Apple Event on Thursday May 18th, 2006?

[pjkelnhofer]

I think I have a problem with the word obsolete. Plenty of people are still going to have and be using 32-bit processors for years to come.

Do you really think that with all the 32-bit processors out there that Leopard is going to be optimized for 64-bit processors that have been out for half a year?!? (Assuming 10.5 comes out in Jan '07). Apple is going to have to support G5's for several more years and you think they are going to phase out the 32-bit Intels right away? People are still buying G4 iBooks now that is an "obsolete" chip (or at least it should be).

Finally, what are the real world difference we will see going from 32-bit computing to 64-bit both short term and long term. Here is a pretty good article on that.

The answer is that it depends on what you do and what programs you run. Long term 64-bit is the future, I don't think anyone is arguing that. However, by the time there is enough true 64-bit stuff out there to make a difference to the average consumer, a laptop bought now will be out-dated anyhow. Graphics, ports, processor speed, etc. will all have been surpassed in the few years it will take for that to happen. This is why, the PowerMac which is Apple only truly upgradable system is probably the only one that has to wait for the Merom to come out.

There will be a day when people with the Intel 32-bit processors cannot buy new software or run the latest OS. Of course, first those with G4s, then G5s will be out of luck. It will take time. The existence of 64-bit processors doesn't mean that all 32-bit computers should be thrown out the window and all 32-bit applications will cease to exist.

As some one who bought a used IIx just before the first PowerPC's started coming out (I wasn't in tune with what was next in the computing world, I just need something to run Quark Xpress and Illustrator on), I can speak to having an "obsolete" computer. But, it did what I needed it to do and I managed to use it for five years until I got a firewire iMac. So to say that a MacBook (theorectically speaking) that came out today is somehow useless in three months it is simply not true.

 

[pjkelnhofer]

Ughh more things to worry about... I cant imagine that I will ever truly NEED 64 bits... I am the type that will just be doing the surfing, emailing, word docs, playing the occasional game, simple video editing and photo storage. Would I ever utilize the 64bits even if I had it?

When software is optimized for 64-bits you will see a performance difference. Some day (in the distant future) applications will only be released in 64-bits (try finding something written for 16-bits today). However, whether a computer bought today would live to see that is questionable.

My biggest concern, is that if I didnt wait till the 64bit was in the Macbook, would I not be able to purchase a Leopard upgrade when it comes out in ?January? Does this mean that all existing Macs will not be able to change from Tiger to Leopard??

This is the kind of wrong conclusion that people are going to draw from the "the MacBook will be obsolete before it is even released" posts that are filling this thread. Leopard (Mac OS 10.5) will not only support 32-bit Intel processors, but Apple has stated that it will support PowerPC chips (it will defintely support G4s and G5s). So to imply that it wouldn't support a Core Duo is just ridiculous.

Tiger has 64-bit capability (which can only be used on the G5 since is the only 64-bit chip in a Mac). Leopard will have more, but it will not run only on 64-bit chips, in fact, most likely, it will not even be optimized for 64-bit chips. There just will not be enough of them out there by January to make it worth it. Apple could go the Windows route and release a seperate 64-bit version of Leopard, but I doubt it. Multiple versions of their OS (other than the server version) just is not Apple's style.

If the Memron is due in August when do you really think it will be placed in the Macbook?

I would suspect it will probably be going into the MacBook Pro and that will be one of the differences between the two lines.

 

[AidenShaw]

I think I have a problem with the word obsolete. Plenty of people are still going to have and be using 32-bit processors for years to come.

Do you really think that with all the 32-bit processors out there that Leopard is going to be optimized for 64-bit processors that have been out for half a year?!?.

I agree with you on the Windows side - there are lots of Intel 32-bit processors out there, and it would be crazy for any company to drop support for them (except perhaps for high-end CAD or other apps that really need 64-bit memory addressing).

The story on the MacIntel side, however, is very different.

When 10.5 is released, it is possible that there will be more 64-bit MacIntels around that 32-bit ones. (Picture PowerMacIntels in June, the new dual-core Conroe mini-tower in July, and Merom in MBP and iMac in August.)

It is in Apple's best long-term interest to move to an all 64-bit environment as soon as possible. Kind of hard on the people who bought Yonah's, but better for software houses and Apple.

 

[pjkelnhofer]

I agree with you on the Windows side - there are lots of Intel 32-bit processors out there, and it would be crazy for any company to drop support for them (except perhaps for high-end CAD or other apps that really need 64-bit memory addressing).

The story on the MacIntel side, however, is very different.

When 10.5 is released, it is possible that there will be more 64-bit MacIntels around that 32-bit ones. (Picture PowerMacIntels in June, the new dual-core Conroe mini-tower in July, and Merom in MBP and iMac in August.)

It is in Apple's best long-term interest to move to an all 64-bit environment as soon as possible. Kind of hard on the people who bought Yonah's, but better for software houses and Apple.

I think we are disagree on what we mean by around. Sure by the time that Tiger comes out the entire Mac line may be using Merom based chips, but Apple and the software manufactures have an interest in designing software not only for the latest, greatest and fastest computers that are on sale today, but for all the computers that are already sitting in people homes and offices.

Do you think that after saying they will support the G5's until 2009 that they are going to turn their back on the first adopters of the MacIntels just to get to 64-bit as fast as possible?

If you piss off your user base to that degree, you are going to lose a lot more than you gain.

 

[mikea]

Oh I wish you were right. But this time we have an exception to the rule. MacBooks May Be Outdated In 3 Months Rather Than The Usual 3 Years thanks to the imminent 64-bit Merom release in August. All the "new" MacIntels are based on the last of the 32-bit processors. It's really a sad situation for those of us who see the long term big picture.

I know we're getting razzed by those of you who think they are "fast enough" etc. We don't doubt they are fast and cool - well not really cool - and fun and neat. We're thinking about the long term viability of 32-bit processing in the face of a predominantly 64-bit friendly OS next year. While it's nothing to have a cow over, we don't see the point of investing a lot of money in this processor as the opening volly into the Intel space when it will be replaced by a completely new 64-bit processor family beginning in little more than two weeks (June) and completing deployment by September. That's all.

Core 3 Duo is in 2008
Core 4 Duo is in 2010

Why buy Core 1 Duo when Core 2 Duo is so close at hand? . Cooler, Faster, Quieter Mobile Processors in 3 months. Is that really a very long time to wait?

This is how we VOTE on what the MARKET WANTS not what Apple wants to FOIST on the Market. WE ARE THE MARKET. WE CAN VOTE by NOT BUYING obsolete technology now. This is what the debate here is all about.

Now if you need something right away, no problem. Core Duo is fine for the short term. It just appears to me to be a product line family that will have a very short life span and that models containing it will depreciate in value sooner than past and future models have and will. Is that fair? I really don't want to piss anyone off here. I am trying to be gentle. . It's a HISTORICAL BIG PICTURE point of view.

Hey,
A few weeks ago, i was ready to buy something other than the MacBook and you were the one who told me to hold on because it was going to be such a great LapTop at a great price....So what gives. We Live in a ever Changing world..So what would your advice be to someone who really does need a laptop in the next few weeks before I hit the road for 3 months. I really want to make a switch to Mac..It will be My first Laptop, I am a travelling musician and I want to use it for webbuilding, music, some light video work and ofcourse business on line etc....in my down time I want to learn OS and use the tools of ilife.. SO what should I do???

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

Oh I wish you were right. But this time we have an exception to the rule. MacBooks May Be Outdated In 3 Months Rather Than The Usual 3 Years thanks to the imminent 64-bit Merom release in August. All the "new" MacIntels are based on the last of the 32-bit processors. It's really a sad situation for those of us who see the long term big picture.

Well I do remember owning a Pentium II 450Mhz. And then my cousin got a P-III 500 mhz a couple of months later and was all the very much excited bout it. But neither me nor him could see any difference in general performance,games etc. And a few years later(bout3years) both the systems were as much unusable as the other one. No real difference between them.

Now I know yonah and merom might not be exactly comparable to PII and PIII(Jump from 32 to 64 bit). But I really doubt that at the same frequency we`ll see a substantial difference in the system. I dont think a 1.67Core2Duo will be much more usable than 1.67CoreDuo. Both the systems will be unbearable after 3 years. I mean in 2009 we might be having processors which will be 4-5 times faster than the current ones. It wont really matter if you have a 1.67CD or a 1.67C2D. Both of them will be unable to run the latest games and applications.

If we`d wait one more year then we might be be seeing a some real difference in the latest 2.7Ghz C2D and the current 1.67CD. But for now I dont think there`ll be that much of difference in CD n C2D

And in any case as I`ve already stated, there`s no way apple will be putting Meroms in MB before MWSF. Or it might be possible that meroms in MB will be offered only when MB ships with Leopard preinstalled. MBP will get C2D the moment Steve gets his hands on them no doubt.

So there`s no point at all in waiting for C2D for MacBooks.

One thing I m sure is that You guys have definitely made the current MBP owners even more unsatisfied than ever. I mean as if all this heat,whine etc weren`t enough. You`ve added one more reason to consider their purchase of MBP a stupidity. They paid a premium price for the MBP only to find out that it`ll be OBSOLETE in 3 months.

In any case all these comments that your new MB will be unusable in 3-4 years are worthless for me personally. I dont remember a using the same mobile phone for more than 6 months. Now MB will be my second laptop only(sold the iBook after 4 months of use). But I m sure I wont be keeping it for more than 12 to 18 months. If I find out that there is a new MB with completely new mind blowing design is launched. Then I`ll sell my current one and buy the new one. I m sure I wont lose more than 10% of it`s value.

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

Hey,
A few weeks ago, i was ready to buy something other than the MacBook and you were the one who told me to hold on because it was going to be such a great LapTop at a great price....So what gives. We Live in a ever Changing world..So what would your advice be to someone who really does need a laptop in the next few weeks before I hit the road for 3 months. I really want to make a switch to Mac..It will be My first Laptop, I am a travelling musician and I want to use it for webbuilding, music, some light video work and ofcourse business on line etc....in my down time I want to learn OS and use the tools of ilife.. SO what should I do???

I m sorry if you were asking only Multi to reply. But anyways, you can have my opinion till he gives his. I dont think there`s any reason (atleast for you) to to hold now. Except for the actual launch of the MacBook. For your needs a Merom wont really make one hell of a difference. And it seems you`ve been waiting for some time now. There should`n be any reason to frustrate yourself anymore by waiting for Merom MB.

I`ll definitely buy it as soon as I get my hands on one.

Please steve just Launch the Damn #%$#% MacBooks. Everyone`s just getting mad here in anticipation.`cept for maybe Multi and Aiden, offcourse . But I personally dont think they`ll buy one. Both will be buyin a MBP with Merom IMO. Not an MB. Not unless MB is way better lookin than MBP. People who already have a good enough system can wait. But not the ones like us who are stuck to an almost dead system only coz we are waiting for the MB and dont want to invest our money in somthing we might be selling again in a month. So no point in waiting anymore once it`s launched. Or you`ll be waiting till the end of the time.

 

[Peace]

Man you folks are really getting bored eh?

 

[Aquaporin]

In my opinion, Apple will use this opportunity to release their Macbooks. While I do not believe it is a certainty, it would be an opportunity to "surprise" the media. Journalists arrive to see the majestic cube of fifth avenue, only to find themselves apart of a famous "One more thing" presentation. The media would **** themselves out of excitement. On another note, Jobs may wish to focus soley on the new flagship store. The New York market is huge compared to the other markets, and free publicity in the New York Times can only benefit the new store.

 

[BlizzardBomb]

First up I think the average user is a myth because in reality the average user 3 years ago wasn't likely to be doing anything like the level of photo or video manipulation they can these days, and the same will apply for 3 years from now with these and other like multimedia apps. And lets not even discuss games or HDTV

When Photoshop goes Universal, it will perform great on any Intel Mac. HDTV, well I don't see the MacBook's screen handling 1080p and Yonah can easily handle 720p. Games, well the processor won't be the bottleneck... the integrated graphics will.

 

[x64]

Do you think that after saying they will support the G5's until 2009 that they [Apple] are going to turn their back on the first adopters of the MacIntels just to get to 64-bit as fast as possible?

It's not just Apple, other vendors aren't bound by Apple promises.

 

[rhsgolfer33]

It's not just Apple, other vendors aren't bound by Apple promises.

But most of those other vendors are also going to be coding in UBs for the next 3-5 years, so most software will proably run on G5s and whatever intel youre running. Contrary to what seems to be a general belief of some on this forum, the days merom and then leopard are released will not be the complete end of 32bit computing on an Apple. Leopard will be coded for 32 and 64bit support and software companies arent going to stop making programs for the massive Apple user base that wont have 64bit, or even Intel support.

 

[AidenShaw]

But most of those other vendors are also going to be coding in UBs for the next 3-5 years, so most software will proably run on G5s and whatever intel youre running. Contrary to what seems to be a general belief of some on this forum, the days merom and then leopard are released will not be the complete end of 32bit computing on an Apple. Leopard will be coded for 32 and 64bit support and software companies arent going to stop making programs for the massive Apple user base that wont have 64bit, or even Intel support.

Fat binaries aren't free, especially if you need to have 3 versions of your application in them (32-bit PPC, 32-bit x86 and 64-bit x64). Each version has to be separately tested and debugged and supported, which costs money.

If 10.5 isn't true 64-bit, then Yonah won't die a quick death.

One problem is that Yonah does not represent a "massive user base", especially if Apple puts Merom in across the board. It's a few months in a few models of systems.

By the way, I don't think that anyone is implying that 32-bit PowerPC support will be affected by Merom. It's only the long-term prospects for Yonah that are questionable.

 

[tolly]

video ipod

All i'm praying for is the viseo ipod(fullscreen, touchscreen, 40/80gb,bluetooth) When there were rumors about it a few months ago, they generated alot of excitment, therefore i think there are probably alot of people who agree with me when i say "i WANT one, now!"

 

[tolly]

Video Ipod

All i'm praying for is a video ipod (fullscreen, touchscreen, 40/80gb, bluetooth)
when there were rumors about it a few months ago, they generated alot of excitement, therefore, i think there are alot of ppl who will agree with me when i say "i WANT a video ipod, NOW!"



Sorry bout double post

 

[Georgeo]

Man you folks are really gettig bored eh?

Bored?
Blasphemy!!!
Speak for yoursef!! These pages are overflowing with excitement, anticipation, anger, hope and fear....it's like the dawn of a new religion..and the MacBook is the return of JC himself.. Steve Jobs is god (clever eh?) and we are all disciples. Baptize me baby, and may this new MacBook bring you all joy and Happiness for at least 3 months!!!! Hey, If we all bow our heads and send our energy to god JOBS maybe apple (heaven) will send down MacBook and the world will never be the same again...
all together now AMEM!

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

Hey, If we all bow our heads and send our energy to god JOBS maybe apple (heaven) will send down MacBook and the world will never be the same again...
all together now AMEM!

AMEN​

 

[Peace]

Bored?
Blasphemy!!!
Speak for yoursef!! These pages are overflowing with excitement, anticipation, anger, hope and fear....it's like the dawn of a new religion..and the MacBook is the return of JC himself.. Steve Jobs is god (clever eh?) and we are all disciples. Baptize me baby, and may this new MacBook bring you all joy and Happiness for at least 3 months!!!! Hey, If we all bow our heads and send our energy to god JOBS maybe apple (heaven) will send down MacBook and the world will never be the same again...
all together now AMEM!

I was referring to the 64-bit vs. 32-bit stuff..

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

I was referring to the 64-bit vs. 32-bit stuff..

Atleast it`s way better n educative than MacBook vs iBook. What will it be called...............

 

[ImAlwaysRight]

When 10.5 is released, it is possible that there will be more 64-bit MacIntels around that 32-bit ones. (Picture PowerMacIntels in June, the new dual-core Conroe mini-tower in July, and Merom in MBP and iMac in August.)

It is in Apple's best long-term interest to move to an all 64-bit environment as soon as possible. Kind of hard on the people who bought Yonah's, but better for software houses and Apple.

This is all new territory with Apple. Don't necessarily expect Apple to switch chips in all Mac models the day a 64-bit chip starts to ship. More than likely the consumer MacBooks, iMacs and Mac Mini's will all retain Yonah for some time after Merom becomes available. That's what Apple has done in the past, anyway. I don't expect much to change with the Intel chips. Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Another thing to keep in mind -- better than 95% of all Macs in use will not be 64-bit capable when OS 10.5 ships in Jan '07, so I don't see Apple moving to an "all 64-bit environment" anytime soon.

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

This is all new territory with Apple. Don't necessarily expect Apple to switch chips in all Mac models the day a 64-bit chip starts to ship. More than likely the consumer MacBooks, iMacs and Mac Mini's will all retain Yonah for some time after Merom becomes available. That's what Apple has done in the past, anyway. I don't expect much to change with the Intel chips. Guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Another thing to keep in mind -- better than 95% of all Macs in use will not be 64-bit capable when OS 10.5 ships in Jan '07, so I don't see Apple moving to an "all 64-bit environment" anytime soon.

You are almost right. Except for may be the iMac. I think iMac will be updated as soon as the new chip arrives. But then I may be wrong. Coz YouAreAlwaysRight.

 

[mikea]

Thanks

I m sorry if you were asking only Multi to reply. But anyways, you can have my opinion till he gives his. I dont think there`s any reason (atleast for you) to to hold now. Except for the actual launch of the MacBook. For your needs a Merom wont really make one hell of a difference. And it seems you`ve been waiting for some time now. There should`n be any reason to frustrate yourself anymore by waiting for Merom MB.

I`ll definitely buy it as soon as I get my hands on one.

Please steve just Launch the Damn #%$#% MacBooks. Everyone`s just getting mad here in anticipation.`cept for maybe Multi and Aiden, offcourse . But I personally dont think they`ll buy one. Both will be buyin a MBP with Merom IMO. Not an MB. Not unless MB is way better lookin than MBP. People who already have a good enough system can wait. But not the ones like us who are stuck to an almost dead system only coz we are waiting for the MB and dont want to invest our money in somthing we might be selling again in a month. So no point in waiting anymore once it`s launched. Or you`ll be waiting till the end of the time.

Thanks
and
Amen

 

[iJawn108]

You are almost right. Except for may be the iMac. I think iMac will be updated as soon as the new chip arrives. But then I may be wrong. Coz YouAreAlwaysRight.

I might hold off on buying a notebook and get an Imac if they are switched ASAP appon release. I need a computer by the end of the summer though.

 

[Multimedia]

What Do You Buy Now?

Hey,
A few weeks ago, i was ready to buy something other than the MacBook and you were the one who told me to hold on because it was going to be such a great LapTop at a great price....So what gives. We Live in a ever Changing world..So what would your advice be to someone who really does need a laptop in the next few weeks before I hit the road for 3 months. I really want to make a switch to Mac..It will be My first Laptop, I am a travelling musician and I want to use it for webbuilding, music, some light video work and ofcourse business on line etc....in my down time I want to learn OS and use the tools of ilife.. SO what should I do???

I'm sorry. A few weeks ago we didn't have rampant reports of defects in all these MacBook Pros. For the applications you want to use you should buy all the power and screen real estate you can afford and are willing to carry with you on the road. It's a tough call. Music really eats power for breakfast esp Garageband. So it's hard to recommend anything not knowing your budget and plans for it. I would only buy the 17" MBP if I had to buy one now. But I would be making a big stink if my screen isn't bright and even. You will be able to do all you want with the MacBook once it comes out. But definitely on the light side. Sorry for my premature enthusiasm. Now that the newness thrill has worn off, I have become much more pragmatic about the long term relevance of a Yonah processor inside plus all the defects reported. I am not sure what to tell you. You want to private message me for more info about what you want vs. what you need how soon?

 

[Nar1117]

Nobodys splitting hairs here... no of course not.

Anyone who wants to squeeze the last bit of crunching power out of their Mac will have to wait to get one forever. Waiting for something thats going to be coming every 6 months is the worst thing one can do in the computer buisness.

Processors WILL get faster.
Your processor WILL become obsolete. Sometime.

Get over it.