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Apple Disabling 'Sign in with Apple' for Epic Games on September 11 [Updated]
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After you get banned, please be a little more discreet when naming yourself Sweeney
who put you in charge of determining allowable profit margins?
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No, courts don't recognize that.
No, they don't just play video games.
I have yet to see definitive proof that Apple said what Epic said they did: that they would end sign in with Epic....did Epic simply make this up?????
Now that Epic Games' developer account has been terminated, Apple is also ending access to other services, such as Sign in with Apple. According to Epic Games, Apple will no longer let users sign in to Epic Games using Sign in with Apple as of September 11, which is in two days.
Epic says that customers who use Sign in with Apple to access their Epic Games accounts should make sure their email and password are up to date, and the company is offering an FAQ on how to update an account email address and password so Epic Games users don't lose access to their accounts.
Customers who do not update to a standard email address and password will not be able to log in to their accounts, but after September 11, those who did not transition from Sign in with Apple may be able to contact Epic Games to have their accounts recovered manually.
Sign in with Apple is a feature that allows Apple device users to sign in to accounts and services using their Apple ID, with that info obscured from the website or service for privacy purposes. It's similar to Google and Facebook account sign in options, but with Apple promising greater privacy through options like Hide My Email.
The feature was introduced as part of iOS 13 and apps and services have been adopting it since then. Apple requires any app that uses Google and Facebook login options to also offer Sign in with Apple.
Update: According to Epic Games, Apple is providing an "indefinite extension" and will not be ending access to Sign in With Apple.
Article Link: Apple Disabling 'Sign in with Apple' for Epic Games on September 11 [Updated]
well.. no, but that is if i, as a user, close my google account - which i might add, i would bloody love to!
No i think it's bad for users on the whole.. it puts me off using that feature if it might get pulled.
I think the main thing here is that the privacy of 'Sign-In w. Apple" was a benefit to consumers, and a ball ache to developers anyway. As someone who has implement OAuth flows in solutions previously, i can confirm those systems are painful.
I've not read the T&Cs of sign in w. Apple, but i didn't realise it was tied to things that were on the App Store only.. 🤷🏼♂️
Ok, that is interesting. I guess we'll never know it wasn't a thing, or they went back?
I believe Sign In with Apple will play a more important role in the greater scheme of things, especially when used in tandem with app clips and the rumoured Apple glasses.No i think it's bad for users on the whole.. it puts me off using that feature if it might get pulled.
I think the main thing here is that the privacy of 'Sign-In w. Apple" was a benefit to consumers, and a ball ache to developers anyway. As someone who has implement OAuth flows in solutions previously, i can confirm those systems are painful.
I've not read the T&Cs of sign in w. Apple, but i didn't realise it was tied to things that were on the App Store only..
As such, I believe it is imperative as as many app developers implement this feature as possible, even if it may not be to their direct benefit.
Fair point. Didn’t even realize it, probably because similar situations are not advertised as much (not as juicy as continuing the “bash apple” train) or it just happens less.
Don’t know the specifics of the API though. If service A offers to sign in via Facebook/Google, and service A gets banned, do I lose my Facebook/Google sign capabilities?
There’s something here that doesn’t add up... to sign in it’s just a handler name and its associated password, why with Apple it suddenly stops working? I mean, if I use my gmail account and my gmail gets obliterated, the webpage won’t really care as long as the gmail “name” and passwords match?
Edit: serious typos
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Maybe that's because Apple is stealing someone's work as "Sign in with Apple".
My patent claim: https://www.domboxmail.com/assets/images/apple/claim11-12.png
Result: https://www.domboxmail.com/assets/images/apple/swjs2.png
A blogger wrote about this issue more clearly: https://mjtsai.com/blog/2020/09/09/...red-from-sign-in-with-apple-update-2020-09-11
Full details: https://www.domboxmail.com/news/apple-copied-our-product
Oh and one more thing. I knew this is gonna happen. So I warned the developers 5 months back.
You call anything here a "patent claim"? Don't make me laugh!
And you then go on to claim that Apple ripped off your "Sign in with DomoBox".
So, only Apple? What about Facebook? They had this well before Apple.
SIWA is actually an OpenId implementation. OpenId has been around since 2005.
Post your ACTUAL patent link (e.g. One that resolves in an official government entity responsible for such items) so we can judge for ourselves.
Might as well pile on the suit from Epic then. Another few million in legal expenses from apple won’t be noticed on the bottom line.
I eventually found his patent application: https://patentscope.wipo.int/search...60D1.wapp1nA?docId=WO2020039327&tab=PCTCLAIMS
Sounds like he's basically trying to lay claim to email. From what I could tell no-one has expressed any interest in his new "email standard" and since it was filed just last year I have no idea how he thinks he's got any case against Apple.
@Alan Wynn & @cmaier : you guys have anything you can offer here, or words of wisdom?
I do find it suspicious that @Viruthagiri neglated to provide a link to this "patent application" and instead just provided small snippets.
This is a PCT application, which means it isn’t a patent application by itself - an actual patent application needs to be filed in whatever countries he wants to get a patent in. The PCT application sort of “saves the date” and gives him time to do so. And then we see if the patent actually issues from the application. Perhaps he’s filed somewhere already - didn’t look into it.
Also looks like the Indian patent office found it invalid over prior art as lacking an inventive step (which is a different approach than that taken in the U.S., but is similar to Europe, and sort of equivalent to the U.S. concept of “obviousness.”). Not sure what the current status is, though. Lots of times you can overcome such things by amending claims, etc.
I had a question regarding why a sign in would stop working with ‘Sign In with Apple’ but became a complicated patent something, stealing and somehow Epic is right 😛.
Maybe you have some insight, the only thing that I find stressful on this ordeal (if I get it right that is) is that my sign in capabilities with Apple are tied to the service I’m using it with being solvent and clean with Apple. Their mistakes seems to punish the user face on.
I don't know why my post makes you laugh. My patent claims made Apple to ditch an important security feature.
This is how they used to ask domain verification. [Link 1] [Link 2]
I added this patent claim: [Link]
This is what Apple says now: [Link]
No it is not. It is Apple's custom implementation. Later Apple made "Sign in with Apple" compatible with "OpenID Connect" after OpenID chairman request. [Open Letter] [Their response]
Have you ever seen that Apple "officially" says "Sign in with Apple" is an OpenID Implementation? Just show me one simple evidence from "Sign in with Apple" documentation, then I would stop this argument.
Remember, ONE SIMPLE EVIDENCE FROM "SIGN IN WITH APPLE" DOCUMENTATION.
Apple is using this patent document [prior art] to steal my work. So "Sign in with Apple" is their custom implementation.
[This] part from that prior art converted as [like this]
[This] part from that prior art converted as [like this]
[This] part from that prior art converted as [like this]
As far the actual patent links, I think you haven't read my full details link which I linked earlier.
Full details: https://www.domboxmail.com/news/apple-copied-our-product
It contains all patent links under the "Relevant Documents" section.
I provided "patent application" links in the full details link I provided.
Apple copied our product as "Sign in with Apple"
Read that fully before passing judgements.
Also I started to file my patents in the US.
I kind of don’t understand the problem here, really. If apple kicks out the developer, then you may lose the ability to use sign in with apple WiTH THAT DEVELOPER. You can still use Sign In with Apple everywhere else. Apple rarely kicks out developers. And when they do, it’s only a problem if you’d keep using that service with some other non-apple devices. I guess it could happen, sure. But why are people more concerned with this than with apple kicking out the developer in the first place? I’m sure most people who were using Sign In with Apple with fort nite were doing so with apple devices, and few of them were also using other devices with fortnite. Can’t prove it, just seems like it.
As @TiggrToo mentioned, my invention is related to email. I'm an SMTP engineer. I try to improve email communication.
I sometimes participate in the IETF discussions.
SMTP Extension for Longer Email Address
This memo defines an SMTP extension with keyword "EAML" whereby an SMTP server can declare that it is capable of handling longer email addresses without any local-part or domain-part restriction set by RFC 5321. EAML stands for "Email Address Maximum Length".
tools.ietf.org
Dombox - Proposal - SMTP Over TLS on Port 26
In 2018, I came up with a new mail system called "Dombox", which addresses email spam problem without relying on spam filters. This is the address structure of Dombox.
I published my research in a 300 page white paper in Feb 2019. ["Sign in with Dombox" is termed as "Teleport" in that paper. You can see that in page 115]
My "dombox addresses" relies on a new DNS record called "SAD Record" to prevent spam and offer privacy. My white paper explained everything clearly. I even made certain terms and conditions for those email addresses. For example, if the SPF verification is not "Pass", then the incoming mail will be rejected. There is more to it. Let's not go there.
The point I'm trying to make is, I innovated in the "email" field. More specifically "email address" field. I built few tools to make this "dombox address" creation easier. "Sign in with Dombox" is one of them.
Apple desperately needs my "Sender Alias Domains (SAD)" solution to make "Sign in with Apple" work. They are trying to clone my "SAD Record" using the "domain policy list" part found in this prior art. Their argument would work only when Fortnite app is found in the "App Store" since this "domain policy list" is provided for preventing "fake fortnite apps".
Once Apple kick out developers from the App Store, Apple is literally killing their business. Because, (a) Developers cannot use "Sign in with Apple" in other platforms without having an app in the "App Store". (b) Apple cannot accept emails to the "Sign in with Apple" generated email address if developers don't have an app in the "App Store".
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I agree. I don’t play Fortnite so the whole Epic thing does not affect me personally.
I think this is a poor move by Apple though and will make many think twice about using Sign In with Apple - a service that is supposed to make life easier now being used as a sacrificial pawn in corporate chess games.
👎
Good luck!I provided "patent application" links in the full details link I provided.
Apple copied our product as "Sign in with Apple"
www.domboxmail.com
Read that fully before passing judgements.
Also I started to file my patents in the US.
Show us an ACCEPTED patent filing.
It's as simple as that to start.
Right now we've a "nobody" posting random snippets in a contextless environment.
And quit conflating cause and effect. I sincerely doubt your emails made a squat bit of difference.
Finally NOTHING you've posted here shows any link to Apple vs Epic other than the subject at hand involves SIWA.
My last comment shows the acknowledgement email I received from Epic Games CEO. Apple made a U-Turn after I told Apple that Epic Games knows about "Sign in with Apple" patent issue.
Epic Games can bring an antitrust lawsuit on Apple since they are the one who forced developers to display their "Sign in with Apple" button without being transparent to the developers. Developers didn't know what they were signing up for.
After my mail, Apple is offering Fortnite an "indefinite extension" now. I also noticed they updated their terms to allow "Game streaming services". I believe that's to please epic games and bring Fortnite back to the App Sore to make "Sign in with Apple" work for them.
Was it, though? Epic have yet to provide any evidence to show it was at risk.