Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple Advertising Snafu in Australia and New Zealand Leads to Confusion Over Possible Price Increases
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Back in the PowerPC days the conversations regarding Apple vs PC had a lot to do with computing power based on what the needs of the owners. Mac hardware was perfect for image editing and other intensive applications. There was no right choice for hardware since the Mac and PC had different designs based on different intentions. Now that Apple has moved to Intel, the argument is more difficult since the hardware parts are virtually identical. Being a Mac owner feels great once a new product is released and it is "leading edge", but quickly loses its appeal after some time on the market. Honestly, who would be proud to purchase a $3300+ 15inch MBP that is only D2C, no bluray, with crappy resolution while the PC hardware can be arguably be better at a lower price point? The difference is the OS, but the superiority of OSX versus Win7 no longer justifies the price increase.
And the entry price is lower. So? It might not be the same specced, but it is lower.
People look at it and go - Right! It's lower. You forget that not everyone is geeky enough to care. Those who need it will say 'Hmm, lets get that one, it seems to have 2 graphics cards... That seems to be... Better!?'
You have to realize that there's a world outside where geeks live in.
In Business, Economics, Psychology, Media... There is something known as 'The Decoy Effect'.
Basically, it means that they offer 3 models (generally)
1) Basic Model, stripped down model with barely anything
2) High end Model, with a little bit of extra features not worth much
3) Middle Model, with most of the High End Model's features, and all of the Basic Models.
The mind will gear towards the Middle Model, and they feel they get the best deal (though it's actually the worse one, whilst the High End Model is the actual best value). This leads to profit maximization for the company, and a feeling of satisfaction for the user.
It's all business, and the normal user won't know that they stripped off a GPU. And honestly, they don't care enough. I'm sorry - but that's the truth. All that matters is, the entry price is lower. Many wants to use Macs, not for their specs, but for OSX. Lower Spec, but lower entry price still means more people!
What you describe is "the entry price.. has dropped". Specs has nothing to do with them being able to accurately say that the entry price has dropped. If they sold a cardboard cutout for $5, the entry price has still dropped. All that needs to happen for them to be able to say that the entry price drops is that the entry price drops. If you draw your own assessment of the value for money and the manner it was accomplished, that's your business. For other people it's not the big huge deal you think it is. A hard drive spins a little slower, a perfectly fine graphics card replaces another perfectly fine graphics card. The entry price still dropped, and a lot of people don't give a crap if an entry level machine was made more economical by using more economical parts. Don't apply your own priorities to everyone else. And don't pretend like it's some massive conspiracy/scandal/consumer affairs alert.
You must also get very stunned every single time you buy McDonalds that the burgers don't look like the photos.
How about premium hardware for the premium price they charge? Apple has put themselves in this situation by wanting to stay in the premium, high price market. If they want to sell old hardware then lower the prices.
Macs are good values when they are updated. A year (sometimes sooner/longer) later they turn into horrible values because their price has stayed the same with the same hardware while Apples competitors have either lowered the price and/or increased the hardware for the same price. Even the average person wants the most for their dollar and doesn't feel like getting shafted.
It seems unlikely that significant updates to the Macbook Air/Pro And Mac Pro will be released before the iPad launch. Such an update would clash with the launch of the iPad. Hexacore Mac Pros and Core i5/i7 Macbook Pro would have to compete for attention over all the hype of the iPad. I think that they may wait until after the initial launch of the iPad. Maybe mid April.
So, buy a PC or don't. You make a cost/benefit analysis of the choices, make your decision and then just freaking stick to it. You make the same sorts of evaluations every day when you're given hundreds of little choices. You choose one breakfast cereal over another, you choose one thong over another based on what's most important to you. So, you have a choice. PC: superior hardware (supposedly), Mac: superior OS. What is most important to you. Take your pick, then stop crying about it, because it's ultimately pointless and you have free will.
And I have still not heard anything about why you "need" such things as Blu-Ray - what it is that the current absence prevents you from doing, other than watching movies (hello, buy an actual BR player). You want it, but why? Just to keep up with the PC-Joneses? And if you "need" it, you will have either already bought another product that fulfils the requirement, or you will be lying catatonic on the ground, drool dribbling out the corner of your mouth and a wet puddle under you from not being able to make it through without it.
Agree with you as I mentioned that earlier, as Apple cannot significantly drop prices to their MacBooks and be in line with SONY VAIO laptops that have a significant edge over current MacBooks. It will snowball their iPad marketing and sales. I dare Apple drop prices for MacBooks as per SONYs superior offering.
I have an extensive collection of blue rays i like to watch on the go. I also have a g4 notebook. I do not want to drag along an external drive just to watch my movies on the go. I also do not want to settle on a PC when macs could easily have blu ray players. If the rest of the competition has it and your not offering it and there clearly is a demand for it then your doing something wrong.
The basic frustration i have with apple is that i love the OS. I prefer it over windows. But I hate feeling junkloved over prices and specs. Yes apple does things differently, but this is not always a good thing. The worst part is that they are very popular now, its a very in thing to have(a mac), and as long as people buy their products they wont even think about lowering prices on old tech or changing a thing. I could easily see them not going i7 or i5 in their notebook line until june or something. Didnt they post a record profits gain recently?
If the competition has something you don't, but:
1) you are generally increasing your market share faster than the competition.
2) your profits are well ahead of market averages.
3) you own the highly highly profitable "over $1000" market segment.
4) you just toasted the competition in the latest Consumer Reports rankings.
Then I'd argue you are doing very little wrong.
Apple may not be meeting your particular needs, admittedly. But I wouldn't call that "...doing something wrong." I would just call it not meeting your needs.
I don't think that anyone can make any sort of assumption about anything from this "leak".
It appears that the whole thing was bungled. Even as a rumor, it's completely useless, other than to draw pageviews.
It appears that the whole thing was bungled. Even as a rumor, it's completely useless, other than to draw pageviews.
So, basically to summarize: you were given a choice. With all the information available to you and coupled with free will, you made a fully informed choice, and now you're going to pretend that you're being hard done by (based on not being able to watch high-def Couples Retreat on your lo-def display at 30,000 feet) when you're not, all because Teh Evil Apple won't meet your singular demands and thus are the bully on the block, ruining your day and hoarding all the money, not handing some of it around simply because they claim to be a "business". Which you chose. Out of everything else. Willingly and fully informed. With no guns or other weapons aimed at you.
Or the needs of many others.
How long can Apple sell the same crap before the fanboys finally give in and say, "Yes Apple is really lagging behind and it's pathetic and unacceptable, asinine prices aside"?
Doesn't it strike you as a little pathetic that the current high end MBP nearly matches that of the CTO MBP from October 2008?
I bought my 2.8 CTO MBP in November 2008, and it's still sitting up top in the prominent position a year and a half later, just one place down in the lineup from the CTO spec it was at a year and a half ago.
After a year and a half, I wouldn't expect to STILL be able to buy my model (for a laughable $3k still...) and if I could, it surely should be the bottom model about to get its ass kicked out the door.
That said, I'm sure glad I bought the 2.8 CTO back then and got the most for my money and have enjoyed it for 1.5 years now--as my first Mac I certainly would've never had the foresight to realize it would still be sitting on the shelf (again in the high end slot no less) 1.5 years later.
You can bet when I pick up a second MBP here it will be a new Arrandale because we know now that it will still be on the shelf in two years with Apple's lame ass and almost laughable nine month update cycle as a technology company where new tech is out every three months.
All of the above aside, when was the last time Apple upped the resolution on 15" models? I know it's been years, but when did it go 1440x900 and what was it increased from? I'd love 1680x1050.
Correct.
The needs and desires of a specific individual are irrelevant to Apple Inc. (unless your name is Steven P. Jobs). It's about the entire marketplace and how you address it.
Apple chooses to focus its efforts on certain segments (the ones typically with the highest margins) and ignore others. Apple dominates the premium computer category (over $1000), but doesn't compete in the netbook market.
If you look at Apple's stock performance over the past five years, it is clear that they are indeed doing very little wrong. They aren't perfect, but they are doing a better job than the rest of the industry at maintaining profitability, especially in a down economy.
Competition in the electronics industry is vicious and apple has no magic bean that makes them invincible. On top today can turn to on the bottom tomorrow if you don't continue to compete as apple themselves have experienced. The pro line (ESPECIALLY the laptops) needs to be updated very soon to be at all reasonable at its current price point. I don't know what the problem is exactly, but I expect it has more to do with intel's asshat decision regarding GPU's.
At this point Apple needs to put out an update soon, and probably more than a simple refresh. They still have the best built laptop in the industry in my view, but HP and Sony are serious about catching up. I don't quite understand what's taking so long, but if they start to make a habit of keeping old tech in on $2000+ units their market position WILL erode.
That's exactly what I keep saying on these forums, Apple has been so slow to update the innards of their computers lately, I thought one of the main reasons they went Intel was to get on a more frequent update schedule, but no, they're making mountains of cash quarterly so why the rush. We are not going to see refreshes across the line until that giant iPod touch comes out. It's all about the casual market, God forbid they put distracting Mac updates lest little Joe buy a Macbook instead of an iPad.
I really dont care if they are more expensive, just update your freaking MBP line so I can buy my first apple laptop.
I have the 15inch with that crappy resolution. I cannot take it anymore. 1440x900 is just pathetic. It is barely above the resolution my wife's $500 netbook came with. And I am fortunate my wife encourages me to get new toys when I want them
Higher resolution isn't everything. Until OS X finds a way to scale up menus, preference panes, and fonts, then higher resolution is problematic.
It's great for editing big photos and having more screen real estate but it's terrible for reading and web surfing.
Zooming in on web pages can look ugly. I use Readability, a web browser bookmarklet for very small text but that eliminates 95% of the web design.
Close - SNAFU is an acronym from Vietnam, and stands for "Situation Normal, All F***ed Up."
edit - damn, someone beat me to it!
Let's all just hope Apple doesn't jack up their prices even HIGHER.
I'm in the same boat. This sucks, I'd be more than willing to (over)pay 2500-2700 USD for a new MBP because the rumored updates would fit my standards so well,but I'm so close to just giving in and getting something else. Come on Apple, I need a laptop for school, not an iPad...
October 2005 (1280x854 to 1440x960). It dropped slightly to 1440x900 with the MacBook Pro I think. The resolution bump before then was on April 2002 (1152x768 to 1280x854).
I'm fine with 1-2 more resolution bumps. After then the text gets a bit too small for me.
Want some cheese with that? If you people are so frustrated with Apple, go buy a PC. I know full well the tech inside most Apple computers isn't the newest or fastest. But I'm paying for seamless integration and excellent support. If you don't care or want any of that build/buy a PC.
Finally someone who see's it my way! I really think Steve Jobs & Co believes the future of computing is the 9inch ipod touch.
Commoditization
I just went and looked through all of Sony's line, seeing as I haven't done it in a year or two.
While you are correct Sony has a few newer models in their line up, the pricing is nothing to write home about, in fact the most directly comparable to the MBP's are actually more expensive, and the most directly comparable to the MB is only ~10% less?
The macbooks are a fine price, with fine hardware for their overall value proposition. They simply don't meet your expectations, but they do for the majority out there.
I think people around here are forgetting that computers are becoming (expensive) commodities. The majority of people, even people using computers every day to make their livings, do not care if it has the newest XYZ part. They want a working computer with decent battery life (if a portable) that looks good in their home or on there personage. It is becoming, for the majority of people out there, a question not unlike that of purchasing a stand mixer or dishwasher. Do they care about the decision? Absolutely! However 99% of buyers are not going to be pouring over the dishwasher spec sheet to see if it has a new turboboostin42 washer pump and powerX2-i5250 washing heads.
They want to know that it will work, do so reliably, and look good doing it.
This is why Apple has literally poured money into there chassis design. The more rugged (within reason) they can make there machines, the better overall the brand becomes. It is also why they don't make cheap machines, it gives them the headroom to make decisions regarding reliability and usability without having to worry about if they can afford it in XYZ model.
It's only once you understand that the enthusiast market is a statistically small, and shrinking, market and that Apple understands the growing commoditization of the market will you understand their, admittedly intelligent, approach to PC products.
I'll be the first to say I wish Apple made some more niche products for us in the "small percentile", however I also realize that Apple has found they work most efficient when they have a small to do list and a small product line.
So far their bet on the commoditization of PC hardware is turning out to be correct, and while I may not always have every bell and whistle, I have had a stable platform for years now, one which allows me to be profitable in my business endeavours.
Karl P
I just went and looked through all of Sony's line, seeing as I haven't done it in a year or two.
While you are correct Sony has a few newer models in their line up, the pricing is nothing to write home about, in fact the most directly comparable to the MBP's are actually more expensive, and the most directly comparable to the MB is only ~10% less?
The macbooks are a fine price, with fine hardware for their overall value proposition. They simply don't meet your expectations, but they do for the majority out there.
I think people around here are forgetting that computers are becoming (expensive) commodities. The majority of people, even people using computers every day to make their livings, do not care if it has the newest XYZ part. They want a working computer with decent battery life (if a portable) that looks good in their home or on there personage. It is becoming, for the majority of people out there, a question not unlike that of purchasing a stand mixer or dishwasher. Do they care about the decision? Absolutely! However 99% of buyers are not going to be pouring over the dishwasher spec sheet to see if it has a new turboboostin42 washer pump and powerX2-i5250 washing heads.
They want to know that it will work, do so reliably, and look good doing it.
This is why Apple has literally poured money into there chassis design. The more rugged (within reason) they can make there machines, the better overall the brand becomes. It is also why they don't make cheap machines, it gives them the headroom to make decisions regarding reliability and usability without having to worry about if they can afford it in XYZ model.
It's only once you understand that the enthusiast market is a statistically small, and shrinking, market and that Apple understands the growing commoditization of the market will you understand their, admittedly intelligent, approach to PC products.
I'll be the first to say I wish Apple made some more niche products for us in the "small percentile", however I also realize that Apple has found they work most efficient when they have a small to do list and a small product line.
So far their bet on the commoditization of PC hardware is turning out to be correct, and while I may not always have every bell and whistle, I have had a stable platform for years now, one which allows me to be profitable in my business endeavours.
Karl P