iPad Pro Anyone know if mini-LED displays on new iPad Pros could lead to PWM-related headache issues?

[saintforlife]

I'm one of those people that is unfortunately affected by sensitivity to screen flicker that comes from PWM controlled LED screens. This means that I'm have been stuck using the iPhone XR and iPhone 11 as I can't use the LED powered X, 11 Pro or 12 as those phones give me a terrible headache when I use them.

I'm not sure how the soon to be launched mini-LED screens on the new iPads will be different from the LED screens on the new iPhones and am afraid if I'll be stuck using an older iPad model with LCD screen if it has the same screen flicker. Anyone here know how the brightness on the mini-LED screens are controlled and if they use the same PWM method as they do on the iPhone?

 

[AutomaticApple]

I'm one of those people that is unfortunately affected by sensitivity to screen flicker that comes from PWM controlled LED screens. This means that I'm have been stuck using the iPhone XR and iPhone 11 as I can't use the LED powered X, 11 Pro or 12 as those phones give me a terrible headache when I use them.

I'm not sure how the soon to be launched mini-LED screens on the new iPads will be different from the LED screens on the new iPhones and am afraid if I'll be stuck using an older iPad model with LCD screen if it has the same screen flicker. Anyone here know how the brightness on the mini-LED screens are controlled and if they use the same PWM method as they do on the iPhone?

No, mini-LED doesn't use PWM.

 

[chabig]

I'm one of those people that is unfortunately affected by sensitivity to screen flicker that comes from PWM controlled LED screens. This means that I'm have been stuck using the iPhone XR and iPhone 11 as I can't use the LED powered X, 11 Pro or 12 as those phones give me a terrible headache when I use them.

Not to minimize your problem, but you're confusing LED backlit LCD displays with OLED. iPhone X, 11, and 12 use OLED. The rumored iPad with mini-LED would use a traditional LCD display with LED backlighting, not OLED.

 

[saintforlife]

Cool! I knew I probably didn't fully understand the technical differences between OLED and mini-LED panels. Thank you for the response!

 

[rui no onna]

I just got my 2021 iPad Pro 12.9 and it does appear to be giving me a headache. 😭😭😭

Totally sucks since I’ve been really enjoying not having my tabs reload. Also watched like 2 minutes of Infinity War last night to test the display and that was gorgeous, too.

Luckily, the 2018 12.9 1TB LTE popped up on the refurb store. I just placed an order for that. If I keep getting headaches with the 2021, I’m gonna have to return it.

Refurbished 12.9 inch iPad Pro Wi Fi + Cellular 1TB Space Gray 3rd Generation - Apple

Apple Store Search Results

www.apple.com

 

[rui no onna]

From the image @Serban55 posted taken iPhonedo’s YouTube review, the 2021 iPad Pro does appear to have some flickering albeit at a much higher frequency compared to OLED iPhones.

 

[sguser]

I just got my 2021 iPad Pro 12.9 and it does appear to be giving me a headache. 😭😭😭

Totally sucks since I’ve been really enjoying not having my tabs reload. Also watched like 2 minutes of Infinity War last night to test the display and that was gorgeous, too.

Luckily, the 2018 12.9 1TB LTE popped up on the refurb store. I just placed an order for that. If I keep getting headaches with the 2021, I’m gonna have to return it.

Refurbished 12.9 inch iPad Pro Wi Fi + Cellular 1TB Space Gray 3rd Generation - Apple

Apple Store Search Results

www.apple.com

I couldn’t use iPhone X, i was getting dizzy in a matter of minutes. With iPhone 11 Pro and 12 Pro it wasn’t so bad, I owned both phones, no issues.

when I received my 12.9, during the first day, I felt uncomfortable looking at it. I felt an eye strain and a bit of dizziness. But today, I used it for a couple of hours without any issues. I guess my eyes needed some time to adapt to the screen.

 

[rui no onna]

I couldn’t use iPhone X, i was getting dizzy in a matter of minutes. With iPhone 11 Pro and 12 Pro it wasn’t so bad, I owned both phones, no issues.

when I received my 12.9, during the first day, I felt uncomfortable looking at it. I felt an eye strain and a bit of dizziness. But today, I used it for a couple of hours without any issues. I guess my eyes needed some time to adapt to the screen.

Yeah, I’m giving it until the return period but if that doesn’t pan out, it’s going back.

I’ve got an iPhone 12 mini and I’m pretty much just using it as 5G hotspot at the moment since I can’t use it for more than 30 minutes before getting a headache.

 

[Jetro]

They should go back to non-pwm controlled screens for everything. If the contrast ratio takes a hit so be it, it’s better to save peoples’ eyes than have a more beautiful looking screen. I sold my 11” pro 2020 model because of the headaches it caused me and iphone 12 does the same thing so I have to sell that and return to my trusty 7 plus. My eyes thank me. The nice thing also is there is no need to upgrade anyway because the old things I have still work great. Maybe I’ll try the air 4 though since it is non-pwm.

 

[Momof9]

Yeah, I’m giving it until the return period but if that doesn’t pan out, it’s going back.

I’ve got an iPhone 12 mini and I’m pretty much just using it as 5G hotspot at the moment since I can’t use it for more than 30 minutes before getting a headache.

I saw you mentioned something in another thread...
I do get migraines from flashing lights, strobes, fluorescent lights etc.
Currently I own 2018 12.9 & 11 iPad Pro - no issues. I also have iPhone 11 Pro Max- no issues.

I do have a new 12.9 coming at the end of the month. I will Keep an eye on this thread

 

[Momof9]

why is this not showing up in the main thread?

 

[TDDM]

I’ve been using the miniLED iPad since Fri, here are my impressions eye-strain wise:

TLDR: Better than OLED screens, but still gives me headaches.

-It doesn’t have that weird shimmery effect that Macs seem to have.
-I don’t really notice any difference between the brightness levels, the eye strain is the same.
-I did the slow-mo video method to test for flicker, it’s nowhere near as bad as OLED, but still present.
-My usual symptoms from flickering devices are pressure in the area above eyes, headache, gritty eyes, and general discomfort. From my usage, I seem to only have gritty eyes and slight pain above the eyes when using this iPad.

Bottom line: It’s a step up from OLED, but not perfect. I‘m extremely sensitive to flicker, (I can’t use any Apple device after 2017 without some level of strain, with the worst offenders being the OLED iPhones and recent Macs) so I’m not surprised that it’s not working well for me. That said, even if you have trouble with flicker, I’d still recommend trying the miniLED screen since they seem to have done something differently with the screen this time.

 

[mi7chy]

From the image @Serban55 posted taken iPhonedo’s YouTube review, the 2021 iPad Pro does appear to have some flickering albeit at a much higher frequency compared to OLED iPhones.

To properly test PWM it has to be done below 100% which is explained here.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Why-Pulse-Width-Modulation-PWM-is-such-a-headache.270240.0.html

 

[Momof9]

Since I pretty much use mine at 100% I should be fine?

 

[rui no onna]

Things have improved for me. Disabled ProMotion (had it disabled on my 2017 Pro as well) and that seems to help.

Looks like I may be able to keep mine which is great since I'm absolutely loving not having my Safari tabs reload.

 

[Momof9]

I realized my problem is, I need to replace my 11" and not my 12.9". I would love to have both, but will just get a new 11"

 

[jimmy_uk]

I’ve been using the miniLED iPad since Fri, here are my impressions eye-strain wise:

TLDR: Better than OLED screens, but still gives me headaches.

-It doesn’t have that weird shimmery effect that Macs seem to have.
-I don’t really notice any difference between the brightness levels, the eye strain is the same.
-I did the slow-mo video method to test for flicker, it’s nowhere near as bad as OLED, but still present.
-My usual symptoms from flickering devices are pressure in the area above eyes, headache, gritty eyes, and general discomfort. From my usage, I seem to only have gritty eyes and slight pain above the eyes when using this iPad.

Bottom line: It’s a step up from OLED, but not perfect. I‘m extremely sensitive to flicker, (I can’t use any Apple device after 2017 without some level of strain, with the worst offenders being the OLED iPhones and recent Macs) so I’m not surprised that it’s not working well for me. That said, even if you have trouble with flicker, I’d still recommend trying the miniLED screen since they seem to have done something differently with the screen this time.

ah, this is not a good read as I am currently talking myself into going for the 12.9" as I think I will use the iPad on the keyboard a lot. I cannot be doing with flickering screens damn it!

 

[TDDM]

ah, this is not a good read as I am currently talking myself into going for the 12.9" as I think I will use the iPad on the keyboard a lot. I cannot be doing with flickering screens damn it!

Are you able to use any of the previous iPad Pros/iPhone XR/11?

 

[jimmy_uk]

Are you able to use any of the previous iPad Pros/iPhone XR/11?

The iphone 11 did seem to effect me. Not like OLED (eye strain, headache), but it wasn't comfortable viewing. Like the screen was shimmery/too bright on the edge of my vision.

Last ipad I owned was the 2nd gen 12.9 which was fine. Was thinking of jumping back in but 11" maybe a safer bet. I've not spent long enough on the newer ipads to know if the screen is an issue. Maybe the M1 Air is an even safer choice?

 

[Jodiuh]

I’ve been using the miniLED iPad since Fri, here are my impressions eye-strain wise:

TLDR: Better than OLED screens, but still gives me headaches.

-It doesn’t have that weird shimmery effect that Macs seem to have.
-I don’t really notice any difference between the brightness levels, the eye strain is the same.
-I did the slow-mo video method to test for flicker, it’s nowhere near as bad as OLED, but still present.
-My usual symptoms from flickering devices are pressure in the area above eyes, headache, gritty eyes, and general discomfort. From my usage, I seem to only have gritty eyes and slight pain above the eyes when using this iPad.

Bottom line: It’s a step up from OLED, but not perfect. I‘m extremely sensitive to flicker, (I can’t use any Apple device after 2017 without some level of strain, with the worst offenders being the OLED iPhones and recent Macs) so I’m not surprised that it’s not working well for me. That said, even if you have trouble with flicker, I’d still recommend trying the miniLED screen since they seem to have done something differently with the screen this time.

Thank you! I deal with the same issue w/ regard to eye pressure, pain, then a headache. I can’t last more than a minute on the iphone 12’s, but I do have an 11 vanilla and have not had any issues. It does not use PWM at any brightness. FWIW, I do have the blue light filtering invisibleshield on both the iphone and an iPad Pro 12.9 from 2020…that screen’s PWM free above 15%. I do however only really use the ipad with light on, so it’s never below 15%.

Good luck!!!

I saw you mentioned something in another thread...
I do get migraines from flashing lights, strobes, fluorescent lights etc.
Currently I own 2018 12.9 & 11 iPad Pro - no issues. I also have iPhone 11 Pro Max- no issues.

I do have a new 12.9 coming at the end of the month. I will Keep an eye on this thread

AFAIK, the 11 pro max flickers at a low rate of 240ish…could be wrong tho.

If that’s not causing any issues, the 2021 mini-led’s probably not going to be a problem.

Also, look into Thera spec for a lens that can protect your eyes against fluorescents and the like. They offer custom lens to fit in your own frame. I’m using Oakley cross link fits as they wrap around quite a bit, but have a special nose piece that lessens fog to a high degree. I can easily work out with them.

Good luck bud!

Not to minimize your problem, but you're confusing LED backlit LCD displays with OLED. iPhone X, 11, and 12 use OLED. The rumored iPad with mini-LED would use a traditional LCD display with LED backlighting, not OLED.

iphone 11 does not use PWM.

 

[Jodiuh]

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[Jodiuh]

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[Momof9]

I am doing ok with the 2021 12.9. I have not use it a ton yet Its been a busy week

 

[Artsketch]

I bought a discounted 12.9" 2020 and sold my 2018. The 2020 caused immediately eye strain. Maybe related to it’s lower contrast ratio. I use them usually at 50% brightness. After 2 weeks I had to return the 2020 and bought the Mini LED 2021. No eye strain any more.

 

[Martius]

Interesting.

What about 11" 2021? Is it PWM free?

Trying to decide between Air 4 / 11" 2021