Apple Challenges EU Digital Markets Act Over Feature Delays

[turbineseaplane]

This is absolutely not what is happening here. The EU is about to introduce a powerful privacy-invading law called ChatControl that will be constantly scanning all our messages and photos, and they need all computing devices to have weakened privacy for that. See my message earlier here : https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...ys.2467466/page-5?post=34178232#post-34178232

Thank you for sharing that and I echo your concerns over those sorts of things.
I would say, however, that's a different topic than the DMA & App Stores and feature integrations.

By the way, Apple was all onboard with CSAM scanning until outrage .. I expect they will be again.
Just a matter of time.

Apple is not going to be a savior on any of this.

Here in the US, they are literally afraid to release a show about domestic terrorism for fear of backlash (from public or, worse, the US government)

 

[Athonline]

This is absolutely not what is happening here. The EU is about to introduce a powerful privacy-invading law called ChatControl that will be constantly scanning all our messages and photos ( for europeans), and they need all computing devices to have weakened privacy for that. See my message earlier here : https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...ys.2467466/page-5?post=34178232#post-34178232

I am against ChatControl and have emailed my MEPs about it, but that has nothing to do with DMA and its compliance. Let's not confuse the two.

 

[clayj]

Apple needs to design their products to accommodate US law, period. If that makes them unable to offer products in Europe, then so be it. Enough of letting unelected bureaucrats and extortionists dictate Apple's product designs.

That goes for Microsoft, Google, and every other American technology company, too.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Apple needs to design their products to accommodate US law, period.

They need to design products to comply with regulations in any jurisdictions they are selling them.

Or they can simply not sell there (as you highlighted)

None of this is new stuff folks.
Companies have been required to offer discrete products in different markets for decades.

 

[I7guy]

This is absolutely not what is happening here. The EU is about to introduce a powerful privacy-invading law called ChatControl that will be constantly scanning all our messages and photos ( for europeans), and they need all computing devices to have weakened privacy for that. See my message earlier here : https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...ys.2467466/page-5?post=34178232#post-34178232

This seems to be part of the issue being cited - over regulation. And guilty until proven innocent.

The EU is not the good guy here.

And sure people will vote with their wallets. We’ll see how it goes.

 

[matthijst]

Wait. Where are these porn apps again?
Asking for a friend.

 

[matthijst]

I take very little from anecdotes like this honestly.

Why?

Because my MAGA relative says this sort of stuff all the time about Seattle, even when I'm literally walking around downtown Seattle telling him basically nothing he's saying is accurate (he's just getting it from Fox News).

All the bums and homeless junkies moved to Portland?

 

[turbineseaplane]

All the bums and homeless junkies moved to Portland?

Every city of size has these issues.
We are even getting them in Boise .. in Idaho.

I'm just exhausted with folks holding up societal issues like some indictment on an entire place.

I don't want homeless people literally scooped up with a bulldozer, like trash, as many Red state cities would do.
Nor do I want them all "rounded up" by the Stasi.

Let's have some humanity here please.

 

[Pezimak]

Apple really is trying it’s best to gaslight everyone, it has nothing to do with any consumerism and everything to do with Apple protecting it’s 30% cut.

 

[WarmWinterHat]

Apple needs to design their products to accommodate US law, period. If that makes them unable to offer products in Europe, then so be it. Enough of letting unelected bureaucrats and extortionists dictate Apple's product designs.

That goes for Microsoft, Google, and every other American technology company, too.

Period?

It's not just the EU, it's Brazil, India, China, Taiwan, Japan, and more to come I'm sure.

US companies shouldn't be exporting US business practices and law, period. If they only want to follow US law, they shouldn't operate beyond the US borders.

 

[I7guy]

Apple really is trying it’s best to gaslight everyone, it has nothing to do with any consumerism and everything to do with Apple protecting it’s 30% cut.

As it should. And as a consumer you have choices as well in picking who to do business with.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Apple really is trying it’s best to gaslight everyone, it has nothing to do with any consumerism and everything to do with Apple protecting it’s 30% cut.

👆
This.
To pull out the old classic:

 

[ginkobiloba]

Thank you for sharing that and I echo your concerns over those sorts of things.
I would say, however, that's a different topic than the DMA & App Stores and feature integrations.

By the way, Apple was all onboard with CSAM scanning until outrage .. I expect they will be again.
Just a matter of time.

Apple is not going to be a savior on any of this.

Here in the US, they are literally afraid to release a show about domestic terrorism for fear of backlash (from public or, worse, the US government)

I think it doesn't matter if Apple is standing ground on privacy purely for cynical marketing reasons, or if they are doing it for real sincere reasons. In both cases it leads to the same result, a bit more privacy than the rest of Google/Meta tech.

There is absolutely a connection between the EU forcing Apple to weaken their user privacy with laws and measures disguised as fighting a "monopoly" ( as if Apple had one ..). It's a smart way to prepare us Europeans for what is coming.

To be clear, I'm happy with quite a few regulations like GPDR and such, but that isn't in contradiction with them preparing the biggest privacy-invasion ever thru other regulations disguised as fighting monopolies.

And if Apple fight them purely for cynical business reasons, I'm fine with that as long as it leads to the desired result : more privacy protection for users.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I think it doesn't matter if Apple is standing ground on privacy purely for cynical marketing reasons, or if they are doing it for real sincere reasons. In both cases it leads to the same result, a bit more privacy that the rest of Google/Meta tech.

There is absolutely a connection between the EU forcing Apple to weaken their user privacy with laws and measures disguised as fighting "monopoly" ( as if Apple had one ..). It's a smart way to prepare us for what is coming.

If that's your take, you're fighting an unwinnable war anyways.

MegaCorps aren't going to be a savior against governments.

Apple won't even release a TV show for fear of retaliation from 1/3 of the US as well as the US Gov.

This is about money for Apple and very little else.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

I don't like the speed limits in my city. Instead of obeying them, I will tell the city to remove them. They prevent me from getting to work on time.

No, I will not simply leave home earlier. I am right. It is the government and its people that are wrong.

 

[Webcat86]

Good.

The only way to deal with behavior like Apple is displaying is to forcefully and publicly push back, especially when Apple tries to twist the narratives in their favor.

Apple has become tedious on this topic.

I appreciate this being said:


“This undermines the company’s narrative of wanting to be fully cooperative with the Commission.”

He said Apple had snubbed the Commission’s efforts to engage in positive talks to help them comply with the DMA.

“Results of this positive engagement? After two months, Apple came back and asked us to scrap everything,” he said, adding: “We of course fully get companies want to defend their profits at all costs, but that’s not what the DMA is about.”

Can you elaborate on “positive talks” and “fully cooperative?”

Sounds a hell of a lot like “do as we tell you” to me.

 

[I7guy]

I don't like the speed limits in my city. Instead of obeying them, I will tell the city to remove them. They prevent me from getting to work on time.

Correct. You vote out the people that make the laws you don’t agree with.

No, I will not simply leave home earlier. I am right. It is the government and its people that are wrong.

You can change government. Free speech and all that. Same as Apple. Free speech and all that.

 

[Pezimak]

As it should. And as a consumer you have choices as well in picking who to do business with.

Fortunately that is not how competition works in Europe, it doesn’t follow American business ethics. If Apple doesn’t like the laws of capitalism and business outside the US, then it can very well stay in the US ONLY and stop complaining. It makes enough money as it is… Don’t like EU laws? Fine pull out of the market, lose your billions in annual turnover and suffer the loss of share price and access to technologies and science.

 

[surferfb]

I don't like the speed limits in my city. Instead of obeying them, I will tell the city to remove them. They prevent me from getting to work on time.

No, I will not simply leave home earlier. I am right. It is the government and its people that are wrong.

I don't like that some of my citizens prefer a closed ecosystem when an option for an open one exists. So I will ban companies from being able to offer closed ecosystems. Who cares about the free market. I am right, the free market, citizens who prefer it, and the companies who offer it are wrong.

 

[ginkobiloba]

If that's your take, you're fighting an unwinnable war anyways.

MegaCorps aren't going to be a savior against governments.

Apple won't even release a TV show for fear of retaliation from 1/3 of the US as well as the US Gov.

This is about money for Apple and very little else.

It doesn't matter if it's about money or not. see my response for a similar post : https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...act-over-feature-delays.2467466/post-34178551

 

[turbineseaplane]

see my response for a similar post : https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...act-over-feature-delays.2467466/post-34178551

That's actually a post I already replied to, and you just quoted here.. haha

I think we are typing at the same time.
All good

👍

 

[surferfb]

Apple really is trying it’s best to gaslight everyone, it has nothing to do with any consumerism and everything to do with Apple protecting it’s 30% cut.

What does requiring Apple give live translation to Bose & B&O have to do with the App Store and Apple's cut at all?

 

[I7guy]

If that's your take, you're fighting an unwinnable war anyways.

It’s true. Bad government regulations do persist.

MegaCorps aren't going to be a savior against governments.

An bad governments and/or regulations aren’t the citizen champions either.

Apple won't even release a TV show for fear of retaliation from 1/3 of the US as well as the US Gov.

Right and Jimmy Kimmel’s show was suspended because what he said was completely innocuous.

This is about money for Apple and very little else.

An it should be. Apple is a for profit private company that earns its revenue from its customers. If it’s customers aren’t buying they aren’t getting served properly.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

I don't like that some of my citizens prefer a closed ecosystem when an option for an open one exists. So I will ban companies from being able to offer closed ecosystems. Who cares about the free market. I am right, the free market, citizens who prefer it, and the companies who offer it are wrong.

This is the part that I don't get, and that anti-DMA people fail to explain. How, exactly, has Apple's ecosystem been forced open? We've had DMA for what, nearly 2 years now?

In what way is any European forced to leave the walled garden? From here it looks like you can happily and successfully stay inside of it if you so pleased.

Is that not what consumer choice looks like?

 

[I7guy]

Fortunately that is not how competition works in Europe, it doesn’t follow American business ethics.

We understand that and that is why the state of tech is the way it is.

If Apple doesn’t like the laws of capitalism and business outside the US, then it can very well stay in the US ONLY and stop complaining.

Or it can exercise its free speech. Correct? Or it can pull out or Trump can raise the tariffs or….

It makes enough money as it is…

I love it when people count other people’s money.

Don’t like EU laws? Fine pull out of the market, lose your billions in annual turnover and suffer the loss of share price and access to technologies and science.

Sure maybe the US should halt all aid to the EU as well if we are going in that direction.