Apple Becomes Trillion Dollar Company Again

[I7guy]

Rumors or not I think people have a right to be disappointed when for the past few years all we’ve seen since the X are camera improvements and not much else.

Agreed. And people have a right to like the overall improvements and innovation that are present in this phone. It depends if one wants to be disappointed for what’s not there or happy for what’s there. Glass half full or half empty syndrome. And that is life and the way she goes.

 

[Abazigal]

Rumors or not I think people have a right to be disappointed when for the past few years all we’ve seen since the X are camera improvements and not much else.

It is most certainly their right. That I cannot deny.

That said, who are "these people", and just how many of them are there? Time and time again, we see a few disgruntled posters make their displeasure known online, while blowing up the whole matter and making the whole thing seem like a huge deal. Then Apple announces their quarterly earnings and we see the disparity between reality and what the critics would have us believe was their reality. And when this happens, you really have to wonder just who really is out of touch with reality - Apple, or their detractors?

Apple can't please everyone. That doesn't mean that Apple isn't pleasing anyone.

 

[Donnation]

It is most certainly their right. That I cannot deny.

That said, who are "these people", and just how many of them are there? Time and time again, we see a few disgruntled posters make their displeasure known online, while blowing up the whole matter and making the whole thing seem like a huge deal. Then Apple announces their quarterly earnings and we see the disparity between reality and what the critics would have us believe was their reality. And when this happens, you really have to wonder just who really is out of touch with reality - Apple, or their detractors?

Apple can't please everyone. That doesn't mean that Apple isn't pleasing anyone.

Again for the last time, no one is saying that everyone hates this phone. Some people like it, great. I’m not nor is anyone else stating that every single person hates the iPhone 11 Pro.

And if you don’t trust people on here just look on YouTube at established tech bloggers who aren’t biased, like Marques Brownlee. He offers that same sentiment of disappointment as do other bloggers.

There are always going to be those people who are against one brand or another; but the narrative of “the only people who are disappointed in this years phone are haters or paid to be negative” is tired and is ridiculous.

 

[Donnation]

Agreed. And people have a right to like the overall improvements and innovation that are present in this phone. It depends if one wants to be disappointed for what’s not there or happy for what’s there. Glass half full or half empty syndrome. And that is life and the way she goes.

It has nothing to do with glass is half empty or not.. People are allowed to be disappointed over something and still be a positive person. I'm disappointed we don't have world peace. According to your logic I'm a glass is half empty guy because I'm not seeing the positive in that. There is nothing wrong with being disappointed in something Apple releases. Doesn't mean I'm a paid shill or that I hate the company or want to see them fail.

And we are talking about a freaking phone, that's all. Anyone overly happy over the release of a phone has problems as is someone who thinks the sky is falling because they were disappointed in it. The problem in here as I see it is there are a select few people who absolutely refuse to let anyone say anything negative about Apple. These are are the same people who would say their MacBook Pro keyboards are fine and its user error when they fail. Apple is a company that sells us stuff. If I don't like something they are selling or think they could have done better then I'm going to voice that. If some people can't handle that its not my problem.

 

[1bcoolrob]

What's up with all those low IQ comments against Apple

 

[I7guy]

It has nothing to do with glass is half empty or not.. People are allowed to be disappointed over something and still be a positive person. I'm disappointed we don't have world peace. According to your logic I'm a glass is half empty guy because I'm not seeing the positive in that. There is nothing wrong with being disappointed in something Apple releases. Doesn't mean I'm a paid shill or that I hate the company or want to see them fail.

And we are talking about a freaking phone, that's all. Anyone overly happy over the release of a phone has problems as is someone who thinks the sky is falling because they were disappointed in it. The problem in here as I see it is there are a select few people who absolutely refuse to let anyone say anything negative about Apple. These are are the same people who would say their MacBook Pro keyboards are fine and its user error when they fail. Apple is a company that sells us stuff. If I don't like something they are selling or think they could have done better then I'm going to voice that. If some people can't handle that its not my problem.

Conversation like this seems apt in this thread.

However, just as you claim you are “allowed” to have a certain viewpoint on an Apple product, so am I and others. If others can’t handle my viewpoint as you say it’s not my problem.

Some are bemoaning what functionality wasn’t included in the iPhone 11 while I’m applauding the improvements Apple did include. That doesn’t mean I’m a shill either.

“And we’re talking about a freakin’ phone”, yep...that’s what it is.

 

[Donnation]

Conversation like this seems apt in this thread.

However, just as you claim you are “allowed” to have a certain viewpoint on an Apple product, so am I and others. If others can’t handle my viewpoint as you say it’s not my problem.

Some are bemoaning what functionality wasn’t included in the iPhone 11 while I’m applauding the improvements Apple did include. That doesn’t mean I’m a shill either.

“And we’re talking about a freakin’ phone”, yep...that’s what it is.

I have said numerous times that if someone was happy with the Pro then that’s great and I’ve not said a single word to anyone about being happy about it. I’m not coming into threads saying “You paid Apple shills need to stop posting these positive comments.” It goes both ways.

And yes, it’s a phone. Just because someone is disappointed with it doesn’t mean that they hate life and ragging on Apple makes them feel good. Just like if someone likes it I don’t think their entire self worth is build around liking an iPhone.

At the end of the day the only people who seem to have a problem with this are the ones who’ve started this conversation. I’ve not engaged with a single person who’s said anything positive about the phone. But for some reason it’s ok to go after people in here because they might not like Apple’s offering this year. Seems odd.

 

[digthewell]

What's up with all those low IQ comments against Apple

Pretty much the general trend here.

 

[Baymowe335]

A 5.27% yield gives you $52,700 in cash on $1,000,000 worth of AT&T stock. That's actual money you can use or reinvest. Yes, if you trade constantly, then you can sell the Apple stock and reinvest that money as well; otherwise those are just unrealized gains. Obviously the best way to do it is have a combination of growth and mature stocks. But AT&T is still highly underrated in my opinion.

ATT should pay a great dividend if the share price barely moves.

And you’ll pay tax on that dividend income. Don’t forget, Apple pays a dividend too which isn’t even included in the 125% gain in 5 years.

The performance of the 2 stocks is so different, we shouldn’t even compare. 100% of ATT investors over the 5 year period would prefer Apple if they could go back and change their investment.

 

[Abazigal]

Again for the last time, no one is saying that everyone hates this phone. Some people like it, great. I’m not nor is anyone else stating that every single person hates the iPhone 11 Pro.

And if you don’t trust people on here just look on YouTube at established tech bloggers who aren’t biased, like Marques Brownlee. He offers that same sentiment of disappointment as do other bloggers.

There are always going to be those people who are against one brand or another; but the narrative of “the only people who are disappointed in this years phone are haters or paid to be negative” is tired and is ridiculous.

The original context of the discussion was you stating in another thread how you thought the keynote sucked and that Apple's stock price would fall as a result (the implication was that many other people would think the same way, vote with their wallets and result in Apple doing poorly financially).

People like MKHBD or Unboxtherapy do not represent the average consumer. It is their job to always have the latest and greatest smartphone, which is not how most people handle their phones, and this leads to them being incredibly out of touch. Just look at how many criticised the iPhone XR over specs like its low-res display, which turned out to not be an issue with the people actually using them. That's why I say there's this disconnect.

This is what I am responding to. I am not saying one cannot not like the iphone, but that it's a stretch to claim that Apple will not do well because of one's personal feelings towards it. I have mentioned numerous reasons why I feel Apple will do well, from their services being very competitively priced to the iphone 11 being fairly affordable to the Apple Watch 5 spurring a new wave of upgrades amongst series 0-3 owners.

Repeat after me - What the market needs right now isn't innovation, but compromise. I am starting to understand this saying better and better now. Crazy specs and wild new features may earn you a front page article on TheVerge, but that doesn't necessarily translate into actual sales, which when you think about it, is really what matters more.

 

[Donnation]

The original context of the discussion was you stating in another thread how you thought the keynote sucked and that Apple's stock price would fall as a result (the implication was that many other people would think the same way, vote with their wallets and result in Apple doing poorly financially).

People like MKHBD or Unboxtherapy do not represent the average consumer. It is their job to always have the latest and greatest smartphone, which is not how most people handle their phones, and this leads to them being incredibly out of touch. Just look at how many criticised the iPhone XR over specs like its low-res display, which turned out to not be an issue with the people actually using them. That's why I say there's this disconnect.

This is what I am responding to. I am not saying one cannot not like the iphone, but that it's a stretch to claim that Apple will not do well because of one's personal feelings towards it. I have mentioned numerous reasons why I feel Apple will do well, from their services being very competitively priced to the iphone 11 being fairly affordable to the Apple Watch 5 spurring a new wave of upgrades amongst series 0-3 owners.

Repeat after me - What the market needs right now isn't innovation, but compromise. I am starting to understand this saying better and better now. Crazy specs and wild new features may earn you a front page article on TheVerge, but that doesn't necessarily translate into actual sales, which when you think about it, is really what matters more.

Let’s just agree to disagree.

 

[Abazigal]

Let’s just agree to disagree.

Yeah, let’s.

 

[I7guy]

I have said numerous times that if someone was happy with the Pro then that’s great and I’ve not said a single word to anyone about being happy about it. I’m not coming into threads saying “You paid Apple shills need to stop posting these positive comments.” It goes both ways.

And yes, it’s a phone. Just because someone is disappointed with it doesn’t mean that they hate life and ragging on Apple makes them feel good. Just like if someone likes it I don’t think their entire self worth is build around liking an iPhone.

At the end of the day the only people who seem to have a problem with this are the ones who’ve started this conversation. I’ve not engaged with a single person who’s said anything positive about the phone. But for some reason it’s ok to go after people in here because they might not like Apple’s offering this year. Seems odd.

Basically this is the modus operandi in an online Internet forum. Each of us posting our views and as such the back and forth in the various threads ensues.

As far as the iPhone 11, I haven’t taken an anecdotal poll of my friends, coworkers, family to determine their assessment of the iPhone 11.

But as I said this appears to be standard commentary for the last many years.

 

[johnnygee]

So are you going to check daily informing us whether or not it falls below or above the market cap?

Nah, you can google AAPL yourself and watch the stock rise.

 

[DreamyLucid]

The share price rallied amongst the sea of red showed that investors are approving of the product line up.
[doublepost=1568305022][/doublepost]

So are you going to check daily informing us whether or not it falls below or above the market cap?

The Stocks app is useful too. I'm sure AAPL is default in the watchlist.

 

[Stephen.R]

Sweet merciful crap. Is this debate still going on? I think I regret even mentioning it now. I opted to ignore a few posters, because the endless back and forth is never going to stop otherwise.

@Abazigal you're on the money - as I said multiple times, if you're (the prospective buyer) holding last years phone and saying "hey this new one is not that different" I would suggest that says more about your buying habits than it does about how good or bad the latest model is.

 

[Baymowe335]

Rumors or not I think people have a right to be disappointed when for the past few years all we’ve seen since the X are camera improvements and not much else.

There was a lot more to the X than camera improvements. You may like it or not, but FaceID changed the industry as did the no home button, notch, overall form factor, and gestured OS.
[doublepost=1568306919][/doublepost]

Again for the last time, no one is saying that everyone hates this phone. Some people like it, great. I’m not nor is anyone else stating that every single person hates the iPhone 11 Pro.

And if you don’t trust people on here just look on YouTube at established tech bloggers who aren’t biased, like Marques Brownlee. He offers that same sentiment of disappointment as do other bloggers.

There are always going to be those people who are against one brand or another; but the narrative of “the only people who are disappointed in this years phone are haters or paid to be negative” is tired and is ridiculous.

Those guys don’t represent iPhone users or users in general. They also have a channel they need to promote, so I disagree that there is no bias.

Consumers love their iPhones...that we can see in the data. Slumping iPhone sales doesn’t mean people stopped loving iPhones. The whole industry slowed and people are simply keeping a phone they are happy with longer, not switching to Android because it has more RAM.

The installed base continues to grow and thus we see a move to services to monetize that base further. Brilliant execution from Apple.

 

[I7guy]

The sad part is that the small boost is strictly on the back of $699 entry price for iPhone 11, and $599 for iPhone XR.

The Pro barely matters, because the iPhone market can't afford the flagship iPhone anymore. What a shame. The reason iPhone gained such traction is because for years Apple put out their absolute best effort in 1 phone, at a reasonable price, that was within reach of most of the market. Apple abandoned that entire strategy in favor of price gouging.

Don’t think that’s the definition of price gouging.

 

[Donnation]

There was a lot more to the X than camera improvements. You may like it or not, but FaceID changed the industry as did the no home button, notch, overall form factor, and gestured OS.
[doublepost=1568306919][/doublepost]
Those guys don’t represent iPhone users or users in general. They also have a channel they need to promote, so I disagree that there is no bias.

Consumers love their iPhones...that we can see in the data. Slumping iPhone sales doesn’t mean people stopped loving iPhones. The whole industry slowed and people are simply keeping a phone they are happy with longer, not switching to Android because it has more RAM.

The installed base continues to grow and thus we see a move to services to monetize that base further. Brilliant execution from Apple.

I said since the X all we've really had are camera improvements. Then XS now 11. There is no reason to think that the next phone won't be the 11S.

If you watch Marques, he is generally very unbiased. He trashes Android phones when they are no good and has been very critical of them. So yes there are those out there that do that, but there are also Apple shills (iJustine) who lap up every Apple device and don't dare say anything bad about them. Apple doesn't invite people that constantly go against them (see unbox therapy) and Marques was invited and is not one of those people.

 

[Baymowe335]

I said since the X all we've really had are camera improvements. Then XS now 11. There is no reason to think that the next phone won't be the 11S.

If you watch Marques, he is generally very unbiased. He trashes Android phones when they are no good and has been very critical of them. So yes there are those out there that do that, but there are also Apple shills (iJustine) who lap up every Apple device and don't dare say anything bad about them. Apple doesn't invite people that constantly go against them (see unbox therapy) and Marques was invited and is not one of those people.

Apple skipped iPhone 9 and 7S and iPhone went to X and iPhone 8 after iPhone 7.

They also skipped an S version of the Xr because the added camera makes it more than just a speed upgrade. We are on the third year of the kitchen design, so I’d bet on a redesign next September.

Whatever they do, it will be thoughtfully calculated but I don’t think we have a good sense of iPhone naming conventions. Very random lately.

 

[BuddyTronic]

It really depends on what kind of investor you are, so there is no right answer

AAPL is incredibly volatile, so you can easily lose those paper gains you had made.

The 5% AT&T is a good place to park money temporarily if you were trying to accrue dividends while you strategize on a time to buy.

Many people who don’t do options do both where you park in high yield index funds then pull out when you feel it’s the right time to buy a stock like AAPL. It’s a win win to always be moving real gains around and not hold on paper money aka unrealized gains.

That's what Cramer says - he asks "what kind of investor are you?" Young person, retiree etc etc. I'd say - AAPL is for ALL investors. Who doesn't want the best stock?

I like Cramer - but he puts emphasis on basic stuff. Risk matters - Apple is low risk - even with it's high volatility. It's a very weird stock.

I also think "diversification" is a bit of a farce in general.

Diversification is for people who don't know a good thing when they see it, or it's not their area of interest or expertise.
Warren Buffet says he will tell his wife to by an index fund when he is gone - because she doesn't know anything. Otherwise diversification is for amateurs. Warren Buffet would be done better in the last 20 years if he held ONLY AAPL stock - but he didn't understand the company until recently. so he is forgiven.

With the volatility of Apple in the short term, you might take a hit when you invest - but only for the short term. Long term looks great for AAPL stock. Why try to beat that with a phone company that has done zero for the last 10 years? Seriously - Why?

Would you stick your money into ATT and count your measly 5% dividend through the year? Meanwhile wouldn't you be stressing over whether the stock drops more than 5%? Better than cash? Perhaps. Holding ATT might be better than holding cash - but not by much.

The no brainer investment for a long long time has been AAPL. For people who failed to recognize that Apple was undervalued 5 years ago or 10 years ago or today - is there any way you open your eyes on this matter? Is there really anything to say about ATT stock that you believe is worth sharing in comparison to AAPL? I looked at it, and I scoff at the idea of ATT stock.

Put it this way - when the PE on AAPL was 9 and you failed to recognize that it was way out compared to the rest of it's peers - what do you say now about it? Most people can't discern what is a good thing unfortunately.

We all saw Forest Gump make a fortune on AAPL stock "that fruit company" - but if you did not have an inkling to invest then either, well that's too bad. If you bought AAPL when Forest Gump movie was released, you'd also beat Warren Buffets performance probably - and for righteous reasons.

 

[Donnation]

Apple skipped iPhone 9 and 7S and iPhone went to X and iPhone 8 after iPhone 7.

They also skipped an S version of the Xr because the added camera makes it more than just a speed upgrade. We are on the third year of the kitchen design, so I’d bet on a redesign next September.

Whatever they do, it will be thoughtfully calculated but I don’t think we have a good sense of iPhone naming conventions. Very random lately.

They skipped the 7S in name only as the 8 absolutely was the 7S. And the X was only released and named such because it was the 10th anniversary of the iPhone.

I would hope for a smaller notch, but I think that's about all we'll be seeing next year from a design standpoint.

 

[ilikewhey]

Only going up from here too. Apple self driving cars anyone?

lol project titan, anyone heard any news about them recently? asking for a friend

 

[JMO1]

Yes, but those billions of dollars in R&D money aren’t all going to the next iPhone. In fact, most of that isn’t going to the next iPhone. Several billion of that R&D money is for Apple TV+ content. Likely billions more is for Apple’s pet projects like AR hardware and “autonomous systems.” More still presumably goes toward things like the new Apple Maps, and there are surely other projects that we know nothing about. R&D expenditures are a useful tool for Apple because we never get to know (officially) just how much they’re spending on what projects in R&D.

Besides, what should they be spending iPhone R&D money on? Technology for smartphones has mostly plateaued in terms of major features. We might see better displays, better cameras, or better battery life. We might see the notch reduced in size or removed. We’ll probably see 5G next year, and of course, we’ll continue to see improvements to Apple’s silicon. Other than that, though, the iPhone (as with all other smartphones) is poised to be mostly iteration from here on out; even these things generally don’t take big R&D bucks.

I agree; it’s not going anywhere, especially with that attitude. Innovation never stops, imagine if they thought that with the car, TV, or (Nokia) with the phone. I don’t believe we are close to the end of telecommunication innovation in the form of a handset. Right now it may be stale, but there are definitely areas to be explored.

 

[Baymowe335]

It really depends on what kind of investor you are, so there is no right answer

AAPL is incredibly volatile, so you can easily lose those paper gains you had made.

The 5% AT&T is a good place to park money temporarily if you were trying to accrue dividends while you strategize on a time to buy.

Many people who don’t do options do both where you park in high yield index funds then pull out when you feel it’s the right time to buy a stock like AAPL. It’s a win win to always be moving real gains around and not hold on paper money aka unrealized gains.

It turns out, there is a right answer. AAPL has been a far better investment than ATT.

You're making valid points about investor psychology, but no reasonable investor would say after the last 5 years that they would have rather owned ATT because it consistently paid them that dividend and barely moved. They would have rather taken the ride and been richer for it by owning Apple.

Not every investor can handle that, sure...but trying to time the market is a loser's game anyway. You will lose with a "park your money in ATT to make dividends while I devise which stocks to buy" strategy.

The more you trade, the worse you'll do. Cramer is right about one thing on AAPL...own it, don't trade it.

If you own ANY individual stock, you need to completely understand the company. If the company is fine, you don't sell when it goes down, like AAPL. You buy more, as I've done every time it's dipped.

Apple has NEVER been in any real trouble since they launched the iPhone and probably since they launched the iPod. If you understood AAPL's fundamentals, you should have never, ever sold.

The reason people sell is because they don't understand what they own and they panic.