Apple and Intel's Collaboration on MacBook Air and Beyond

I think this is good news. Now I don't care about a MBA, cause it doesn't suit my purposes. What I really want is a truly new and truly improved MacBook Pro.

The design has really run it's course and they need to take care of the heat issues. If Snow Leopard really starts to make the most of all of the cores and the GPU. They need to fix the heat issue. Cause my MBP runs so hot it even gives me kernal panics some times.

If unique Intel processors, specifically made for Apple can do the above, than I can only cheer them on.
 
CWallace said:
... I could see those showing up in future MBA's. I expect the most likely to be:

SP9400 (2.4GHz, 6MB, 25W, 1,066MHz FSB)
SP9300 (2.26GHz, 6MB, 25W, 1,066MHz FSB)
SL9400 (1.86GHz, 6MB, 17W, 1,066MHz FSB)
SL9300 (1.6GHz, 6MB, 17W, 1,066MHz FSB)
Click to expand...

Yeah, you right, S series is what we need for Air.

The trouble is, SP is 25W, and Air has difficulties dissipating even 20W. and this 25% increase is actually a long way to go, as roughly 10W can be passively dissipated, everything above needs a fan.
So, in this completely unscientific calculation you have 50% more do dissipate (15W vs. 10W difference above "free" 10W dissipation)

This leaves SL's only suitable for Air. while they are much better than todays 1.6-1.8 chips, both cooler & faster, they won't be available until September'08.

But if we are to speculate here (it's a Rumor's forum after all :rolleyes:) I can imagine how they would use SP' CPUs, in a new MBP ....

2,499$ one will be slightly "faster" (2.53 vs 2.5), but it will be significantly cooler (25W vs 35W).
This allows for much slimmer frame, and if you adopt Air'philosophy and ditch DVDD, around 4lbs slim.

I truly believe that they onto something, with all Th'Innovation they've built into Air.
It feels like it's not a niche thing, but could be a basis for a broader approach, on which other product groups can be based.

At least it feels about time (Apple's Time Zone :D) to start to get rid of DVDD as internal component.
Having just one USB, is a bit too early for me .... but with 15" they can build two, or borrow idea from HP/Voodoo, and introduce hybrid DisplayPort/USB slot.

And if iPhone will become Air'ified aventually (I SSH via WiFi just fine) that's one less USB to lack.
 
Abstract said:
So are other PC manufacturers stuck with the standard Intel fare, while Apple gets the smaller stuff? I'm only asking because I wonder how other manufacturers are building their small laptops? The article makes Apple look like Intels only customer for these chips, but maybe Apple was just the customer who requested the product and got the ball rolling for Intel?
Click to expand...


No, these chips are not exclusive to Apple. For example, the MBA processor is in the Voodoo Envy.
 
Wolfpup said:
(Only they're also updating their systems much more frequently-kind of a best of both worlds thing.)
Click to expand...

Really? I'm afraid there are more systems than just the iMac and the iPhone. Mac Pro took 2 years. And then there's the Mini, the Macbook (Air doesn't count), and the ever-static ACDs.
 
Intel SSDs?

I wonder if this has as much to do with SSDs as with CPUs. Remember that last year Intel announced their intention to compete aggressively in this space by introducing drives with faster throughput. Apparently, the first drives are supposed to be in production this year.

I think that we'll see these drives appear as options in the MBP and MBA as Apple begins the slow transition from HDDs to SSDs.
 
So let me see if I have this straight: Intel gives Apple access to a vault of their old and abandoned ideas, as well as access to a production pipeline capable of turning out a custom chip in volume (The Air's chip was an abandoned idea, and Intel ramped up production almost exclusively for Apple, all in under a year). Here, however, since it was Intel's design to begin with, they also sold the chip to Lenovo and others.

Meanwhile, Apple buys PA Semi and brings a lot of chip designing talent in house. Auspiciously this was for "iPod and iPhone chip design", but with the Air also having the iPhone's multi-touch chip in it, crossover is not unheard of. The problem is, neither Apple nor PA Semi have any production facilities! Luckily Apple happens to have a friend who has recently proven capable of taking a chip design from drawing board to full-scale production in under a year.

If Apple is the one with the chip idea next time, then they would most likely keep full rights to its sales, even if Intel was the production house. If Apple were to share certain ideas or even hire Intel as a consultant on the design, then things might go even smoother. Having the Intel team and the PA Semi team both competing with each other would be greatly beneficial to Apple (and Intel) in the long run.

One possible scenario: Apple wants to use the Atom chips in the next iPhone, so Intel opens up the schematics to Apple's team (mostly comprised of PA Semi people). Apple then makes a lot of modifications in close consultation with Intel's team. Intel then ramps up production on a custom Atom chip exclusive to the iPhone. Lenovo and others complain, but Intel can't sell the chip to them since Apple partly owns the design.
 
MattInOz said:
Screw mini-DVI, HDMI and the right Cable will give you most of the DVI output you loss compatiblity with Analog like VGA but still who wants that anymore?
Click to expand...

Agreed on HDMI, it's a smaller plug. But you can't connect it to normal Computer Screens. Believe it or not, most cheap/old Flat Panel Displays only have VGA.
 
For the record, the first custom component Intel made for Apple went into the :apple:TV.

PA Semi may design chips, but it is highly unlikely Intel will dedicate any time to being a foundry for any single customer. Right now fabs will be ramping down one process within months of completing the ramp up to keep in line with Intel's "tick, tock" strategy. For a fab to switch architectures (tock) isn't a big deal, but shrinking the gate size (tick) could involve buying millions, if not billions, of dollars worth of new equipment. Apple/PAS would either have to work mighty fast to get exactly what they want, or work hand-in-hand with the Intel side to get the best compromise in the shortest amount of time.

On the other hand, the merger of Fab 11 with Fab 11X I'm betting leaves a fair amount of empty, non-profitable fab space...
 
Epicurus said:
One possible scenario: Apple wants to use the Atom chips in the next iPhone, so Intel opens up the schematics to Apple's team (mostly comprised of PA Semi people). Apple then makes a lot of modifications in close consultation with Intel's team. Intel then ramps up production on a custom Atom chip exclusive to the iPhone. Lenovo and others complain, but Intel can't sell the chip to them since Apple partly owns the design.
Click to expand...
Apple can either license the design, and earn cash each time a pc is sold with these chips.
 
Intel fan noise and MacBook heat

I have a G4 powerbook and the latest MacBook for comparison.

I have noticed that the new Intel MacBook is much noisier and a heck of a lot hotter to the touch, the fan runs much more....

I think the Intel chipset choice for Apple was a great move. It was needed to increase the speed in laptops and to run windows on a mac ... IBM didn't have a solution on how to put a G5 in a laptop so here we are. Intel was reaching their GHZ return limit so they just threw in more cores..

The powerPC was built from the ground up based on RISC architecture and I feel it was a more elegant and efficient platform. G4 and G5 always had more L1 cache then the intel counterparts. I feel like the latest Intel chips are a bunch of patchwork solutions stacked on top of each other to maintain compatibility back to the original 8086 complete with a 640k barrier!
 
EspressoLove said:
I truly believe that they onto something, with all Th'Innovation they've built into Air.
It feels like it's not a niche thing, but could be a basis for a broader approach, on which other product groups can be based.
Click to expand...

An interesting twist on words here, that is leaving things out of AIR is seen as building in innovation. AIR is an interesting machine but I'm not convinced that it represents a huge amount of innovation.

Dave
 
i can't remember where, but i remember reading an article that was an interview from one of the Intel guys. basically said that they were excited about Apple using their chips, not only because of the increased revenue, but because they felt that Apple could help with growth and giving them new challenges that other manufactures weren't interested in. and this is basically why i see Intel and Apple working together so well. they tend to push each other to think in different terms and grow their products naturally. the problem with IBM and Motorola in the past is that they just didn't care enough to push themselves.
 
I'm actually still confused about the Macbook Air processor; Apple says it's a 1.6GHz/1.8GHz Core 2 Duo, so it's a low voltage processor I'm guessing? Apple does not say and they won't tell me when I ask (more like their Customer Service probably don't know either...)

Anyways, hopefully they will release this small chip packages in the future before the socket replacement for Socket T (775) on desktops is huge and a shrink like this would be spectacular, not to mention decrease the needed cooling. Maybe even replace the Peryns with the new package!

... :rolleyes:
 
alphaod said:
I'm actually still confused about the Macbook Air processor; Apple says it's a 1.6GHz/1.8GHz Core 2 Duo, so it's a low voltage processor I'm guessing?
Click to expand...

It draws less voltage then a standard Core 2 Duo, but not as little as an actual Low Voltage Intel CPU. The voltage is 1.0V - 1.25V while an LV processor draws 0.9V - 1.2000V and an Ultra Low Voltage (ULV) draws 0.8V - 0.975V.

AnnandTech has a good write-up.
 
I am looking forward to a major update to the Air.

My hopes: 5x faster GPU with modern architecture, 128gb - 256gb SSD, longer battery life. Faster CPU, optional.

I love the Air. I used to use the 17" for about 4 years, and I couldn't imagine having a small screen. But the Air is so light, so mobile, I don't miss the big screen at all. I love the portability.
 
wizard said:
It shouldn't require much effort to move to SATA in AIR. One has to wonder why they didn't in the first place.

Of course this is just one short coming tat Apple needs to address with AIR.

Dave
Click to expand...

I recall hearing that SATA uses more power than PATA, that may be why they didn't use SATA.
 
SchneiderMan said:
so would the new cpu be any one of these?
http://www.intel.com/Consumer/Learn/family-desktop.htm#/Desktop-desktop_core2extreme/
Click to expand...

Those are desktop CPUs. They put out so much heat they'd melt a MacBook or MacBook Pro. :D

Seriously, Intel is developing a quad-core mobile CPU due out in late Q3/early Q4 of this year. However, it will be very expensive ($1000+). So if we see it at all, it will be as a BTO option on the 17" MacBook Pro and will likely be around $3499 in that configuration.
 
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