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Apple Announces iPhone 3G S, Launching June 19th

First off everyone needs to go read this link from AT&T. It talks about what are the requirements for getting a subsidy on a new phone.

Second, this is why phones shouldn't be subsidized. Because the Apple faithful feel that they are super special and should be able to break cycle and get upgrades whenever Apple comes out with new hardware. AT&T should flip all you the bird, as there is nowhere else for you to go to get the iPhone. To all those that assume it will be on Verizon in 2010, good luck with that. Even if Verizon is going to use LTE the phone will still need CDMA fallback for when it is not in LTE service area.
 
RonD69 said:
hehe...I do feel really dumb buying the 3G iPhone AND knowing that Apple's iPhone product cycle is about a once a year refresh, but STILL I bought the 3G at subsidized prices. Live and learn I guess. Now I'm going to wait for my contract to end next year and see what new goodies Apple will be offering.
Click to expand...
I'd say be happy with what you have. Except for perhaps marginally better battery life and the better camera, is there any big reason to upgrade from a 3G to a 3G-S? There aren't a bunch of games out there that require a 3G-S to run (yet), and the 3G's got enough horsepower for everything the iPhone does now. Most of the other new features you heard about in the keynote are iPhone 3.0/AT&T features, not hardware related, and you'll get them anyway on the 17th.
 
.:R2theT said:
of business
Most developers seem to be doing alright. In fact, all the stories I read talk about developers quitting their other jobs to just develop for iPhone.

.
Click to expand...


Are you in the developer program, I don't know many developers who are quiting there day jobs. There are exceptions I'm sure, but are they giving up 90K+ jobs to develop iphone apps, I think not.

There was just an article about the small profit margins in app development. The motivation is still what mostly drives most.

God I've put more time and effort into the backend which I have to give away for free than the native app which I might make a small profit on.

Mind you I'm just starting out, we haven't had anything approved just yet, but very soon we should. Within the next month we hope.

There wasn't a lot of talk about att in the key note you noticed. Chances are Apple didn't consider the developer network yet, its too new to figure into any equation.

But none the less there will be an impact.

To get the "good" price I am adding a line of service, others are paying premium.

We were planning on release our imageShare* application at 3.99, now to make up for the additional cost we will probably be going 6.99 - 9.99.

Ripple effect.
 
michelle21 said:
And why does Sprint and other carriers do it. .. Could be because you make more off premium services than you subsidized that phone for.

When I contract with a finance company I don't subscribe to a service from them, its a flat contract. With a cell phone carrier I have a finance contract and a variable subscription plan.

I love these apple and oranges justifications. There is definitely a problem with how this is being handled. Maybe someone will do something about it but most likely not.
Click to expand...

yes, they supply a service with those payments, but do you honestly think (i live in the uk, so using uk prices) that it costs the carrier (in this case O2) £30 a month to supply a user with 100 minutes and 75 text messages a month? yes, there's unlimited web use as well, but as always that is within "fair usage" reason. part of that payment, no matter what plan you are on, covers the cost of them "giving" you some of that phone for free. this is exactly why they tie you down to a set amount of months, and why the up front cost varies depending on the plan. the more you are going to pay, the more they will "give" you (knowing they will get it back, and then some) because those payments are (unless you want to screw up your credit score/not get another iphone) guaranteed. they are not going to just cut you free of what you owe them. its not apples and oranges at all. they are basically providing you with a loan for the rest of the phones cost while providing you with a service. they give you nothing. it has been like this ever since phones started being subbed. the only way it will stop is if you go PAYG and buy the phone outright.

as for sprint and others... well that's not the iphone, is it?
 
Contacted AT&T

I logged onto my wireless account and sent an email to Customer Service telling them how disappointed I was with AT&T not being ready for the 3GS to support MMS and tethering, and the $200 upgrade penalty for existing iPhone users. Boy, did it feel good to type that email!!!

I hope you do the same. With enough negative backlash, hopefully they'll reverse course. But I highly doubt they will; it's theraputic anyways.
 
To all those bitching and moaning about not getting the subsidy:

That's just how phone subsidies work! Just because you're a "loyal apple supporter," that doesn't entitle you to be treated any differently. If you were a fan[boy] of say, the motorola razr, does that mean you should get a subsidized phone every time a new one comes out? No, you either wait two years, or pay full price just like everyone else. If you feel the need to upgrade your phone every 12 months, accept the fact that it COSTS MORE to have the latest and greatest gadgets. Duh!

Rant over.
 
SeaFox said:
Real loyalty does not require rewards. You're just asking to be bought.
Click to expand...


As I was explaining all this to my family. How we have to justify this, with the economy beging so tight. As a developer I've already invested too much to not continue. I have to consider the others collaborating on the project. Further we HAVE to be very sure for legal purposes the app works on the new hardware.

We already found out there are definite performance differences between the real phone hardware and the simulator. QA has to be on both new and old hardware. Looks like I will have the only new phone in our project. No one else can justify the cost.

We need to consider supporting video in our already long laundry list of features apple left out.


  • Share images between iphones connected to the server
    peer to peer via bonjour (can't discuss yet, NDA)
    Dedicated chat
    Instant updates like twitter
    Share travellogs with additional gps data
    Locate uses on google maps
    Print locally or from online server
    And more
 
diamond.g said:
First off everyone needs to go read this link from AT&T. It talks about what are the requirements for getting a subsidy on a new phone.

Second, this is why phones shouldn't be subsidized. Because the Apple faithful feel that they are super special and should be able to break cycle and get upgrades whenever Apple comes out with new hardware. AT&T should flip all you the bird, as there is nowhere else for you to go to get the iPhone. To all those that assume it will be on Verizon in 2010, good luck with that. Even if Verizon is going to use LTE the phone will still need CDMA fallback for when it is not in LTE service area.
Click to expand...

You're a bit mistaken, and a bit correct.

LTE is more along the lines of EVDO and HSDPA in that it's for data. Like you said, it would still need CDMA but for voice, which Verizon has said they will not have. The only other option would be for an LTE-only phone, essentially making placing calls over VOIP. If people think the iPhone plan is expensive now, wait until Verizon tries to nickel and dime you for every single megabyte and kilobyte when LTE is your only option. Not only that, LTE's full rollout won't be perfected until the very end of 2010. If you get an iPhone now and Verizon's is anticipated to be better by the end of 2010/2011...you'll be able to tough it out for 6-8 more months until your 2 year contract is up in 2011 and then jump ship.

Apple does this all the time - they refresh their hardware annually. Once you're able to get over that fact, it's really a great company. The new MacBook Pros make me super jealous since I'm using my '07 model, but guess what? This one still works like a charm and I don't see any reason to upgrade any time soon.
 
Jayenh


Business is business, we will pay the premium, But understand something, developers kind of operate in packs. We communicate a lot.

Expect to pay through you nose for anything coming along. WE HAVE to justify our costs too.

Last word.

I'm picking up my phone next week, If att recanted it wouldn't help me right now so whats the point.

To all my fellow "complainers'

You need to understand the overall business model.

It just works so well for the rest of the economy doesn't it!!!:mad:
 
I wasn't going to write anything because I just like to read what others say, but this is the most whining I've ever seen.

First of all, get over it! If you want to upgrade now and your contract is not ended, you have to pay for the fee. Its plain and simple. Sell your current phone to make up for the difference if you really want it that bad. You are not suppose to upgrade every 12 months. You are suppose to upgrade every 18 or 24 months depending on your contract. It's the same in every business. You don't get privilages just because you have an iphone. Many people didn't upgrade from 2g to 3g last year when it was released. Now, they can upgrade and you can wait, and when the next one is released in a year, you'll upgrade without any penalty fees and the rest can whine ;)

Second, while its not a major upgrade, it is still an upgrade, and a decent one none the less; better battery, faster, higher capacity, compass, voice commands etc. You can't expect apple to max out every spec on the phone. If they did, you'd be disappointed in the future upgrades because there won't be much to upgrade. People are buying Iphones anyways.

It's a good opportunity for those with 2g to upgrade now. It is also a good opportunity for those who never had an iphone. I was holding on until a 32GB model, so I'll probably buy one now when I'll have the money for it.

If you think it's not a good upgrade, stop complaining and stick with your 3G or whatever phone you are using. It's perfectly fine. That's what I would have done if I had a 3G. They are going to release another one in 1 year anyways.

if you think it's expensive, well think about it. It's more than a phone. If you are just going to use it as a phone, then yea its expensive. But considering all the things an Iphone can do, it's not expensive. If you are going to compare it to other smartphones, then why don't you just go buy one of those?
 
existent said:
I wasn't going to write anything because I just like to read what others say, but this is the most whining I've ever seen.

First of all, get over it! If you want to upgrade now and your contract is not ended, you have to pay for the fee. Its plain and simple. Sell your current phone to make up for the difference if you really want it that bad. You are not suppose to upgrade every 12 months. You are suppose to upgrade every 18 or 24 months depending on your contract. It's the same in every business. You don't get privilages just because you have an iphone. Many people didn't upgrade from 2g to 3g last year when it was released. Now, they can upgrade and you can wait, and when the next one is released in a year, you'll upgrade without any penalty fees and the rest can whine ;)

Second, while its not a major upgrade, it is still an upgrade, and a decent one none the less; better battery, faster, higher capacity, compass, voice commands etc. You can't expect apple to max out every spec on the phone. If they did, you'd be disappointed in the future upgrades because there won't be much to upgrade. People are buying Iphones anyways.

It's a good opportunity for those with 2g to upgrade now. It is also a good opportunity for those who never had an iphone. I was holding on until a 32GB model, so I'll probably buy one now when I'll have the money for it.

If you think it's not a good upgrade, stop complaining and stick with your 3G or whatever phone you are using. It's perfectly fine. That's what I would have done if I had a 3G. They are going to release another one in 1 year anyways.

if you think it's expensive, well think about it. It's more than a phone. If you are just going to use it as a phone, then yea its expensive. But considering all the things an Iphone can do, it's not expensive. If you are going to compare it to other smartphones, then why don't you just go buy one of those?
Click to expand...

Very well said. It isnt JUST a phone, it always has been much more than that & no matter how much other companies try, they just cant match Apple iPhone. Iphone & Itunes, the availabilty of software updates & apps & movies & so much more!
 
existent said:
I wasn't going to write anything because I just like to read what others say, but this is the most whining I've ever seen.

those?
Click to expand...

Whinning is good psycholigically, aside for technical issues thats what forums are for.

You blow off some steam, makes you feel a bit better then sit down and make the most rational decision you can.

Don't kid yourself, most of us understand the business. That doesn't mean we have to think it is fair. There are so many pressues in life, so many things to justify... You just have to talk about it. Maybe its more of a girl thing.. (I doubt it) But I do like to voice my distaste for things I don't care for.

Then in the end you just go with the flow. Thats life....
 
existent said:
I wasn't going to write anything because I just like to read what others say, but this is the most whining I've ever seen.

First of all, get over it! If you want to upgrade now and your contract is not ended, you have to pay for the fee. Its plain and simple. Sell your current phone to make up for the difference if you really want it that bad. You are not suppose to upgrade every 12 months. You are suppose to upgrade every 18 or 24 months depending on your contract. It's the same in every business. You don't get privilages just because you have an iphone. Many people didn't upgrade from 2g to 3g last year when it was released. Now, they can upgrade and you can wait, and when the next one is released in a year, you'll upgrade without any penalty fees and the rest can whine ;)

Second, while its not a major upgrade, it is still an upgrade, and a decent one none the less; better battery, faster, higher capacity, compass, voice commands etc. You can't expect apple to max out every spec on the phone. If they did, you'd be disappointed in the future upgrades because there won't be much to upgrade. People are buying Iphones anyways.

It's a good opportunity for those with 2g to upgrade now. It is also a good opportunity for those who never had an iphone. I was holding on until a 32GB model, so I'll probably buy one now when I'll have the money for it.

If you think it's not a good upgrade, stop complaining and stick with your 3G or whatever phone you are using. It's perfectly fine. That's what I would have done if I had a 3G. They are going to release another one in 1 year anyways.

if you think it's expensive, well think about it. It's more than a phone. If you are just going to use it as a phone, then yea its expensive. But considering all the things an Iphone can do, it's not expensive. If you are going to compare it to other smartphones, then why don't you just go buy one of those?
Click to expand...

Wow a good reply for a change, that's more like it!

In the UK even upgrading from a typical Nokia/Sony/Samsung to another typical Nokia/Sony/Samsung costs a fair amount of money if you are mid-contract. They need to make their money back on the phone somehow, and even little basic phones are expensive for the network providers to buy. If I wanted to upgrade to a normal phone it would be around £100 if you weren't at the end of the your term.

I am surprised people are so shocked with the prices.
 
NATO said:
I would quite like a 3G-S so here's my plan:

Option 1 - Wait 6 months until my contract ends then get one on a new 18 month contract (in which time Apple might release a new version and then I'm in the same situation all over again).

Cost of iPhone: £184.98
Tariff : 18 x £34.26
TOTAL : £801.66

or

Cost of iPhone: £87.11
Tariff : 118 x £44.05
TOTAL : £880.01


Option 2 - Buy it on 'Pay as you Go' on release and then switch to a O2 Simplicity SIM (SIM-Only) tariff when my current contract expires. Calculated over 18 months for ease of comparison, but this leaves me free to change phone/contract as I wish as I'm not locked into a contract.

Cost of iPhone : £440.40
Tariff : (18 x £14.69) + (18 x £7.50 Internet Bolt-on)
TOTAL : £839.82

Not much of a difference in price over 18 months, plus by going the PAYG route I'm not tied into a contract and can change my tariff up or down every 30 days if desired. As much as I'd like to go contract, it makes more sense for me to pay a little more up front with very low monthly bills from then on.
Click to expand...

Contracts are a scam.

My personal experience of being on O2 in a contract is not all that good. I was with them for years and you get no perks at all. On Pay and Go I get money back as a percentage of my top ups, you can get a percentage of your top ups as cash against the cost of any handset on O2, you can swap tariffs as often as you like. I personally am on O2 unlimited, you get free data for 12 months on the pay and go iPhone and after that you can always throw a Simplicity simcard in for 30 a month you can get 1200 mins, and choose what you want as a freebie eg unlimited O2 calls, unlimited data, and you also get 2,400 texts a month... compare that with the iPhone contracts and Pay and Go / Simplicity works out cheaper over 18 months and even better over 24 months. For me it's a no brainer.
 
julianna1973 said:
Very well said. It isnt JUST a phone, it always has been much more than that & no matter how much other companies try, they just cant match Apple iPhone. Iphone & Itunes, the availabilty of software updates & apps & movies & so much more!
Click to expand...

exactly. Apps and the UI is what makes all the difference.

For example, sure Palm has an app store now, but how many apps in there? 20? 30? Same for nokia. They may have a bigger app store, but not many quality apps, and the UI is not the greatest in the world. I have an N95 right now, but I don't use it anything other than as a phone and as a mp3 player (only because my ipod died and didn't buy a new one).
 
tomacwhite said:
Wow a good reply for a change, that's more like it!

In the UK even upgrading from a typical Nokia/Sony/Samsung to another typical Nokia/Sony/Samsung costs a fair amount of money if you are mid-contract. They need to make their money back on the phone somehow, and even little basic phones are expensive for the network providers to buy. If I wanted to upgrade to a normal phone it would be around £100 if you weren't at the end of the your term.

I am surprised people are so shocked with the prices.
Click to expand...

nod.. I'm in UK as well. Most of the smartphones cost something upfront when they first come out anyways even if you are just making a new contract (and not upgrading).
 
ccuk said:
Contracts are a scam.

My personal experience of being on O2 in a contract is not all that good. I was with them for years and you get no perks at all. On Pay and Go I get money back as a percentage of my top ups, you can get a percentage of your top ups as cash against the cost of any handset on O2, you can swap tariffs as often as you like. I personally am on O2 unlimited, you get free data for 12 months on the pay and go iPhone and after that you can always throw a Simplicity simcard in for 30 a month you can get 1200 mins, and choose what you want as a freebie eg unlimited O2 calls, unlimited data, and you also get 2,400 texts a month... compare that with the iPhone contracts and Pay and Go / Simplicity works out cheaper over 18 months and even better over 24 months. For me it's a no brainer.
Click to expand...

Really? PAYG is cheaper than contract on 02? Got some more numbers there, I am interested...
 
michelle21 said:
As I was explaining all this to my family. How we have to justify this, with the economy beging so tight.
Click to expand...

Your argument is a double-edged sword. The economy is tight for AT&T, too, not just you. Perhaps they can't afford to just hand out subsidies to people like candy. Remember that these subsidies are granted against a two-year contract extension. What happens when someone racks up four years of contract time and suddenly flies the coop or declares bankruptcy? Is AT&T going to get (early term fee x num. of extensions)? Nope. Now multiply this times a boatload of irresponsible "I-gotta-have-the-latest" consumers, and during a recession where they're more likely to have financial issues, no less. AT&T has to manage it's risk, too.

As a developer I've already invested too much to not continue. I have to consider the others collaborating on the project. Further we HAVE to be very sure for legal purposes the app works on the new hardware.

We already found out there are definite performance differences between the real phone hardware and the simulator. QA has to be on both new and old hardware. Looks like I will have the only new phone in our project. No one else can justify the cost.
Click to expand...

Isn't this the "cost of doing business"? I'm sorry if this sounds mean, but logic says if you can't afford the tools you need for your job/career, perhaps you need to get some investors or reconsider the scale of your operation.
 
axboi87 said:
Ok i like others bought my 3G the day it came out and am not eligable for an upgrade. However my mom's motorola has been eligable for an upgrade for a while now...what if I:
Upgrade her line to a new iphone
Subsequently cancelled the newly added iphone data plan added to her line
put the new sim back in her old phone
put my current 3g's sim in the new phone

Would it work?
Click to expand...

jmorrison0722 said:
It would work...I think ATT just requires you keep phone plan for 2 years. I can't imagine they could argue if you just say you broke the iPhone and therefore don't need the data plan portion. You're mom wouldn't be able to upgrade her old Motorolla for 2 years though.
Click to expand...

Yeah that's fine because my mom will buy a new phone on ebay. I have another question about my plan...Since I might have some trouble upgrading her line when I'm not her (I am an authorized user however). What if i reserve an iphone 3GS to be picked up at the apple store on the 19th? Wouldn't there be less indentification problems if it was already paid for? would I need to bring her old phone in or anything?
 
SeaFox said:
Your argument is a double-edged sword. The economy is tight for AT&T, too, not just you. Perhaps they can't afford to just hand out subsidies to people like candy. Remember that these subsidies are granted against a two-year contract extension. What happens when someone racks up four years of contract time and suddenly flies the coop or declares bankruptcy? Is AT&T going to get (early term fee x num. of extensions)? Nope. Now multiply this times a boatload of irresponsible "I-gotta-have-the-latest" consumers, and during a recession where they're more likely to have financial issues, no less. AT&T has to manage it's risk, too.



Isn't this the "cost of doing business"? I'm sorry if this sounds mean, but logic says if you can't afford the tools you need for your job/career, perhaps you need to get some investors or reconsider the scale of your operation.
Click to expand...


If you read my earlier comment, I said it was apple that needed to fix this not att.

Without developers and apps the PRE would be outselling the iphone right now.
 
julianna1973 said:
Very well said. It isnt JUST a phone, it always has been much more than that & no matter how much other companies try, they just cant match Apple iPhone. Iphone & Itunes, the availabilty of software updates & apps & movies & so much more!
Click to expand...

You're right, the iPhone isn't just a phone. Which is exactly why I completely disagree with this argument. The model of upgrading and contracts was great when phones were just phones. But this is no longer the case anymore, and because of this mentality, the rest of the world has soared past the US in cellular technology.

The "upgrade every 2 years" argument worked when a phone was a phone. The extremely rapid pace of technological expansion has rendered that argument moot as customers want to upgrade way more frequently than was previously permitted by large corporations follownig a old business model. The longer telecom companies have their head up their rears and continue to rely on old networks to support new and faster devices, the more it hurts us as Americans.

Personally, I'd be fine with paying my $500 if it did not have a two year agreement extension. That plus the $18 upgrade fee and the $18 activation fee stinks of corporate greed.
 
koobcamuk said:
Vodafone told me the same thing 18months ago. They want to keep people onboard.
Click to expand...
I had a Verizon rep tell me a similar thing about a month ago. He said they'd have it by the end of '09 or early '10 since AT&T's exclusive contract would be ending.
 
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