Apple Comments on Microsoft's Laptop Hunter Ads

[Digital Skunk]

Are you kidding? I hope so. Laptops, due to their portability, are more prone to accidents. Do you think the guy that dropped his Macbook in that thread I linked wanted to do it? Obviously not. It's called an accident. And accidents happen.


First off, I didn't make an analogy. Second, your conclusion is ridiculous. My point is that Macs aren't design to some higher standard that people seem to think (ie. comparing Macs to BMW and PC to Kia).

Put an aluminum Mac through the same tests that Sony Z series went through and it would be ugly. And that Sony Z is just a regular laptop, not some industrial strength one like a Toughbook.

that was such a sound argument that I you must be right. I have never heard anything ever put that way.

I am off to sell my macs now and buy Sony Z laptops since I can drop them all day without a problem. I never knew how important it was to drop my laptop on a daily basis, Apple users are suckers since they can't drop their laptops, those loosers don't know what they are missing!

The next time I look for a mobile workstation that's NOT a touchbook, I will make sure to drop it a few times, right on the hard asphalt or tile floor.

In other words, we get you, but what's really the point bro? Users buy touch books if they intend to manhandle them, other than that they treat their machine carefully. If we were talking cell phones here, sure, iPods, maybe, basketballs, HELL YEAH..... laptops..... eh, not so much.

Once again, we understand and welcome the links, just that it may not be the best example of FAIL for Apple.

 

[mikeinternet]

We humans simply have to fight or argue over something or anything. Race, color, religion computer brand. When I was into PCs it was IBM vs Compaq and on and on ad nauseam ... we fight over anything at all.

1000 years from now there may be OS wars!

 

[pdjudd]

No but that wasn't your point. Your point was, why would Apple bother to design a computer you just stick under your desk or tuck away somewhere. Yet that's what they're doing with the Mini and the Mac Pro.

I don't see that with the mini and as I have said twice, the Pro does not count. Its a workstation thats not intended to be shown off like an iMac is. Its a workhorse and thats it.

If they made a slim tower, like this one but with an aluminium case of course...

Just because ASUS or another PC manufacturer does something, doesn't mean that Apple should do it. We are talking about Apple - not Asus.

...I'd say it would end up *on* people's desks, or next to TV sets and such. Could be useful as a media center. I use a Mini for that, but obviously it would be nice with a little more storage, HDMI, 5.1 output etc. You can only get so much livingroom fun out of a lunchbox with a headphone jack and a laptop HDD.

Once again, you project your impressions onto the masses. I see nothing more than an elegant plastic small form factor PC. I see them all the time and I still don't see why Apple should do one. Just because a PC company can make a small form factor, doesn't mean anything regarding Apple. Once again, you want Apple to product something that goes against what Apple does. The Mini is not intended to be a home server no matter how much you want it to be. Its hardly part of Apple's focus anyway. Apple's main desktop computer that they tout is the iMac. They aren't going to change that system. It just does not fit with Apple. Its irrelevant that tits technically possible. Thats not the point. Apple's consumer things are built to be shown off, not shoved aside. You can't just say "the mini gets shoved away" without admitting the fact that the mini is not a tower or a mini tower. Its nothing more than a small form factor computer that is kept around to dangle in fronto of switchers.

You want a powerful small form factor. That isn't the mini and its not going to be something that Apple builds unless you want their prosumer workstation. These things aren't desktop friendly anyway. You want something that Apple just doesn't want to sell. It's just not in their DNA to make something that everybody else has and is largely relegated to under the desk.

 

[awmazz]

Did you even watch all the tests in the Sony link? I expect laptops to survive moderate accidental drops without bending out of shape and looking like hell was unleashed on it like the forum member's laptop. Do you think your Macbook would survive the reliability tests in that Sony video? I think not.

An Apple laptop will survive 99% (pulled that figure out of the air) of all typical laptop drops without a single mark or dent - the Magsafe power connector is magnetically detachable when the typical dufus trips over the power cord and typically brings the laptop sliding off the desk onto the floor. *That* is Apple's design for impact-damage prevention, not Soviet-style Soyuz impact-withstanding re-entry vehicle design.

This is all part of the industrial design a lot of people seem to ignore. You don't think Apple researched the most common cause of laptop falls? And how did they solve it? Very elegantly. And cleverly. Not by making it impact proof by reverting to cheap shock absorbing plastic, but by designing it to remove the greatest cause of impact damage itself so they can go on and be free to design a damn fine looking piece of equipment however they want.

And as for that guy who threw his laptop over his shoulder onto a concrete driveway, he's that guy. You know, that guy they put labels on hairdryers for in hotels which say "do not use while in shower". Don't ever use that guy as an example of type of the typical 'these things that can happen to you too', or you demean who you are talking to.

My point is that Macs aren't design to some higher standard that people seem to think (ie. comparing Macs to BMW and PC to Kia).

Well, your point is wrong, because yes they are. You're previous comment about them just being the same PC in a fancy skin means you can't see the industrial design either. Even the modest power connector is part of Apple's industrial design which sets them at a much higher standard than your example of having to throw laptops around as some necessary part of that process.

 

[pdjudd]

This is all part of the industrial design a lot of people seem to ignore. You don't think Apple researched the most common cause of laptop falls? And how did they solve it? Not by making it impact proof by reverting to cheap shock absorbing plastic, but by designing it to remove the greatest cause of impact damage so they can go on and be free to design a damn fine looking piece of equipment.

I agree, People seem to forget that Macs are all about shiny aluminum products. They really think about their design so that the not only look good, but to implement forward looking technologies. Apple isn't going to make something that isn't forward looking. One of the things they sacrificed is expandability in all but the product lines that demand it (the Mac Pro is the prime example). On the other extreme is the mini which is not intended to be upgraded at all (you have to way go out of your way). Apple's biggest grief is against graphics cards, but I contend that they don't want to deal with the wide swath of video cards out there that mostly exist to satisfy gamers (and thats mostly Direct X oriented and Apple hasn't been much of a gamers system anyway) and their drives (which are mostly form factor related - there aren't any lot loading blue ray drives in Apples size - except on the pro not enough to re-architect the system).

Apple has always looked at their products from the point of view of simplification and good looks that you would want to show off. That explains the iMac and their design on the MacBooks. No surprise, these units are the bulk of their consumer business. Part of their design mantra simply said "most of our units are not going to be upgradeable by the end user and we are OK by that. We don't want our hardware to be associated with the beige boxes." Apple's mantra is think different. That means making innovation and offering things that defy what the rest of the consumer (not prosumer) demands. The Magsafe plug is a great example of an approach that solves a problem that nobody approached before. And you know what? PC makes still make power adapters that plug in and can break off after tripping on the cable causing the dang thing to fall off the desk. The only time a computer should hit the ground is if the whole computer is in somebody's hands. That is pretty uncommon given that laptops usually go from desk to bag.

Apple offers great products that their competitors almost never offer. Better means lots of things. Thats what makes them good and thats all I am going to say on this topic. Its getting too tough for me to argue with people on this subject. Apple may not be perfect (and I do have my grievances with them on a few things), but I just am not going to argue on what Apple will or will not do compared to the PC industry. Its a bit out of my league and can start getting into things that too tough to explain. Suffice to say, Apple is not a specs company. They are not now nor will they ever will. Thats not what a Mac is and that something that the PC industry and especially Microsoft doesn't understand. Macs are more than speed a cheap bargain. But they are not just style, coolness, or a cult of fanboys. If you look at anything by looking at their extremes, you will always see the worst in them.

 

[Synthetickiller]

May I ask you a question? You joined a few days ago, and your first post seemed innocent. You asked a few questions that seemed very reasonable. Then all of a sudden, your tone and opinions changed. You became heated and confrontational, and began baiting people into topics you seemed all too prepared for shooting down, almost as though you had a prepared list to follow an agenda. Why did you join Macrumors if you loathe Apple products so much and refer to those who prefer it as "snobs"?

Operating systems are only as useful as the available software, right? What good is something like linux to a person who doesn't know very much? Not very much for the average user. For someone who loves to program, its a gem, right? You can compile anything. Simple, yet can be elegant and complex if you like.

Then there's the other side, the no-nothings who need a n00b friendly gui to make things work. These are people who specifically use a computer for email, internet, and documents (sometimes). If you showed them where the icons where in ANY OS, they would be fine. Linux would be as "safe" as mac from viruses, whereas windows is not. Of course, its due to popularity of use, so of course, its going to be targeted by hackers and the like so its not as "safe."

There are others (many who use both macs and PCs alike) who do more than just internet browsing, but not full blown programing all the time. This is what I don't understand. Windows has a nearly limitless amount of software. Linux far less, much is homebrew (not bad), but can be a pain for new hardware, wireless drivers (this might have been remedied since I tried ubuntu about a year ago). What I still have to see is the "draw" towards macs. I was hoping people could give examples of software that I "can't live without" that only available on the mac platform. I did a bit (not a lot mind you) of searching and I have yet to find anything revolutionary or different, besides the gui (which I've seen been done in linux, much better mind you). Spread sheets are spreadsheets, auto updates are still just updates, and itunes is still itunes. What is the difference besides this so-called "cool" factor? I'd like to know, b/c if there is something better about it (not stability since that not an issue for me) I'd purchase one.

I joined in hope to find some decent info on why a mac would be better, but I repeatedly keep finding posts like "way to go apple" or "apple is the best" in response to some marketing venture made by apple. Are these guys payed by apple or something?

 

[Sehnsucht]

It's pretty ridiculous that you don't get that particular Optiplex fixed or replaced.

Even more ridiculous that EVERY DAY without fail you make the same mistake and use an obviously sick machine.

But the most ridiculous thing is that you expect us to believe that anecdote!

How is a sudden freeze triggered by a double click a "mistake"? The school has 350+ Optiplexes, all of the same model. The glitchfest plagues all of them, with varied frequency. I can sign on to any computer in the school and it will happen eventually (which averages about an hour at least.) The teachers claim the slowness is due to the fact all our files are stored on the server. Which doesn't make sense because a network is supposed to function normally and at acceptable speeds.

Oh and did I mention viruses and pop-ups? We're supposed to have some sort of enterprise antivirus software, but it never works. If it's not a BSOD, then it's a pop-up like "XXX HORNY MOMS ON MILF CAM XXX".

As for me expecting anyone to believe it, I'm sure the other 99% of non-Windows-troll forum readers will have no problem believing it. Tomorrow is Monday...I shall have my phone ready in the morning to take a snapshot of the screen for proof.

 

[tubbymac]

What I still have to see is the "draw" towards macs. I was hoping people could give examples of software that I "can't live without" that only available on the mac platform. I did a bit (not a lot mind you) of searching and I have yet to find anything revolutionary or different, besides the gui (which I've seen been done in linux, much better mind you).

What's the point? Why should we tell you why you should get a Mac if you're already happy without one? If you weren't happy, that'd be a different story.

If you're happy drinking cheap wine and you go to a wine tasting convention, can't see what all the fuss is about, and ask everybody there to tell you why you should prefer finer wine, what do you expect them to say?

If you can't see what the fuss is about you don't really need a Mac and are the wrong person for a Mac.

 

[AidenShaw]

How is a sudden freeze triggered by a double click a "mistake"?

Really, all you have to do is double-click to BSOD a Vista system? That's pretty much unbelievable.

It doesn't surprise me that 350 systems running Photoshop from one file server would be a bit sluggish - unless it's a pretty massive server with multiple 10 GbE or multiple teamed GbE links to a fast switch, with a really good multi-pathed Fibre Channel disk array.

Instead of hunting for MILFs, your school should hunt for competent IT staff.

 

[Synthetickiller]

What's the point? Why should we tell you why you should get a Mac if you're already happy without one? If you weren't happy, that'd be a different story.

If you're happy drinking cheap wine and you go to a wine tasting convention, can't see what all the fuss is about, and ask everybody there to tell you why you should prefer finer wine, what do you expect them to say?

If you can't see what the fuss is about you don't really need a Mac and are the wrong person for a Mac.

There goes the "snobbishness". You're equating windows (or anything else since you don't actually know everything I run) to cheap wine and mac to fine wine. I can't see the forest for the trees? I don't think so.

I'd like to know what I'm missing out on.

The point is, it should be clear why it's superior. Is my question that difficult to answer? Why are you guys using mac as opposed to windows or linux? Is that a better question to ask?

 

[zephyrnoid]

I prefer to see my competition using PC's. It knocks a bundle off the cost of competing

 

[Synthetickiller]

I prefer to see my competition using PC's. It knocks a bundle off the cost of competing

Care to elaborate? What are you referring to?

 

[queshy]

check out apple's new ads....pretty funny (most of them).

 

[NoSmokingBandit]

The point is, it should be clear why it's superior. Is my question that difficult to answer? Why are you guys using mac as opposed to windows or linux? Is that a better question to ask?

I can only speak for myself here, but i find that iLife is what keeps me on OS X. Which is ironic because iLife is geared toward amateurs and prosumers yet the hardware required to run it is priced out of the range of most amateurs and prosumers. It seems a little contradictory. Apple keeps trying to appeal to college students and soccer moms, both of which usually cant afford to drop $1300 on a 13" laptop.

@queshy
I just watched the new ads. Imo they are the worst batch yet. It feels like Apple is really lashing out with these commercials and it feels immature and angry. Just my opinion though.

 

[Sehnsucht]

Really, all you have to do is double-click to BSOD a Vista system? That's pretty much unbelievable.

It's not Vista, it's XP. If I mentioned otherwise I apologize for the mix-up. Performance under Photoshop (or any other Adobe app) is always extremely sluggish, which is a double whammy since nearly all my assignments have me needing to run Photoshop and Flash at the same time. When this is going on, a single click can and does trigger a crash. I sh*t you not. Cross my heart and hope to die.

It doesn't surprise me that 350 systems running Photoshop from one file server would be a bit sluggish - unless it's a pretty massive server with multiple 10 GbE or multiple teamed GbE links to a fast switch, with a really good multi-pathed Fibre Channel disk array.

I don't know what we have, but I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it probably isn't that.

Instead of hunting for MILFs, your school should hunt for competent IT staff.

Ditto. And we should get Macs.

 

[Synthetickiller]

I can only speak for myself here, but i find that iLife is what keeps me on OS X. Which is ironic because iLife is geared toward amateurs and prosumers yet the hardware required to run it is priced out of the range of most amateurs and prosumers. It seems a little contradictory. Apple keeps trying to appeal to college students and soccer moms, both of which usually cant afford to drop $1300 on a 13" laptop.

Thank you! Thats what I was looking for. Thanks for not over analyzing the question.

I will look into ilife and see if I could ever use it.

 

[Mad Mac]

An Apple laptop will survive 99% (pulled that figure out of the air) of all typical laptop drops without a single mark or dent.

Do you make up a lot of numbers to justify your position? Let me try that too. An Apple laptop will NOT survive 99% of all laptop drops withouth a single mark or dent.

the Magsafe power connector is magnetically detachable when the typical dufus trips over the power cord and typically brings the laptop sliding off the desk onto the floor. *That* is Apple's design for impact-damage prevention, not Soviet-style Soyuz impact-withstanding re-entry vehicle design.

And yet I've never dragged a laptop off the table by tripping on the cord. But I'm always knocking the power cord out by simply moving my MBP around because MagSafe sucks. It's an answer to a question nobody asked.

This is all part of the industrial design a lot of people seem to ignore. You don't think Apple researched the most common cause of laptop falls? And how did they solve it? Very elegantly. And cleverly. Not by making it impact proof by reverting to cheap shock absorbing plastic, but by designing it to remove the greatest cause of impact damage itself so they can go on and be free to design a damn fine looking piece of equipment however they want.

LOL. Yeah, design a product with sharp edges that dig into your palms and will transmit the most energy on a drop. That's both ergonomic and preferred in engineering. Not.

And how about those scratching Nanos. I bet Apple ID thought about that too huh? Or did they think about it after the lawsuit?

And as for that guy who threw his laptop over his shoulder onto a concrete driveway, he's that guy. You know, that guy they put labels on hairdryers for in hotels which say "do not use while in shower". Don't ever use that guy as an example of type of the typical 'these things that can happen to you too', or you demean who you are talking to.

Way to insult a fellow forum member. Accidents happen. Maybe you're perfect but people do have mishaps.

Well, your point is wrong, because yes they are. You're previous comment about them just being the same PC in a fancy skin means you can't see the industrial design either. Even the modest power connector is part of Apple's industrial design which sets them at a much higher standard than your example of having to throw laptops around as some necessary part of that process.

ID means exactly what I said. The same hardware in a different suit. You obviously don't do product design if you think a magnetic power cord is enough to redeem a MBP in reliability testing.

In other words, we get you, but what's really the point bro?

If you don't know the point then you don't need to know the point. You'll figure it out soon enough if you ever drop your laptop or spill water on it.

 

[Double J]

oops

 

[Setmose]

No, it would be the false premise where you stated that allowing customers to downgrade to XP from Vista was a sign of it 'sucking' when actually MS have allowed previous version downgrades with every OS they've released.



Yes. After March 31 2004. Three years after XP was released. What part of that are you having difficulty understanding?



Actually, I ignored it because it's the usual clueless rant from someone who gets their info from fansites rather than product literature. I just don't see the point in debating with someone as ill informed as you appear to be.

Let's see. You "snipped", and ran away from my point that in past "quiet" downgrade programs the user was left to search for a replacement OS, whereas with Vista the downgrade is included as media in the box and advertised by the PC manufacturers as a product *feature*, because consumers and business demand XP upfront, because they know that Vista sucks.

Let's see. You "snipped" and didn't bother at all to answer the question: if Vista doesn't have problems, why did Microsoft spend millions of dollars on the lame "Mojave Experiment" ads. The answer is that enough people are withholding revenue from Microsoft (because they know that Vista sucks) that Microsoft felt the need to make an expensive marketing maneuver towards recouping that lost revenue.

Let's see. You state in sneering and arrogant terms that you don't see the point in debating me, who got info from a "fansite" (and I provided additional quotes). But you continue to do so. In a "fansite" no less.

Failed Logic 101, again.

You are a prime case. You are not even a fanboi who likes something, but rather just another netspace loser trying to prove his geek manhood anonymously. And failing.

 

[BongoBanger]

Let's see. You "snipped", and ran away from my point that in past "quiet" downgrade programs the user was left to search for a replacement OS, whereas with Vista the downgrade is included as media in the box and advertised by the PC manufacturers as a product *feature*, because consumers and business demand XP upfront, because they know that Vista sucks.

What the hell? MS have never been 'quiet' about downgrade options. As mentioned a number of times they've offered it for every version Windows that I can recall.

The difference is there were no stupid tech blogs trumping the downgrade option as a 'fact' that XP sucked back in 2001.

Let's see. You "snipped" and didn't bother at all to answer the question: if Vista doesn't have problems, why did Microsoft spend millions of dollars on the lame "Mojave Experiment" ads. The answer is that enough people are withholding revenue from Microsoft (because they know that Vista sucks) that Microsoft felt the need to make an expensive marketing maneuver towards recouping that lost revenue.

Vista does have problems in terms of perception. No-one's arguing that. Your argument, however, was that the downgrade options was an indicator of this which is flat out wrong.

It helps to know what one's talking about and, frankly, you don't.

 

[Wikinerd]

Operating systems are only as useful as the available software, right? What good is something like linux to a person who doesn't know very much? Not very much for the average user. For someone who loves to program, its a gem, right? You can compile anything. Simple, yet can be elegant and complex if you like.

Exactly. And are you saying you cannot do the same in Mac OS X? Most of the open source apps you find out there has the source where you can take it and compile it yourself if you find it fun that way.

(Besides, Mac OS X can run most programs/apps for Linux distros via X11)

Then there's the other side, the no-nothings who need a n00b friendly gui to make things work. These are people who specifically use a computer for email, internet, and documents (sometimes). If you showed them where the icons where in ANY OS, they would be fine. Linux would be as "safe" as mac from viruses, whereas windows is not. Of course, its due to popularity of use, so of course, its going to be targeted by hackers and the like so its not as "safe."

Ah, but for something other than normal browsing, most Linux distros start lacking in terms of pre-compiled apps. Or no apps at all.. And for the GUI, there is a difference. Maybe you should look at the difference between GNOME, KDE, and Apple's Human Interface Guidelines

There are others (many who use both macs and PCs alike) who do more than just internet browsing, but not full blown programing all the time. This is what I don't understand. Windows has a nearly limitless amount of software. Linux far less, much is homebrew (not bad), but can be a pain for new hardware, wireless drivers (this might have been remedied since I tried ubuntu about a year ago). What I still have to see is the "draw" towards macs. I was hoping people could give examples of software that I "can't live without" that only available on the mac platform. I did a bit (not a lot mind you) of searching and I have yet to find anything revolutionary or different, besides the gui (which I've seen been done in linux, much better mind you). Spread sheets are spreadsheets, auto updates are still just updates, and itunes is still itunes. What is the difference besides this so-called "cool" factor? I'd like to know, b/c if there is something better about it (not stability since that not an issue for me) I'd purchase one.

More programs/apps does not necessarily mean better programs/apps. While there may not be as many apps for OS X, most of what people find essential is found on OS X (no, gaming doesn't count. You won't die because you didn't go on Crysis or what you happen to like for a few days). For those apps that you can find on Windows and you can't find for Mac, you have a few choices: run it under Wine (maybe using one of codeweaver's apps), run it in a VM, or run it in BootCamp, which is what it's for...

Though coming to think of it, there are a few apps (or suites of apps) that I can run in Mac OS X that cannot be found on Windows. First being iWork; I have had a hard time with powerpoint, and making the transitions look something more than "pure boredom"... Keynote really helps; at least it is done in style—it is made with design in mind. Nothing I can find on Windows comes anywhere remotely near. Numbers? Mostly better than Excel, but still got quite a few functions missing. Pages is more or less perfect. (Oo.o is better than Microsoft Office, but still not as good as iWork...) Second, 1Password—all-in-one password management utility, digital wallet, secure notes, digital identity, form filler; all that can be used in conjunction with all OS X browsers—and done in AES-128. Another app that cannot be found in Windows is Quicksilver; dubbed as the "Swiss Army Knife" of Application launchers that can do nearly everything "except file your taxes and bake you warm delicious cookies." (anything from launching iTunes and playing a specific playlist to issuing terminal commands). Simply "insanely great". And while Photoshop is not bad, there is a little-known competitor for it called Pixelmator; does nearly everything Photoshop does in addition to new and original brushes and filters. Pixelmator uses your graphics card for filters; it doesn't tie up the CPU; and how is it different to GIMP? Little or no learning curve—as well as a prevailing interface in comparison to Photoshop. For coding? BBEdit for sure— do anything from PHP to Java to ObjC, and lightweight but powerful... Extremely powerful. And of course, the iLife suite—nothing out there does things so elegantly and integrates everything so gracefully as the iLife suite. "Comes free with every new mac" and a "$79 upgrade for existing copies".

And btw, you said that you've seen the GUI done better in Linux distros... So why exactly did the Mac's market share double in less than 4 years, and Linux still stayed at around 1%? Why aren't people using that particular Linux distro if the GUI is "done better" (made easier to use, more efficient; which is what GUIs are for)?

I joined in hope to find some decent info on why a mac would be better, but I repeatedly keep finding posts like "way to go apple" or "apple is the best" in response to some marketing venture made by apple. Are these guys payed by apple or something?

What did you expect? Do you expect "Oh I like mac because of ...", "macs are superior because of ..."? God. This is a discussion thread for THE TOPIC—which happens to be about ads—Apple's ads. So how strange is it for people who say "way to go Apple" when they made a successful (subjective) campaign?

It's like Digg. You've got a topic, people can just comment on the topic, or they can discuss about the topic. So does that mean that they're paid by Digg or whatever that topic is about? No.

Please.

Oh, and you still have a question to answer: (no BSing and no changing of the subject.)

May I ask you a question? You joined a few days ago, and your first post seemed innocent. You asked a few questions that seemed very reasonable. Then all of a sudden, your tone and opinions changed. You became heated and confrontational, and began baiting people into topics you seemed all too prepared for shooting down, almost as though you had a prepared list to follow an agenda. Why did you join Macrumors if you loathe Apple products so much and refer to those who prefer it as "snobs"?

What the hell? MS have never been 'quiet' about downgrade options. As mentioned a number of times they've offered it for every version Windows that I can recall.

The difference is there were no stupid tech blogs trumping the downgrade option as a 'fact' that XP sucked back in 2001.

That's because XP's launch was successful—rather unlike Vista's. The Vista downgrade option backfired so badly that Microsoft had a hard time getting people to stay with vista.

The big news every time XP's phase-out is a result of the media onslaught that Vista's failure as an anticipated operating system release.

Vista does have problems in terms of perception. No-one's arguing that. Your argument, however, was that the downgrade options was an indicator of this which is flat out wrong.

It helps to know what one's talking about and, frankly, you don't.

Well, Vista did have it's fair share of problems to scare off consumer trust ("say it ain't so" http://blip.tv/file/340692). And that is what the Mojave Experiment is supposed to bring back—and ~failed~. Again. This perception you're talking about is a consequence of Microsoft's failure to deliver Vista as the Operating System it's hyped up to be (which is again their own fault—they can just keep it secret and release it when ready).

Yeah. It helps to know what one's talking about, and frankly, you don't.

 

[4D4M]

What I still have to see is the "draw" towards macs. I was hoping people could give examples of software that I "can't live without" that only available on the mac platform. I did a bit (not a lot mind you) of searching and I have yet to find anything revolutionary or different, besides the gui (which I've seen been done in linux, much better mind you). Spread sheets are spreadsheets, auto updates are still just updates, and itunes is still itunes. What is the difference besides this so-called "cool" factor? I'd like to know, b/c if there is something better about it (not stability since that not an issue for me) I'd purchase one.

It would help if you could tell us what kind of apps you're looking for. What do you use a computer for? What line of work are you in?

It's a bit difficult to pluck apps out of the air and recommend them without knowing your background. There are lots of apps I use on a daily basis that I consider vital, but unless your need is the same as mine, you might find them useless.

If you can be a bit more specific I'm sure some people here would be very willing to point you towards some great apps.

 

[AidenShaw]

This perception you're talking about is a consequence of Microsoft's failure to deliver Vista as the Operating System it's hyped up to be (which is again their own fault—they can just keep it secret and release it when ready).

Microsoft is doing that - it's called Windows 7 and it will be out this summer at every computer store except for one.

Microsoft, however, is not keeping it a secret. By releasing the beta to millions of people, they are putting pressure on hardware and software vendors to make sure that everything works on Windows 7 on Day 1.

If you look at many download sites, "Windows 7" is already listed as a supported OS! (Which is easy, of course, since virtually every Vista driver and application should work on Windows 7.)

Note this at Nvidia's driver download page, for example:

 

[djellison]

There are lots of apps I use on a daily basis that I consider vital, but unless your need is the same as mine, you might find them useless.

I'd be interested to know what they are.

I have only one Mac app that I simply have to use. Keynote. It does things that I need, that powerpoint can't do. It's that simple.

Everything else, I'm OS ambivalent.

 

[Wikinerd]

Microsoft is doing that - it's called Windows 7 and it will be out this summer at every computer store except for one.

Microsoft, however, is not keeping it a secret. By releasing the beta to millions of people, they are putting pressure on hardware and software vendors to make sure that everything works on Windows 7 on Day 1.

If you look at many download sites, "Windows 7" is already listed as a supported OS! (Which is easy, of course, since virtually every Vista driver and application should work on Windows 7.)

Note this at Nvidia's driver download page, for example:

Apart from a few minor changes (such as revamped explorer) imho Windows 7 is only a streamlined version of Vista... The free upgrade the consumers deserve for all the hassle caused by the Vista debacle. Microsoft really should take a page out of Apple's history on this one. (OS X 10.0 was a major failure—and Apple's response was to release a less buggy, streamlined version 10.1 for free.)