I guess your annual income must be in the hundred ks. Nothing to be jealous about. That's how life is. So basically, yeah its about status and lifestyle. Thanks for the remark! Appreciated.
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Apple Announces iPod Touch Software Update
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I guess your annual income must be in the hundred ks. Nothing to be jealous about. That's how life is. So basically, yeah its about status and lifestyle. Thanks for the remark! Appreciated.
Here's my last word on the matter. There are a few issues:
First, what did Apple do? They designed two products - the iPhone and the Touch - to run on the same OS. They then designed a few apps that could work on both, and decided to put it on the iPhone only. A few months later - after jailbreaking had already become common, but before the release of the SDK - they proposed to charge $20 for these apps on the Touch.
Second, is Apple "wrong"? Well, it's their product. Manufacturers can charge whatever the heck they want for their product. I think such commercial choices should keep the anticipated reactions of the consumers in question, but this is less of a moral question than one of good marketing strategy. It's obvious that Apple's pissed a lot of people off, so it seems like they made a bad move here. Are they "wrong"? Not in any moral sense. But they weren't being very nice to early adopters. Fanboyism will certainly die down for a while.
Third, should consumers complain? Consumers can whine and moan all they want, and why should we stop them? As the ones paying the bills, consumers should have all the whining/moaning rights they want. But I think the whining is pointless if consumers still fork out the $20. Apple's still laughing to the bank, knowing that fanboyism will be back up and running in no time. Besides, what do they care about our feelings as long as they do not translate to sales reduction? Apple knows that despite our whining, we will continue to buy Apple because it is awesome. The only way to protect the rights of the consumer is via changing our consumer behaviour. Stop behaviourally condoning undesirable actions by giving in to their schemes. Again, this is all behavioural psychology 101. Jailbreak, people, jailbreak. Someone here did it for 2 hours. It takes about 10 minutes now, and it's totally reversible. And it renders the iPod Touch a machine to be reckoned with (argh, ending a sentence with a preposition!). No (read: very little) reason to pick Apple's $20 upgrade over jailbreaking.
Fourth, what should Apple have done? This is up for the marketing experts, really. But here's what I think: I think Apple should have waited until they released the SDK, and before anyone else managed to design any apps, offer these 5 applications on the Downloads page as $2 (or more) applications. They charge for FileMaker, they charge for Quicktime Pro, they charge for Bento (soon), so why not charge for iPod Touch Mail, etc? They'll still make money off the apps (and fulfill whatever legal obligations), and I bet people will be less annoyed. Especially if they called it "Mail for iPod Touch" instead of saying (as they implied) "Now your iPod Touch will be like the iPhone (haha, suckers)." It's all semantics, but it's clever.
So, in conclusion: Please - whiners, moaners, and such - don't pay the $20. You're positively reinforcing this behaviour, and it will only get worse. Behavioural psychology 101 (I'm a cognitive psychologist, but meh). Jailbreak, and get the same apps (and more) for free. As far as I can tell, as long as you don't install pirated apps, jailbreaking isn't illegal. It voids the warranty, but there's a simple solution to that as mentioned multiple times. Also, it's simple and fast. And glorious.
First, what did Apple do? They designed two products - the iPhone and the Touch - to run on the same OS. They then designed a few apps that could work on both, and decided to put it on the iPhone only. A few months later - after jailbreaking had already become common, but before the release of the SDK - they proposed to charge $20 for these apps on the Touch.
Second, is Apple "wrong"? Well, it's their product. Manufacturers can charge whatever the heck they want for their product. I think such commercial choices should keep the anticipated reactions of the consumers in question, but this is less of a moral question than one of good marketing strategy. It's obvious that Apple's pissed a lot of people off, so it seems like they made a bad move here. Are they "wrong"? Not in any moral sense. But they weren't being very nice to early adopters. Fanboyism will certainly die down for a while.
Third, should consumers complain? Consumers can whine and moan all they want, and why should we stop them? As the ones paying the bills, consumers should have all the whining/moaning rights they want. But I think the whining is pointless if consumers still fork out the $20. Apple's still laughing to the bank, knowing that fanboyism will be back up and running in no time. Besides, what do they care about our feelings as long as they do not translate to sales reduction? Apple knows that despite our whining, we will continue to buy Apple because it is awesome. The only way to protect the rights of the consumer is via changing our consumer behaviour. Stop behaviourally condoning undesirable actions by giving in to their schemes. Again, this is all behavioural psychology 101. Jailbreak, people, jailbreak. Someone here did it for 2 hours. It takes about 10 minutes now, and it's totally reversible. And it renders the iPod Touch a machine to be reckoned with (argh, ending a sentence with a preposition!). No (read: very little) reason to pick Apple's $20 upgrade over jailbreaking.
Fourth, what should Apple have done? This is up for the marketing experts, really. But here's what I think: I think Apple should have waited until they released the SDK, and before anyone else managed to design any apps, offer these 5 applications on the Downloads page as $2 (or more) applications. They charge for FileMaker, they charge for Quicktime Pro, they charge for Bento (soon), so why not charge for iPod Touch Mail, etc? They'll still make money off the apps (and fulfill whatever legal obligations), and I bet people will be less annoyed. Especially if they called it "Mail for iPod Touch" instead of saying (as they implied) "Now your iPod Touch will be like the iPhone (haha, suckers)." It's all semantics, but it's clever.
So, in conclusion: Please - whiners, moaners, and such - don't pay the $20. You're positively reinforcing this behaviour, and it will only get worse. Behavioural psychology 101 (I'm a cognitive psychologist, but meh). Jailbreak, and get the same apps (and more) for free. As far as I can tell, as long as you don't install pirated apps, jailbreaking isn't illegal. It voids the warranty, but there's a simple solution to that as mentioned multiple times. Also, it's simple and fast. And glorious.
8 GB iPod Touch Successful Jailbreak!
So I took JonathanJong's advice and successfully jailbroke my iPT last night. I now have a bunch of great 3rd party apps, a much more customized dock and the iPhone apps that are included in the $20 iPT upgrade.
2 problems, however:
1) I am unsuccessful in locating good advice on how to configure Cisco VPN on my iPT. I do have the network settings preferences now, which allows you to input VPN settings, but it it not set-up to use Cisco. Maybe it can't be done yet...I just wanted to find out.
2) In order to jailbreak, I had to downgrade to firmware 1.1.1 (yeah, I know you all know that), but do you know if and how I can upgrade to 1.1.2 now that the 1.1.3 upgrade is now in itunes? I found the 1.1.2 firmware file online, and downloaded it to my desktop, but is there a way to upgrade your iPT from somewhere other than iTunes?
I need your help!! Thanks!!
So I took JonathanJong's advice and successfully jailbroke my iPT last night. I now have a bunch of great 3rd party apps, a much more customized dock and the iPhone apps that are included in the $20 iPT upgrade.
2 problems, however:
1) I am unsuccessful in locating good advice on how to configure Cisco VPN on my iPT. I do have the network settings preferences now, which allows you to input VPN settings, but it it not set-up to use Cisco. Maybe it can't be done yet...I just wanted to find out.
2) In order to jailbreak, I had to downgrade to firmware 1.1.1 (yeah, I know you all know that), but do you know if and how I can upgrade to 1.1.2 now that the 1.1.3 upgrade is now in itunes? I found the 1.1.2 firmware file online, and downloaded it to my desktop, but is there a way to upgrade your iPT from somewhere other than iTunes?
I need your help!! Thanks!!
People have been making the comment that there is no purpose in buying the apps when you can jailbreak the iPod Touch. What they fail to realize is that because Apple charges for these applications on iPod Touches now, putting the apps on by any other means is essentially piracy.
P-Worm
P-Worm
Sarbanes-Oxley
Yeah, I'm slow.
I was just perusing info on the Sarbanes-Oxley Act. I can't make heads or tails out of how it supposedly affects Apple and in particular the Touch software charge. The Act was created to prevent corporate fraud. How is Apple avoiding fraud by adding value to a product and then offering to back-charge people who already bought the product?
Well, duh... You mean you just now figured that out?
Yeah, I'm slow.
I was just perusing info on the Sarbanes-Oxley Act. I can't make heads or tails out of how it supposedly affects Apple and in particular the Touch software charge. The Act was created to prevent corporate fraud. How is Apple avoiding fraud by adding value to a product and then offering to back-charge people who already bought the product?
Well it looks as though things have started slowing down here in this thread.
I'm back to retract most of my complaining. I have gotten info that I wasnt aware of and although I don't think it was the best PR move thats what they did and we'll have to live with it.
For all those that go it for Christmas hopfully you'll be able to take advantage of the 30 price match. So ill leave it like this
I'm back to retract most of my complaining. I have gotten info that I wasnt aware of and although I don't think it was the best PR move thats what they did and we'll have to live with it.
For all those that go it for Christmas hopfully you'll be able to take advantage of the 30 price match. So ill leave it like this
Personally I think this stinks
I bought one of these as an xmas gift three weeks ago and personally I think it stinks making people pay for the upgrade.
I never paid for an upgrade on my old ipod, nor on any of my macs.
When leopard came out three weeks after I bought a macbook, apple even gave me that for free.
With that history, I did not expect the receiver of the gift to be screwed for 20 bucks three weeks after I bought a product.
And what does this mean for the future? Will the next upgrade cost again?
And should you buy this one or wait for a better one in three weeks time??
No guys, say what you like but this sucks and that's not what we expect from apple.
I suggest everyone complains to apple here:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/ipodtouch.html
Until they realize what a PR disaster this is and change the price.
It has happened before ....
I bought one of these as an xmas gift three weeks ago and personally I think it stinks making people pay for the upgrade.
I never paid for an upgrade on my old ipod, nor on any of my macs.
When leopard came out three weeks after I bought a macbook, apple even gave me that for free.
With that history, I did not expect the receiver of the gift to be screwed for 20 bucks three weeks after I bought a product.
And what does this mean for the future? Will the next upgrade cost again?
And should you buy this one or wait for a better one in three weeks time??
No guys, say what you like but this sucks and that's not what we expect from apple.
I suggest everyone complains to apple here:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/ipodtouch.html
Until they realize what a PR disaster this is and change the price.
It has happened before ....
Can't all of you objecting on principal find something more important to do with your principals? If you feel this outraged by this then i'm sure that there are many other things that you feel even more strongly about that might genuinely make a difference.
Buy the upgrade, don't buy the upgrade, but do something positive with your massive sense of injustice rather than moan about a damn stocks app on a music player.
Buy the upgrade, don't buy the upgrade, but do something positive with your massive sense of injustice rather than moan about a damn stocks app on a music player.
Personally I am hoping that everyone reading this thread takes the positive action of jailbreaking their iPod touch.
Not an accountant, an economist, and I deal with SOx issues all the time for a big Telco.
I don't need intimate knowledge of what Apple is doing to know what they CAN do, and that they CHOSE to do so and are not required to do so.
The other thing is their excuse of calendar year is pretty self-created because all of these could easily have been launched prior to the new year.
What's more likely is that they CHOSE to charge for 2 major reasons a) they are overly worried after their backdating options fiasco, and want to appear to be doing more than required, however they could even give it a 0 value under SOx as well b) they want to give these apps value to set a precedent, either for future sales (establish SDK app prices) or for value assesments in legal negotiations.
Once again it's not just about the money (especially since people plonked $300-400 for these versus much cheaper options; and for most it's $20 per app with 4 apps they don't care about thrown in.
I'm not surprised that an Apple defender would discount the value of a dollar though, no evidence of previous understanding of that value from the defenders of the realm.
I think this is it. I've got to think that all these new apps that will come about will NOT be free. We'll be paying for all of them. I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt it.
Again, getting these apps for free is now piracy. How is that 'positive?' just because you want t for free?
I plan on getting the software as soon as they get the download and install issue sorted out because I have ause for it. If you don't think the package is worth it, don't use it.
P-Worm
No such luck !
1.1.3 is the firmware update, the apps are something different ! - Sorry !
1.1.3 is the firmware update, the apps are something different ! - Sorry !
of course not, i just suspect most of the people of principal on this thread aren't committing the same energy to constructive engagement on this or any other subject as they are to moaning.
have you read the thread?
i can understand people being hacked off but it's getting more than a bit OTT in places - it's a couple of apps for a music player. if that's the extent of people's worries in the world then they should be happy, if it's not then perhaps focus on the the bigger issues.
just asking for a bit of perspective i guess.
indeed.
i don't get why anyone who is happy pirating software (which jailbreaking and copying the apps is) gives a toss one way or another as licensing is at best an academic matter to them.
can i ask people - if apple released a bunch of games at $5 each but gave them free to iphone users, would you be equally pissed or would you think "hey, that guy will pay £800 over the next 2 years for his iPhone, i paid £270 for my iPod touch, it's not unreasonable that he gets more than me?"
to me the idea that touch owners don't get the same is a bit of a given - pay less, get less.
Not really here to say anything more about the upgrade issue, just to answer one of Taramac's question:
Once you've jailbroken on 1.1.1, you can use Oktoprep's Tweak software to prepare your jailbroken iPod for 1.1.2. Then, you can update to 1.1.2 with the ipsw file you downloaded, and then run the 1.1.2-jailbreak .jar file from jailbreakme.com. In the end, you have a jailbroken iPod Touch running 1.1.2. Also, installing Apple's iPod Touch apps on your iPod without paying is piracy and therefore illegal. Fortunately, these apps (as far as I know) are not available. Some pretty darned close ones are, though. (For more instructions, jailbreakme.com/1.1.2 is a comprehensive resource).
And I dunno about your VPN issue.
Once you've jailbroken on 1.1.1, you can use Oktoprep's Tweak software to prepare your jailbroken iPod for 1.1.2. Then, you can update to 1.1.2 with the ipsw file you downloaded, and then run the 1.1.2-jailbreak .jar file from jailbreakme.com. In the end, you have a jailbroken iPod Touch running 1.1.2. Also, installing Apple's iPod Touch apps on your iPod without paying is piracy and therefore illegal. Fortunately, these apps (as far as I know) are not available. Some pretty darned close ones are, though. (For more instructions, jailbreakme.com/1.1.2 is a comprehensive resource).
And I dunno about your VPN issue.
Way to help foster the growing hacker community.
Why do I care what's positive or about piracy? Why should I care anymore than Apple does about their early adopters who helped make a succesful launch?
If Apple wants to go after pirates spending thousands of dollars to get their $20, that'll help their flagging stock prices and poor PR I'm sure.
How many of those "pirates" would be legit if they weren't being charged for what is being offered free to people who bought the product days after them?
How many of those would never have jailbreaked, and now that they've gone that step will add paid and hacked apps because by your standard they are already 'pirates'?
Bad strategic move in such a fickle and tech savy marketplace, even if it is still just 'Apple-savy', where the jailbreak already existed before they made their decision on how much to charge for those apps.
There's nothing to bring those already broken back into the fold which would've been a better strategy. Better strategy give these apps for free, thus please your early adopters and also bring in the jailbreakers who probably wouldn't jailbreak again after 1.13 because their basic needs would've been satisfied. Instead they have more reason to stay jailbroken and keep on doing it, giving even more motivation and more end-users to the hackers. Brilliant move to foster not lessen your hacker community by turning a potential handful of users into a much larger group.
Why do I care what's positive or about piracy? Why should I care anymore than Apple does about their early adopters who helped make a succesful launch?
If Apple wants to go after pirates spending thousands of dollars to get their $20, that'll help their flagging stock prices and poor PR I'm sure.
How many of those "pirates" would be legit if they weren't being charged for what is being offered free to people who bought the product days after them?
How many of those would never have jailbreaked, and now that they've gone that step will add paid and hacked apps because by your standard they are already 'pirates'?
Bad strategic move in such a fickle and tech savy marketplace, even if it is still just 'Apple-savy', where the jailbreak already existed before they made their decision on how much to charge for those apps.
There's nothing to bring those already broken back into the fold which would've been a better strategy. Better strategy give these apps for free, thus please your early adopters and also bring in the jailbreakers who probably wouldn't jailbreak again after 1.13 because their basic needs would've been satisfied. Instead they have more reason to stay jailbroken and keep on doing it, giving even more motivation and more end-users to the hackers. Brilliant move to foster not lessen your hacker community by turning a potential handful of users into a much larger group.
That's not the issue, the issue is for the same product at the same price, if you buy it on Monday it's $20, if you buy it on Tuesday it's included with your purchase. So your example is very flawed and not so much of a given as you seem to imagine.
Online Petition
I found a petition to Apple regarding the iPod Touch's January Software Update. Here is the link:
http://www.petitiononline.com/freeappi/petition.html
As of writing this it has over 6900 signatures.
While I'm on the subject, I thought I would put in my two cents. I think these feature updates should be included while you're under warranty. For those wishing extended enhanced feature software support past a year, Apple could include feature updates within their Apple Care program.
Best Regards,
Jack
I found a petition to Apple regarding the iPod Touch's January Software Update. Here is the link:
http://www.petitiononline.com/freeappi/petition.html
As of writing this it has over 6900 signatures.
While I'm on the subject, I thought I would put in my two cents. I think these feature updates should be included while you're under warranty. For those wishing extended enhanced feature software support past a year, Apple could include feature updates within their Apple Care program.
Best Regards,
Jack
Okay, I'll take a stab at that...
Oh, I don't know...because Apple's decision is legal and pirating software is not?
M
Mr.damien
Guest
Ok, so why selling all the apps in one package ?
Why should I pay 4$ for each crap application like "Stock exchange" or "Notes" that do not even worth their price.