Apple Announces New MacBook Air With M4 and 'Sky Blue' Color Option

[jlc1978]

In short, for products that develop a fault within an unreasonable length of time (a small claims court would make a call on that if it came to it by considering the price and reasonable expectations) it must be repaired or replaced for free.

From what I can see it’s more complicated. The statutory limit is 6 years, and after 6 months the burden is on the consumer to prove the defect existed at time of purchase. Even if the seller agrees they can deduct from any refund a reasonable amount based on age and use.

 

[0049190]

UK Consumer protection laws are quite powerful, but most consumers don't know them. In short, for products that develop a fault within an unreasonable length of time (a small claims court would make a call on that if it came to it by considering the price and reasonable expectations) it must be repaired or replaced for free. This trumps the warranty. So very likely, a £1,000 laptop that stops working within 3-4 years for example through no fault of the user would fall under this. UK retailers are fully aware of this, so will quickly buckle if you show you know what you are talking about.

I’ve never heard of anyone actually using this against Apple to get an older device repaired or replaced. I would be interested to hear from anyone who has successfully done this.

 

[PaladinGuy]

Seems like if anyone is considering upgrading from the base specs they might as well go with the base Pro which comes with the first tier upgrades plus more ports.

That’s always the goal. They’re always looking for small incremental pricing differences that will push people to go to the next expensive tier.

 

[F27]

I’ve never heard of anyone actually using this against Apple to get an older device repaired or replaced. I would be interested to hear from anyone who has successfully done this.

It’s almost impossible and I don’t think anyone ever has because although it’s “the law” you have to spend thousands getting experts (to prove the fault was by design or defect) and lawyers to build a case and who realistically is going to do that. It cannot be done in small claims court because Apple will take you to proper court!

 

[Allen_Wentz]

How have you got them specced? At 16/512, it’s $400 difference for the 13”. But maybe you’re talking about the 15”?

I’m sympathetic to the argument that $200 is not that much difference for a computer you’re probably keeping at least 3-5 years, but at the same time, why spend money that won’t change your experience at all?

Honestly, it sounds like either would be totally fine for you, so probably no wrong choice here.

How can you with a straight face say "won’t change your experience at all" when the MBPs have better, brighter displays; better speakers; and more ports. All things that constantly "change your experience."

Note that I do consider the MBA a very good - even excellent - lower end computer at its price point. But it gets old reading folks claim the MBPs "won’t change your experience at all."

Yes there are a few folks using their laptops in clamshell mode with external display and speakers and no need for more ports for whom the MBPs "won’t change your experience at all." However that small segment of users does not justify the generic statement.

 

[Apple_Robert]

I just watched Brian Tong's video with the new M4 and the lighting makes Sky Blue look very silver. Maybe it is one of those colors where the hue changes a good bit depending on angle and the room lighting. I hope the blue is more pronounced instead of very, very, subtle color as is the case with the blue in the Midnight Blue option.

 

[Apple_Robert]

How can you with a straight face say "won’t change your experience at all" when the MBPs have better, brighter displays; better speakers; and more ports. All things that constantly "change your experience."

Note that I do consider the MBA a very good - even excellent - lower end computer at its price point. But it gets old reading folks claim the MBPs "won’t change your experience at all."

If the person doesn't care about or doesn't noticed the difference with Promotion or the depth of color in general day to day web surfing, reading emails, and watching YouTube videos, using the MBP won't be a meaningful user experience for said person as it would someone else who notices such or cares much more about tech specs versus actual use.

The person you responded to makes sense. Your are biased in your reading and with your retort because you don't want to accept someone else's personal use experience being different than what you may notice or find acceptable. Your frustration is self-induced.

 

[Otwer22]

If the person doesn't care about or doesn't noticed the difference with Promotion or the depth of color in general day to day web surfing, reading emails, and watching YouTube videos, using the MBP won't be a meaningful user experience for said person as it would someone else who notices such or cares much more about tech specs versus actual use.

The person you responded to makes sense. Your are biased in your reading and with your retort because you don't want to accept someone else's personal use experience being different than what you may notice or find acceptable. Your frustration is self-induced.

A lot of users think of and use computers with idea they are an appliance. That is most likely the majority of people that use computers. I work around a lot of people that need to know how to use them , and that is how most all of them view computers. It’s geeks that post in forums like this that are passionate about computers that care about this stuff. While I am passionate I’m not to the point of being and elitist on all aspects associated with what makes a good machine. I take into account cost, resale, need, practicality, etc…

 

[Apple_Robert]

A lot of users think of and use computers with idea they are an appliance. That is most likely the majority of people that use computers. I work around a lot of people that need to know how to use them , and that is how most all of them view computers as.

For the most part, I, too, think of my Apple toys as expensive appliances with very useful interface and integration.

You bring up a valid point. I think your point encompasses the majority of users outside of MR. On MR, Macs are too often seen and embraced as works of art instead of tools. And this echo chamber forum often makes said mentality worse with people obsessing over color, battery percentage, and tech specs, while the average user is free from such drivel and can appreciate the tool used in the proper balance of work or personal life.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

Also love how the poster claims something subjective like no noise is not a benefit. If I say I like no fans running, then I like no fans running, and it is a benefit to me, no matter what they say. And lots of reports online of m4 pro fans running more aggressively than previous generations so that poster must have gotten the one silent m4 pro.

That poster [me] has an M2 MBP Max. Perhaps the reason the fans essentially never spin is because of the impact of having enough RAM [96 GB] to run everything optimally; never swap, etc. The only times I have had the fans spin was on hot days with particularly aggressive images work.

I do not denigrate the fact that some folks like no fans running. What I denigrate is the argument that having fans is an argument against the superior MBPs, because my MBP runs essentially fanless out of the box; and if I wanted to further curtail fan operation [I do not] I could do so using software.

 

[whsbuss]

I just watched Brian Tong's video with the new M4 and the lighting makes Sky Blue look very silver. Maybe it is one of those colors where the hue changes a good bit depending on angle and the room lighting. I hope the blue is more pronounced instead of very, very, subtle color as is the case with the blue in the Midnight Blue option.

I saw that video as well. My local Bestbuy said they expect the new Airs to be in the store next Wednesday. They are closer than the Apple Store so I plan to stop by and see the blue in person.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

That’s always the goal. They’re always looking for small incremental pricing differences that will push people to go to the next expensive tier.

That is just good product tier placement. Not some evil practice by Apple. We all choose the tier we find best for each of us.

 

[Otwer22]

That poster [me] has an M2 MBP Max. Perhaps the reason the fans essentially never spin is because of the impact of having enough RAM [96 GB] to run everything optimally; never swap, etc. The only times I have had the fans spin was on hot days with particularly aggressive images work.

I do not denigrate the fact that some folks like no fans running. What I denigrate is the argument that having fans is an argument against the superior MBPs, because my MBP runs essentially fanless out of the box; and if I wanted to further curtail fan operation [I do not] I could do so using software.

I posted in either this or another thread that I have a MBP M4 16” and can get my fans to spin fairly easily. I also understand that on a MBA it will throttle a bit. But these machines still perform very well even throttled. I’m not getting a MBA for the fanless, I need portability and light weight.

 

[0049190]

It’s almost impossible and I don’t think anyone ever has because although it’s “the law” you have to spend thousands getting experts (to prove the fault was by design or defect) and lawyers to build a case and who realistically is going to do that. It cannot be done in small claims court because Apple will take you to proper court!

It can be settled in the Small Claims Court. The defendant has no recourse to a higher court unless they counter sue.

 

[SkweeBop]

Had it timed out better, I gotta say I'd have gotten a blue Air...

 

[CausticSoda]

From what I can see it’s more complicated. The statutory limit is 6 years, and after 6 months the burden is on the consumer to prove the defect existed at time of purchase. Even if the seller agrees they can deduct from any refund a reasonable amount based on age and use.

I'm not sure the second sentence is strictly true, but I am no expert. I picked it up from a consumer rights podcast. The act is doubtless very long and complicated, but the general message seemed to be that the warranty period is not the end of the seller's responsibility. And the UK Apple website (only) does acknowledge that.

 

[CausticSoda]

I’ve never heard of anyone actually using this against Apple to get an older device repaired or replaced. I would be interested to hear from anyone who has successfully done this.

Me neither. I would be interested too. The UK Apple website does clearly state that statuary rights are not affected by the warranty, which is a recognition of rights above and beyond the 1 year warranty period. Perhaps MacRumors could investigate and do an article on this stuff?

 

[FlyingTexan]

Its the chip swap we all knew it would be ... plus a Center Stage camera

And the continuation of horrendous component upgrade price gouging

View attachment 2488580

Everyone complains about the component upgrade costs. 1) You don't need memory on a mac like you do windows, what are people using an air for that needs more than 16GB? 2) Go price a similarly specced Thinkpad x1 and get back to me.

 

[huge_apple_fangirl]

Just curious : why haven't you upgraded to M3 last year?

Waiting for M4. M4 chip was released not long after M3 MBA. Plus my Intel MBA has only developed an issue where the fan constantly goes off in the past few months.

 

[jlc1978]

I'm not sure the second sentence is strictly true, but I am no expert. I picked it up from a consumer rights podcast. The act is doubtless very long and complicated, but the general message seemed to be that the warranty period is not the end of the seller's responsibility. And the UK Apple website (only) does acknowledge that.

From Apple’s website on UK statutory rights:

Any defect or non-conformity of goods with the contract which becomes apparent within 6 months of delivery are presumed to have existed at the time of delivery. After the expiry of this 6-month period, the burden to prove that the defect or non-conformity of goods with the contract existed on delivery generally shifts to the consumer.
and
If the product does not conform with the contract after one repair or replacement a consumer is also entitled to exercise a final right of rejection and withdraw from the contract by returning the goods in exchange for a refund. In these circumstances, Apple may deduct a reasonable sum in connection with the period of use that the consumer had of the goods.

As you pointed out, it’s unsure how this would play out in reality; especially if the device was bought from a smaller 3rd party seller. For example what is a “reasonable sum?” Number of months in use divided by 72 (60 in Scotland?) What does “generally shift” mean in a court? I would think a common defect such as failing keyboards would still be on the seller, but who knows what a court might decide.

Not trying to be argumentative, just pointing out it is more complicated than bring it back and get your money back.

 

[CausticSoda]

From Apple’s website on UK statutory rights:

Any defect or non-conformity of goods with the contract which becomes apparent within 6 months of delivery are presumed to have existed at the time of delivery. After the expiry of this 6-month period, the burden to prove that the defect or non-conformity of goods with the contract existed on delivery generally shifts to the consumer.
and
If the product does not conform with the contract after one repair or replacement a consumer is also entitled to exercise a final right of rejection and withdraw from the contract by returning the goods in exchange for a refund. In these circumstances, Apple may deduct a reasonable sum in connection with the period of use that the consumer had of the goods.

As you pointed out, it’s unsure how this would play out in reality; especially if the device was bought from a smaller 3rd party seller. For example what is a “reasonable sum?” Number of months in use divided by 72 (60 in Scotland?) What does “generally shift” mean in a court? I would think a common defect such as failing keyboards would still be on the seller, but who knows what a court might decide.

Not trying to be argumentative, just pointing out it is more complicated than bring it back and get your money back.

Sure, I realise it's not that simple and it's all in the hands ultimately of a small claims court if buyer and seller do not agree. I imagine (purely a guess) that if the screen of your £3000K MacBook simply does not come on after 2 years of use and there is no visible sign of damage or misuse, I would hope the ruling would be that the device has not lasted a reasonable amount of time and the screen must be replaced at no cost to the consumer. I hope so, anyway...

"After the expiry of this 6-month period, the burden to prove that the defect or non-conformity of goods with the contract existed on delivery generally shifts to the consumer." This bit may not be as demanding as it sounds, perhaps just saying most Apple MacBook screens last 6 years+ (or whatever) so the fact this one has not shows there must have been a manufacturing fault. Of course Apple will make it sound as difficult as possible to dissuade people. I think a court would say as there is no sign of damage or misuse it was clearly provided with a fault. (Whereas if it was a £300 cheap plastic laptop, they would probably say 2 years is about right for a major part then to fail).

What is definitely the case though is that most retailers just say, "tough luck, out of warranty" and few consumers know they do have rights beyond the warranty, and just shrug and pay for repairs without any challenge. I didn't know until I heard the podcast. It would be good to hear of any real life examples!

 

[RigSatMe]

Still old screen 500 nits, 2 ports...

 

[Galas]

My 50 Cents beef….
🙄🙄
I love Space Grey…cry me a river emoji….and 32GB is AMAZING (for longevity and tabs galore).

I’m torn between a 15” MacBook Air and 14” MacBook Pro. But you can’t get base model Pro with 32. You have to go 24 (arguably enough, but why offer 32 on the Air anyways then??¿¿ OR 64 which just makes it INSANELY expensive. So…cry baby emoji I guess.

You actually can get 32 with the base pro.

 

[Astuces iOS]

Waiting for M4. M4 chip was released not long after M3 MBA. Plus my Intel MBA has only developed an issue where the fan constantly goes off in the past few months.

Oh ok I understand. Thanks.

 

[jlc1978]

What is definitely the case though is that most retailers just say, "tough luck, out of warranty" and few consumers know they do have rights beyond the warranty, and just shrug and pay for repairs without any challenge.

I suspect that is the case as well. Even if they do, the time and effort to prove it was an existing defect is likely to be prohibitive; plus your machine is out of service until it gets resolved. All of which point to just getting it repaired of buying a new one is the path of least resistance.

In your screen case, I would hope a court would rule it was an existing defect, but how do you prove it unless you have some engineering analysis to prove it? A seller could counter with “I’ve sold x of the same vintage an this was the only reported failure of this kind.” I could see a court deciding either way.

I didn't know until I heard the podcast. It would be good to hear of any real life examples!

That would be interesting.