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You're misinformed, you don't get adverts on Android (as in, the OS itself), and Google doesn't track your OS usage any more than Apple. Apps with ads are on both platforms.

I am concerned about my privacy, and specifically for this I choose Google over Apple. Google is transparent about what they do and what they track, and you have a lot of options to fine-tune and opt-out of stuff.

Unlike, say, Apple, who on OSX sends by default everything you type in Spotlight to Bing. Including local file searches.

I perceive Apple as an unethical, greedy company that is absolutely the greatest entity on this planet at selling lies to people, including its commitment to privacy and security. I work in security and I know for sure that their claim is a bare-faced lie that doesn't stand to any scrutiny and only impresses the naive or technically illiterate.

You must be reading some very different articles to me about google and apple then. Not only is google collecting and selling user data it is actively using it to serve google ads in the browser! Android is not secure and no requests are made to unlock it as it's very easy to get data off an android device. iOS device require decapping of chips and is almost impossible to get into.

'I work in security' has to be the worst way to claim knowledge on the subject. It doesn't validate your point at all! At this point there are no ETHICAL companies, google and apple both have bottom line profits and shareholder interest running the show. Apple aren't spinning some security lie, there is plenty of evidence and events that support iOS being a more secure platform. When you say spotlight sends data by default you mean you are offered a checkbox that everyone uncheckes at install/setup. That is NOT by default, it's an options to have or not have.
 
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The biggest issue I have with Android is support and backups.

This is made worse with Google increasingly making life harder for modders who usually fix this issue.

Granted they are supposedly making it easier for OEMs, but I'd rather see Google either opening up the OS more like with Windows or forcing OEMs to provide x amount of support for devices.

Backups are also another issue, with my iOS devices I just plug it in and back it up....simple.

On Android I have to either root (breaking things) or p*** with other programs which can be hit or miss.

I also like how things sync up between my phone macbook and ipad (particularly messages and calls).



You mean the adapter which takes up the only port requiring another adapter if you need the port for e.g. charging?

Also I've used adapters like this in the past and I found them annoying.
Huh? Backups on Android are so much easier. You say all you have to do is plug your iPhone in, yet on Android you don't even have to plug it in, everything by default backs up to Google. If you get a new phone, you just log in and your contacts, photos, documents, text messages, apps, and app data are restored right then and there.
 
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You must be reading some very different articles to me about google and apple then. Not only is google collecting and selling user data it is actively using it to serve google ads in the browser!
You are confusing the OS with the browser and with specific Google services such as Google Search.

Google collects data if you use specific Google services (and you have a lot of opt-out control). Google does not spy on you simply using your OS, nor does the Google browser (i.e. Chrome) spy on you. If you want us to believe otherwise, please provide conclusive proof, otherwise it's just innuendo.

Android is not secure and no requests are made to unlock it as it's very easy to get data off an android device. iOS device require decapping of chips and is almost impossible to get into.
I think you're basing your mistaken assumptions on a couple of highly publicised crimes in which perpetrators used iPhones, and I believe in all situations the data was eventually extracted. Otherwise Android is about as secure as iOS, with the Android running on the newest Google devices being more secure, since Google has the most pro-active security policy.

In any case, nobody with a modicum of common sense should be worried about security on any Android device, as long as they don't install dubious applications especially from unknown sources.

To date I never heard of anyone of my acquaintance using Android having some security issue, however I know of people having messed-up iPhones because they received some SMS.

'I work in security' has to be the worst way to claim knowledge on the subject.
I don't see how that follows. It's like saying that "I'm a surgeon" has to be the worst way to claim knowledge on anatomy, i.e. nonsense.

At this point there are no ETHICAL companies, google and apple both have bottom line profits and shareholder interest running the show.
Ethics has nothing to do with profits and bottom lines. They are not mutually exclusive. It's plain stupid to assume that profit makes everyone a liar and a cheat. One thing has nothing to do with the other. I don't think Apple is unethical because they're very profitable, but because they are. It's company culture: high prices, bling-bling and lies.

Apple aren't spinning some security lie, there is plenty of evidence and events that support iOS being a more secure platform.
More nonsense. And yes, Apple is spinning all sorts of security lies. At they core they believe in security through obscurity, i.e. no real security. Their attitude in respect to exploits and security problems is that they should be hidden from the public, while they are in absolutely no rush to fix them. See their response to the flaws revealed by Google's security team - it wasn't "thanks we'll fix it asap", it was "we'll sue you if you keep disclosing them".

Some of their past security flaws were so crass as to imply that core security code written by Apple passes no code reviews, no automated testing, and that generally Apple is cavalier about security.

All this reveals a profoundly unsettling image about Apple in terms of security. This is in my mind without a doubt an unethical company whose executives habitually lie and deceive the public on the topic.

When you say spotlight sends data by default you mean you are offered a checkbox that everyone uncheckes at install/setup. That is NOT by default, it's an options to have or not have.
I have two Macbooks thus I went through two Sierra initial setups and I assure you that it was on by default, and that the setup process was not straight-forward about it sending by default everything I type in Spotlight to Bing. Thankfully I am privacy-aware and I usually dig through options as soon as I have a new OS.
 
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I'm probably going to stick with Apple, but honestly I think it's more and more tempting to switch over to android, especially with the Google Pixel being such a strong contender on it's first iteration.

The problem for me is services. iCloud just can't compete with either Microsoft or Google. Every day computing is about services. Cloud computing is about services.
 
I'll take structured and boring. I like my devices to be secure and work consistently. Wasting time endlessly troubleshooting things that stop working for no reason is far from my idea of fun; though granted, it's certainly not boring.

If that's the worst people can say about iOS, personally I think that says why it's the best.

Take a very simple use-case: you're in an app and you want to connect to the WiFi (or some Bluetooth device), then go back to the app.

In Android, this is very quick and simple: drop down the settings, long press the WiFi or Bluetooth icon, select the network or device, press Back and you're done.

In iOS, this is an unholy mess. You have to exit the app, hunt for the screen with the Settings, enter the Settings app, select the appropriate category, then there's no immediate way to go back to your app. Doing it by task switching means double-clicking the button, swiping to the app and selecting it. Way too convoluted.

This in a nutshell describes iOS vs Android daily use. Android has a flow from app to app, sharing is much better, you can select default apps, notifications are way better and easier to handle, you can access its filesystem, the app settings are where they should be, and everything takes fewer taps, clicks and swipes to do.
Talking about different points of view...one generic and superficial the other one precise and detailed. The "wasting time endlessly" part is my favourite though. It almost seems true.
 
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Read and repeat after me:

Updates and upgrades are free
Updates and upgrades are free
Updates and upgrades are free
Updates and upgrades are free

You had to pay to upgrade from Windows XP or Windows 7 where as in the Mac world you can upgrade/update macOS for free with devices that are 6 years old still supported by the latest version of macOS. Btw, I raised the issue of Windows and the recent security fiasco as not an attack on Microsoft but to use it as an example of security being at the forefront for many 'normal people'. By the way, cut the crap and stop excusing the piss poor job that Google and it's OEM's do when it comes to getting updates out on time - the April update STILL has not arrived to Samsung phones in New Zealand with neither of the three big carriers receiving the software update for testing. Again, cut the crap.

No you don't... Microsoft issued patch for Windows XP free of charge. Tell me the last time Apple issues security update to set Mac OS version or iOS 9?

Microsoft also offered free upgrade to Windows 7 to Windows 8 to Windows 10. If you didn't take advantage of that, then it is your issue.

Apple, Microsoft, Google can release all the security update all they want, it is up to user to install. There are lots of reasons people don't install security update. All the gaint corporation don't just install update when Microsoft release one, IT department need to make sure update won't mess up their system.

Again... Apple only care about price who use the most recent OS and they don't give a crap about you when you rocking older devices or using old OS. Even when you have the most updated version, you can still face virus outbreak like WannaCry.

Most Apple fanboys think they are living in some shorty of la-la land where they face zero risk...That is stupid as ****...

Also, blame you stupid carrier... Because Google issued security patch to May and I have it with my Nexus and Pixel phone.

By the way, just by the way, there are examples where Apple left security exploit for decades and still not fix the problem. Apple is very scussful on brainwashing people, leading people to believe that iOS and Mac are somehow more secure than other. It is all BS
 
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It's not superior at all.

Take a very simple use-case: you're in an app and you want to connect to the WiFi (or some Bluetooth device), then go back to the app.

In Android, this is very quick and simple: drop down the settings, long press the WiFi or Bluetooth icon, select the network or device, press Back and you're done.

In iOS, this is an unholy mess. You have to exit the app, hunt for the screen with the Settings, enter the Settings app, select the appropriate category, then there's no immediate way to go back to your app. Doing it by task switching means double-clicking the button, swiping to the app and selecting it. Way too convoluted.

This in a nutshell describes iOS vs Android daily use. Android has a flow from app to app, sharing is much better, you can select default apps, notifications are way better and easier to handle, you can access its filesystem, the app settings are where they should be, and everything takes fewer taps, clicks and swipes to do.

It doesn't matter how fast the latest A-whatever processor is, when you put in on a byzantine, convoluted OS that's mostly designed to make Apple more money by funneling its users into using Apple's monthly subscription services. The users will be poorer and less productive. But they look fashionable and upwardly mobile at Starbucks so I guess that's ok.

I am quite confident to say the entire IOS is littered with such convoluted and illogical UI interactions/use cases. The reason is very simple. IOS was designed to be idiot-proof which means doing just ONE thing at a time. For those users who have the capability to handle idiot-proof UI interactions only, then Iphone is the mother of user friendliness and ease of use. For those users who wanted to do bit more of multi-apps collaborative UI interactions then IOS become the mother of "what the heck was Apple thinking.."
 
Huh? Backups on Android are so much easier. You say all you have to do is plug your iPhone in, yet on Android you don't even have to plug it in, everything by default backs up to Google. If you get a new phone, you just log in and your contacts, photos, documents, text messages, apps, and app data are restored right then and there.

That wasn't my experience last time I tried it, only time I've had a 100% no problem backup/restore with stock OS was ios and itunes.

Plus it looks like the Google backup eats into Google drive storage and doesn't backup everything e.g. texts/sms (or at least it's hit or miss).
 
That wasn't my experience last time I tried it, only time I've had a 100% no problem backup/restore with stock OS was ios and itunes.

Plus it looks like the Google backup eats into Google drive storage and doesn't backup everything e.g. texts/sms (or at least it's hit or miss).
How long ago was this?
 
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I am quite confident to say the entire IOS is littered with such convoluted and illogical UI interactions/use cases. The reason is very simple. IOS was designed to be idiot-proof which means doing just ONE thing at a time. For those users who have the capability to handle idiot-proof UI interactions only, then Iphone is the mother of user friendliness and ease of use. For those users who wanted to do bit more of multi-apps collaborative UI interactions then IOS become the mother of "what the heck was Apple thinking.."
I believe you're right, and there's something else to it too. Apple always tries too hard to be different. Often this is the case of being different for the sake of being different, and it works with their marketing spin, since their loyal users get a kick out of being "special".

This often leads, as you say, to illogical and convoluted UI interaction. It's not clear and obvious to me why my browsing history in Safari needs to be accessible through the bookmarks button. It's not clear at all why "find in page" should be activated by typing something in the address bar and looking at the last option in the drop menu that appears. This is very obscure functionality that a lot of people would never discover by themselves, and iOS is littered with this type of thing. I don't know for sure half of them and I hate obscure, non-intuitive user interfaces.

Take "force touch". It's never clear when it can be used and when not. There's no indication. Perhaps users are supposed to read a manual, or just try like idiots to press on everything? My solution on the Macbook Pro is that I simply don't use it. It's not good user interaction.

Another major issue is when some other company - say, Google - made some UI interaction that is either optimal, or very hard to improve upon. Because Apple tries so hard to be different, they basically deliberately gimp their own experience in order to emphasise this difference.

Take the notifications. It amazes me how poor the iOS notifications are compared to Android. It's like Apple wants to copy the Android ones, but not fully - otherwise too many people would laugh too hard - so they made some that are just worse.

Ditto with widgets. First, no widgets. Then tab the notifications (horrible idea) and put them there. Then put them on their own screen. Only to avoid doing what's blindingly obvious and useful, i.e. letting people put widgets wherever they want on the screen. But hey, they can't do that, Android's already been doing it for too long, it might look like they're 10 years behind.
 
iPhone ares selling at a slower pace than the market is growing - or in other words - Apple are losing market share.

Sounds like a desperate move to me.

Battery performance on my iPhone? This feels like a slap in the face for every Active Sync Exchange - user.. 2 days I can EASILY achieve with my "crappy android phone". Which is under NO circumstances possible with my iPhone.

Neither my iPhone nor my "crappy android phone" are slow yet... They sure will be, though, in a couple of years of software updates... or does the new iPhone run on pixie dust now, that prevents if the from slowing down when running later software releases then it was ever intended to run?

Also Google offers free unlimited cloud storage for pictures, something they probably did not dare to compare in their videos...

I've seen many friends of mine with iPhones that get a lot of lag after newer versions of iOS gets loaded on older hardware. I've seen a lot of complaints about this and have seen the same thing happen to my iPads over the years.

This forum is about the only place people will claim that iPhones never slow down or lag even when you throw an iOS update on an older phone.
 
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How long ago was this?

First time was admittedly a while back (2012) on my Siii (no app data restored), my aunts phone about two years ago (restore failed), her tablet around 8 months ago and my dads phone about two weeks ago which also had a Sony method which was a PITA to get working and even then failed to backup the apps properly.

In the end, I've only ever really had luck using third party options such as Helium for app data and backing up the internal SD to a zip file (because MTP is unreliable (e.g. missing data in the Android folder and certain files types (e.g. json)).

Compared to iOS and iTunes which has never given me any problems and no storage limits other than my ssd.
 
I do like iOS on my iPad, but when it comes to a phone where notifications are a much bigger part of the experience I think I'd really miss Android. One of the best features on my S8 is the always on display. At a glance I can see if I have anything new. It seems like you'd have to be checking your phone all the time with an iPhone.
 
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http://bgr.com/2017/05/16/galaxy-s8-sales-figures/

Ok so maybe 5 million in the first few weeks and a projected 60 million by the end of the year are lower then what we'd expect from Apple, but it's certainly not a flop.

Heck Apple could just introduce a 7S next year and it's fans would be lining in for hours for the latest and greatest. In fact, Apple would be smart to push the 8 off another year. It would mean a lot of one year upgrades. If your selling a brand like iPhone use it as hard as you can for maximum profit. Why not?

It's less than a quarter for Apple, and those are optimist projections. So it's a flop!
 
It's less than a quarter for Apple, and those are optimist projections. So it's a flop!

Although it is the dream of many hardcore iPhone fans that Google will drop Android development and vendors like Samsung and LG will pull out of the smartphone market I don't see it happening.

Would the iPhone be better or worse if Apple had no serious competition? I think if Apple didn't have to compete you'd now be paying over $1,000 for a 3.5" screen.
 
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Apple could have saved a lot of money if they paid me just 10% of what they pay their ad agency, so I can think of such a creative ad
 
It's less than a quarter for Apple, and those are optimist projections. So it's a flop!
Sheer nonsense. It's like declaring the Macbook a flop because VW sold a lot more Golfs.

By all sensible accounts (i.e. expectations vs reality), the S8 looks like a major success for Samsung. Which is a bit surprising to me, given the Note 7 scandal, the lack of clear camera improvement (admittedly pretty good to begin with) and the poor fingerprint reader placement.
 
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In fact what you wrote reminds me of the time when I bought my $850 iPad mini, which couldn't hold 3 web pages loaded in tabs (it still cannot, many updates later). My lowly Nexus 4 at the time did much, much better. If you want poorly performing software and insufficient RAM look no further than Apple iOS devices.

This discussion isn’t about iPads. I have no experience with them and thus no opinion.

Once you put aside the desire to impress others with your overly-expensive phone, and just want a smartphone that does stuff well, you have a wealth of choice in the Android world.

You have a wealth of choice between rubbish and good phones, that is precisely my point. All of them still suck when it comes to receiving (timely) OS updates. Moreover, if you want to have the ’stock experience’ that Google designs Android for, your choices are limited.

Nearly every $300+ phone will do a good job, but there are some particularly good ones and some particularly good-value-for-money ones. It's easy to find out which, with minimal Google research. Just yesterday I read an article about how the Honor 8 Pro makes the iPhone 7 Plus look a bit crap, at half the price.

I claim it is not that easy at all. Sure, this phone seems to impress now, in reviews and on spec sheets. Many Android phones do on release, admittedly. The interesting aspect is how well they do after a while and it is here where most Android phones fall apart in my opinion. Huawei, for instance, has a poor trackrecord when it comes to updating the software. As I said, there’s always a caveat.

I have no poorly performing preinstalled software, a weak CPU, insufficient RAM and so forth. In fact, in my history of Android phones, I've never seen this. My Android phone is running the default software (no custom ROM or launcher) and it's fast and fluid, it has never crashed (in just over one year of ownership), and it hasn't slowed down either.

Which phones did you have then?

Samsung TouchWiz in particular is notorious for performance issues. This point still comes up in reviews of today’s phones, e.g. The Verge still notes it as an issue in their glamorising Galaxy S8 review.

You have experienced no issues, I did and I hear constantly about them from others. Based on my experiences, I will thus never recommend an Android phone when asked, unless there are budget constraints.
 
My midnight black S8+ is a thing of beauty. It's fast and stable. That always on display is trick and those edge notifications are beautiful. I've really enjoyed using the Gear VR headset. The Infinity qHD display is top notch. Battery life is very good. The experience has been excellent. It's nothing like Android phones of 4-5 years ago. The Samsung Experience software has came a long way since the S3 Touchwiz days.

The last thing is I don't see Apple Pay as an advantage over Samsung Pay. Samsung Pay works on just about every card reader and they have an awesome rewards program and tons of freebies.

Now with that said, I also own an iPad Air 2 and I can totally understand why iOS appeals to certain crowd. It's boring, but it's simple. Simple sells well.

The strong competition between Android manufactures (especially Samsung) and Apple means we all benefit with better products.

Yeah and then I watched a colleague unlock their phone which was on their desk - that finger print reader the back - awful.

I'll take the 7 (or 7s if there is one) if Apple follows this path.
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Apple releasing/revamping this ''Switch'' site just a few weeks after the release of the new Samsung S8.

Coincidence??

I dont think so...

"Life is easier on iPhone'', not at all Apple. After 7 years using every new released iPhone I can tell you my life is much, much more easier (and a lot more productive) with my new S8 then every other iPhone from the past.

"Why is iPhone so fast'', no Apple. My new S8 is in some cases even faster/smoother then any of my previous iPhone 7 (or any of my earlier iPhones)

That 2nd video is pure nonsense

All you're doing is talking. Provide examples so we can see exactly how the S8 is better for you - it might help some of us switch too. Otehrwise all this just reads like Apple hate/ Samsung advertising.

The time I used an S8 for a few hours it failed to cache apps as well as the iPhone in the background - all the reloading made for a crummy UX.
 
Integration with the Mac is good, but if you have to live a life with a PC in the mix I find Google to be easier to integrate. As long as you stay all Apple iOS is great, but if you throw other platforms into the mix life gets a bit more messy. Ever used iTunes on Windows? :)
Say no to pc :)
Nope no reason for a pc here..Too bad apple dropped the ball on iTunes on windows.
Maybe they just want people to switch to Mac :)
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I could never recommend Android phones to my family and friends, unless they are specifically looking for a cheaper phone. Poor update policies and inconsistent experiences from manufacturer to manufacturer, both in terms of hardware and software, make this a non-starter. Most people I know do not even contemplate installing a different launcher or flashing a ‘ROM’. iPhone remains the solid, unfortunately expensive, choice every time.
Ha! Friends don't let friends android :)
 
Otehrwise all this just reads like Apple hate/ Samsung advertising.
.

yeah, thats why I have a bunch of other Apple devices (Macs/iPads/iPhone 7/Apple TV and Time Capsule) besides my Samsung S8, here at home.

Maybe, just maybe you should not jump to conclusions too soon
 
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yeah, thats why I have a bunch of other Apple devices (Macs/iPads/iPhone 7/Apple TV and Time Capsule) here at home.

Maybe, just maybe you should not spring to conclusions too soon

I never said you didn't, don't be so defensive.

I said what you wrote "reads like Apple hate/ Samsung advertising." - which it does. Examples would be great like I said, let's see:

"my life is much, much more easier (and a lot more productive) with my new S8 then every other iPhone from the past." - how Geert76? Not saying it isn't but it sounds like advert without telling us.

"My new S8 is in some cases even faster/smoother then any of my previous iPhone 7 (or any of my earlier iPhones)" - how Geert76? Not saying it isn't but it sounds like advert without telling us.

I am not calling you a liar - just after something more than descriptive words. :)

I am always up for using new tech - but the fingerprint reader positioning (awkward) and poor app caching (slows me down) have been a let down in my use of the S8 (along with iCloud - but there are 3rd party alternatives on Android which I could make work). Build wise I love the front - hate the back of the S8.
 
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