Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple regularly communicates with developers... ? good joke!

Since many years, nothing changed:


Internally the same BS:
 
Last edited:
This does seem like an overt mischaracterization. Apple is supporting developers and content makers and themselves by running ads that many cannot afford to run themselves. Verizon runs ads for the new iPhone, Best Buy runs ads for the latest Sony TV on Reddit.

Seriously, what am I missing. This seems like a hit piece drumming up clicks and drama.

You're missing the 15% - 30% of life long lost revenue from Apple ads directing consumers to subscribe in app vs. a developers ad that would direct the consumer to subscribe on their website. It's pretty significant. It's not a one time sale either. It's a sub.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Wildkraut
I'm not sure about anyone else, but I would be thrilled if Apple wanted to spend their advertising dollars to help grow my app.

It's them properly using the money they're making on their 30%, and a great example of good distribution.

But...... thats not how this works.

People are already searching google for a brand they already know they want to use, to subscribe directly from the vendor.

Apple is jumping in and saying here is a link, come subscribe.

They aren't building brand awareness. They are siphoning off 30% that the vendor was otherwise going to make on their own. And they are causing the actual brands to have to pay more in their own advertising to compete against what Apple is bidding to advertise on their brand name.

This isn't like Walmart advertising a can of green beans when you can't buy from Green Giant direct.
 
Can someone explain what the problem is here? ?

  • If an app already has lots of brand awareness, it’s questionable whether Apple is actually bringing in new customers vs. “sniping” people who are already searching for the app but click the ad at the top rather than the organic result.
  • In this case, if the customer signs up within the app, Apple will get 15% for the entire duration of the subscription vs. zero if the customer signed up through the Web site. So, to the extent that the customer would have signed up anyway, this is a loss for the developer.
  • As an example. Tinder owner Match says it pays nearly US$500 million in fees to the app stores annually, the company's single largest expense.
  • Apple’s bidding on ads increases the cost of ads that the developer is buying.
  • You could look at this as Apple using its arguably too-high fees against the developer that is paying them. They would rather pay lower fees than pay more for this “service.”
  • There’s some asymmetry here because most developers aren’t allowed to purchase Google ads that use Apple trademarks like “Mac” for better targeting, but yet Apple is placing ads using the names of the developers’ products, even though they don’t want it to.
  • Apple doesn’t seem to have commented on the allegation that there’s no way to opt out.
I also dont think the "regularly communicates with developers." is correct in the context. They sure do this in some capacity, but not in this context with regards to ads spending to their product.
 
Last edited:
  • If an app already has lots of brand awareness, it’s questionable whether Apple is actually bringing in new customers vs. “sniping” people who are already searching for the app but click the ad at the top rather than the organic result.
There is no guarantee that the customer is going to buy direct until they do. Maybe Apple is securing revenue by showing them they could manage the payment on their device. As long as the price is the same having Apple between my credit card and the seller is a benefit for the customer.
  • In this case, if the customer signs up within the app, Apple will get 15% for the entire duration of the subscription vs. zero if the customer signed up through the Web site. So, to the extent that the customer would have signed up anyway, this is a loss for the developer.
This is the same point as above, so I will repeat that signing up via the app has added value. There are subscriptions that I have let laps because the developer charges too much but when they contact me directly about saving money by paying directly I decline because I want the same product for less.
  • Apple’s bidding on ads increases the cost of ads that the developer is buying.
This conflicts with the point you were trying to make before. Even if the price increases all traffic is resulting in increased sales. So their need to buy ad space decreases and the advertising expense is partially moved to payment to Apple. Who, again, closed the deal.
  • You could look at this as Apple using its arguably too-high fees against the developer that is paying them. They would rather pay lower fees than pay more for this “service.”
This doesn't make sense to me. Who is you, them, and the service?
  • There’s some asymmetry here because most developers aren’t allowed to purchase Google ads that use Apple trademarks like “Mac” for better targeting, but yet Apple is placing ads using the names of the developers’ products, even though they don’t want it to.
And? It's not fair. Why does that matter?
  • Apple doesn’t seem to have commented on the allegation that there’s no way to opt out.
They could pull their app from the app store.
 
But...... thats not how this works.

People are already searching google for a brand they already know they want to use, to subscribe directly from the vendor.

Apple is jumping in and saying here is a link, come subscribe.

They aren't building brand awareness. They are siphoning off 30% that the vendor was otherwise going to make on their own. And they are causing the actual brands to have to pay more in their own advertising to compete against what Apple is bidding to advertise on their brand name.

This isn't like Walmart advertising a can of green beans when you can't buy from Green Giant direct.

Apple is actually advertising a better experience which most likely translates to a higher conversion rate. With Apple, I see an HBO MAX ad on my device, I click, I download, I choose a plan, and I subscribe. With a first-party HBO MAX ad, I click, I navigate some offers, I register, verify my email, I dig out my credit card, I enter in all the info, then, if I'm lucky, I'm kicked to an App Store link, I download the app, I log in.

Apple saves me a lot of friction.

Let's be honest, Apple is not siphoning off 30%. Any of these companies could turn off in-app purchases and entirely disincentivize Apple from doing this, but all of them have determined that this is an acceptable way for users to sign up for their service because they see some benefits to it so they allow it.
 
Last edited:
Damn it Apple. How dare you spend your own money to promote your developer’s apps without their permission? Obviously exploitative.
 
OMG Forbes....seriously!! I kept getting clickbait articles from Forbes in Apple news and I was under the impression they were reputable until such times that I kept reading their articles and realised what a complete and utter joke they were so chose to not show their items any longer in options!! They are completely disgraceful and nothing less than an embarrassment to society as far as I'm concerned. They're no better than Facebook.
 
  • Disagree
Reactions: Sanme
So does Forbes now correct its article? Hard to be "secretive" when it has been known and communicated for 5 years. Probably just a whiney developer that wanted to make a big deal of something that is not a big deal. and why contact google? If you don't want your app advertised, shouldn't you contact the originator. There is so much hear that makes no sense
Sounds like this is in the contract.
 
  • There’s some asymmetry here because most developers aren’t allowed to purchase Google ads that use Apple trademarks like “Mac” for better targeting, but yet Apple is placing ads using the names of the developers’ products, even though they don’t want it to

Of course they want to. They have agreed to a contract where they have appointed Apple to be their marketeer.
Unless developers are agreeing to contracts they don't agree with.
 
Damn it Apple. How dare you spend your own money to promote your developer’s apps without their permission? Obviously exploitative.
You have no clue how marketing works. This is an arbitrage opportunity that's lost for the developer.
 
”On the contrary, the company says that it regularly engages in conversation with developers about the ads it places and many developers express their appreciation for this support.”

And if some developers don’t express support or consent and, in fact, ask Apple to stop, then it isn’t an overt mischaracterization in those cases.
Do you know for a fact that this is occurring? Otherwise it's pure speculation like the "article".
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Deguello
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.