Another Boeing 737 Max crash

darksithpro

macrumors 6502a
Oct 27, 2016
582
4,567
Over at Airliners there's a 15 page thread. Looks like the Corporations are freaking out, sending emails to their executives and partners to avoid flying on the Max. This can be very bad for Boeing.
 

darksithpro

macrumors 6502a
Oct 27, 2016
582
4,567
Some more information. It seems according to Airliners.net that the FO only had 200 hours. The forum members are leaning towards pilot inexperience/panic...

https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1417519&start=850

"moments ago

Varsity1 wrote:
YoungDon wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
So the first officer had 200 hours? This was probably his first flight flying a jet of any kind. I would suspect a loss of control.


That's definitely not the case, training programs in foreign countries start out with cadets with no time flown beginning on jets. He's definitely inexperienced, but it's entirely possible all of his flight time is in jets.

What will be interesting to know is the amount of time he had on the MAX.

You don't spend your first 200 hours learning in jets anywhere on earth except some militaries.

Even if he had 200 hours all in the 737 max, it's almost nothing for flight time. Most pilots fly 100 hours a month!

You're right, I probably should have said mostly on jets. Agreed that's not much experience at all, and its an interesting data point in all this. If he was the PF the plot certainly thickens."
 
Last edited:

StarShot

macrumors 6502a
Mar 31, 2014
967
357
Avoid Southwest Airlines - their entire fleet is made up of the new Maxes.
Southwest Airlines and American Airlines operate the same new Boeing 737involved in the fatal Lion Air crash in Indonesia. ... Southwest had 23 175-seat Max8s in its fleet of 742 aircraft as of Sept. 30, and has orders for more.Oct 29, 2018

They've probably added a few since Sept 30th, but the Max makes up a very small part of their fleet.

Come on people, get your facts right.
 

baypharm

Contributor
Nov 15, 2007
1,691
568
Southwest Airlines and American Airlines operate the same new Boeing 737involved in the fatal Lion Air crash in Indonesia. ... Southwest had 23 175-seat Max8s in its fleet of 742 aircraft as of Sept. 30, and has orders for more.Oct 29, 2018

They've probably added a few since Sept 30th, but the Max makes up a very small part of their fleet.

Come on people, get your facts right.
Sorry. My bad.
 

cube

Suspended
May 10, 2004
16,983
4,965
Ethiopian Airlines grounded them too.

Royal Air Maroc grounded the ones they have.

Mongolia and Indonesia grounded theirs.

Vietnam will not grant licenses (they don't have any yet).
 
Last edited:

cube

Suspended
May 10, 2004
16,983
4,965
Jet Airways is not operating any MAX.

Comair grounded it.
 
Last edited:

quagmire

macrumors 603
Apr 19, 2004
6,339
1,177
IF this crash was caused by the MCAS as well, it's still a complicated matter than simply laying blame on the plane. As usual, crashes have multiple contributing factors though. Obviously we won't know them until the report comes out. Below is assuming this crash was caused by the MCAS.....

  • The primary cause if it was the MCAS was involved is still the plane giving a bad AoA data which caused an erroneous activation of the MCAS. From what I read of the system, it only requires one of the two AoA systems to say the plane is stalling. That to me is insane to think about. For Boeing not design MCAS activation requiring both in agreement is a massive oversight. What did they think of the chances of one malfunctioning were?
  • Would be curious if Ethiopian has implemented any training on the MCAS ever since Lion Air?
  • If there was an erroneous MCAS activation, the procedures to stop it is the same as runaway trim. Did they have enough altitude to recover? Did they perform the runaway trim procedure? Did they recognize what was going on?

To address the whole FO only had 200 hour thing..... Step out of the America-centric view. Total hours doesn't always reflect pilot skill. The FO could have had 2000 hours in a Skyhawk, but only 200 hours in the 737. He would still be inexperienced in the 737( and the airline environment as a whole) despite the total hours. Some of the experience he learned while flying the Skyhawk sure can be transferred to the 737, but that's mostly decision making skills, etc. I know here in the US we now require pilots to get their ATP before becoming an FO at an 121 outfit as the result of the Colgan crash. And I love what it did for improving the QOL and pay at the regionals, but it was more of a knee jerk reaction from the public which Congress placated. The FO in that crash having a commercial pilot license had zero contribution to the crash( she had over 1500 hours anyway as well). The low pay, rest requirements, and the poor QOL the regional airlines offer had a more contributing factor towards the crash than her not having an ATP.
 

cube

Suspended
May 10, 2004
16,983
4,965
Always horrible when something like this happens. Very tragic.

I am flying next month and the first thing I did after seeing info about the crash is checked what aircraft they were using.

Looks like I am on a 777 then an Airbus A330.
It would be very rare to replace a widebody with narrowbodies. Most of the time it is not possible.

But one could be rerouted.
 

cube

Suspended
May 10, 2004
16,983
4,965
Yeah I figured for the flight overseas it wouldn't be a 737, but once I got abroad it could have been a possibility. I'd like to hear more information about what's going on with those aircraft that's for sure.
I guess it is a very long trip if you're taking 777+A330. Or you meant A320?
 

Similar threads

Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.