So if you're WAITING on an update, it's simply because you HAVE to have the "LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME" latest greatest thing available. The updates the Mac Pro is going to get will NOT have a life-altering or earth shattering impact on your user experience. Trust me.

Sure, maybe businesses with money to blow and an immediate demand for a macpro can drop all the money they want on the outdated hardware and be fine with that. But I, a freelance professional, cannot justify spending my hard earned money on outdated equipment. It seems everyone in here likes to speak for everybody else quite often, however, I'm sure each person has their own reasons for wanting or not wanting an updated macpro. I personally can afford to wait for the update and will not buy until I see one.

By the way, you forgot to mention the video cards that do not need any updating for a while.

 

[macjay]

Like I said, when 9to5 calls it, it happens.

When 9to5 shares info from a source that something will happen, it happens. They mention no source in that post. It is their own speculation. Doesn't mean it won't happen.

 

[sunfast]

If it happens, it'll certainly please / shut up quite a few folks around here

 

[peejack]

Sure, maybe businesses with money to blow and an immediate demand for a macpro can drop all the money they want on the outdated hardware and be fine with that. But I, a freelance professional, cannot justify spending my hard earned money on outdated equipment. It seems everyone in here likes to speak for everybody else quite often, however, I'm sure each person has their own reasons for wanting or not wanting an updated macpro. I personally can afford to wait for the update and will not buy until I see one.

By the way, you forgot to mention the video cards that do not need any updating for a while.

Absolutely, I will be buying my first mac pro for professional use and really don't want to have to buy the current model, purely because it's very old and outdated, sure it will probably do for me perfect, but like everyone i want the most bang for my buck, it's not like it's a few hundred quid, if you spend thousands you want the best or at least nearly the best

Anyway roll on mac pro update at macworld

 

[zdobson]

P.S. Dealing with Apple users and customers for a long time, I've found that about 97% of people don't care when the products are going to be updated. They don't even realize that there could be an update in the next year, nor do they care. They buy when they need it.

I believe that yes, you are right; medium to large businesses don't need to concern themselves with updates. They buy what they need when they need it.

So if you're WAITING on an update, it's simply because you HAVE to have the "LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME" latest greatest thing available.

That's a bit of a broad statement. I am a freelance photographer and I want to wait because I believe that the new computers will be at the same price point, so I might as well wait a month or two to get the most for my money. Also, I'll get a longer life span out of it. I'm not trying to impress anyone with it. Besides, I work from home so only I, my wife and my cat will see it. And belive me, the cat is not impressed by anything I do.

The updates the Mac Pro is going to get will NOT have a life-altering or earth shattering impact on your user experience. Trust me.

I believe it. But if a computer, for me, has a 5 year life span, I could buy the current MP, which will be 5 years old in August 2011, or wait for the update, which will be 5 in January/February 2013.

 

[RichP]

Angst doesn't exist as vastly as people think. Pro's are perfectly happy with Mac Pros right now and are in no hurry to upgrade. That's not to say we don't welcome a 10% boost in processing power and new graphics options. But everyone acts like the target market for this machine is struggling to get by and is ready to march on Cupertino if they don't get an update on the 15th. That's simply not the case.

I completely agree. MacPros, in their current form, are not exactly slow, or outdated. It was only a few weeks ago that the new processor line for these machines was released, and they have just started to ship from other vendors.

People act like it is still running a G4...

 

[timestamp]

I completely agree. MacPros, in their current form, are not exactly slow, or outdated. It was only a few weeks ago that the new processor line for these machines was released, and they have just started to ship from other vendors.

People act like it is still running a G4...

I guess you didn't get the memo on the Clovertown release back in November of 2006. Yes, thats right, Clovertown has been around since 2006. And to refresh your memory, they retailed at just about the same price as Woodcrest. And a price drop came in mid 2007 on them. We could have had eight-cores standard long ago.

So yes. It is outdated. It has been for quite sometime. That isn't to say it is slow. But the rest of Apples customers don't exactly have to worry about having a dated machine. Why should we?

 

[Macinposh]

Well, I'm a photographer, busy working AND needing a new machine really badly. I just can't drop that kind of coin on two year old hardware!

Hello collegue!

You really should be more concerned about your photoshops performance than your future macpros... You are getting shafted by adobe every single minute,and you still seem to get all upset by Macpro.

Newsflash : You speed increase with your future MP will be practically nil in PS use compared to,say, my 1.5yrs old 4x3.00.
With lightroom you will fare better,thanks to relatively good threading.
In all the other photo related actions,be transfering pics from mem cards to HDDs,backuping,burning DVD backups,sending pics to clients via mail or ftp, will be about just as fast as with a present machine.

So when you run your new MP with photoshop, and see your 8 cores total a whopping 100% speed on most filters/actions (of the 800%) you will start to bite your face and direct your aggression towards Adobe.

And the help will arrive earliest 12 months from this date, if they have managed to rewrite the code for CS4. If not,well,tuff, you have another 18 months to wait after that. All the time,you will watch how the photoshop huffs and puffs at a whopping 100% core useage... Whoopdiduu.


Dont get me wrong.
If you have the money in your hand, you obviously wait. There might be some perks and yes,you would have a more futureproof machine.
But if the MP failes to materialize,well,you buy your workhorse if you need it.
If you dont buy it,well,then you can continue the banter.

Timestamp: please read the other threads in this forum,visit logic/ps/fcp user forums and get a bit perspective,please. Your opinions about "apple screwing up with people" is quite tiresome and childish.

The power of present single MP has saturated quite many production fields allready (photography,music,layout/graphs) , is adequate on some areas (video editing) and wont be never enough (heavy rendering,heavy compositing/cgi).

So yes,you are fretting about the MP at the moment, in my honest opinion.

I see that apple has way,way bigger issues to correct at the moment,say : MBP keyboard issue, iMac display problems,the rumored LED display problems and utterly useles Airport Extreme.
Products that people have bought that are next to useless.

I personally think we as customers would benefit the most if apple would sort them out and let use use the products that we have allready paid for.
Do you agree with me on that part?

 

[netdog]

Your 4x3.00 cost a heck of a lot more than my 2.83x8 with a far better graphics card will. You bought a great machine, and you've had use of it, but don't try to convince me that as multi-core support develops, my 8-core with better graphics will plough through anything I can throw at it...all for $2499 with 2GB of RAM and 320-500GB standard. That's my prediction anyway, whether it comes tomorrow, on the 15th, or on the 22nd.

 

[OnePumpChump]

Well due to the hefty price tag on a mac pro, no, I'm guessing not too many people are going to update with every update a macpro has. But obviously, there are many peeps that are in the market for something new and want the most current technology, whether or not it is to show off, or to get the most life out of their computer, or even for someone in the market for their first macpro. And yes, to a point, the current macpro is outdated, even if it more than enough to run all current apps, especially the video cards.

 

[OnePumpChump]

I personally think we as customers would benefit the most if apple would sort them out and let use use the products that we have allready paid for.
Do you agree with me on that part?

I know you were not directing it at me, but I would agree if I already had a macpro or something to get me by. But I do not, so therefore a new macpro is definately welcome in my book, asap!

 

[Gloor]

Oh my my my, where do I start. Production houses, news facilities, freelance professionals. I talk to these people on a daily and weekly basis. They're all buying or just bought new gear. Not a whisper of "Oh I feel like I'm getting screwed by Apple, I hope they update the Mac Pro soon". No way. They're all "We need what we need now, we don't care about an update because it's not out NOW." You're idea that Mac Pro users are "forced" into a position is ridiculous. The target market for Mac Pros aren't FORCED into anything. You're projecting your own fear, frustration, and arrogance onto the professional market for which you've not demonstrated any credible representation for.

And as far as MacBook Pros being updated, more and more CONSUMERS are buying those because more and more CONSUMERS want dedicated graphics cards, bigger screens, etc. I'd say if ANYTHING, notebook buyers are getting "forced" into buying something. MacBook Pros are being updated more often because of newer technology and increased demand. MBPs are outselling Mac Pros by a HUGE margin and thus require more refreshening and attention. Mac Pros simply don't need that kind of attention.

Is there new tech out there that it can use? Sure. Is Apple feeling pressure from it's target market to update it? No. Will they? Of course. Back in the G5 days, there was incredible pressure to update the Pro desktops. But now with 4-8 Xeon processors, a 4TB internal HDD ceiling, a 16GB RAM ceiling, and 4 PCI-e slots, we're set for a while thanks.

And yes, working inside the mothership DOES give me more insight than you. And yes, working among and inside the target market (high end post production, news, freelance) for the product in question DOES give me more insight.

That being said, if Steve mentions a Mac Pro update at the keynote, I'd be happy to take all my claims back and admit defeat (I'm sure you'd be happy to rub it in my face), but I'd say it's unlikely to get a note at MWSF's keynote.

P.S. Dealing with Apple users and customers for a long time, I've found that about 97% of people don't care when the products are going to be updated. They don't even realize that there could be an update in the next year, nor do they care. They buy when they need it. So if you're WAITING on an update, it's simply because you HAVE to have the "LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME" latest greatest thing available. The updates the Mac Pro is going to get will NOT have a life-altering or earth shattering impact on your user experience. Trust me.

I'm sorry Moviecutter but the post you made makes YOU look like LOOK AT ME. Let me put it in the perspective for you:

I agree that large post production houses or large companies don't read MR or even bother. They have the money and they don't need to worry about anything. When pipeline is slow they look whats out there and they get it because they need it. Money is usually no issue for them.

But lets take me for an example: I love Apple. I switched few months ago but I've been using my gf's mac for over 2 years. So, I'm quite new to mac but that doesn't mean that I am a complete noob. I studied Maya in a large professional studio and am going to start another course in march. My first project at school was 720frames (30secs) long and one frame took around 7 minutes. I had the luxury to use their renderfarm so my project got rendered over a night. Well, that was back then. Now I have iMac (my first mac I got in august when they released new aluminium iMacs) and I'm waiting for updated Mac Pro. The reason is simple - money. If I want to get 8 core Mac Pro now it will cost me extra £960. The difference between 4 cores and 8 cores is huge for me as it will cut the render time by half. I had the luxury not to worry about these things when I had renderfarm available for my personal use but I don't have the luxury now so I have to think twice before I spend my money (as a student I have very little).

So, Intel slashed prices and clovertown costs the same as woodcrest now. Yet, I have to pay £960 to cut my render time in half even thought the price is the same. Penryn released in november will give me even better lifespan for my investment whilst I study (2 years) so the update is crucial for me. It will save me £960 I would have to pay extra for something that should already be included. I'm sure that there are more people like me that just are either students or freelancers that can't afford to spend extra money but they need the update. Seeing that you are in contact with post production houses I would suggest you to look around there as you might see few people trying to get into "that world" that don't roll in it. 8 core penryn MP will change a lot for me and it will save me huge amount of money so don't bash people here with your exaggarated statement. Please!


Edit: P.S.: I'm sure that you are aware how hard it is to get money for MP + display (approx. £2200) whilst being a student. So have some consideration next time you write something.

 

[netdog]

I know you were not directing it at me, but I would agree if I already had a macpro or something to get me by. But I do not, so therefore a new macpro is definately welcome in my book, asap!

+1

 

[TripleCore]

Besides, I work from home so only I, my wife and my cat will see it. And belive me, the cat is not impressed by anything I do.

LOL, sounds like some cats I know.

 

[peejack]

LOL, sounds like some cats I know.

You obviously haven't go the new updated 'cat', it now has more ram as standard and comes with MAT (Mac Appreciation Technology)

 

[surflordca]

LOL, sounds like some cats I know.

Stupid cat. Oh, it sound like my 2 cats...

 

[darthraige]

the Mac Pro doesn't need to be updated since the Pros are happy with the current one.

I consider myself a "Pro." And let me tell you. I'm not happy with the current ones. I want more power. I need more power for the things I do. I want faster speeds, I want more core advantage, and I want better graphics.

 

[zdobson]

Newsflash : You speed increase with your future MP will be practically nil in PS use compared to,say, my 1.5yrs old 4x3.00.
With lightroom you will fare better,thanks to relatively good threading.
In all the other photo related actions,be transfering pics from mem cards to HDDs,backuping,burning DVD backups,sending pics to clients via mail or ftp, will be about just as fast as with a present machine.

So when you run your new MP with photoshop, and see your 8 cores total a whopping 100% speed on most filters/actions (of the 800%) you will start to bite your face and direct your aggression towards Adobe.

....

Dont get me wrong.
If you have the money in your hand, you obviously wait. There might be some perks and yes,you would have a more futureproof machine.
But if the MP failes to materialize,well,you buy your workhorse if you need it.

I think most pro photogs know that CS3 does not yet utilize 8 cores. But you said it yourself, "you would have a more futureproof machine." That is the reason I'm waiting, as are (probably some) other photogs.

Also, 8 cores will enable much greater multitasking, which I think pros in all arenas do.

 

[surflordca]

I consider myself a "Pro." And let me tell you. I'm not happy with the current ones. I want more power. I need more power for the things I do. I want faster speeds, I want more core advantage, and I want better graphics.

I want, I want I want. Me to. I am hoping Jan.15 fills my I wants

 

[dalvin200]

I consider myself a "Pro." And let me tell you. I'm not happy with the current ones. I want more power. I need more power for the things I do. I want faster speeds, I want more core advantage, and I want better graphics.

you don't ask for much do you?