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"In the beginning..."

Those complaining about the cost of the base Mac Pro and the lack of a cheaper tower should consider that Apple's hardware line since the G3 days has been pretty much the same as it is now: A "consumer-level" machine with no internal expandability (the iMac) and a "pro-level" machine with internal expandability (the Power Mac[intosh] / Mac Pro).*

Those two lines have served Apple well with their existing constituency while keeping costs down and profits high. Since Apple's sales volumes are admittedly laughable compared to the major Windows PC retailers, their per-unit costs are much higher. As such, Apple needs to be careful with how many models they release, lest they cannibalize themselves and hurt the RoI on each model.

A Core2 Extreme minitower with an nVidia 9xxx-series GPU would be popular with the gamers, to be sure. And likely it would appeal to many professionals now using Mac Pros. But Apple needs to sell a certain amount of iMacs and Mac Pros to keep the lines profitable. By definition, a Mac Tower is going to take sales away from both the iMac and Power Mac lines, making both of those lines less profitable for Apple**. And because people will still buy both iMacs and Mac Pros instead of Mac Towers, it's going to make the Mac Tower less profitable, as well. It becomes a cycle of attrition - all contained within Apple's product line.


* - With the PowerPC G4 Apple added the Mac Mini, but I view it more as a way for folks with PCs to test the waters of the Mac at a lower price-point. Folks with Power Mac(intoshes) or Mac Pros are not likely to purchase it, nor are iMac users likely to buy it and a Cinema Display vs. a new iMac.

** - And yes, there are Windows PC users who would not buy an iMac or a Mac Mini and cannot afford the Mac Pro. However, they're not customers now so it's a moot point to Apple since they are not costing Apple existing iMac or Mac Pro sales, which Apple users offered a Mac Tower would.
 
OK - I haven't read all 21 pages preceding, but I'm going to ask this anyway:

Am I missing something, or did Apple get rid of the Bluetooth option on the Mac Pro?

On an unrelated note, though: ABOUT FREAKING TIME for the XServe update, I'll finally be ordering one for my organization this week.
 
OK - I haven't read all 19 pages preceding, but I'm going to ask this anyway:

Am I missing something, or did Apple get rid of the Bluetooth option on the Mac Pro?

On an unrelated note, though: ABOUT FREAKING TIME for the XServe update, I'll finally be ordering one for my organization this week.

bluetooth is standard
 
new RAM

CanadaRAM is already offering RAM for new MAC Pros! It's quite a bit cheaper than Apple's but much more expensive than old RAM was. Two 1 GB sticks go for 199$ and two 2GB sticks for 453$. I hope (and expect) that RAM prices will come down quickly.
 
OK - I haven't read all 21 pages preceding, but I'm going to ask this anyway:

Am I missing something, or did Apple get rid of the Bluetooth option on the Mac Pro?

On an unrelated note, though: ABOUT FREAKING TIME for the XServe update, I'll finally be ordering one for my organization this week.


Bluetooth is now standard

Communications

Two independent 10/100/1000BASE-T Ethernet (RJ-45) interfaces with support for jumbo frames
Bluetooth 2.0 + Enhanced Data Rate (EDR) up to 3Mb/s
Optional 802.11n AirPort Extreme wireless networking2
Optional external Apple USB Modem (RJ-11)
 
Are these new CPUS able to be put in old Mac Pros?

Are they pin compatible? Just curios...I have a Quad 3.0 GHZ Mac Pro and wanna know if I can just drop in a CPU and memory and upgrade in the future....
 
And 9to5 have officially lost the status of flawlessness they had, having predicted these updates to come at MacWorld.

Actually, they did okay. They pointed out that it might very well not get time at MacWorld, but that it made no sense for them not to be released by then. They did better than any other site I can think of.
 
[already posted this somewhere else on the forums but i think it fits here also:]

heres my speculation.. or what i would like apple to do...

Cinema Displays:
low end: 20"
mid range: 24"
high end: 30"
(new design, built in iSight)

Desktop:
low end: Mac Mini
mid range: New Mac (user upgradeable video card, hard drive and memory)
high end: Mac Pro

Laptop:
low end: 13" MacBook
mid range: 15" MacBook Pro
high end: 17" MacBook Pro
(aluminum casing, new style keyboard, same slim new look for all models, external optical drive for 13")

All-in-One:
low end: iMac 20"
mid range: iMac 24"
hig end: iMac 30"

iPod:
low end: iPod Shuffle
mid range: iPod Nano
high end: iPod Classic

Touch:
low end: iPod Touch
mid range: iPhone
high end: MacBook Touch

so in summary for macworld we will get: cinema displays re-design, new midrange upgradeable apple desktop, re-design for whole laptop line, new iMac 30" model, and a new "touch interface" ultraportable...

this will make it much easier for people to decide which new mac to get and will give the whole product line up the same low/mid/high configurations...

maybe the upgradable mid range desktop and the 30" iMac will not happen, but i think the rest is a nice summary of all the speculations and rumors going around...

just my thoughts... :cool:
 
You're confusing the PC config earlier in the thread.

The new MacPro still uses FB-DIMM memory.

Ah, I see. That sucks.

Wow look at all the responses to my mistake! You guy's are nasty in these new hardware threads. We geeks are very territorial. :rolleyes:;)
 
Are they pin compatible? Just curios...I have a Quad 3.0 GHZ Mac Pro and wanna know if I can just drop in a CPU and memory and upgrade in the future....

Well the CPU slots on my HP x8400 look like the slots on my HP x6400, so they might be. However, you'd likely need a firmware update to use them (to full-effect). Also, the older Mac Pro system board won't likely support the faster FSB speeds, so you won't get as much performance.
 
Essentially, a smart consumer would configure with 8-Core 3.2GHz then purchase ALL other options individually? How much could one save?

EDIT: I started with the RAM and obtained CRUCIAL 2GB sticks for $50/each - comes with 2GB - add 3 x 2GB = $1500 APPLE .... $150 ME
EDIT2: 2ND Drive - 500GB Hitachi 7200RPM 500GB = $250 APPLE .... $151 ME
EDIT3: GeForce 8800GT 512MB = $400 APPLE ... $260 ME

Without going further obviously the most obvious choice is the RAM with the others being negligible (you would have to sell the factory graphics card :\ )
 
Bluetooth is now standard

Communications

Two independent 10/100/1000BASE-T Ethernet (RJ-45) interfaces with support for jumbo frames
Bluetooth 2.0 + Enhanced Data Rate (EDR) up to 3Mb/s
Optional 802.11n AirPort Extreme wireless networking2
Optional external Apple USB Modem (RJ-11)
Gracias - I was missing something.

Seems really buried in the specs, I'd think that if they were going to make BT standard, Apple would make a bigger deal of it (considering how many folks love to BT sync their phones and such). But even having used Macs since System 6, there's many things about Apple that still elude me.
 
The systemboards are the same. So you will have two CPU slots, with the empty one covered in a plastic plate. You remove that plate when installing the second CPU.

Just got confirmation from the Apple Store online chat. It appears they weren't expecting this question (although I'm kind of surprised - that seems like a pretty key question for the single-cpu build option). If the answer is to be believed, the second CPU is not an upgradeable option, and the two-CPU system must be ordered at the start.

ME: Hi - Question about the new Mac Pros, in particular the build option of a single-cpu machine. Will it have the same motherboard as a two-cpu machine, making it upgradable in the future? Thanks, Dave

AS: That is a great question.

AS: I am really sorry for keeping you waiting, I'll be just another moment.

AS: Just one more moment

AS: It does have 2 processors, what will you be wanting to upgrade in the future?

ME: The standard configuration is two processors, but there is an option to subtract $500 and order a single-processor system. The question is, if I order the single processor system, will it still come shipped with a two-socket motherboard, with one of the sockets empty. The future upgrade would be adding a second processor at a point in the future.

AS: Just one more moment

AS: It is not upgradeable at a later date. You would need to order the 2 processor set up at the time of purchase.
 
Apple announcing this today (before the Keynote) pretty much confirms for me that something huge is coming. I doubt it will be a tablet, but something's coming!

Don't get too excited, it's just Movie rentals and more iPhone stuff.
 
Gamers, please, shut up. You are lame. Wow you can run Quake 4 at 300 fps? Nobody cares. The human brain can't distinguish frame rates that high anyway. Wasted power. 60 fps is fluid. Most DVD's are in the 30-fps area. I really hope the person what whined about the 1.5 GB video card was being sarcastic, because that is an incredible card.

You are now officially my favorite person on MacRumors. :D
 
Those complaining about the cost of the base Mac Pro and the lack of a cheaper tower should consider that Apple's hardware line since the G3 days has been pretty much the same as it is now: A "consumer-level" machine with no internal expandability (the iMac) and a "pro-level" machine with internal expandability (the Power Mac[intosh] / Mac Pro).*

[snip]

well because "it always have been that way it should stay this way" .... so much for "think different" of the old times eh ;)

that said i currently own a mac mini (for a switcher a perfect machine) but for my next PC it simply looks like a disaster with the current apple line up for me
new mac mini: i want more computer power (especially grfx) and more espendability
new imac: AIO therefor out of question for my usage
powermac: awesome machine not only in power but also price and power usage

sure it would be better to have sales cannibalized by another apple product than by a non-apple product (that "it will cannibalize sales" argument has been brought up against a cheaper ipod mini/shuffle/mac mini as well)

edit: more on topic comment:
on the memory .. i'm not sure but with some PC memories it is that way if you mix for example 266mhz and 333mhz memory together then the faster would simply run at the lower speed of 266 (at least it was this way back in the day) so for thos with huge amounts of 667mhz memory there might be still that options but i haven't tried with newer memory ...
anybody knows if that works still the same ?
 
3. The standard graphics suck for a pro model.

Not for actual pros. It's quite capable for video editing and photoshop work. 3D work requires a better card, which is available.

Gaming is not a pro application.
 
How many people using a MAC PRO for professional work actually use a APPLE flat screen?
Not Many because they are Overpriced and SUCK when it comes to color and color management!
Most professionals look to Eizo, Lacie & NEC when quality and color are issues with imaging and graphics.

True, those are the cream of the crop, but the Apple displays are quite good. Certainly much better than the cheapo big box store models from LG, Viewsonic, etc. where white turns to yellow when you move your head even a few degrees to the side.

The Apple displays are worth their price.
 
As well you should.

I'm terribly disappointed that Apple didn't have the gamer in mind when they upgraded their pro tower. Silly Apple. And the graphics card upgrades are pathetic. 1.5GB on a card? Weak.

Well first of all, games only start making use of all those cores so you'd be better off with a high speed dual core right now. The "Pro" in the name also kinda clashes with "gamer". Lots of those Mac Pros will find a home in a cluster with no screen attached anyway. Also, lots of audio people buy them because of the raw CPU power and fast RAM for doing audio editing which, mind you, doesn't really stress the video card too much. Neither does photoshop, everything is rendered by the processors. If you are a movie editor , 3d artist or doing some serious research, you got some nice graphic cards to choose from, 1.5GB of video doesn't sound so bad, does it?

If you're a gamer get a Dell (they got some nice stuff for great prices) or build your own. Games don't really run on OSX so you'd have to install some esoteric Windows that will run poorly on those machines. If you want to use your Mac for gaming, get a Macbook pro or iMac. The Mac Pro just isn't for you, you can get a Dell gaming PC, then another better one in 18 months for the same price.

On a side note, those xServes are pretty neat. Even the price is competitive right now.
 
Perhaps the best news is the abandonment of the FB-DIMMM. Apple seems to have had little choice, but it's welcome all the same.

Perhaps the switch to the cheaper DDR2 memory will help offset the price increase a little.

as written on http://www.apple.com/macpro/specs.html

Memory

* 800MHz DDR2 ECC fully buffered DIMM (FB-DIMM) memory
* Eight FB-DIMM slots on two memory riser cards (four slots per card) supporting up to 32GB of main memory
* 256-bit-wide memory architecture

so still fb-dimm, and thats why 32gigs are well over 9 grand.
 
I used the Store chat just now and they told me that while the 8800GT 2.0

here is a breif summary

i, my name is Wanda. Welcome to Apple!
#

Wanda: Good afternoon.
#

You: can the 8800GT be purchased for use with the previous Mac Pros? If so how much is it to buy the 8800 on its own
#

Wanda: I'm happy to assist you. The 8800GT works in the PCI Express 2.0 slot. The previous generation Mac Pros have the PCI 1.0 slot, so it will not work in that slot.
#

You: the 2.0 is not backwards compatible?
#

Wanda: 2.0 is backwards compatible, but 1.0 is not frontwards compatible. The prevoius Mac Pro has the 1.0 slot

Really? really? crap... I was looking forward to upgrading my MP. I do like the new configurations however. Oh well will just have to use the Radeon still.
 
So if that's where the prices should be, please point us to an equivalent PC that's $500 less for the same features. I'm looking forward to your response.

Someone already posted a Dell comparison, and it was THOUSANDS more.



People keep whining that the design didn't change, but what's wrong with the current design? Change for no good reason seems like a waste of time and money. What about the current design needs fixing?

Listen here Francis.... I'm not looking at "equivalent PC's.... I'm looking at the fact that Apple has just raised the price point of the Mac Pro by an amount that I personally do not feel is justifiable.

Get off my back about the design alright? You say that "Change for no good reason is a waste..." huh??? Well how about those iMacs then? The iMacs did not need a change. They have changed about 4 times since the PowerMac G5 came out. The only external differences between the original PMG5 and the MP are the addition of a second optical bay and rearranged ports on the front/back.

The design is OLD and TIRED.
 
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