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Apple Considering Separate WWDC Conferences for Mac and iOS?

Bad idea!

iOS is Cocoa.

The Mac and iDevice developers are still writing in Objective-C and using the frameworks with its heritage from NeXTstep that eventually became Cocoa. iOS adds some UITouch features to accommodate the special features of the iDevices, but so much of what all of the Apple developers do is in common, it would be destructive to separate them.

I think it is wise for Apple to keep the pace of Mac OS X major versions relatively slow, giving the public the impression that it is a mature, stable platform and the feature-bloat game is over. Obviously, the iPad and iPhone 4 are the sexiest and flashiest things Apple has at the moment, but by this time next year, the novelty will have worn off and new Macs and the latest big cat OS can step back into the spotlight.

There's not a big ObjC community outside of Apple devs. Bifurcating them would be stupid.
 
Two separate WWDC's would be great. Apple has been neglecting the Mac OS X side of things.

I mean Snow Leopard looks exactly the same as Panther to me but with a few transparent menu bars.

I want them to give the whole Mac OS a complete overhaul in design. Hate to say it but Windows 7 looks better than Snow Leopard in the good looks department. Obviously Mac OS X still runs nicer though :)
 
Great Idea!!!!

Ever since Apple entered the "gadget" market the Mac and Mac OS have become like step-children. THEY NEED MORE LOVE!!!!

Hope if this comes to pass that it will be more than just window dressing.....
 
I really don't see the issue here. Two developer conferences are a no brainer.

The advantages are numerous.

1. More specific sessions on the product lines. Mobile products (iPod/iPhone/iPad) and more on Desktop (Mac)

2. It's easier for Apple to do two separate events than one long one. Anyone that's worked a tradeshow before knows that doubling the amount of time is grueling. I'd presume a good setup would be WWDC Mac in January around CES time and WWDC Mobile in June (perfect for back to school)

3. Apple can send the proper engineers. Right now they must send Engineers working on both Mac and iOS platforms. With two WWDC they need only send Engineers who are working on the specific platform. I realize there is overlap here but the flexibility is there.

4. Some iOS developers have no plans to make Mac programs. They have no desire to attend Mac sessions. Some Mac developers have no desire to make iOS programs nor attend sessions. Splitting WWDC gives the focus that these developers need. Those who need both can attend both.

5. Developer reach. Apple's a huge company now. They need to keep their developers engaged. Shafting one platform for the other doesn't make sense.

Cost isn't much of an issue for many companies as attendance of these events can be written off. The benefits of labs, direct access to Apple engineers and the networking benefits far outweigh the monetary costs for many companies.

Apple's had a somewhat sordid history with their developers. They now have WWDC selling out in days not weeks. That's a telltale sign that it's time to expand.

My hope is that next year we could see a WWDC Mac in January with the announcement of 10.7 (shipping in the late Spring early Summer). The WWDC Mac session would grow as well to encompass perhaps a future Mac OS X Home Server and new Apple TV and any other CE products Apple chooses to deliver. January is the right time as the focus is on what new technologies are going to be hot for 2011.
 
Ahh, I can see it now

SJ: Welcome to Mac OS X WWDC 2011.





*crickets chirp*



[turns to Jon Ive] are you sure I'm not allowed to talk about the new iPhone?
 
CFreymarc said:
That makes a lot of sense. The issue is travel and access. Steve Jobs made a strong mention that "we can't find a bigger place" for a conference. This is true if you restrict your venues to the California Bay Area.
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What? Oracle Open World is a 40K-58K person attended event in the exact same complex. OK, Open world also spills out into the sourrounding hotel convention facilities too. 5K ... large .... LOL. Wondercon (a comic convention) might have had more than 5K in Moscone on the peak day a couple of months ago and certainly over the course of the whole weekend.


The Moscone complex can handle the increase in bodies. However, you can just show up one day and say I want the whole complex a couple months from now. I think it is more the case don't know what to do with the large floor space of Moscone North and South. It isn't like have hundreds of vendors that need to display.

I think part of Apple's issue is that they want to keep the conference small. Similar to only having a limited number of products keep more attention on fewer items. Very similar to limited size classrooms for teaching.

The keynote... which they could probably sell tickets to fill up Moscone North and South if really wanted to is not WWDC. Maybe the two conferences would be the keynote circus show and then the boring developers conference.





If really just need larger set of smaller meeting rooms, they might need to use more of the smaller spaces in the hotels within walking distance. That isn't too hard or too difficult. No deep need to switch cities.




Personally, I would love to see WWDC in Las Vegas.
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Apple commonly announces that they bring 1000+ Apple employees to WWDC. That is logistically much more tractable when the vast majority of them go home every night.

Vegas is where you fly in a chunk of the corporate sales/marketing folks and your fat cat clients and whoop it up for a couple of days. That isn't what the core of WWDC should be about.
 
Sorry, but this rumors is stupid for a few reasons:
- MacOS X and iOS share the same Foundation. While the focus this year was on iOS, there were lots of Foundation stuff that applied to MacOS X - it just isn't flashy so it's not talked about. There were some MacOS X specific stuff too.
- They had 1000 Apple engineers, not to mention support staff, and sales staff present. Apple isn't going to take 1000 engineers + other staff away from their jobs for another week. Not to mention the time taken to prepare all of the presentations.
- Many Mac developers are also iOS developers - they're not going to pay to go to two different conferences, especially when there is so much overlap. Even if Apple gave them a break on the ticket price, the travel and hotel expenses are still significant.
 
Scottsdale said:
If Apple was split into two segments, openly sharing information and tech between them, it would result in the same level of innovation on both platforms.
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Sorry, but that's one of the worst suggestions I've read on this forum (and I've read quite a few).

I think it's great that Apple is a dynamic company that has the freedom to shift resources around depending on the current focus. And it's working pretty well for them I would say. Show me another company that has been as consistently innovative as Apple and sustained it for so many years.

So, why is iOS the focus at this time? As some people have wisely pointed out, Mac OS X is a more mature platform, while devices like the iPhone and iPad are (1) exploring much newer angles on communication, entertainment and learning, and (2) generating far greater media and consumer interest. It's a no-brainer really.

And really, what are we lacking in Snow Leopard?? I use it every day for business and personal use and I don't think it's wanting for features. If I had my way I might introduce better metadata into the file system and Finder, and… well honestly, I'm pressed to think of much more I'd want to add in.

macFanDave said:
I think it is wise for Apple to keep the pace of Mac OS X major versions relatively slow, giving the public the impression that it is a mature, stable platform and the feature-bloat game is over.
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I couldn't have said it better.
 
TheAshMan said:
This notion floated by Steve and Apple that the iPad is replacing existing desktop/laptop computing is not valid. … The iPad/appliance and mobile market will grow, but don't pretend they have replaced computers for everyone, for a vast majority they haven't.
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When did Steve or Apple say the iPad would 'replace' computers for everyone? I think you're putting words in Apple's mouth there.

We are going to see a shift. It comes down to what people are actually doing with these devices. If all you want to do is communicate with friends, a portable touchscreen device is probably going to win out over a less portable computer with separate input devices like keyboard and mouse. If you want to consume content that doesn't rely on a huge screen (music, books, games, interactive learning, etc), again, in most cases, the portable device is going to outshine the Mac/PC. When you want a huge screen (television, movies, games, presentations), it doesn't matter what kind of device so much, as long as it interfaces with a bloody big screen. Right? So again, you're going to see smaller, cheaper devices handle this stuff.

And that's really the point of the truck analogy. Outside of the office, a lot more time is spent consuming content than doing more complex tasks suited to a Mac/PC.

Small White Car said:
Imagine an average family today with 5 Macs (1 deskop and 4 personal Macbooks) and 1 iPad.

The future of that family is 1 iMac and 4 iPads. That iMac will be just as important as ever, but the days of every family member needing their own Mac/PC is ending.
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I agree. Not for every family maybe, but for most.
 
calderone said:
It isn't Apple's job to folks interested in OS X development. But even so, the current WWDC has sessions explicitly for iOS. So an iOS developer can simply stick with those sessions or labs.

This is a good thing.

This assumes the pricing would stay the same. I have already mentioned that Apple could offer a combo price or reduce the price of the individual conferences.

In addition, the Mac WWDC may well be smaller overall and can be supported in a smaller venue, thus a cheaper price.
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Do you think that Mac OS is less important than iOS ?

Without Mac OS there would not be iOS and 214,452 apps ! :eek::eek::eek:
 
Small White Car said:
I dunno.

Seems like it may make more sense to get a bigger space and effectively do the "two-conventions" plan, but the same week in buildings right next to each other.
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Why do that? why not have one convention straight after the other - make it a 2 week affair? Quite frankly as an employer allowing an employee to go to a 2 week development expo is money well spent compared to the millions wasted one executive bonus's, private jets and other creature comforts that add nothing to the bottom line.
 
I surely hope AAPL doesn't see its future as iOS

...for such a future would be gloomy, for me. Why? With OSX I can pull down apps to run from a variety of sources, web-wide. With iOS, my source is limited to apps approved by AAPL.

[No further rant or argument as to whether this is good or bad. I've heard the argument before: "Don't like AAPL's walled garden for iOS? Don't buy it!" I won't. Nuff said.]
 
Macintosh was OS 1 to 9. Then Mac OSX was 1 to 6 (10.0 to 10.6).

Now and for the future is iOS.

OSX is dead, they may support it for a while, but it's on it's way out.
 
For a mysterious reason I'm excited for 10.7

To my knowledge there's no available information I've encountered and that mystery keeps me in suspense.
 
Are people basing this "absence of Mac" on the keynote alone or the actual conference ? This is a 1 week event with many other things to see than just the keynote.

Rampant speculation based on 1 keynote that announced basically 1 product.

Get a grip people. I'm pretty sure people don't go to WWDC for the keynote, but for the developper content. Otherwise, why bother ? The keynote is not really dev oriented anyway, it's just a press/fanboy event to get the hype machine rolling.

I think the guy who said 2 keynotes, 1 event is on to something if you really have to have a Mac keynote everytime. Do one for opening day and one for closing day.
 
redbotsoftware said:
Macintosh was OS 1 to 9. Then Mac OSX was 1 to 6 (10.0 to 10.6).

Now and for the future is iOS.

OSX is dead, they may support it for a while, but it's on it's way out.
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It's funny how when some of us suggested the same thing before the conference we got laughed at. It doesn't seem so ridiculous now. On the other hand, what it will actually mean is that many of us will leave Apple products and go back to Windows (I doubt Linux will ever get its standards together to compete on a consumer level for commercial software). No OSX = Windows is King forever. Basically, Steve would be handing Microsoft back the keys to the kingdom because desktop and notebook level computing aren't going anywhere anytime soon. Some might argue they will never disappear because they will always be more powerful than some mobile device where you have to type with your thumbs (no thanks) and look at a tiny screen (I like larger screens personally). If Steve doesn't like traditional computers, then maybe he really should split off that part of the company and let a real leader handle it while he plays with his cell phones and tablets.
 
MagnusVonMagnum said:
On the other hand, what it will actually mean is that many of us will leave Apple products and go back to Windows (I doubt Linux will ever get its standards together to compete on a consumer level for commercial software).
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I was using Linux as a desktop back in 1998, I will use it as a desktop again if Apple ever drops OS X for some kind of iOS solution.

Don't underestimate the portion of OS X users that are OS X users because it is Unix.
 
Apple would be stretched to thin to find content and support for a second WWDC for Mac OS X and Mac Computers.
 
The COMPANY ITSELF needs to split into two separate companies

The COMPANY ITSELF needs to split into two completely different separate companies:

One called Apple, that would engage in RESUMING to produce and market CUTTING EDGE (Blu-ray/Flash/newest processor) workstations and portable computers and OSX and OS XI and CUTTING EDGE Pro Apps without Job's influence, petty squabbles, or declared insane wars, aimed at professionals with money and adults with money and a handful of precocious kids with parents with money, and the other company headed by Jobs called Wapple, or Apple-O, or anything else that would signify the big buck quick profit toy maker/media peddler it is. That way when Wapple goes the way of Wham-o and millions of other fad merchants when smarter and cheaper competition comes along and wipes it out, the toy division and Jobs won't take Apple with it.

Jobs is not immune from history; every company that has gone down his path for the quick buck from the least common denominator is gone in a futile and fatal race to the bottom. Coming up with new gadgets that duplicate old gadgets is NOT innovation; figuring out and then giving established bases of users what they want and need BEFORE they want and need it IS TRUE innovation.

:apple:
 
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