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Apple Cancels Electric Car Project

UltimaKilo said:
You can google, but to which part? Here's an outdated chart (about 7% higher than this as of 2024)View attachment 2353971

The point remains. Electric is not the future, which is why so many manufacturers continue to invest in hydrogen.

spectra.mhi.com

6 reasons why hydrogen is a fuel of the future | Spectra by MHI

Hydrogen has been used by humans for hundreds of years, for numerous purposes. Here are six reasons why hydrogen is likely to be a vital renewable energy source.
spectra.mhi.com spectra.mhi.com
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The Mitsubishi site has a vested interest. Of course they argue for alternatives.

And again, I clearly said that I favor hydrogen.

spectra.mhi.com

Spectra by Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Group

Spectra explores innovations, trends, and expert insights driving progress in energy, industry, and sustainable technology worldwide.
spectra.mhi.com spectra.mhi.com
 
sledgehammer89 said:
They should start with a road bike first.
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applebikle.jpg
 
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Algr said:
You think batteries haven't improved in the last ten years?
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Today, the Molicel P28A is regarded as the best 18650 cell, if you're making a EV pack from 18650 cells.

In 2014, we could say the Samsung 25R was the best.

Nominal capacity (mAh)
Samsung 25R: 2500
Molicel P28A: 2800

A whopping 12% capacity gain across 10 years. Yay!

P.S. Don't bother Google searching for higher capacity 18650 cells. They won't be suitable for high continuous discharge current. The P28A is the gold standard for 18650.
 
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In my humble opinion: Apple is too slow to be competitive. It could be a viable opportunity when they came with something revolutionary to the market in at least 2022. Now it’s too little too late. Tesla and Apple working together would be a match made in heaven. But the Chinese brands are far more competitive and seems to innovate much faster. I hope I’m wrong.
 
HJM.NL said:
In my humble opinion: Apple is too slow to be competitive. It could be a viable opportunity when they came with something revolutionary to the market in at least 2022. Now it’s too little too late. Tesla and Apple working together would be a match made in heaven. But the Chinese brands are far more competitive and seems to innovate much faster. I hope I’m wrong.
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Despite Musk wanting Apple to buy Tesla back in the day, Apple not buying Tesla was the best thing to happen to Tesla in the long run.
 
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Surf Monkey said:
No. Because contrary to your suggestion, batteries do not become completely disabled in the cold.
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My suggestion?

Why would one suggest another battery to warm a battery in the first place?

Obviously the cold has a strong enough effect that you think you need a whole new battery to charge the battery, no?

Completely disabled? Not what I suggested at all. My comment wants to know where the “viability” of ev cars in the actual real world starts/ends if you have to keep coming with ideas on a forum just to let them charge in freezing weather.
 
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IG88 said:
No safe charging system on the planet is going to allow a lithium cell to charge, if the pack temp is below 32F. Period.
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That is why a lot of those system have a BMS that will heat up the battery pack to temperature that can be charge at. Modern EVs have an active BMS heating/Cooling system. Lets take the case you pull into a place to charge with a cold soak battery. It will first turn on the car's heater from the external power source and start heating the battery pack to get it up to a temp and then as allowed start putting more power into the battery pack which increasing the packs temp which allows it to push in more power into a feed back loop to the temp the car likes.

This is even in places that it drops to -40. It can work but nothing works well at -40.

Basically not as big of a big deal as already solved for. It is called use the BMS to heat up the pack. When driving and the car knows it is going to be a charger it will start pre heating the pack to get it at a temp range to speed up charging.
 
jz0309 said:
As for battery “sourcing” - that world is changing, just as electronics are not only sourced in China alone anymore.

Yes, range drops in the cold and that has put the rollout of EVs to a grinding hole in Norway - no, wait, they’re leading the world in EV adoption.
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At the cost of massive subsidies that funnel funding away from other projects such as public transportation.
 
Forget all of the arguing about the efficacy of EV’s which won’t be solved here, but don’t you really wish that Apple would have released an image of what their car would have looked like?
 
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KPOM said:
At the cost of massive subsidies that funnel funding away from other projects such as public transportation.
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what public transite in the US. Sadly building out EV stuff is easier than getting a public transit set up. Lets just look at the joke of a rail system. Like there is no good reason why we dont have high speed rail in the US.
 
Razorpit said:
Yup, certainly blew up the whole argument with that one. I’m willing to bet there have already been more EV fires than the entire history of the Pinto and original Mustang.
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Our Q4 e-tron catches fire at least a couple of times a week, and I’ve lost count how many 20 grand battery replacements I have had to purchase. We have a bit of a game going in our street where we place bets whose EV is going to catch fire each morning, I’m leading.

Give me a 90 quid to fill diesel with a cam belt, dual mass flywheel change and a clogged DPF over an EV any day of the week.

I’ll wake up in a minute and realise I’ve absorbed a shed load of social media propaganda and speaking it out of my rear end before too long.
 
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vinegarshots said:
See how the red dots are super close together on the east coast and west coast, and then how there is a bunch of white space in between in the middle? Now imagine my routes go in between some of the biggest areas of white space....
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ok fair enough. I guess I'm spoiled living in the east coast... I am within a stones throw of a few chargers at all times. I'm sure EV adoption is slower in those areas and doesn't warrant an increase in stations I guess.
 
jz0309 said:
uh, no, that is not taking off, good concept though ... the Toyota Mira is only available in very select markets (eg some of Southern California) and Shell just recently closed all of their hydrogen stations in CA, so a big blow ...
potential is there, but no adoption ...
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Oh dang. Hydro was sounding promising. Thanks for the update.
 
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Razorpit said:
It’s WaRmInG don’t cha know? 😉


Yes, they already have. Ford has lost billions and is cutting back. No one wants them except the early virtue adopters.


They don’t? What’s different? Or is it not being reported?


California just said “no” to hydrogen the other day.


And a battery to keep that battery warm. It’s turtles all the way down. 🐢🐢🐢🐢


😂 I can’t tell if this is sarcasm or serious. There aren’t enough cops to respond to emergency calls, thanks to all the defunding the last few years. And now we expect them to monitor extension cords on the sidewalk? 🤣


Yup, certainly blew up the whole argument with that one. 🙄 I’m willing to bet there have already been more EV fires than the entire history of the Pinto and original Mustang.
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I hand't heard the "no" from Cali about hydro. Interesting...
 
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KPOM said:
Hopefully this improves their focus. Margins are low in cars anyway.
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You can bet your sweet behind they were going to sell "services" and milk subscription revenue with the car.
And I'm sure some form of AppleCare portfolio of products: AC for maintenance, AC for if your jeans leave blue on the seat, etc. Warranty options are a billion dollar business for luxury car brands.
 
jz0309 said:
let's wait until that happens, and, Tesla taking responsibility and liability in case of accidents, which will happen ...
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That's the entire point of Tesla Insurance. If/when the vehicles crash, Tesla will be on the hook for it. Once the software is sufficiently finalized, of course. Which, as I stated earlier, could be literally any day.
 
lazyrighteye said:
I hand't heard the "no" from Cali about hydro. Interesting...
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I think the poster was referring to what I had posted about Shell closing their hydrogen stations in CA.
The Mirai was/is highly subsidized, you get like $10-15k for fueling for I think 3 years and Toyota a month or so ago offered a $40k rebate on the top end model, brought it from $72k to 42k ...
 
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1129846 said:
That is why a lot of those system have a BMS that will heat up the battery pack to temperature that can be charge at.
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Assuming the pack still has enough energy left.

In Tesla's case, the system has to heat the coolant. Which is not an insignificant amt of energy, esp if the car has been sitting in very cold weather all day.

Again, my main pushback here is potential govt mandates vs apartment dwellers, that don't have the luxury of a heated garage / their own charging stations.
 
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Razorpit said:
Yes, they already have. Ford has lost billions and is cutting back. No one wants them except the early virtue adopters.
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This is reading a headline and not bothering to read the content and not factual.
Ford didn't lose money because of electric cars - and for all car makers, year over year sales of models is UP. Early adopters did drive wait lists and demand - that is true. Everyone is cutting back production because of over estimating forecasts and supply chain issues have settled.

Also another reality to consider - that magical think we tap out of the ground called crude oil? Forget that the earth is on fire for a moment - we are going to run out - and within 20-40 years - which is about the time it will take to convert cars globally to something that isn't using fossil fuels.

There things are impacting faster adoption of electric:
1. Charging infrastructure (needed mainly for distance trips and people who don't have a drive way to put in a charger) - and it's coming.
2. Charging time
3. Cost (confusing rebate program, expensive costs to make batteries, and retail prices a bit too high) - which are all being addressed.

Drive an electric car - it will put your gas guzzler to shame.
 
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