They haven't, but it doesn't matter.
The point is that Amazon is allowed to control the Kindle and Apple is allowed to control the iPhone.
We don't need to literally see examples of that in practice to know it's true.
Is that fact really in doubt?
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Amazon's 'Kindle' App Updated to Remove Direct Kindle Store Links
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They haven't, but it doesn't matter.
The point is that Amazon is allowed to control the Kindle and Apple is allowed to control the iPhone.
We don't need to literally see examples of that in practice to know it's true.
Is that fact really in doubt?
Not defending anyone here on either side, and I know this is a totally personal observation...but I always use the Amazon website to buy e-books anyway. From my computer.
I also look for other books and put them on my wish-list and when I'm ready I'll buy them right at the web-site. I've never used the store button in the Kindle app for my iPhone or iPad...and I didn't even use it on my Kindle 3 when I had it.
I was more concerned with their policy before when they didn't want bookstores to sell "off app" at all and were demanding their 30% no matter what.
Dunno, that's just me.
I also look for other books and put them on my wish-list and when I'm ready I'll buy them right at the web-site. I've never used the store button in the Kindle app for my iPhone or iPad...and I didn't even use it on my Kindle 3 when I had it.
I was more concerned with their policy before when they didn't want bookstores to sell "off app" at all and were demanding their 30% no matter what.
Dunno, that's just me.
Agreed, but add one more thing. You can't have a button to bring up the Safari site unless you are selling those goods in app as well. Why, otherwise NO ONE would sell ANYTHING. All apps would be Free, with a button to buy the app directly from them via a Safari form that is brought up when you click the button.
Example.
Angry Birds, Free! Play the first level, click a button to take you to Roxio's homepage and download all the other levels for $1.99. Apple gets $0.00, Roxio gets $1.99 - hosting fee.
Since the App store runs at almost 0 profit already, this would do nothing but suck money from Apple if everyone did it. It would be unsustainable.
Now, did Apple and Amazon try to work out a deal? I'm sure . . . looks like they didn't though. But, in this case, is it really that bad for the consumer?
Fixed your post. Still fair enough?
Of course it isn't. And we're not even getting into the point that MS could never dream of signing all the code on Windows to exclude any competitors who didn't agree to their demands.
Apple being the exclusive source of code signing on iOS was always a terrible idea, that could only be justified if they treated it with the highest principles of only using it to block malware. They have not (quite the opposite). It can no longer be justified. There is no "built ecosystem" - there is merely the long term practice of restricting the ecosystem that would otherwise exist to favour themselves as they don't want to compete on quality of offering.
Looking very hard at doing exactly that. With sadness, but this is completely beyond the pale.
Looking even harder at formal complaints to regulatory authorities - given Apple's market share of the tablet market this is simply not something that should be allowed to exist. It's not "fair" in the slightest. Apple are using market dominance in some areas to force through their own inferior offerings and control pricing. That's the very textbook definition of anti-competition.
Phazer
You are evading the core point which is that for Apple to make money they also rely on others. ISP, browsers, PCs etc. Shouldn't everyone get a cut?
That's cute that you feel that way...unfortunately ISP's aren't seeing it that way. And in the US there's really nothing stopping them from doing exactly that...other than a public-relations problem.
So Kindle app on OS X ow Windows is using MS infrastructure?
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I sure wish they had worked out a deal. I think it would have been better.
I'm not arguing that this outcome is good. Far from it.
I am arguing that Apple, as a for-profit company, certainly SHOULD be asking for these kind of things. It's a shame they couldn't work this out better but I'm not blaming either side here. This is just one of those 'it sucks' situations. Both sides did what was best for them.
Kind of like how 'it sucks' that I have to pay to buy milk at the store. Yeah, it sucks that I have to pay, but I can't pretend that I 'should have' just gotten it for free. It just sucks for me and that's just a fact. No one's fault.
I'm pretty sure Amazon wouldn't give a lick about selling Apple books on the Kindle platform, if Apple had any books.
What Books does Apple have ? They aren't a publisher, they're just a 3rd party reseller. The Kindle is not a open application platform, it's an e-Reader/BookStore.
Apple has nothing to sell on Kindle, so you don't really have a point.
iOS is an open application platform. Amazon happens to make a port of their Kindle book application to it, which provides Apple with great value to offer customers ("Look, we're Kindle compatible!"). They pay 99$/year for the privilege, the asking price by Apple.
The IAP/IAS services are just payment processors. Amazon doesn't need them. Why should they be forced to use them ?
A blow to usability to feed Apple greed. This is what it is.
I see what you're getting at, but you've forgotten one little thing: nobody is denying that iOS is a closed, controlled platform. I certainly am not, and so with that in mind, I approached this Kindle app update by looking at it from the perspective of a closed platform.
Windows may not be open-source, ditto for Mac OS, but neither Microsoft nor Apple are claiming otherwise. Computers are carte blanche, iOS devices are not. That's my point. If Apple wants to close off their platform, then they can, despite how it might affect them or their relationships with consumers and developers down the line.
And at that point Roxio has to handle all the card processing itself. And Apple would be completely justified charging them for bandwidth (as long as they could choose to host it themselves instead).
At that point if Roxio still go with their own solution instead of Apple's, then Apple SHOULD get $0.00. They haven't done any work and don't deserve any money.
If Apple make their processing attractive enough then Roxio will chose to use them voluntarily. That's how markets work.
Phazer
You've got it wrong. There's a big difference here. Amazon is the reseller and hosts the electronic books on its site. The Kindle store button in the iPhone/etc. app was only a passthrough. Apple was collecting a toll for a road that it does not maintain.
Amazon books only work on the Kindle (don't know about other books without DRM, but typically you can only buy from Amazon).
B&N -> BNReader
Apple -> iBooks (but you can read any non-DRM book as well).
I don't like the DRM on the books, I hate tying myself to one reader.
Sure. They can all ask for one.
I'll use alternatives, though, and they'll lose business.
This isn't about "should." This is about who has the power. If IE asks for a cut I'll use Firefox. If Apple asks for a cut in OS X I'll use Windows. If Cox asks for a cut I'll use Verizon.
So they're free to ASK. I'll probably say no.
And Apple's free to ask companies who want to be in the iOS app store for a cut. If they don't like it they're free to go to the Android store. Except...wait. That doesn't make them happy because that's not where the majority of the paying customers are. So they put up with it. (Not all of them, but many of them. Certainly a lot more than in a IE-vs-Firefox situation.)
You all aren't mad that Apple's asking for a cut. ANYONE can ask for a cut. No, you're mad that there aren't any good alternatives to the iOS App Store...that theyr'e in a better position to be told 'ok, we'll pay that.'
In other words, you're mad that the iOS App Store is so successful.
I refuse to be mad over someone's success. It feels petty.
This difference between computers and "iOS" devices exists only in your (and maybe Apple's) head.
Apple owns enough of the tablet market that they should not be allowed to close this off - it's time for regulatory intervention, and time for Apple's customers to speak up that they are sick of Apple making the platform worse.
Phazer
This ridiculous argument again? Folks, you've never been able to make an in-app purchase from the Kindle app. Ever. All you were able to do is go to your browser and buy from Amazon directly. And guess what, you can still do that. Open Safari, choose your Amazon bookmark, and search for the book you want - boom. Purchase it.
For Tom, the guy who wondered if he could still buy books from Amazon and read on iPad or iPhone, yes. I assume your Amazon account already has the settings required for your ebooks to download directly to your device, so follow browser procedure above, and you are good to go.
For Tom, the guy who wondered if he could still buy books from Amazon and read on iPad or iPhone, yes. I assume your Amazon account already has the settings required for your ebooks to download directly to your device, so follow browser procedure above, and you are good to go.
Yup, agreed there. Would have liked to have it worked out.. it didn't so work with what you have or move to a different system. Personally there are far too many other things I like about the current system. But that could change at any time.
*I* allow it on *my* device because *I* paid for it. Fully. Plus 25% margin which piles up to huge earnings for Apple each quarter.
If Apple is giving me an iPhone for free, then things may be different. Until then
Amazon books only work on the Kindle (don't know about other books without DRM, but typically you can only buy from Amazon).
B&N -> BNReader
Apple -> iBooks (but you can read any non-DRM book as well).
I don't like the DRM on the books, I hate tying myself to one reader.
That doesn't answer my question at all. What I am asking is on a new Kindle App install with 0 books, does Amazon tell you to go online to download a book.
I really couldn't care less. I am still able to purchase kindle books via Amazon and read them on my iPad.
It seems as though there is a lot of "moving the goalposts" going on this thread. When the in app purchase regulations were set into motion earlier in the year, the question was whether or not Apple was going to squeeze Kindle entirely off of the iOS platform, period. There was less debate about some mediated position between the parties.
I'm curious how many people actually are in the Kindle app and use that link to purchase books compared to going directly to Amazon in a browser? I know personally I do not even think about launching Kindle to purchase books as it is done through a browser with or without a link from an app.
In the end, Amazon continues to support the iOS platform. iOS users are still able to purchase content for iOS from Amazon. Unlike Kindle or Nook, iOS allows multiple reading platforms on its platforms. Consumers still have choice.
Anyone who gets to bent of out shape over this are zealots, one way or the other.
Edit: Case in point, I downloaded the update and just bought a new book in the manner in which I always have without any disruption.
It seems as though there is a lot of "moving the goalposts" going on this thread. When the in app purchase regulations were set into motion earlier in the year, the question was whether or not Apple was going to squeeze Kindle entirely off of the iOS platform, period. There was less debate about some mediated position between the parties.
I'm curious how many people actually are in the Kindle app and use that link to purchase books compared to going directly to Amazon in a browser? I know personally I do not even think about launching Kindle to purchase books as it is done through a browser with or without a link from an app.
In the end, Amazon continues to support the iOS platform. iOS users are still able to purchase content for iOS from Amazon. Unlike Kindle or Nook, iOS allows multiple reading platforms on its platforms. Consumers still have choice.
Anyone who gets to bent of out shape over this are zealots, one way or the other.
Edit: Case in point, I downloaded the update and just bought a new book in the manner in which I always have without any disruption.