AMD Radeon RX Vega Plug-and-Play in 10.13

[AlexMaximus]

Yes, I was not satisfied with the Nvidia web driver. I was experiencing random slow-downs where the computer was not useable and occasional restarts due to a kernel panic. The panic reports specified the Nvidia web driver as the culprit. Those issues disappeared when I put my old HD 5870 back in. I also don't like having to wait for an Nvidia driver after each MacOS update. And besides that, I was excited to try the new Vega GPU. Since it's going into the new iMac Pro and will most likely be one of the officially supported eGPUs, it will have native drivers, so I thought that may work out better for me.

Thanks for the insights! Once High Sierra hits the market, I am sure it could be a great choice. I hope you report back once you have installed the official High Serra on your system. I would be very interested. Somehow I did not have any problems with the Web Driver so far, maybe I just got lucky. Anyways, I really didn't think the CMP would get another round of OEM card upgrades, its actually really really great for this community. That certainly keeps the CMP forum alive and kicking for another two years. Its great to be here, great to know you guys. Thanks for those awesome tech blogs.

 

[Draeconis]

If you read the post again I'm talking about the power consumption region Apple was happy to use. Nvidia filled that requirement after Kepler but they ****ed their relationship.

I believe Apple were unhappy with the fallout of the 8600m GPU issues they had on the 2008-era MacBook Pros, due to poor quality solder. These same issues carried over to the 9600m GPUs on the 2009 line. Apple (I believe were the only OEM to admit to this as a fault; all overs denied it, including Nvidia. This led to Apple looking bad, and Apple isn't a fan of that. 2013 was the last generation to see an Nvidia GPU (some 2013 iMacs had a 750m), but they'd already begun the transition to AMD with the 2011 MacBook Pros with the 6xxx series.

Ironically, these GPUs also had serious flaws (although inexplicably, mine still works fine!) but it seems the damage was done between Apple and Nvidia, and they apparently (publicly) haven't looked back.

It's a shame really; ignoring the fact that the Mac Pro 2013 form-factor was a bit of an own goal, having a compact space meant that power was at a premium. Making use of cards that are more power efficient and generate less heat seems like an ideal fit for Nvidia. Alas..

Fingers crossed Apple does something a bit more standardised for the 7,1. You can't define a workstation as a commodity.

 

[Squuiid]

I believe Apple were unhappy with the fallout of the 8600m GPU issues they had on the 2008-era MacBook Pros, due to poor quality solder. These same issues carried over to the 9600m GPUs on the 2009 line. Apple (I believe were the only OEM to admit to this as a fault; all overs denied it, including Nvidia. This led to Apple looking bad, and Apple isn't a fan of that. 2013 was the last generation to see an Nvidia GPU (some 2013 iMacs had a 750m), but they'd already begun the transition to AMD with the 2011 MacBook Pros with the 6xxx series.

Ironically, these GPUs also had serious flaws (although inexplicably, mine still works fine!) but it seems the damage was done between Apple and Nvidia, and they apparently (publicly) haven't looked back.

It's a shame really; ignoring the fact that the Mac Pro 2013 form-factor was a bit of an own goal, having a compact space meant that power was at a premium. Making use of cards that are more power efficient and generate less heat seems like an ideal fit for Nvidia. Alas..

Fingers crossed Apple does something a bit more standardised for the 7,1. You can't define a workstation as a commodity.

Nice write up.
Here's a bit more info:
https://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1049921/inquirer-confirms-apple-macbookpros-nvidia-bad-bump-material

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/feedback/MacBookPro_video_failure.html

I unfortunately had MacBooks with all 3 sets of chips and all of them failed.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

I believe Apple were unhappy with the fallout of the 8600m GPU issues they had on the 2008-era MacBook Pros, due to poor quality solder. These same issues carried over to the 9600m GPUs on the 2009 line. Apple (I believe were the only OEM to admit to this as a fault; all overs denied it, including Nvidia. This led to Apple looking bad, and Apple isn't a fan of that. 2013 was the last generation to see an Nvidia GPU (some 2013 iMacs had a 750m), but they'd already begun the transition to AMD with the 2011 MacBook Pros with the 6xxx series.

Ironically, these GPUs also had serious flaws (although inexplicably, mine still works fine!) but it seems the damage was done between Apple and Nvidia, and they apparently (publicly) haven't looked back.

It's a shame really; ignoring the fact that the Mac Pro 2013 form-factor was a bit of an own goal, having a compact space meant that power was at a premium. Making use of cards that are more power efficient and generate less heat seems like an ideal fit for Nvidia. Alas..

Fingers crossed Apple does something a bit more standardised for the 7,1. You can't define a workstation as a commodity.

I had that board with 8600m. It did fail and was replaced for free during the extension they offered. Failed again after a year.

 

[Synchro3]

That's is why I prefer iGPU's in laptops. dGPU's in laptops have always been a lottery, wether with AMD or Nvidia chips.

 

[goMac]

I believe Apple were unhappy with the fallout of the 8600m GPU issues they had on the 2008-era MacBook Pros, due to poor quality solder. These same issues carried over to the 9600m GPUs on the 2009 line. Apple (I believe were the only OEM to admit to this as a fault; all overs denied it, including Nvidia. This led to Apple looking bad, and Apple isn't a fan of that. 2013 was the last generation to see an Nvidia GPU (some 2013 iMacs had a 750m), but they'd already begun the transition to AMD with the 2011 MacBook Pros with the 6xxx series.

Ironically, these GPUs also had serious flaws (although inexplicably, mine still works fine!) but it seems the damage was done between Apple and Nvidia, and they apparently (publicly) haven't looked back.

It's a shame really; ignoring the fact that the Mac Pro 2013 form-factor was a bit of an own goal, having a compact space meant that power was at a premium. Making use of cards that are more power efficient and generate less heat seems like an ideal fit for Nvidia. Alas..

Fingers crossed Apple does something a bit more standardised for the 7,1. You can't define a workstation as a commodity.

A problem which repeated itself the very last time they used Nvidia.

https://www.apple.com/support/macbookpro-videoissues/

But that isn't the major reason Apple isn't using Nvidia.

 

[karsten]

That's is why I prefer iGPU's in laptop's. dGPU's in laptop's have always been a lottery, wether with AMD or Nvidia chips.

too much flexing going on

 

[Squuiid]

But that isn't the major reason Apple isn't using Nvidia.

Please enlighten us then.

 

[MisterAndrew]

I think the 650M in the 2012 non-Retina MBPs has been pretty good. Mine hasn't had issues (fingers crossed), except with the Nvidia web driver (kernel panics) so I use the default driver.

 

[William Payne]

I think the 650M in the 2012 non-Retina MBPs has been pretty good. Mine hasn't had issues (fingers crossed), except with the Nvidia web driver (kernel panics) so I use the default driver.

What are you doing when you get these karnel panics with the web driver? Did you report the issue to Nvidia?

 

[fendersrule]

This really suxors.

Currently using a unflashed 7950. Been having a blast with it for 1440p gaming. No, I'm not playing the latest and greatest stuff, but I've sunken hundreds of hours into games over the past few months. I'm not even afraid to play Doom on it. But I WANT to play VR. And there's no way I would expect my cMP to do VR acceptably with a 7950.

RX480/580 = Can break your mobo.
RX570 = Would be a decent card and I'd run basic VR with it, but have no clue if it works with MacOS.
ANY nVidia card's web driver = sounds awful. It also sounds like it's a "must" to have a second Mac in the house to be able to screen share with it to update the drive. Is that really true? And it sounds like stability issues are not worth it.

Great options that exist = 0. And I don't even care about a boot screen either.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

I think the 650M in the 2012 non-Retina MBPs has been pretty good. Mine hasn't had issues (fingers crossed), except with the Nvidia web driver (kernel panics) so I use the default driver.

That was a good chip. Still works like a champ.

 

[William Payne]

This really suxors.

Currently using a unflashed 7950. Been having a blast with it for 1440p gaming. No, I'm not playing the latest and greatest stuff, but I've sunken hundreds of hours into games over the past few months. I'm not even afraid to play Doom on it. But I WANT to play VR. And there's no way I would expect my cMP to do VR acceptably with a 7950.

RX480/580 = Can break your mobo.
RX570 = Would be a decent card and I'd run basic VR with it, but have no clue if it works with MacOS.
ANY nVidia card's web driver = sounds awful. It also sounds like it's a "must" to have a second Mac in the house to be able to screen share with it to update the drive. Is that really true? And it sounds like stability issues are not worth it.

Great options that exist = 0. And I don't even care about a boot screen either.

The web driver thing is weird. Some people have zero issues. Some have nothing but issues. It really is hard to pinpoint what is going on.

You don't need two macs to do screen share. If I'm not mistaken you can do it on an iPad. (Not sure about iPhone). I find the easiest way is just keeping a stock Mac video card either in the machine or just have one to swap in. I have only had my Mac Pro less then a year and haven't really updated it yet. I'm planning on it soon. I'm currently running the web driver with the stock gt120 so for me I'm having no issues but my situation cannot be compared to those running Pascal cards.

I would though like to know exactly what is going on.

 

[Squuiid]

This really suxors.

Currently using a unflashed 7950. Been having a blast with it for 1440p gaming. No, I'm not playing the latest and greatest stuff, but I've sunken hundreds of hours into games over the past few months. I'm not even afraid to play Doom on it. But I WANT to play VR. And there's no way I would expect my cMP to do VR acceptably with a 7950.

RX480/580 = Can break your mobo.
RX570 = Would be a decent card and I'd run basic VR with it, but have no clue if it works with MacOS.
ANY nVidia card's web driver = sounds awful. It also sounds like it's a "must" to have a second Mac in the house to be able to screen share with it to update the drive. Is that really true? And it sounds like stability issues are not worth it.

Great options that exist = 0. And I don't even care about a boot screen either.

RX 580 will not break your mobo and is your best option.

 

[MisterAndrew]

What are you doing when you get these karnel panics with the web driver? Did you report the issue to Nvidia?

Totally random. Often the computer wouldn't even boot all the way before restarting. I didn't report anything to Nvidia. They only have beta support for the MacBook Pro for the web driver anyways and it's okay because the MacOS default driver works fine.

 

[William Payne]

Without sounding like an idiot. I am not an expert on this stuff but I'm going to make it my mission to find out what's going on. I'll get Nvidia on the phone if I have to.

 

[MisterAndrew]

Without sounding like an idiot. I am not an expert on this stuff but I'm going to make it my mission to find out what's going on. I'll get Nvidia on the phone if I have to.

Why? It's not really an issue because we don't currently need a web driver for the GT 650M.

 

[William Payne]

Why? It's not really an issue because we don't currently need a web driver for the GT 650M.

I don't care about it for that case, no. But there are a lot of people using pascal cards with their macs. A lot of people having problems. A lot of people who have no idea what is going on. I would like to know what is causing the web driver problems.

 

[MisterAndrew]

Maybe Nvidia is working on it and the next web driver will be better.

 

[William Payne]

Maybe Nvidia is working on it and the next web driver will be better.

That may be the case, I personally don't like jumping to conclusions or assuming that anyone will do anything. I think everything should be looked into logically and not get overly emotional.

Every problem has a cause and you can't fix the problem until the cause is determined.

 

[itdk92]

I really think we need someone else with an RX 580 to test this out and confirm this isn't a freak result.
This impacts a lot of us with RX 580 pre-orders, which should perhaps be changed to Vega56 pre-orders asap.

Please could someone with an RX 580 run the iStat test again and confirm these results? It'll be a different card, different cable and different cMP which should eliminate all variables.
Many of us would be very grateful.
[doublepost=1504955402][/doublepost]
Yep, we need this tested on not only an RX 580 but also a Vega56 to get a true sense of whether either card is really suited to the cMP.
[doublepost=1504956252][/doublepost]
So, RX 580 in Furmark:
AUX A: 0W
AUX B: 82.5W
PCIe: 82.5W

Ouch. No spontaneous shutdowns Kris?
I'd be very keen to see the results of this on Vega56 also. Max draw in real usage could be very different to the reported spec sheet and the distribution of it very much matters when used in a cMP.

I will test single and dual RX 580 power draw today

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

Yep Apple produced their first GPU revealed today. We have been speculating this for months but had our naysayers. Would be great to see how it compared to mobile AMD.

 

[fendersrule]

RX 580 will not break your mobo and is your best option.

More specifically, the Sapphire Pulse 8GB, right? The one that isn't available, and/or that basically costs $480? I hardly consider that the best option...
[doublepost=1505245617][/doublepost]

I will test single and dual RX 580 power draw today

Thanks! Is this the Sapphire Pulse model that you'll be testing?

 

[goMac]

Please enlighten us then.

Do you think Apple has an easier time pushing around AMD or Nvidia?

 

[MisterAndrew]

Anyone try High Sierra GM yet?

Edit: I guess it's not available yet.