Apple Abandons Car Plans 'For Now,' Sets Late 2017 Deadline to Decide Fate of Self-Driving System

[9081094]

Maybe they're finally realizing that people don't want a self-driving car. That's not something that's feasible for the near future. And to be honest, driving is fun. As much as I like technology, I'm very against self-driving cars.

Maybe Apple came to the conclusion that it's very hard for them to compete with phones and computers. They acknowledged that their hard- and software offerings are stale on innovations.

As far as cars go, I don't think they will ever be able to build better cars than German or Japanese manufacturers. Also google is very close working with them on the software front. If CarPlay and Siri, maps are signs of Apple's car future I'm very reluctant to ever use it. It is going to be a hell of a ride

 

[Dmunjal]

Tim Crook

1. can't deliver Macs desktops and laptops with latest tech and competitive price
2. can't deliver an iPhone/iPad without bumps, long battery and with wireless charging
3. can't deliver a cable tv service
4. can't deliver a netflix service

and do you think he will be able to deliver an electric car ?

mercedes, tesla, ford, volkswagen, audi and every other car company will kill Timmy

he is incompetent and greedy, he will bring Apple to bankruptcy or sell it to google or Facebook

he only thinks about money and squeezing the last dollar from his customers

This is the difference a CEO makes and why a good one is worth all the millions that they make. There are plenty of smart people at Apple but they need the guidance and leadership to make the right decisions and greenlight the winning projects and kill the ones that are wasting time and money. Tim Cook as NO idea how to do this unless he thinks it can help the bottom line.

 

[Bacillus]

As I've stated many times, the car project was a convenient fairy tale, a way for Cook to shore up the share price while he (and others) wait for their compensation packages to pay off. Cook, Ive, and Cue will likely be gone by the end of next year.

Chicken and egg problem: it would probably require a very advanced self-steering car, of the more stubborn kind, to get Cook&Co moved to another place...

 

[9081094]

I think they abandoned Mac plans too.

I had the impression they did that already a few years ago. They upped the prices because they're antique now

 

[mi7chy]

Too bad. I was hoping to get an Apple Car Edition with ceramic finish.

Jet black version for me but I'd have to avoid buffing it as it'll leave micro scratches so rinse only.

 

[VMMan]

How can the board not see that history is repeating itself and that Tim Cook is another John Sculley??

 

[ArtOfWarfare]

When I checked a couple of years ago, there was at the time only enough raw materials to build batteries for 10 to 12 years at the then current rate of usage. Without a technology breakthrough, EV's are dead in the water for mainstream use.

Which raw material are we going to run out of? Lithium? It's naturally occurring worldwide. You can get it from seawater.

 

[amegicfox]

Every day at work I use a desktop computer. I love it. It has a BIG screen and it is powerful. A beauty to use.

At home I also work on a desktop computer and again It has a beautiful BIG screen and it is fast.

I also use a laptop when on the couch.

I use the iPad when in the bathroom.

Tim Crook do not try to force the iPad use on me.

 

[jlc1978]

The problem is that that they don't have the battery capacity to build more than 30K next year. Tesla is already selling 80K in a year.

Huh? Tesla sold 50 K cars in 2015, per IBT, and are not on track to sell and deliver 80K in 2016. There total sales are around 125K since 2008. If GM wanted to they cold find a way to build more EVs, my guess is that the don't see a market , yet.

 

[ActionableMango]

I'd still like to know how many people really want a self driving car.

Maybe they're finally realizing that people don't want a self-driving car. That's not something that's feasible for the near future. And to be honest, driving is fun. As much as I like technology, I'm very against self-driving cars.

I enjoy driving too. So much so that I'm one of those people who will take a short trip just for the purpose of going for a drive, with no destination other than coming back home.

However, it's a bit selfish to be against self-driving cars. Self-driving cars would enable mobility and expand the world for all those who are incapable of driving due to handicap, age, or other impairment. I'm particularly sensitive to this because as my parents age, I see them having to make compromises like not driving at night because they cannot see as well. I suspect that it won't be long before my mom cannot pass the vision test and won't be able to renew her license. Her world will become very small at that point.

There is also anyone who:

• Cannot pass the driver's test
• Wants a taxi without the driver ripping him off
• Drank more than they planned and doesn't want to drive home drunk
• Had a long day of skiing, hiking, etc and doesn't want to doze off
• Had to go to the hospital for any number of standard procedures--for example you're not allowed to drive home after something as simple as a colonoscopy

One last thing. Even among people who can drive and aren't impaired, there are a ton of people who don't seem to want to drive whether they know it or not. I walk to work occasionally, and one day I noticed that a LOT of people drive while using their phones. So I decided to take count. I'd say it was about 1 out of 10 people while driving, and 1 out of 2 while stopped at a light.

The worst I saw was someone repeatedly looking up at the window and down at the phone while performing a left turn across two lanes of oncoming traffic. Clearly there are a lot of people who just want to get somewhere but don't want to drive. They would prefer to read, message, watch TV, lookup store hours, or whatever.

 

[Dmunjal]

Huh? Tesla sold 50 K cars in 2015, per IBT, and are not on track to sell and deliver 80K in 2016. There total sales are around 125K since 2008. If GM wanted to they cold find a way to build more EVs, my guess is that the don't see a market , yet.

Tesla has committed to 80K this year:

http://www.latimes.com/business/aut...y-production-3q-musk-20161002-snap-story.html

"For the second half of the year, Tesla said, it expects to deliver 50,000 cars. That would bring the year’s total to 79,212."

There's a reason that Tesla is building a gigafactory that's will produce more batteries than the world does today combined. Tesla received almost 400K orders for the Model 3 and GM is trying to produce up to 50K Bolts. Where will GM get the capacity for more when their battery vendors haven't built up the capacity yet?

 

[SteveW928]

I agree with Gruber (and Marco Arment):

http://daringfireball.net/linked/2016/10/17/bloomberg-apple-car

Except that how do we know anymore what Apple would do. The 'new' Apple isn't the same as the 'old' Apple, so I don't think that applies. There is no un-Apple anymore.

We could also save lives by enforcing traffic laws, and forcing people to actually LEARN HOW TO DRIVE, rather than handing out drivers licenses as Cracker Jack prizes? Require advanced driving schools that actually cover real world driving situations? Require driving instruction that actually teaches drivers how to survive dangerous situations, and how to avoid many of them in the first place?
...
Too many stupid people, and not enough saber tooth tigers to EAT them all, and we're going to let even more stupid and lazy people be even more stupid and lazy. Brilliant!

No doubt! The standards for driving are so insanely low, it's a testament to to what the automobile industry has been able to do in terms of safety that there aren't 10x more deaths.

But, these are the ways of 'progress' so you'll have to try and stay out of the way. When I first saw the movie Idiocracy, I thought it was prophetic, but over-the-top. Now, I'm guessing we'll surpass it in the next decade or so.

You, as a human, didn't recognize symptoms that your brakes were failing. The self driving car, on the other hand, knows exactly how much the car should be slowing down. If it's not slowing down by the right amount, the car needs to be serviced.

Also... I've never been in this situation before so just asking... shouldn't your E-brake/parking brake still work?

No, the AI-car, as a computer, doesn't recognize *ANYTHING* unless the engineer implemented the right sensor, AND the programmer wrote the proper routine (and the correct action to take for the situation... which might be more complex than they envisioned).

And, what good would it do if the car 'knew' it needed to be serviced after you're sitting at the bottom of the Pacific? Do these things even have e-brakes?

I understood in the EU a law is under way that would only allow electrical cars to be released from 2030 onwards

Well, a bunch of idiots can pass about any law they like. That doesn't mean it will actually work or won't have significant negative implications.

Since you're driving someplace where you have to decide between hitting a pedestrian and hitting a wall. Neither of these obstacles exist on roads where the speed limit is over 35 MPH. If both of these obstacles are present, you're in an alleyway and the speed limit is probably lower than 20 MPH.

Where the heck do you drive? No pedestrians, other obstacles, or surprises when going over 20mph? Sounds like a fenced test-track.

 

[OllyW]

I understood in the EU a law is under way that would only allow electrical cars to be released from 2030 onwards

You've got that totally wrong. The Germans are pushing the EU to get electric cars to replace cars with combustion engines by 2030.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...combustion-diesel-vehicles-2030-a7354281.html

 

[canadianreader]

Except when they aren't:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cars/tesla-reliability-doesnt-match-its-high-performance/

I hope Tesla succeeds but I am not blind to the issues they face.

I read the article thanks
I hope they and others players will improve electric vehicles and driver safety.

 

[pat500000]

And the TV sector doesn't? We have so many companies jumping on the streaming bandwagon, the market is crowded, and Apple's missteps have hurt them in this endeavor

Kind of reminds me of this particular children story: "little train that could," but couldn't due to hear failure and asthma.

 

[SteveW928]

I enjoy driving too. So much so that I'm one of those people who will take a short trip just for the purpose of going for a drive, with no destination other than coming back home.

Me too, I love driving.

However, it's a bit selfish to be against self-driving cars. Self-driving cars would enable mobility and expand the world for all those who are incapable of driving...

I'm not against them because I love driving, or because I'm selfish... I'm against them... because they WON'T WORK. For AI cars to truly work would require all cars to communicate and be automated, as well as a major re-design of our transportation infrastructure. Without that, they are insanely dangerous.

One last thing. Even among people who can drive and aren't impaired, there are a ton of people who don't seem to want to drive whether they know it or not.

Agreed, and that's dangerous too. But, the solution is to GET THESE PEOPLE OFF THE ROADS! The penalties for impaired driving (due to alcohol or texting, etc.) should be pretty severe. If enough people lose their driving PRIVILEGES, new and better (more affordable) taxi and public transit will need to be established.

That's the solution, not some sci-fi dream (based on false presuppositions).

 

[amegicfox]

Others have superior technical background and experience. You can't necessarily throw money at a problem and expect success.

Other companies have CEOs who work in an office all day and night and are obsessed about delivering the best product on the market. Tim is obsessed about his image, traveling and taking pictures with politicians and taking sides on social causes. Sadly.

 

[Bacillus]

Timmy is always traveling taking selfies and making millions after millions. He is laughing his way to bank and on his way to be a billionaire when Apple still sell overpriced and outdated products.

He has been spending Apple billions in R&D like a drunken sailor and we still have macs that are 4 years old.

What are thousands and thousands of engineers at Apple doing every day ?

the iPhone still costs over a thousand dollars and doesn't have wireless charging

Apple is mess. Please someone fire Timmy the crook and the entire board

Ah, I heard that the iPhone lead designer is making cardboxes these days...

 

[amegicfox]

Apple focus is on iPhones, iPhone accessories and related services then from time to time iPads that's it.

a phone that cost over a $1000 without wireless charging and with a battery that lasts less then a day ?

Tim and Ive innovation is: new iPhone colors

 

[apolloa]

I understood in the EU a law is under way that would only allow electrical cars to be released from 2030 onwards

Nope, you can buy a Tesla here if you want and they want to heavily push electric vehicles. Perhaps you meant to say 'autonomous'?

Apparently they are going to make autonomous vehicles have to pass a driving test!?!?!?!?!?!?!? So prove the software and sensors work?

 

[Dmunjal]

a phone that cost over a $1000 without wireless charging and with a battery that lasts less then a day ?

Tim and Ive innovation is: new iPhone colors

This is what happens when you pay more attention to Wall Street than to your customers.

 

[shaunp]

Purchased a used XPS 13 (the new ones maxed out) on craigslist for a crazy steal price for my brother back home in Michigan. Played with it for a day or two before shipping it out and was amazingly impressed. If I need a new laptop any time soon I would strongly consider the Macbook vs XPS 13. The touch screen was awesome and worked really well. Only thing not the greatest was the trackpad.

Agreed the trackpad isn't as nice as an Apple trackpad. However I got a 15" refurb, added a second SSD (512GB Samsung PCi-e) and 32GB RAM and the whole lot was just over £1500 - that's for a quad core i7, dedicated GPU, 4K touch screen (and the touch is useful when showing things to colleagues), 32GB RAM and 1.5TB SSD. It's also lighter than my previous rMBP. I intended it to be a stop-gap until the new rMBP came out, but instead I'm keeping it. Ditched my nMP and got a custom build Broadwell E PC. Apart from iPads and iPhones there soon won't be any Apple kit left in our house. When I need a new phone I won't be looking at Apple.

 

[dan110]

Agreed the trackpad isn't as nice as an Apple trackpad. However I got a 15" refurb, added a second SSD (512GB Samsung PCi-e) and 32GB RAM and the whole lot was just over £1500 - that's for a quad core i7, dedicated GPU, 4K touch screen (and the touch is useful when showing things to colleagues), 32GB RAM and 1.5TB SSD. It's also lighter than my previous rMBP. I intended it to be a stop-gap until the new rMBP came out, but instead I'm keeping it. Ditched my nMP and got a custom build Broadwell E PC. Apart from iPads and iPhones there soon won't be any Apple kit left in our house. When I need a new phone I won't be looking at Apple.

This reminds of a conversation I had back in the late spring of 1995 right before Microsoft released Windows 95.

 

[Exhale]

Also... I've never been in this situation before so just asking... shouldn't your E-brake/parking brake still work?

Parking brakes aren't stellar for the job - but even so, combine it with a good degree of engine breaking and you can still bleed off significant speed.

Not as much as the proper brakes - thats what they're designed for - but few drivers know how to engine brake, and its not easy to engine brake optimally. Even more so in an emergency situation - where human drivers would generally take at least a second before realising the proper brakes aren't working. For many drivers, i'd put the reaction time at 2-3 seconds.

Automatic systems would far exceed any human driver at quickly recognising the failure, and are far better at engine braking simply because they can shift faster than any human can - and know when it should do so.

 

[840quadra]

It must be a personal rant since it can't be called a practical criticism. I've never been interested in a GM product myself until today. Today, I put down a deposit on a Chevy Bolt, and I did that because they and not Tesla or any of those "non-disaster" companies was first to the mark with a 200+ mile EV for under $40k, and by all accounts GM made a good job of it. One of the reasons they were first to mark was their history of building EVs.

Congratulations, it is a great car that is (Finally) going into production.

GM had every chance to be a world leader in EV, however their ties to oil companies, their interest groups, the sweet taste of high profitability of selling low tech Trucks at high prices, put the brakes on many projects. They are only now releasing more EV / hybrids because It is a "thing" now, and they can price accordingly.

My criticism comes from my personal like of their products, and with knowing some of the people involved with the Volt / Bolt project. The Bolt is nearly a decade later than it could have been, always having been put on the far back burner as compared to trucks and sports cars. GM (of those days) didn't see the value in pushing the technology forward. Thankfully, someone like Testla came along and pushed the issue, causing GMs leadership to finally take a look at the projects they had simmering on the back burners, in their corner kitchen.