App Store Developers Debate Pricing and Marketing

[Xian Zhu Xuande]

When you develop for the iPhone, yes, you're under more pressure to deliver "value for the dollar". If you can't handle that? Good ... go away and shovel your more costly software at people using inferior phones, who are FORCED to pay more.

This is offset completely by the actual demand for iPhone apps. Far more iPhone users download apps than do RAZR users, and the RAZR users who download apps only download a fraction of what is offered on the iPhone. Would you rather sell an app 200 times for $5 or 59,000 for $1.99? And don't forget that you keep more of your sales value on the iPhone than you do on the other platforms (unless you're a heavy duty developer on a platform that has a large up-front payment).

 

[Xian Zhu Xuande]

The problem is partly apple's fault, because of how the store works. The ratings inveritably go down when users delete apps, and position is based solely on downloads. Finally, the new section is so messed up it's impossible to find new apps. If they fix that, the prices will go where they're supposed to be and we'll get better apps. The games that compare to psp and ds games so far are all $10 and under. That's not fair to the developers but it's what they have to do.
Nate

I have seen a downward trend in ratings as a result of the rate-as-you-delete feature, though for the most part those ratings aren't much lower than the actual ratings left for an app. It is a somewhat different playing field for free apps, but I don't buy an argument that this is a bad thing. The apps with low ratings are apps with real problems that are generally discussed at length in real feedback. There are many high quality free apps which has solid ratings despite the rate-as-you-delete feature.

And frankly, it is nice to see immediate feedback.

 

[kingtj]

Not fair to the developers, how?

The games "that compare to psp and ds games" are selling for under $10, and that's "unfair" how?

IMHO, if you want to run games like this on a PHONE, vs. an actual portable game system, you're already getting a sub-standard experience - because there's no true physical buttons to press to control the game. Yeah, they can do some creative things with the motion sensor ... but in the end, many games just won't translate that well to a touch-screen.

Plus, you have to consider that most iPhone users out there have battery life concerns. We need to be able to take and make our PHONE CALLS throughout the day. If I spend too much time playing battery-draining games on my phone, I compromise my talk time, so I tend to "game" a lot less on the iPhone.

I just don't think it's sensible to expect me to want to pay more than $10 for a game I'll only use casually at best, on a device that's not even specifically designed for the purpose of gaming. That's why they can't break through that "$10 price barrier" ... and it has nothing to do with Apple's store forcing it on developers.

tveric, it's not that developers aren't grateful. I'm grateful that I can write an iphone app and *instantly* have it available to the whole iphone community. That being said, apple owes the developers more as well. Apple needs the developers as much as the developers need apple. So they do have a right to complain, in the hopes that a better relationship comes about.
The problem is partly apple's fault, because of how the store works. The ratings inveritably go down when users delete apps, and position is based solely on downloads. Finally, the new section is so messed up it's impossible to find new apps. If they fix that, the prices will go where they're supposed to be and we'll get better apps. The games that compare to psp and ds games so far are all $10 and under. That's not fair to the developers but it's what they have to do.
Nate

 

[liptonlover]

I have seen a downward trend in ratings as a result of the rate-as-you-delete feature, though for the most part those ratings aren't much lower than the actual ratings left for an app. It is a somewhat different playing field for free apps, but I don't buy an argument that this is a bad thing. The apps with low ratings are apps with real problems that are generally discussed at length in real feedback. There are many high quality free apps which has solid ratings despite the rate-as-you-delete feature.

And frankly, it is nice to see immediate feedback.

Sorry I didn't mean to sound like I don't think it's a good thing. I just dont' think it's gone far enough. It should have all the options of a review, including a written one. Also, a bug report option because a lot of times that's what causes me to delete an app.
Also, I mentioned in another thread they could make this dialog come up at other times, like after you close the app for the first time. Then they could give you an option to save it for next time in case you aren't ready to decide. Or you could say you never want to see the review box again for said app.

The only bad thing about it I think is that it affects free apps more than paid apps. I bought quite a few apps that I didn't delete because I wanted them updated. I never gave them a rating. But free apps I delete and rate all the time.
Anyways, I shouldn't have even brought up the reviewing. I suppose that's not really part of the problem.

 

[liptonlover]

The games "that compare to psp and ds games" are selling for under $10, and that's "unfair" how?

IMHO, if you want to run games like this on a PHONE, vs. an actual portable game system, you're already getting a sub-standard experience - because there's no true physical buttons to press to control the game. Yeah, they can do some creative things with the motion sensor ... but in the end, many games just won't translate that well to a touch-screen.

Plus, you have to consider that most iPhone users out there have battery life concerns. We need to be able to take and make our PHONE CALLS throughout the day. If I spend too much time playing battery-draining games on my phone, I compromise my talk time, so I tend to "game" a lot less on the iPhone.

I just don't think it's sensible to expect me to want to pay more than $10 for a game I'll only use casually at best, on a device that's not even specifically designed for the purpose of gaming. That's why they can't break through that "$10 price barrier" ... and it has nothing to do with Apple's store forcing it on developers.

The iPhone isn't the one being advertised as a gaming platform. It's the touch. So forget about calling people being a problem for now. Sure the battery isn't nearly as good as the DS or PSP, but it's still decent. It's certainly useable.

Some games won't work, but most will. I've only had interface/control problems with a few apps that just didn't do it right.

I'll use brother in arms as an example. It's what, $30 on the DS? I could get it for $10. I haven't bought it so I can't say from personal experience that it's on par, but the reviews say it is. No one complains about the battery life cutting short their enjoyment of the game, nor do they say that the controls were horrible and unuseable. The game is exactly the same, on a different device. I see no reason why it should be $10.

 

[michaellinehan]

Multiplying drivel

"One man's trash is another man's treasure."
and
"I don't see a problem. The 99 cent apps are fine."

Not when you get twenty-five slightly different iterations of the same idea. Multiply that and we have an app store with a far too large percentage of "me too" drivel. Apple, if you're there, puh-lease put some kind of brake on how many times the same thing can be repeated.

 

[Bevz]

Price Point breakdown on the app store...

What about creating a new price point breakdown of apps on the app store? So as well as listing all games by date or top paid, top free, what if you could also see a breakdown by FREE, $0.99, $1.99, $2.99 etc... That way the 4.99 apps will not be drowned out by the $0.99 apps, and human nature being human nature people will naturally begin checking out the higher price point lists thinking they are getting a better quality app; although it may encourage a culture of "i'll up it's price point to increase perceived quality" amongst some developers, i think it will genuinely help developers who are for e.g. programming quality 4.99+ apps but who are dropping off lists quickly before they get a foothold in the market because of all the 0.99 apps flooding the store.... I have nothing against 0.99 apps it's just they are aimed at a different consumer than an app for 4.99 or even 49.99!

High street shops essentially already do this, yes, you'll have a cheap whiskey next to an expensive one, but they're side by side; you can compare and make your choice; but the app store doesn't give you such a luxury as a consumer, all apps are essentially treated as "equal" no matter what the price point and all shoved on the same "shelf"....

Just my thoughts....

 

[ratz]

Bull

I know that I for one will pay more for a app that is worth it. If a developer develops an app that is useful and well developed I have no problem paying what it's worth.

I think if you develop an app where there's a need or one that is useful enough to charge a higher price word will get out and it will sell.

 

[tveric]

That being said, apple owes the developers more as well. Apple needs the developers as much as the developers need apple.

Well, you're free to hold that opinion, but I would argue that the advantage in this relationship is certainly Apple's. Your point hinges on the argument that the "developers" are a single entity, as much as Apple is, and if that were true, you'd be correct. Of course, we know they're not a single entity, and unless they form some sort of wacky App Store Developers' Union (not remotely likely), Apple will continue to not need each single developer as an individual or even small software company, because there's literally hundreds of them around, and all of them want to make money.

I'll repeat this again: it's as pure a form of capitalism as you're currently going to see in software development. People vote with their dollars. If your App is worth the price you set, you'll make money. If not, you have three choices: a) charge less b) write a better app c) stop writing Apps.

It seems the guy who wrote the original article doesn't want to do any of those things, which is understandable, to a point. Unfortunately for him, those are the de facto rules of making a profit on the App Store.

The games that compare to psp and ds games so far are all $10 and under. That's not fair to the developers but it's what they have to do.

I'm not sure there's any iPhone games that compare to the best games on the PSP or DS; if you know of any I'd love to try them out and even buy them after I read a few reviews. But consider this: the people creating the games for the PSP and DS don't enjoy the freedom that you get writing for the iPhone, while a crappy game that costs $40 for the PSP or DS won't sell either, at least not much.

No one is holding a gun to a developer's head to make them write iPhone apps. Think you can make more writing for another platform, or working for some giant company like EA? Then you should go do that. Fair has nothing to do with it. It's just survival of the fittest.

 

[iphonedevguy]

better funding model for apps

Come on, $1 for an app is really uninspiring. An app should be priced around $5 for some utility and around $10 for more usefulness. May be Apple should enforce price slabs - free, $2, $5, $10 etc. Then this revenue-by-volume experimentists would go and only serious app devs would stay. We should follow Apple's strategy : Enhance the app, keep the price same! Other than that, marketing is going to be crucial as app-mountain is rising. And we need a more frugal VC or angel funding model.

 

[whitehexagon]

Assume every App will be Free or .99, then develop & market accordingly, ie go for volume. With this level of developer interest, and such easy entry into the market, sooner or later someone going to undercut you anyway.

At which point we'll probably see the ugly head of software patents appearing. That's the thing that worries me as a developer. Why to spend 6 months on a quality App, when either Apple can reject it because it competes with something they had in mind, or someone else has got to the market first and the sues you for copying.

 

[liptonlover]

Well, you're free to hold that opinion, but I would argue that the advantage in this relationship is certainly Apple's. Your point hinges on the argument that the "developers" are a single entity, as much as Apple is, and if that were true, you'd be correct. Of course, we know they're not a single entity, and unless they form some sort of wacky App Store Developers' Union (not remotely likely), Apple will continue to not need each single developer as an individual or even small software company, because there's literally hundreds of them around, and all of them want to make money.

I'll repeat this again: it's as pure a form of capitalism as you're currently going to see in software development. People vote with their dollars. If your App is worth the price you set, you'll make money. If not, you have three choices: a) charge less b) write a better app c) stop writing Apps.

It seems the guy who wrote the original article doesn't want to do any of those things, which is understandable, to a point. Unfortunately for him, those are the de facto rules of making a profit on the App Store.



I'm not sure there's any iPhone games that compare to the best games on the PSP or DS; if you know of any I'd love to try them out and even buy them after I read a few reviews. But consider this: the people creating the games for the PSP and DS don't enjoy the freedom that you get writing for the iPhone, while a crappy game that costs $40 for the PSP or DS won't sell either, at least not much.

No one is holding a gun to a developer's head to make them write iPhone apps. Think you can make more writing for another platform, or working for some giant company like EA? Then you should go do that. Fair has nothing to do with it. It's just survival of the fittest.

The advantage is obviously apple's, but they should still show more love to the developers. If they're going to run the only app store available for unjailbroken iphones, they should make it the best one possible. It's beneficial to them, to, as they'll get less bad press about it (not that there's too much of that) and everyone will be happier. If fixing the app store involves giving developers more money, the bigger names may get in on the iphone, or those already there may put more on.

I almost agree. Exposure and press has a LOT to do with how well you do. If you have one star ratings from a thousand people out of a thousand and one, your sales will slow dramatically. If you have a 5 star rating in the said scenario, you'll sell like hotcakes, even if you're overpriced.

I just said, brothers in arms is identical on the iphone and ds, except of course for different controls. And the fact that the iphone version is $20 less. Not sure you're going with the freedom point...

The obvious problem with that is the psp and ds don't have open stores like the iphone. You'd have to get with one of the companies. And the reason for not doing that from my point of view at least, is actually freedom. I want to create what I want, without deadlines or forced parameters or anything.