Apple CEO Tim Cook and CFO Peter Oppenheimer Testify In Front of Senate Committee on Tax Strategies [Hearing Over]

[aka777]

If we raised the top marginal rate to 70%, we'd likely have an economy that is as bad as it was during the Eisenhower administration.

Or maybe not.

The top marginal rate then was 92% and we had the strongest economy in the history of the world.

During the 50's and 60s, we had the biggest boom and strongest economy, largest middle-class and highest quality of like on the planet, yet the top tier tax rate was a whopping 92%. After Reaganomics we are ranked dead last in essentially everything but defense.


Heck, look at the wealthiest countries, wealthiest people and strongest economies on the planet today (G20), they are all high-taxing large government nations.

Whereas, every single nation that espouse the Libertarian/TEAparty creed of no taxes, no regulation, zero government, and guns is a 3rd world country today.

 

[Benjamins]

Cool story bro. Except tax avoidance is COMPLETELY LEGAL, and practiced by any large firm with common sense.

in this case, it's not even tax avoidance. Apple is just keeping money made overseas at overseas. No reason why Apple should pay foreign tax, bring the cash back to US, pay US tax, and send it back out to other countries for expansion.

 

[Torrijos]

I only caught part of this - so I could be wrong. But one issue that came up is that a company like Apple can get a tax deduction based on taxes paid overseas - but yet companies like Apple aren't necc paying taxes overseas (on everything). So is it really "fair" for them to get a deduction. I'm not saying they should be taxed on foreign monies - but they also shouldn't get deduction either.

The facts is if the US government were to try to enforce the double taxation for the profits made selling Apple product in foreign countries, you would probably the resurgence of the old way of business, like when Nestlé had local independent subsidiaries for each countries they were doing business in. Complex structures bleeding money for the shareholders (and the company).

 

[everything-i]

It's not about who is really avoiding taxes, it's about making a circus out of it, and no company is going to generate the headlines of Apple.

Trouble is its making the Senate look like a bunch of fools. Their posturing and politicizing is obvious and gratuitous as it seems they have no case to make. I really don't understand what they are trying to prove with all of this other than Apple pays a hell of a lot of money in tax to the US and generates a lot of wealth generally for the US. By the way this is being reported around the world in pretty negative terms for Apple so way to go killing the golden goose.

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I think Apple was chosen for this very fact. They do not participate in tax avoidance schemes. Had the senate named another company, the public would be more aware of what a joke these loopholes for the elite are.

I hadn't thought of it like that, now it all makes perfect sense. Thanks.

 

[samcraig]

The facts is if the US government were to try to enforce the double taxation for the profits made selling Apple product in foreign countries, you would probably the resurgence of the old way of business, like when Nestlé had local independent subsidiaries for each countries they were doing business in. Complex structures bleeding money for the shareholders (and the company).

I admit I'm no accountant. But my concern overall (not with Apple) is that companies can claim a deduction on taxes made overseas.

I know US citizens can claim deductions in their residency state if they work in another (and pay taxes in that state). But why (if it is indeed the case) are companies given deductions for foreign sales if the US isn't seeing any of the income at all?

 

[jamesnajera]

This is pathetic of our congress. When you have McCain stating the following:

"However, the company is taking advantage of a system that allows profits to be shifted and allows the company to avoid paying taxes on $44 billion in income over the past 6 years."

Hey congress if you don't want companies "taking advantage of a system..." then change the laws. You have the power to do it. Congress is an absolute embarrassment right now. This is sad.

 

[drorpheus]

I love the 2% tax they pay in Ireland and the thousandth of 1%. Same with the no tax residency for thier 3 subsidaries. Lets hear how they pay more than enough.

 

[sseaton1971]

I wonder if they'll find a way to tie Hilary Clinton into this hearing. That would be a Republican's wet dream for setting up 2016 elections.

What? You do know that the chairman of this subcommittee, Senator Levin, is a Democrat, right? Except for McCain, the majority of the criticism of Apple's tax practices are coming from Democrats. Jeesh.

 

[zephonic]

I can't help but feeling this is a waste of time and money.

Like an astute soul over at the Ars Technica forum observed:

Apple doesn't pay lobbyists in DC, and now they are being singled out because no big company should be allowed to escape the clutches of the DC political racketeering scheme.

 

[nefan65]

I wonder if they'll find a way to tie Hilary Clinton into this hearing. That would be a Republican's wet dream for setting up 2016 elections.

Ha! How true...! And Karl Grove will make some insane prediction, while Ann Coulter goes off on some Anti-Gay tirade...

P.S. Ann Coulter is a DUDE! I've seen that Adams Apple...

 

[derbladerunner]

The questions from some of the senators are a complete waste of time.

They could look up all that information on sales, employee numbers etc. in Apple's filings or press releases.

Simple Google Search

 

[stockscalper]

Ha! How true...! And Karl Grove will make some insane prediction, while Ann Coulter goes off on some Anti-Gay tirade...

P.S. Ann Coulter is a DUDE! I've seen that Adams Apple...

Type An Coulter used to be a man into Google and look at all the things that pop up. Look at her hands too.

 

[krravi]

"This committee will admit that Apple has not broken any laws, yet here we are at this show trial just for politicians..."

Get 'em Rand!

Reminds me of the republican politician who apologized to BP for the Gulf Oil Spill.

 

[JAT]

I think Apple was chosen for this very fact. They do not participate in tax avoidance schemes. Had the senate named another company, the public would be more aware of what a joke these loopholes for the elite are.

I think you mean evasion, which is illegal.

I only caught part of this - so I could be wrong. But one issue that came up is that a company like Apple can get a tax deduction based on taxes paid overseas - but yet companies like Apple aren't necc paying taxes overseas (on everything). So is it really "fair" for them to get a deduction. I'm not saying they should be taxed on foreign monies - but they also shouldn't get deduction either.

Should actually be a tax credit, which is generally better for the company than a deduction. But it would only be exactly the amount paid. So, if it's $1b in paid foreign tax, they get a billion off, if $1, they get a buck. I'd say it's one of the fairest tax laws we have, they want to get your tax to 35%, and they'll share it with other countries if they have to, dollar for dollar. Now, whether 35% is a fair amount is a different topic.

 

[sseaton1971]

Well, most "liberals" have better things to do than huuunt or kill. Our fun tends to be go on a holiday or to the beach, not shoot at defenseless animals. We also like to drive advanced and efficient vehicles or use highly efficient mass transit.

So, "most liberals" must be vegetarians, I guess. They would never purchase meat that comes from animals that were confined and then slaughtered to be sold on the market.

And "most liberals" must be wealthy, because going on holiday and purchasing "advanced and efficient vehicles" is expensive.

Oh, and "most liberals" must live near the ocean and not in rural areas, because they wouldn't be able to go to the beach and use "highly efficient mass transit" systems.

Thank you for helping me understand "most liberals".

 

[Tiger8]

These dirty liberals are just drooling at the thought of getting a chunk of that 100 billion. What a shame. This isn't what our founding fathers wanted when they formed this government.

I love when conservatives talk about the founding fathers as if they met them.

Our founding fathers also gave us the ability to write new laws and even ammend the constitution if need be, I'm on Apple's side on this one but I'm sure our founding fathers did not have a country with a disappearing middle class in mind when they formed the govenment.

 

[iSRS]

McCain destroyed any credibility he had when he ended it by asking why he has to update apps.

Again, just a circus show.

That said? He has a good point.

 

[aka777]

You got something under Hypocritical: hates government, unless it's telling other people how to live by your morals (i.e. no gay marriage, no abortions, etc.).

Good point. Added this too.

 

[iGrip]

wut?

Suit:

Fatcat:

 

[spacehog371]

Are you going to suggest that Apple has no tax advantages over smaller or only domestic companies? Really?

What tax advantage do they have? They pay the same taxes here as any other company that isn't multinational. What does it matter to domestic companies what taxes they are paying overseas? It isn't like Apple didn't pay taxes for the overseas profits... they did, they paid all of the taxes in the country that they sold the product in.

They are not shifting profits from the U.S. into overseas companies to lower taxes... that would put domestic companies at a disadvantage, but that is not happening.

 

[JAT]

P.S. Ann Coulter is a DUDE! I've seen that Adams Apple...

Does this matter? Were you going to ask her out tomorrow?

 

[krravi]

You are a whole new level of lost.

They dealt with HUMAN NATURE. Human nature hasn't changed much at all in 1000's of years. The wisdom of the the US founding fathers is the most precious thing this nation holds. Their lessons and their blood IS who we are and it drives and defines who we are.

Government like the one we have now is nothing this nation hasn't seen and defeated before. It's a shame that it is our government that is the enemy of the citizens and not the ally.

I don't seem to recall hearing about the founding fathers that much when you know, a trillion dollars were wasted on a phony war.. or war profiteers looted in the name of rebuilding a country and yet.. suddenly many seemed to have woken up after 1776 to present day. Everything in between must be foggy.

 

[fanspeed]

bottom line

it may be legal,but it still comes across as shady Fanboys

 

[50548]

Rand Paul's intervention was, OF COURSE, the only sensible one. Too bad the average US citizen is NOT intelligent enough to vote for the Libertarians.

As for Messrs Levin and McCain, well, they embody once more the most blatant evidence of the failure of the two-party system in the US. Brainless, clueless and full of undeserved power. Apple pays ALL the taxes it owes, full stop. So unless these clowns can prove that the company is breaking any laws, they should just SHUT UP.

Congrats again for your sensible remarks, Mr Paul! One can only wish that you become President of the US of A one day!

 

[JAT]

McCain destroyed any credibility he had when he ended it by asking why he has to update apps.

Again, just a circus show.

That said? He has a good point.

My take: That's his only real reason for coming.