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@springsup Thank you for this post. I've been arguing for a while Apple is becoming a fashion company rather than an electronics one. There is money in fashion and they're after it. Burberry, Hermes collaborations, Beats, Watch Edition, the new Macbook which has the speed of 2011 Air, has one USB-C slot, but it's so pretty and so light. All those are fashion products. But that's also why Apple don't need a 32GB base iPhone model. Because they're Apple. Same as Louis Vuitton doesn't need an "entry level" cheap bag. I will not be surprised to see a Kanye West or Kim Kardashian version of iPhone 7. It will cost. It will sell. It will have 16GB storage.

I expect Apple products to become more expensive, more beautiful and thin, less technologically advanced and less adventurous in the coming years. It's a switch in customer base. I feel they are correct – from the shareholder and money-making point of view that is. I am not going to be in that new target group. As long as I can continue using my Macs and not switch to Windows, I will be happy. And hang around here ;)
 
Removing the optical drive was a much easier task, in fairness. It wasn't so much about a shift to wireless: it was about a shift from mechanical components (optical drives and spinning hard disks) to solid-state ones (USB sticks/NAS and flash drives). Mechanical components are big, power-hungry, slow and prone to mechanical failures - while at the same time, we had mature replacement technology that had none of those drawbacks and was rapidly falling in price.

I don't see that same balance for wireless against wired technologies. We're shoe-horning wireless in to replace wired standards, and they come with the obvious convenience benefit of not having wires, but are worse in almost every other respect. They have unpredictable performance (but always worse than wired), are less reliable, consume more power and sometimes require proprietary technologies which don't interoperate with devices from other vendors. Take AirPlay vs cabled video output, for instance: it used to be that every laptop needed VGA in order to hook up to beamers; now it's been modernised to HDMI. If we go Apple's route and eliminate all cables, we have to buy AppleTVs everywhere to support AirPlay because it's a software protocol and they can break it whenever they feel like. That doesn't even bring us to the issue of wireless charging.

So the truth is that Apple is just pretending you don't need cables. The facts of life are that you do, and that having those standards codified in hardware is actually an implicit form of consumer protection against incompatible protocol changes. In practical usage, you will need cables, often at unpredictable times, and then you'll find out that you can't attach them without an additional breakout box. In short: it becomes incredibly inconvenient.

I sometimes get the feeling Tim Cook is 'acting' the role of Apple CEO. He's acting so like people think Apple should stereotypically act, that he loses track of the important points underneath it all. Usually, when Apple makes bold decisions, I can see a good technical and engineering reason behind it. Maybe I'm growing older and wiser, but increasingly Apple's products have little technical innovation and pitch themselves too aggressively as creative tools made by artists.

The Apple Watch marketing campaign was a massive shock to me. People often accuse people of being a fashion brand (that is: style but not substance), but they've always fought against that by making technically superior products and decisions. Then they just threw it all away and said "SURPRISE! We really are a fashion company! And in fact, we're so arrogant and conceited we're going to make a $25,000 version out of solid gold, only going to sell it in curated 'collections' to limit your personalisation options, and even then only sell it in high-end fashion stores!" Now they've had to turn back their expectations, selling it for half-price and expanding distribution to include mainstream electronics vendors like Best Buy.

It's like they want to be Burberry, who can sell a scarf for €400 because of their name. That has never been who Apple was (to me, at least). Yes, their products were more expensive than their competitors and yes, they had more style - but they also had more substance. Now they don't even care about pitching to you based on substance. They don't care about making a better product, the same way Burberry doesn't care about making a better scarf and Louis Vuitton doesn't care about making a better suitcase.

I'm torn about selling my shares. On the one hand, I think Apple is incredibly cheap based on where they are right now; on the other hand, I'm not impressed with their progress this year and believe they need some absolutely barnstorming improvements to get back on track.

The Watch2/WatchOS3 is going to have to really blow us away to get some momentum for that product. The AppleTV needs an enormous amount of work just to get where it should have been at launch. There are huge question marks over the future of the iPad. Apple isn't really ending 2015 in the sort of supremely strong position they're usually in.
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What ridiculous logic. The dude earned $10 million for a year's work leading a team of people who are also incredibly well paid (and, one would imagine, must be incredibly talented and competent at their jobs to deserve such money).

If other CEOs are getting paid more, that's the problem. Those are the people who should be making less.
If other executives at Apple are getting paid more, that's another problem. Those people should be making less.

I can't believe that people who don't earn a fraction of what Tim Cook just did, who probably have way more stresses and pressures in their lives than he has, are waving away cases of Chinese workers who literally work themselves to death in order to say that a man who made $10 million deserves more money.

You probably don't even understand how much $10 million is. You could probably add up all the money you'll ever see in your life, and it would be less than $10 million. He made just above 374x the average salary of people in the USA. To put that another way: Tim Cook earned as much every single day (including weekends and bank holidays) as the middle-of-the-road American makes in an entire year. And you're saying he should get paid more.

Now, he has responsibilities and such (well, not really... if he fails those responsibilities, he still gets loads of cash. If a janitor fails his responsibilities he's out of a job, in danger of losing his home, etc). Are those responsibilities really worth an entire year's worth of back-breaking labour (such as janitorial work) every single day?

Amen. The pay differences at corporartions is obscenely stupid. Only here do we do that kind of crap. No one is worth that much to ANY company. Sorry to burst the CEO-lovers bubble but its true. If he got run over by a truck tomorrow, Apple would be fine. Period. Everyone on this planet is replaceable. Sorry.
 
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I will not be surprised to see a Kanye West or Kim Kardashian version of iPhone 7. It will cost. It will sell. It will have 16GB storage.

Oh, man, now you're scaring me.

The scariest part is how believable it is, especially after the Taylor Swift/Apple Music deal. I can totally imagine a Kim Kardashian iPhone.

Oh, ****...
 
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Maps fullfilled it's purpose: to make google add all the features they were excluding from ios' google maps so Android would have a better experience.
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And yet you want her to use an iPhone like you want to use it. It's her money and she decides to buy an iPhone to use it as a normal phone because she likes it and she cans. Simple as that.
@springsup Thank you for this post. I've been arguing for a while Apple is becoming a fashion company rather than an electronics one. There is money in fashion and they're after it. Burberry, Hermes collaborations, Beats, Watch Edition, the new Macbook which has the speed of 2011 Air, has one USB-C slot, but it's so pretty and so light. All those are fashion products. But that's also why Apple don't need a 32GB base iPhone model. Because they're Apple. Same as Louis Vuitton doesn't need an "entry level" cheap bag. I will not be surprised to see a Kanye West or Kim Kardashian version of iPhone 7. It will cost. It will sell. It will have 16GB storage.

I expect Apple products to become more expensive, more beautiful and thin, less technologically advanced and less adventurous in the coming years. It's a switch in customer base. I feel they are correct – from the shareholder and money-making point of view that is. I am not going to be in that new target group. As long as I can continue using my Macs and not switch to Windows, I will be happy. And hang around here ;)


A bit unfair to Apple. The remarkable A9 chip/performance enhancements of the iphone 6, even 3D touch and second-to-none fingerprint scanners, high quality front/rear camera, etc. are serious, well-implemented technological innovations that prove Apple cares about its power users. The ipad pro's pencil is also a nice piece of kit. I just hope Apple doesn't lose sight of the company's aspirations under Jobs and continues to innovate rather than provide mere luxury value for Cooked profit margins.
 
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poor guy is barely scraping by. maybe he can make more next year by lowering employee benefits.
 
Thinness relates to weight and that's what's really behind Apple's seeming obsession with thinness.

Lighter devices lead to better UX/ portability, whether you're talking about laptops, tablets or smartphones.
I would argue that too light isn't good or comfortable to use. I'll take for example my ipod touch, it's so thin I have trouble holding/grabbing it correctly and really light, which makes me forget i put it on my lap or something and drop it.
 
No one should be complaining that Cook is underpaid. He's getting ~$50mm in vested stock options yearly.

For tax purposes, he probably stated he'd rather only make $1mm a year in a salary and take the stock options. I knew someone that was getting paid right on the edge of the next tax bracket and opted to make less money per year and go into a lower tax bracket. Made more that way than by being paid a higher salary.

Like someone said as well, everything he does is a business expense.

Hell, years ago I worked at a major retailer and if a VP wanted to take a vacation, he'd simply stop at a store for 10 minutes and call the entire weeklong vacation a business expense since he stepped foot into a store and conducted business on his travel.
 
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Says who?
Me.
Just because Steve loved skeuomorphism doesn't make it superior to anything else.
But it makes it vastly different from the flat design under Jony. So don't make them soulmates. Forstall made the UI Steve loved. And Jobs died two years before iOS 7. We will never know if he would have liked or disliked it.
As far as maps go, who cares what the UI looks like, if the underlying data is crap?
Apple cared, it couldn't improve the UI without vector-based maps and Google wasn't providing them. They keep the valuable data as an competitive advantage for Android, so Apple had to build their own maps database from scratch. They had no choice, but to swallow the unavoidable initial inaccuracies.
Had Forstall gone on stage, been really humble and announced maps as a beta product people may have been more forgiving over data issues.
Almost every new Apple feature is a beta product. Sometimes the first version is already good enough to rely on. But that doesn't mean, it's not brand new technology never before tested in the wild. Only after Jobs dead, Apple lowered it's secrecy and opened the beta program for non-developers, who can't be threatened with non-disclosure agreements. Steve wanted to surprise people more than he wanted their help to eliminate errors.

So how is Forstall to blame? Steve rehearsed every minute on stage and he wasn't a humble man himself.
 
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you sound like all the real estate reps from 2007: "everything is great! dont change a thing!"

Yeah, because that's comparable... :rolleyes:


Every year. EVERY YEAR, people like you talk about how bad things are going for Apple, and how much of a buffoon Tim Cook is. Yet, every year they increase their sales, they increase their profit, and they increase share price. And every year they nail it on the prediction of what their performance is going to be. So they obviously know a HELL of a lot more about the way that company should run than you do.

And let's not lose sight of the fact that Steve Jobs hand picked Tim Cook to help bring Apple out of the dumpers. He then hand picked him to succeed him. And he pretty much gave Jony Ive carte blanche for life at Apple. So he must have seen something in them.

I am a stockholder with nearly $100,000 invested in Apple. And I am quite fine with the crew that's running it.
 
A bit unfair to Apple. The remarkable A9 chip/performance enhancements of the iphone 6, even 3D touch and second-to-none fingerprint scanners, high quality front/rear camera, etc. are serious, well-implemented technological innovations that prove Apple cares about its power users. The ipad pro's pencil is also a nice piece of kit. I just hope Apple doesn't lose sight of the company's aspirations under Jobs and continues to innovate rather than provide mere luxury value for Cooked profit margins.

Oh, I'm not saying that they literally do not advance the technology in any way. They have the best chip designers in the business, and on the software side the Swift team seems very strong.

I'm not even talking about "power user" features like CPU speed though: I'm talking about the substance of what the product is and does. The iPhone launched with some clear technological breakthroughs: a full mobile internet browser, mobile maps, and an interaction paradigm that replaced buttons.

What does the Apple Watch have? Nothing. It has no stand-out, market-beating feature. It does a collection of little things, like show you stocks and weather synced to your phone. The marketing shifted to show you what the focus of the product was: fashion. That is the focus of the Apple Watch.

What does the AppleTV have? Again, nothing. The market-beating feature was supposed to be Apps, but it seems like Apple completely forgot that you have to discover Apps to get them. The AppleTV AppStore is such a joke, if I described it to you you'd think I was exaggerating. The AppStore isn't successful anywhere except on the iPhone, where it's been taken over by freemium crapware. You could make a very good case that its failure to reward developers is one of the reasons for the iPad's failure. Apple will bend over backwards to placate Taylor Swift, but when App developers tell them they can't make a living they just plug their fingers in their ears. Oh, and they'll also break their AppleTV requirements so that Rock Band doesn't need to support the Siri Remote; break their iOS requirements so Facebook can spam you with "Do you know ... ...?" notifications. Your apps? NO WAY.

It's not just the AppStore - the AppleTV interface is just boring. They've tried to jazz it up with bouncy effects so it "looks like Apple", but the Apps really don't look good. OK, they couldn't get the content deals in time, but there is literally no content other than Apps. You'd think this wouldn't all be such an afterthought.

The marketing pitch with AppleTV basically is: "it's Apple. You know Apple? This is them. For your TV. I dunno, Apps n' shiz. I suppose."

Apple never relied on their name shifting a product. The iPhone (following the iPod) could have been much less excellent than it was, but the determination to build a superior product made it so good. You know when Steve was pitching the iPhone, he said he was showing it to someone and they said "you had me at scrolling"? Tim Cook's Apple would have stopped at scrolling, and thought that was all they needed for a new product people would buy.
 
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You quoted below should give your heads a shake... really.

You sound like business owners when slavery was abolished! "We can't afford to pay our slaves a wage!!".

Blue Orange -> Minimum Wage should be a living wage. BTW - M.W isn't just for students... so companies can't pay 50c an hour...

Yaxomaxay -> No evidence to suggests this occurs - actually the opposite -> in countries where a "minimum wage" means "living wage"... Also, same arguments against minimum wage was talked about being introduced in severals countries.

Minimum wage isn't meant to be a living wage. That's why they call it minimum. It's a way for students to earn spending money or save for school while they can still live at home. If you want to earn more than minimum wage, work hard and acquire skills that pay more. There are millions of open jobs(many of which are highly paid) that companies can't find qualified workers for. There's plenty of opportunity out there, people just have to work for it.

This is the same reason we shouldn't give out participation trophies/ribbons. Sets kids up to believe they deserve something just for showing up.

Yes and kill all the entry level jobs, increasing the problem of poverty and inequality.
$5/hour is not much, but that $5/hour job is the difference between life and death to a former inmate who's looking for workplace redemption, or for anyone trying to come out from poverty.
No company would give $20/hour to a felon or someone without experience/degree/history/credibility.
You want to help poor people? Find a way to encourage companies to contribute to skill-forming education (Certifications, Associate Degree etc).
 
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Oh, I'm not saying that they literally do not advance the technology in any way. They have the best chip designers in the business, and on the software side the Swift team seems very strong.

I'm not even talking about "power user" features like CPU speed though: I'm talking about the substance of what the product is and does. The iPhone launched with some clear technological breakthroughs: a full mobile internet browser, mobile maps, and an interaction paradigm that replaced buttons.

What does the Apple Watch have? Nothing. It has no stand-out, market-beating feature. It does a collection of little things, like show you stocks and weather synced to your phone. The marketing shifted to show you what the focus of the product was: fashion. That is the focus of the Apple Watch.

What does the AppleTV have? Again, nothing. The market-beating feature was supposed to be Apps, but it seems like Apple completely forgot that you have to discover Apps to get them. The AppleTV AppStore is such a joke, if I described it to you you'd think I was exaggerating. The AppStore isn't successful anywhere except on the iPhone, where it's been taken over by freemium crapware. You could make a very good case that its failure to reward developers is one of the reasons for the iPad's failure. Apple will bend over backwards to placate Taylor Swift, but when App developers tell them they can't make a living they just plug their fingers in their ears. Oh, and they'll also break their AppleTV requirements so that Rock Band doesn't need to support the Siri Remote; break their iOS requirements so Facebook can spam you with "Do you know ... ...?" notifications. Your apps? NO WAY.

It's not just the AppStore - the AppleTV interface is just boring. They've tried to jazz it up with bouncy effects so it "looks like Apple", but the Apps really don't look good. OK, they couldn't get the content deals in time, but there is literally no content other than Apps. You'd think this wouldn't all be such an afterthought.

The marketing pitch with AppleTV basically is: "it's Apple. You know Apple? This is them. For your TV. I dunno, Apps n' shiz. I suppose."

Apple never relied on their name shifting a product. The iPhone (following the iPod) could have been much less excellent than it was, but the determination to build a superior product made it so good. You know when Steve was pitching the iPhone, he said he was showing it to someone and they said "you had me at scrolling"? Tim Cook's Apple would have stopped at scrolling, and thought that was all they needed for a new product people would buy.


I've been on your side of this debate, and the thoughts you have expressed in your last 3 posts are exactly in line with what I have been saying/thinking on here and to others in the real world. You have been able to express those same thoughts in a very straightforward and concise manner, so I applaud you for that. My feelings on the direction of Apple, my "bottom line" feelings, so to speak, are that Apple has slowly shifted from a performance based computing company that makes beautiful and elegant products to beautiful and elegant products that are computers. The iPhone, I think, is still best in its class, its still the most pleasant to use.. But on so many other ventures, at least the last few ventures they have embarked on, the computing power of the product has been second to getting the products into the hands of fashion houses and overrated celebrities. It has been a colossal mistake, and whomever has decided that is the right direction to take certain parts of the company deserve to be fired immediately.

They have also released products that are "half-baked" in regards to their competitors in the market. The Apple Watch is pretty much just another smart watch. It could even be argued it is missing some important features. For years they let chatter about Apple TV build up, and then released something that could be described as anything but underwhelming. Both big releases, both big disappointments, neither had any features at all that differentiated themselves from the rest of the market.

Should we even begin to discuss Tim Cook's decision to increase reliance on China's economy for future growth with what we are seeing now? I think I heard Cook even, on a recent earnings call, say that he thought the Market in China would soon be more important to Apple than the Market in the United States. The CEO of a proud US company essentially through under the bus the customer base that has grown Apple into the monster that they are because he thinks further growth will come only from an emerging market with a larger population. It was an odd statement, I thought.
 
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So he earned $28219 on average each day, including the day in which he approved a MacBook with a single USB port.

it's an ultra-portable, why not? if you need more capabilities than an ultra-portable delivers, get one of the more robust offerings in the lineup. problem solved. but then....no whining. yeah, i see the problem.
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Angela is extremely overpaid. She manged to bungle both the Apple Watch and iPad Pro launches in the same year.

what on earth are you smoking? the head of retail doesnt dictate manufacturing schedules, so availability isn't her deal.
 
it's an ultra-portable, why not? if you need more capabilities than an ultra-portable delivers, get one of the more robust offerings in the lineup. problem solved. but then....no whining. yeah, i see the problem.
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what on earth are you smoking? the head of retail doesnt dictate manufacturing schedules, so availability isn't her deal.

I would just like to know where this pivot, in regards to how Apple is marketing some of its products, is coming from. Is it unreasonable to make the assumption that perhaps it is coming from the person who used to be the CEO of a fashion brand for years before she was hired at Apple?

And if you think that has been a big mistake, then is it really unreasonable to then think that perhaps that person should be replaced immediately, before they do further damage to the brand?
 
I'm fully aware of that and it still surprises me. Tim sits on that board, Al Gore, ex-CFO of Boeing and the Current CEO of Disney all sit on that board.

It surprises me that they haven't requested more compensation for the amount of profit they generate. They are literally operating the most profitable company in the world as of 2015. And yet Bob Iger, current CEO of Disney, a member on the board of Apple made $44.9 Million in 2015.

Disney profit 2015 so far: $7.84 Billion
Apple profit 2015 so far: $44.46 Billion

So Apple makes 5.66 times more profit, but the CEO (Tim Cook) is only paid $10.28 Million which is 4.37 times less than Bob Iger.

So to put this in perspective, Bob, a member of Apples board gets paid 4.3x more money for bringing in 5.6x less profit.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with these compensation levels, I'm not saying Tim should be paid more or Bob should be paid less. I'm just saying it's surprising that Tim isn't paid more considering the company he is leading and the profits he and his team are generating. It's not unheard of for investment bankers to make 200 Million and be generating nowhere near these kinds of profits. And yes I know I'm not including time releasing stocks in the future into his current pay package.

You aren't taking into account Cook's share grants which vest over time. His share grants total well over a MILLION shares of Apple stock. So if Apple's stock remains about where it is, he could get over a billion dollars in compensation.

From the Interwebs:

In an effort to retain Cook over the long term, Apple awarded their new CEO 1 million RSUs (restricted stock units). Half of these restricted stock units vest on August 24th, 2016, while the other half vest on August 24th, 2021. Cook is free to sell his shares as soon as they vest.

These RSUs currently have a market value of nearly $900 million.
 
Apple's Board is paying Tim what they think is appropriate. He could likely get more money elsewhere. My sense is Tim is not in it for the money.
 
You aren't taking into account Cook's share grants which vest over time. His share grants total well over a MILLION shares of Apple stock. So if Apple's stock remains about where it is, he could get over a billion dollars in compensation.

From the Interwebs:

In an effort to retain Cook over the long term, Apple awarded their new CEO 1 million RSUs (restricted stock units). Half of these restricted stock units vest on August 24th, 2016, while the other half vest on August 24th, 2021. Cook is free to sell his shares as soon as they vest.

These RSUs currently have a market value of nearly $900 million.

I don't think you read my entire post as I addressed that at the bottom.
 
Yeah, because that's comparable... :rolleyes:


Every year. EVERY YEAR, people like you talk about how bad things are going for Apple, and how much of a buffoon Tim Cook is. Yet, every year they increase their sales, they increase their profit, and they increase share price. And every year they nail it on the prediction of what their performance is going to be. So they obviously know a HELL of a lot more about the way that company should run than you do.

And let's not lose sight of the fact that Steve Jobs hand picked Tim Cook to help bring Apple out of the dumpers. He then hand picked him to succeed him. And he pretty much gave Jony Ive carte blanche for life at Apple. So he must have seen something in them.

I am a stockholder with nearly $100,000 invested in Apple. And I am quite fine with the crew that's running it.

Yep. And ONE day ... I guarantee you ... you will realize you held onto your stock in Apple just a little too long. Just like so many other investors who were convinced the sky was ALWAYS the limit. :) Good luck to you.
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So you think the head of retail should be deciding when a product launches? My guess is she's not involved in the design or manufacture of these products so why should she decide when they go on sale?
Ok ... I get that. But again, I throw the question back at you: What exactly does she do then --- that correlates to a 30 million dollar income?
 
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Removing the optical drive was a much easier task, in fairness. It wasn't so much about a shift to wireless: it was about a shift from mechanical components (optical drives and spinning hard disks) to solid-state ones (USB sticks/NAS and flash drives). Mechanical components are big, power-hungry, slow and prone to mechanical failures - while at the same time, we had mature replacement technology that had none of those drawbacks and was rapidly falling in price.

I don't see that same balance for wireless against wired technologies. We're shoe-horning wireless in to replace wired standards, and they come with the obvious convenience benefit of not having wires, but are worse in almost every other respect. They have unpredictable performance (but always worse than wired), are less reliable, consume more power and sometimes require proprietary technologies which don't interoperate with devices from other vendors. Take AirPlay vs cabled video output, for instance: it used to be that every laptop needed VGA in order to hook up to beamers; now it's been modernised to HDMI. If we go Apple's route and eliminate all cables, we have to buy AppleTVs everywhere to support AirPlay because it's a software protocol and they can break it whenever they feel like. That doesn't even bring us to the issue of wireless charging.

So the truth is that Apple is just pretending you don't need cables. The facts of life are that you do, and that having those standards codified in hardware is actually an implicit form of consumer protection against incompatible protocol changes. In practical usage, you will need cables, often at unpredictable times, and then you'll find out that you can't attach them without an additional breakout box. In short: it becomes incredibly inconvenient.

I sometimes get the feeling Tim Cook is 'acting' the role of Apple CEO. He's acting so like people think Apple should stereotypically act, that he loses track of the important points underneath it all. Usually, when Apple makes bold decisions, I can see a good technical and engineering reason behind it. Maybe I'm growing older and wiser, but increasingly Apple's products have little technical innovation and pitch themselves too aggressively as creative tools made by artists.

The Apple Watch marketing campaign was a massive shock to me. People often accuse people of being a fashion brand (that is: style but not substance), but they've always fought against that by making technically superior products and decisions. Then they just threw it all away and said "SURPRISE! We really are a fashion company! And in fact, we're so arrogant and conceited we're going to make a $25,000 version out of solid gold, only going to sell it in curated 'collections' to limit your personalisation options, and even then only sell it in high-end fashion stores!" Now they've had to turn back their expectations, selling it for half-price and expanding distribution to include mainstream electronics vendors like Best Buy.

It's like they want to be Burberry, who can sell a scarf for €400 because of their name. That has never been who Apple was (to me, at least). Yes, their products were more expensive than their competitors and yes, they had more style - but they also had more substance. Now they don't even care about pitching to you based on substance. They don't care about making a better product, the same way Burberry doesn't care about making a better scarf and Louis Vuitton doesn't care about making a better suitcase.

I'm torn about selling my shares. On the one hand, I think Apple is incredibly cheap based on where they are right now; on the other hand, I'm not impressed with their progress this year and believe they need some absolutely barnstorming improvements to get back on track.

The Watch2/WatchOS3 is going to have to really blow us away to get some momentum for that product. The AppleTV needs an enormous amount of work just to get where it should have been at launch. There are huge question marks over the future of the iPad. Apple isn't really ending 2015 in the sort of supremely strong position they're usually in.
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What ridiculous logic. The dude earned $10 million for a year's work leading a team of people who are also incredibly well paid (and, one would imagine, must be incredibly talented and competent at their jobs to deserve such money).

If other CEOs are getting paid more, that's the problem. Those are the people who should be making less.
If other executives at Apple are getting paid more, that's another problem. Those people should be making less.

I can't believe that people who don't earn a fraction of what Tim Cook just did, who probably have way more stresses and pressures in their lives than he has, are waving away cases of Chinese workers who literally work themselves to death in order to say that a man who made $10 million deserves more money.

You probably don't even understand how much $10 million is. You could probably add up all the money you'll ever see in your life, and it would be less than $10 million. He made just above 374x the average salary of people in the USA. To put that another way: Tim Cook earned as much every single day (including weekends and bank holidays) as the middle-of-the-road American makes in an entire year. And you're saying he should get paid more.

Now, he has responsibilities and such (well, not really... if he fails those responsibilities, he still gets loads of cash. If a janitor fails his responsibilities he's out of a job, in danger of losing his home, etc). Are those responsibilities really worth an entire year's worth of back-breaking labour (such as janitorial work) every single day?

I believe that capitalism can be a positive force. And that amazing CEOs of amazing companies should be well compensated. I also believe in reasonable regulation, and taxation. We currently do not have enough of the right corporate regulations in place, nor do we tax the richest even CLOSE to where we should (hint: we should switch to a wealth tax, not an income tax). So... I think Tim should be paid more, but he also should probably be paying more taxes as an individual, his company should be paying WAY more in taxes, and absolutely, industries should be more regulated on many levels, including all sorts of things that make it exceptionally difficult for companies to, say, enlist overseas "slave" labor. The fact is, Apple is probably by far one of the MOST responsible companies that uses overseas contract manufacturing labor, and is also one of the most environmentally active of any major company. Apple, to be blunt, isn't even CLOSE to representing the worst of the corporate world.
 
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I believe that capitalism can be a positive force. And that amazing CEOs of amazing companies should be well compensated. I also believe in reasonable regulation, and taxation. We currently do not have enough of the right corporate regulations in place, nor do we tax the richest even CLOSE to where we should (hint: we should switch to a wealth tax, not an income tax). So... I think Tim should be paid more, but he also should probably be paying more taxes as an individual, his company should be paying WAY more in taxes, and absolutely, industries should be more regulated on many levels, including all sorts of things that make it exceptionally difficult for companies to, say, enlist overseas "slave" labor. The fact is, Apple is probably by far one of the MOST responsible companies that uses overseas contract manufacturing labor, and is also one of the most environmentally active of any major company. Apple, to be blunt, isn't even CLOSE to representing the worst of the corporate world.


If capitalism is to be a positive force, then we need to pay the workers - especially those that make his company so valuable - more. Especially customer support, and if you ever did that type of job you'd sure as heck understand why. We also need more opportunities, which will help reduce crime. Or is Apple too scared to open up education centers and other things in, say, inner cities where crime - especially amongst the poor - is high. Let's really talk about issues, since locking up all the guns won't do any good if we don't fix the horrible things that lead to people wanting to commit violence in the first place.

Apple, for years, has dealt with "Foxconn and others use child labor, slave labor at suicide factories, etc". All we know right now is that the reports of using the same slave factories that every other tech company still uses have ceased. That does not mean conditions have improved.

Apple still exists to make money for itself. Blaming customers for faulty antenna designs, overheating systems, and other things is not good responsibility - thankfully the previous CEO left the company. Cook ranks far better than his predecessor for macbook repair extensions, ipad recalls, et cetera. By far. But, to be blunt, and cynical, this is the same "responsible" company that has had Al Gore on it since 2003 and Apple's record on being green and all that is still laughable, despite superficial changes.

Meanwhile, Apple Store retail employees, who puts up with the most crap of anyone in the whole company, makes $16 per hour in San Francisco.

Quite. The employees, customer representatives, ARE the company - from the eyes of the customer. Like how Apple has poor grade engineers (I've posted on that time and again), maybe they should take some of the college courses like "Ethics" and "Business/Stakeholder Econimics" that openly say that customer reps are the company in that aspect, yet are treated very poorly by many customers, for which I often apologize to those workers for those trash customers that don't give a sh...

Anyway, while Cook flaunts it, he supports the offshoring of jobs and opportunities - moving them to even to communist countries that he and other republicans say are baaaaaaaaaaaaaad, scapegoating of unions and schools in America and the west (while doing nothing to prove his company is better than those he blames for America's problems, typical private industry dog and pony shows as usual), blaming tax laws despite his company having lobbyists trying to make them better for him (unless Apple just hates it when other companies have lobbyists?)...

And so on and so on... because anything to save a buck goes to all that. I imagine, doing the math, raising peoples' wages would result in a temporary loss but would be reclaimed as grateful people continue to buy the products of the company that he is CEO of.

All I do is read the news. Which is not "liberal media" given how the liberals are said to be anti-business, communists, and everything else yet the media often puts out things to generate audiences because the ads from clicks generates anti-commie liberal money... but maybe the news, or some of it, is distorted, which in turn has the cascade effect of us reading misinformation and then responding to it by either refuting it or supporting it, not knowing what's real and what isn't.
 
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