Apple and Epic Return to Court as Judges Question Prior Rulings

[Bigbuddy1]

Epic, that wants to pay no commission to Apple wants to pay a commission to Apple. Got it!

Hey buddy
The epic ceo asked apple to negotiate on the commission apple then told him to do one so please stop revising this and when apple wouldn’t then that’s when they went to court

 

[Bigbuddy1]

Folks in the EU that would like to play Fortnite on their iPhones would likely disagree on this point. They’re forced to use the Epic Games store or some other non-Apple Store. Customers in the EU that would prefer to use the App Store? It would appear they no longer have that choice.

That has already proven to be true.

I assume you have asked everyone in the EU that they would rather use the iOS App Store
Or is it just feels?

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Apple gives developers access to hundreds of millions of customers that have proven they’re willing to pay for digital content. The developer has to bring their skills/ideas, the price of a Mac, and $99. Beyond that, if the developer doesn’t make a sale, Apple also doesn’t make money. If the developer does end up actually creating something desirable (which depends on their skills/ideas/code abilities of course) and makes, say $20,000 in one month, they get $17,000. Offsetting $3,000 in order to have $17,000? I don’t know too many people that would turn down that cut.

Now, here’s the real question. Are they actually able to take advantage of the opportunity and eventually make a living wage or much, much more? The truth, for very many developers (the vast majority of developers, in fact), is no. You could direct hundreds/thousands of dollars in their direction (there’s no way to make it any easier) and they just wouldn’t be able to profit from it.

They’re most certainly free to keep trying as long as they like, but, and some may find this part hard to believe… everyone doesn’t become a star in athletic pursuits, everyone’s not an intellectual powerhouse, and not everyone has what it takes to be a developer with the abilities to make a profit when given access to hundreds of millions of people who, again, have spent considerable sums previously. If their idea of being a developer is “guaranteed payday made easy for me”, reality would like to sit them down and have a heart to heart.

And for Apple they have no costs irrespective of the developer makes it big or not at all. And as example epic offers the developer to keep 100% of revenue untill 1 million a year. That is secondary revenue and exposure opertunties. Or if you’re a developer that is in a competitive market you would absolutely want to lower the cost. And as we can see there hundreds and thousands of developers who are willing to forgo the 30% commission by doing their sales personally so they circumvent the commission and can either keep the 30% to incurred their margins or lower the price and be more competitive

Folks in the EU that would like to play Fortnite on their iPhones would likely disagree on this point. They’re forced to use the Epic Games store or some other non-Apple Store. Customers in the EU that would prefer to use the App Store? It would appear they no longer have that choice.

That has already proven to be true.

There’s plenty of fortnight liken games I can play. If Facebook gets their own Facebook store, then I’m sorry but I’m not downloading it and moves on. If steam releases iOS games then I would move every game purchase from the AppStore to the steam store as it’s 1.000c better in every shape or form to the AppStore.

 

[svish]

Waiting to see what will happen. Battle between Apple and Epic is never ending.

 

[MilaM]

There have been a few; they all have failed. People don't want too many choices.

This is nonsense. If consumers don't want choices, why do we have dozens of car brands and hundreds of car models to choose from? No, the problem is app portability. To establish a new competing operating system you would first have to convince thousands of app developers to port their apps to your OS. Some third party apps are so essential to daily life, that no sane consumer would consider buying such a smartphone right now.

 

[spazzcat]

This is nonsense. If consumers don't want choices, why do we have dozens of car brands and hundreds of car models to choose from? No, the problem is app portability. To establish a new competing operating system you would first have to convince thousands of app developers to port their apps to your OS. Some third party apps are so essential to daily life, that no sane consumer would consider buying such a smartphone right now.

Spending $25-$100k is not the same as buying a phone. Also, how any of those cars are truly different ...

 

[MilaM]

Spending $25-$100k is not the same as buying a phone. Also, how any of those cars are truly different ...

Saying a Fiat 500 and a Cybertruck are essentially the same thing is an interesting take. You could argue they both will transport you from A to B, sure. In my mind that would be where the similarities end.

 

[Rogifan]

Yes, if they’re able to get that deal. Absolutely, no question. I DON’T think that the government should force ISP’s and cellular providers to get a cut of hardware sales.

You DO realize that every company doing business with Apple agrees to terms prior to deploying an app to the App Store, right? Apple does not “deserve” it, Apple is contractually obligated to receive it. The companies working with them agree to adhere to the terms of their agreement. They don’t just start deploying apps to the App Store without an agreement. And, any company that doesn’t like the terms can just say “good day” and cut Apple out of their plans.

Who knows, maybe by avoiding Apple and building their own thing, they become the next internet powerhouse where NOT making their app available on the App Store becomes the thing that eventually takes Apple down.

And do you think Apple should raise the price of their hardware (i.e. pass on to consumers) these fees from cellular providers/ISPs?

 

[I7guy]

This is nonsense. If consumers don't want choices, why do we have dozens of car brands and hundreds of car models to choose from? No, the problem is app portability. To establish a new competing operating system you would first have to convince thousands of app developers to port their apps to your OS. Some third party apps are so essential to daily life, that no sane consumer would consider buying such a smartphone right now.

Nonsense. For consumer electronic devices made by for profit companies although some marketing maybe similar the number of models are different. How many different oled tv models does Samsung sell in 2025 as a 2025 model? Certainly not dozens. Same as iPhones. A few models with different configurations.

App portability is not apples issue. It’s like saying cross platform applications on windows are Microsoft’s problem.

 

[MilaM]

App portability is not apples issue. It’s like saying cross platform applications on windows are Microsoft’s problem.

My point is that if apps were portable, chances that a competing operating system emerges would be much higher. But it's completely hypothetical at this point. Maybe AI/LLMs will some day make porting apps more convenient.

It would be much easier for Apple to argue that against the Gatekeeper designation if there was a third OS in the marketplace. Maybe Apple should fund it the same way Microsoft helped Apple keep afloat years ago.

 

[pankajdoharey]

I just fail to understand how Epic Games can cantinue to charge 12% markup to game developers on their Epic Game store but want Apple to charge nothing on their App store, does no one sees this hypocrisy? Moreover Why hasnt apple pointed it out to the judges and the Jury? The only counter argument Epic has is The store is optional. Apple should comply to the same standards, Let people sideload apps as long as these are not pirated they can be run. Put effort on more secure apps and encryption keys etc ... its not that as if people cant sideload at all, there are insecure ways but no one trusts them. Apple has to change its strategy instead of fighting tooth and nail. Pose better standards. If people want to install unsecure apps from unsecure places its their choice all you can do is educate them. I think Apple 2.0 has to be more about openness. Microsoft transformed itself by being more accepting and open instead of being rigid and unaccepting.