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"Jony, why did you decide to go with the notch design?"
"Jony, why did you decide on NOT including a tactile volume functionality on the AirPods"
"Jony, why did you decide to let people charge their Apple pencil like a giant penis sticking out of the iPad?"
"Jony, why did you make an ugly red dot on the clean looking Apple Watch?"

"Because I'm a meticulous bastard and I'm in charge!"
*mic drop*
 
Don't forget....
image-jpeg.580195
I'll see the mouse and your pencil, and raise you this...

mwtati.jpg


Three perfect examples of the "mmmyeah... really can't be bothered" school of design that's prospered under Ive post-2011.
 
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Note 8 is ip68, better than iphoneX ip67, and carries a headphone jack. They removed it to sell wireless headphones, lets be honest here.

never said it's impossible with the headphone jack. you can put resources into making a headphone jack that's waterproof, or put your resources into something else.
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But it is not redundant .. I can connect a universally accepted standard headphone to one but not the other (without a dongle).

Just because something is universally accepted, doesn't mean it's not redundant. I think you got the wrong idea of what redundant means.

By your logic we should remove the "redundant" front camera, the lower speaker, Bluetooth and/or wlan chip and volume buttons and many more things. Yeah, we could still do the "same" things as before (with adequate adapters, dongles, devices or software solutions) but it wouldn't be a nice phone anymore ..
No, that's the same logic.
If you removed the front camera, you've removed the feature of looking at someone over video chat while they can see you.
If you removed the lower speaker, you've removed speaker mode.
If you removed bluetooth, you've removed wireless audio and apple watch capability
If you removed wlan chip, you've removed the ability to go on wifi
If you removed the volume button, you've removed the ability to take photos with a shutter button, to perform diagnostic tasks, to perform the screenshot shortcut on the iPhone X, and the ability to change volumes quickly (something that people do many times a day)

Remove the headphone jack, retain the same features with a dongle, gain battery life, gain water resistance, gain the taptic engine.

So no, it's not the same logic
 
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Add to the question list why are they still using 10 year old iMac design?!

And the notch, for sure.

They used to be good at design...
 
a
You carry your phone with you possibly 8-12 hours a day. You possibly look at your iPhone 3-5 hours a day. That's ~1000-~2000 hours a year spent looking at a phone.

If you included a bezel at the top instead of a notch, that means you're shifted the status bar down a bit, essentially reducing the amount of space for user content, and have about 5% of space of the front panel doing absolutely nothing for the user. That's ~1000-~2000 hours a year where the user is viewing a useless bezel and viewing a screen that contains less space that could have been used for user content.

similarly, this reasoning can be applied to the headphone jack. the jack takes up ~1-~3% of the volume of the phone. Assuming you carry your headphones with you about 30 minutes-1 hour a day, you're better off carrying a dongle for 182-365 hours a year compared to carrying a useless port that could be used for battery or other essential technology for ~3000-~4000 hours a year.

and hump?
Wouldn't surprise me to see Ive 'leave' Apple within the next 12 months. Maybe not formally sever ties like Woz, but certainly quietly abdicate much of his day-to-day role and responsibilities.

The campus is complete, the iPhone X (no doubt viewed internally as the start of next-gen devices) is in the open, and let's be honest, he's not winning any credible design awards ever again. His time is up.

Sure, he'll be wheeled out for tech talks like this one, and industry events when needed, or another bit of cringeworthy "charity" PR puff alongside his buddy Marc Newson with some pretentious monstrosity of "custom" Apple product, but suspect he'll quietly fade from the picture like a Keynote slide transition, and subsequently take up a directorship/consultancy or two, or even front a worthy but suitably grandiose academic initiative back in the UK.
dyson university or its car. A ‘proper’ pretentious company :(
 
Just because something is universally accepted, doesn't mean it's not redundant. I think you got the wrong idea of what redundant means.

No, that's the same logic.
If you removed the front camera, you've removed the feature of looking at someone over video chat while they can see you.
If you removed the lower speaker, you've removed speaker mode.
If you removed bluetooth, you've removed wireless audio and apple watch capability
If you removed wlan chip, you've removed the ability to go on wifi
If you removed the volume button, you've removed the ability to take photos with a shutter button, to perform diagnostic tasks, to perform the screenshot shortcut on the iPhone X, and the ability to change volumes quickly (something that people do many times a day)

Remove the headphone jack, retain the same features with a dongle, gain battery life, gain water resistance, gain the taptic engine.

So no, it's not the same logic

Redundant means that the same functionality can be achieved with or without that component. So removing the option to connect a universally accepted connector directly they did remove functionality. So either I do have to carry that dongle everywhere or accept that in situations I will not be able to connect to music equipment I could connect to before. So no .. it is not redundant. It is only redundant with the dongle which is stupid to carry around.

And again by that same logic it would be ok to remove the bluetooth chip and provide a dongle if you happen to require bluetooth connectivity. Also a lot device can also be accessed via airplay anyways. It is by your definition a redundant chip (provided a dongle).
Or the volume buttons .. those are all things available through the software already, removing them would not change the things you could do with your phone one bit, it would just be less user friendly and practical, just like carrying a stupid dongle is less user friendly.
 
and hump?

The largest component inside the phone (besides the screen) is the battery. Take a look at how customers use their phones: customers already charge their iPhone every night. So Apple decided the battery should last a single day for an average user/typical usage. A 2-3 day battery is unnecessary in Apple's eyes for a few reasons which I can get into if you want (even though some would disagree).

So, given that a battery that lasts one day and given the dimensions of the screen would give you the thinness of the phone. But, the camera lens have a physical limitation. It's physically impossible to shrink the camera lens without affecting the quality of the images. So, it's either have a thick hollow phone with a flat back, or have a hump. Apple chose a hump. Knowing that Apple is selling millions of these, they'll reduce waste by having a hump.

Unintentional side effect: the camera lens is sapphire which doesn't scratch as easily as the backside of the phone. so by resting the phone on this sapphire surface, it'll reduce the scratches on the backside of the phone.
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Redundant means that the same functionality can be achieved with or without that component. So removing the option to connect a universally accepted connector directly they did remove functionality.

Just because you're slightly hindred by the removal of the headphone jack doesn't mean it's not redundant.

In a technical example, a RAID5 3-disk array allows you to lose one hard drive, but you're hindred by write/read speeds. Can you still function without that one redundant hard drive? Yeah, it'll be slow though.

Same with a headphone jack. Losing it means you must leave a dongle attached to the headphones. Can you still listen to music? Sure, you're just hindered with the jack.


It's redundant.

So either I do have to carry that dongle everywhere or accept that in situations I will not be able to connect to music equipment I could connect to before. So no .. it is not redundant. It is only redundant with the dongle which is stupid to carry around.

Keep it attached to the headphones. So whenever you carry your headphones (which is not as long as carrying your phone), you can listen to music using your iPhone.

And again by that same logic it would be ok to remove the bluetooth chip and provide a dongle if you happen to require bluetooth connectivity. Also a lot device can also be accessed via airplay anyways. It is by your definition a redundant chip (provided a dongle).
Or the volume buttons .. those are all things available through the software already, removing them would not change the things you could do with your phone one bit, it would just be less user friendly and practical, just like carrying a stupid dongle is less user friendly.
I think you're confused on what airplay is. Airplay is not a chip. Airplay uses wifi to stream media. Airplay cannot be a replacement of bluetooth.
If you remove the volume buttons, you can't change volume in certain scenarios. Some people have control center disabled on the homescreen for security reasons (also some people have control center disabled in apps). Also you can't put your device in restore mode if you remove the volume buttons.
But with that said, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple starts virtualizing the volume buttons with the taptic engine (like they did with the home button on the iPhone 7) within the next several years. That way, it'll feel like volume buttons without actually being a button. So yeah, removing the volume button can certainly happen in the future.
 
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I don't think it was just for the barometer. But ok, let's say we include a barometer, thicker battery, and a headphone jack. You're still carrying a headphone jack which means you're still carrying something that's redundant in your pocket since a lightning port can take care of the same purpose. Not just you, but millions and billions of users will carry a redundant port in their pockets.

Regarding the benefits of removing the jack: "Apple realized it was easier to install the new Taptic Engine for the pressure-sensitive Home button, implement a bigger battery, and reach an IP7 water resistance rating" https://www.macrumors.com/2016/09/07/apple-explains-headphone-jack-removal/


Not everyone carries headphones in their pockets 8-12 hours a day. But everyone carries a phone in their pockets 8-12 hours a day.

Then explain why iPad, laptops and iMac still has a headphone jack. If this is Apple's attempt to standardize bluetooth headphone use and still keep the 3.5 on other systems, then they failed and contradicted themselves by doing it only on the iPhone. They compromised the design integrity of the iPhone for the sake of thinness.

Steve may think thin is better, but it's not always the case.
 
Just because you're slightly hindred by the removal of the headphone jack doesn't mean it's not redundant.

In a technical example, a RAID5 3-disk array allows you to lose one hard drive, but you're hindred by write/read speeds. Can you still function without that one redundant hard drive? Yeah, it'll be slow though.

Same with a headphone jack. Losing it means you must leave a dongle attached to the headphones. Can you still listen to music? Sure, you're just hindered with the jack.

It's redundant.

We can talk about the real world impact of removing the headphone jack and solutions like leaving the dongle attached to the headphone or the car audio or the home stereo. Some of those will work for some folks not for others. Some is overdramatic, some is a real pain. I get that.

To me something is only then redundant if it can be taken out with no significant impact (and to me having to carry a dongle is significant).
Agree to disagree? You think using an extra device to make up for the loss of the connector is fine and I don't.

This might be nitpicking, but in the beginning the intention of RAIDs was to have redundant disks for fault tolerance. The speed aspect was added later after the name had been minted. So while it is called RAID, the intention of a RAID 5 is very different from a RAID 0.

I think you're confused on what airplay is. Airplay is not a chip. Airplay uses wifi to stream media. Airplay cannot be a replacement of bluetooth.
If you remove the volume buttons, you can't change volume in certain scenarios. Some people have control center disabled on the homescreen for security reasons (also some people have control center disabled in apps). Also you can't put your device in restore mode if you remove the volume buttons.
But with that said, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple starts virtualizing the volume buttons with the taptic engine (like they did with the home button on the iPhone 7) within the next several years. That way, it'll feel like volume buttons without actually being a button. So yeah, removing the volume button can certainly happen in the future.

Well .. nevermind. I tried to give examples of other things that could potentially be removed from the phone and be replaced with a dongle or a software solution.

In the end it is quite clear that Apples real motivation was to push sales of wireless headphones or that they were to lazy or incompetent to achieve their design goals otherwise as the saved space is not used and the water resistance is achieved by other phones with headphone jacks.
 
We can talk about the real world impact of removing the headphone jack and solutions like leaving the dongle attached to the headphone or the car audio or the home stereo. Some of those will work for some folks not for others. Some is overdramatic, some is a real pain. I get that.

To me something is only then redundant if it can be taken out with no significant impact (and to me having to carry a dongle is significant).
Agree to disagree? You think using an extra device to make up for the loss of the connector is fine and I don't.

If you want get official, definition of redundancy from Google:
"the state of being not or no longer needed or useful.

Apple makes products for a broad audience. They saw that most wouldn't need a headphone jack in the future of this phone, therefore, the headphone jack became redundant. It was no longer needed since the lighting port produces the same function. Headphone jack provides audio and lightning port provides audio.

This seems to be boiling down to an opinion rather than a fact. I, along with Apple, believe that the headphone jack is now redundant. For you, carrying a dongle is such a challenge and painful to the point where a headphone jack is not considered redundant to you. So I think we can leave it that.

This might be nitpicking, but in the beginning the intention of RAIDs was to have redundant disks for fault tolerance. The speed aspect was added later after the name had been minted. So while it is called RAID, the intention of a RAID 5 is very different from a RAID 0.

The affected speed of losing a disk in RAID 5 is because of calculating the parity each time a disk is accessed. Yes RAID 0 is 0 redundancy, hence the "0" in the name. To say that RAID 5 doesn't have any qualities of being redundant would be factually wrong since it does contain redundant data (even though speed hinders when the redundant disk is lost).



Well .. nevermind. I tried to give examples of other things that could potentially be removed from the phone and be replaced with a dongle or a software solution.

You did give examples and I responded that the volume buttons could potentially be removed in the future. Removing Bluetooth (without providing a solution) would substantially degrade the product and the benefits of doing so wouldn't outweigh the costs.


In the end it is quite clear that Apples real motivation was to push sales of wireless headphones or that they were to lazy or incompetent to achieve their design goals otherwise as the saved space is not used and the water resistance is achieved by other phones with headphone jacks.

The problem with a lot of the people that complain about Apple's design decisions is that it's always 100% evil or 100% good. Why could it not be both? Removal of the headphone jack solves: 1) engineering issues 2) improves user experience (which you disagree with) 3) provides new features 4) encourages wireless headphone sales 5) reduces waste.
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Then explain why iPad, laptops and iMac still has a headphone jack. If this is Apple's attempt to standardize bluetooth headphone use and still keep the 3.5 on other systems, then they failed and contradicted themselves by doing it only on the iPhone. They compromised the design integrity of the iPhone for the sake of thinness.

Steve may think thin is better, but it's not always the case.

Well, think it through like a designer. What are the implications of removing a headphone jack on those devices?

With the iPad and laptop, the headphone jack doesn't provide substantial battery life or other feature improvements if removed. Having 30 minutes of additional battery on the iPad doesn't mean as much as having 30 minutes of additional battery on the phone. Since the laptop uses Intel chips which is less efficient compared to the ARM chips in the iOS devices, removing a headphone jack would probably provide additional 5-10 minutes of battery life on the laptop, again not meaningful to the user.

More importantly, there's no lightning port on the laptop or iMac. You'd either have to include a lightning port (which would be confusing to users, since they might think you can charge a Macbook via lighting port with a 5W charger) or use one of the usb ports. But if you use a USB port, that's another dongle to carry with you along with the lightning dongle for your iPhone.
 
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Jony Ive has nothing to do all day. probably a good thing too.
there is likely a whole apple swamp that could be drained and no one would know its gone.
 
The problem with a lot of the people that complain about Apple's design decisions is that it's always 100% evil or 100% good. Why could it not be both? Removal of the headphone jack solves: 1) engineering issues 2) improves user experience (which you disagree with) 3) provides new features 4) encourages wireless headphone sales 5) reduces waste.

I think that holds true for both sides though. For some people Apple can do no wrong, no matter how blatantly they try to rip off people.

To me, I don't see the advantages of this decision at all .. for me. I do see the advantages for Apple sure, but for me as a customer, there is no advantage. Having to buy new headphones or carrying a dongle does not improve my user experience and I don't buy the bigger battery argument.

Actually it produces a lot of waste since a lot of good technology becomes obsolete now and will be replaced and end up in the landfill.
 
To me, I don't see the advantages of this decision at all .. for me. I do see the advantages for Apple sure, but for me as a customer, there is no advantage. Having to buy new headphones or carrying a dongle does not improve my user experience and I don't buy the bigger battery argument.

disagreed, i bought new wireless headphones and never looked back at wired headphones again. i no longer have headphones/earbuds popping out of my head because of something catching on the wire. i no longer drop my iPads/iPhones because I got up from the chair while the headphones were still plugged in. and the W1 chip in the airpods makes it much easier to switch devices, even better compared to wired headphones in certain situations (i no longer have to search for the port on my mac mini).


Actually it produces a lot of waste since a lot of good technology becomes obsolete now and will be replaced and end up in the landfill.

i've probably owned over 20-30 pairs of headphones in my life. half the time it's because i broke the irreplaceable wire or the jack (sometimes only the left side plays unless i rotate the jack). a couple of times is when i broke the audio port where you plug in the wire into the headhpone (one of them was a bose qc15 and the other was made by audio technica). once you remove the wire from the picture, headphones would last much longer.



by encouraging users to switch to wireless now, you're actually going to start reducing waste in the long run.
 
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