Another Boeing 737 Max crash

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by stylinexpat, Mar 10, 2019.

  1. gkarris macrumors 604

    gkarris

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    #2
    Bad, bad for Boeing.

    My friends just flew to Iceland and back on one a week ago, and I was concerned back then...

    The plane will have a bad stigma if this continues...

    FAA needs to ground them.
     
  2. darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    #3
    Over at Airliners there's a 15 page thread. Looks like the Corporations are freaking out, sending emails to their executives and partners to avoid flying on the Max. This can be very bad for Boeing.
     
  3. stylinexpat thread starter macrumors 65816

    stylinexpat

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  4. darksithpro, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019

    darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    #5
    Some more information. It seems according to Airliners.net that the FO only had 200 hours. The forum members are leaning towards pilot inexperience/panic...

    https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1417519&start=850

    "moments ago

    Varsity1 wrote:
    YoungDon wrote:
    Varsity1 wrote:
    So the first officer had 200 hours? This was probably his first flight flying a jet of any kind. I would suspect a loss of control.


    That's definitely not the case, training programs in foreign countries start out with cadets with no time flown beginning on jets. He's definitely inexperienced, but it's entirely possible all of his flight time is in jets.

    What will be interesting to know is the amount of time he had on the MAX.

    You don't spend your first 200 hours learning in jets anywhere on earth except some militaries.

    Even if he had 200 hours all in the 737 max, it's almost nothing for flight time. Most pilots fly 100 hours a month!

    You're right, I probably should have said mostly on jets. Agreed that's not much experience at all, and its an interesting data point in all this. If he was the PF the plot certainly thickens."
     
  5. cube, Mar 10, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019

    cube macrumors P6

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    #6
  6. darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    #7
  7. cube macrumors P6

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  8. baypharm macrumors 65816

    baypharm

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    #9
    Avoid Southwest Airlines - their entire fleet is made up of the new Maxes.
     
  9. darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    #10

    This is just sad. Before we know any of the facts we blame it on the plane and it's manufacturer. These two incidents can ruin the reputation of a multi billion dollar company, where thousands of jobs and lives could be at risk. Lets wait for the facts to come out.
     
  10. cube macrumors P6

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    #11
    They only have thirtysomething. They have 700 older 737s.
     
  11. StarShot macrumors 6502a

    StarShot

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    #12
    Southwest Airlines and American Airlines operate the same new Boeing 737involved in the fatal Lion Air crash in Indonesia. ... Southwest had 23 175-seat Max8s in its fleet of 742 aircraft as of Sept. 30, and has orders for more.Oct 29, 2018

    They've probably added a few since Sept 30th, but the Max makes up a very small part of their fleet.

    Come on people, get your facts right.
     
  12. baypharm macrumors 65816

    baypharm

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    #13
    Sorry. My bad.
     
  13. cube, Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019

    cube macrumors P6

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    #14
    Ethiopian Airlines grounded them too.

    Royal Air Maroc grounded the ones they have.

    Mongolia and Indonesia grounded theirs.

    Vietnam will not grant licenses (they don't have any yet).
     
  14. cube, Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019

    cube macrumors P6

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    #15
    Jet Airways is not operating any MAX.

    Comair grounded it.
     
  15. quagmire macrumors 603

    quagmire

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    #17
    IF this crash was caused by the MCAS as well, it's still a complicated matter than simply laying blame on the plane. As usual, crashes have multiple contributing factors though. Obviously we won't know them until the report comes out. Below is assuming this crash was caused by the MCAS.....

    • The primary cause if it was the MCAS was involved is still the plane giving a bad AoA data which caused an erroneous activation of the MCAS. From what I read of the system, it only requires one of the two AoA systems to say the plane is stalling. That to me is insane to think about. For Boeing not design MCAS activation requiring both in agreement is a massive oversight. What did they think of the chances of one malfunctioning were?
    • Would be curious if Ethiopian has implemented any training on the MCAS ever since Lion Air?
    • If there was an erroneous MCAS activation, the procedures to stop it is the same as runaway trim. Did they have enough altitude to recover? Did they perform the runaway trim procedure? Did they recognize what was going on?

    To address the whole FO only had 200 hour thing..... Step out of the America-centric view. Total hours doesn't always reflect pilot skill. The FO could have had 2000 hours in a Skyhawk, but only 200 hours in the 737. He would still be inexperienced in the 737( and the airline environment as a whole) despite the total hours. Some of the experience he learned while flying the Skyhawk sure can be transferred to the 737, but that's mostly decision making skills, etc. I know here in the US we now require pilots to get their ATP before becoming an FO at an 121 outfit as the result of the Colgan crash. And I love what it did for improving the QOL and pay at the regionals, but it was more of a knee jerk reaction from the public which Congress placated. The FO in that crash having a commercial pilot license had zero contribution to the crash( she had over 1500 hours anyway as well). The low pay, rest requirements, and the poor QOL the regional airlines offer had a more contributing factor towards the crash than her not having an ATP.
     
  16. TheAppleFairy macrumors 68020

    TheAppleFairy

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    #18
    Always horrible when something like this happens. Very tragic.

    I am flying next month and the first thing I did after seeing info about the crash is checked what aircraft they were using.

    Looks like I am on a 777 then an Airbus A330.
     
  17. cube macrumors P6

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    #19
    It would be very rare to replace a widebody with narrowbodies. Most of the time it is not possible.

    But one could be rerouted.
     
  18. TheAppleFairy macrumors 68020

    TheAppleFairy

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    #20
    Yeah I figured for the flight overseas it wouldn't be a 737, but once I got abroad it could have been a possibility. I'd like to hear more information about what's going on with those aircraft that's for sure.
     
  19. cube macrumors P6

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    #21
    I guess it is a very long trip if you're taking 777+A330. Or you meant A320?
     
  20. TheAppleFairy macrumors 68020

    TheAppleFairy

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    #22
    JFK to Beijing, then to Japan.
     
  21. cube, Mar 11, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019

    cube macrumors P6

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  22. baypharm macrumors 65816

    baypharm

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    #24
    Safe travels
     
  23. cube macrumors P6

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