Apple encourages grievances such as these. I’m here for it. I hope everyone ends up being paid exactly the same. Let’s see how that works out for ingenuity. Lol. 😂
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Apple Executive Addresses Recent Employee Concerns in Internal Video
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They do. They are called equity awards, Stock comp/gifts, and dividends.
All this “equal pay” stuff will achieve is lower compensation as things are forcibly normalized to favor the below average.
You are worth exactly the amount of money you accept in exchange for your employment. Your paycheck is not a reward for work done, it is an amount of money that YOU earned for the work YOU did.
Victimhood culture.
Remember when polite society used to reject the self loathing woe is me types. Yeah, social media has flipped the tables.
Remember when polite society used to reject the self loathing woe is me types. Yeah, social media has flipped the tables.
I blame this solely on Apple. They created a workforce of snowflakes and pretend to be shocked when they start melting and screaming.
The reality is like so many people AND corporations they say one thing and do something else.
The reality is like so many people AND corporations they say one thing and do something else.
It is intentional that it gives a surface appearance of doing something while pretty clearly not doing anything. If it was too convincing, employees might be left with the impression they call the shots.
Just about every time I see Tim Cook talking he holds his hands like he is praying.
Oh my goodness I am a first year technical writer, why does Tim Cook get paid more than I do?
Millennials are hilarious. Pay based on your intersectionality sounds amazing when you have no skills and are starting out. It looks pretty silly when you have experience and make actual contributions. But this is our future. From each according to their ability and to each according to their victen hood matrix.
Millennials are hilarious. Pay based on your intersectionality sounds amazing when you have no skills and are starting out. It looks pretty silly when you have experience and make actual contributions. But this is our future. From each according to their ability and to each according to their victen hood matrix.
I wonder why your pay is a public record. Hmmmm. Boy let’s see. I seem to remember something about why that would be....
Are your pensions and benefits public? I assume they are because....
Ive been in positions of hiring all through my career. There is no separate scale for women and “minorities” that I’ve experienced in the corporations I’ve worked at. Internal promotions had a set scale. While I’m not trying to deny that inequality of pay did happen years and years ago I’ve never experienced it.
I do think, especially more now, that folks have this perception that their own performance and skills isn’t the issue it’s someone or thing else keeping them down. There’s a feeling of entitlement that’s becoming a lot more prevalent.
I find it difficult to believe that Apple has wide spread practices of pay inequality. And if employee x feels that way, quit.
Hmmm, it's an interesting hypothesis, but I question if it will work well even if that is the intent. Apple made similar statements to quell the "voices of the screeching minority" and they still ended up being the ones calling the shots within a few weeks.
Apple is not handling their image well lately, internally or externally.
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I know of several cases (not necessarily in Apple) where men are paid LESS than women, with similar experience and performance. And people not of the company's ideology have learned to keep quiet, sometimes even to the point where they don't feel free to talk about things like their church or their bible study group.
But nobody DARES bring it up to HR, because they feel very strongly that they would be branded for all time. Not necessarily by their direct manager, either. But in the long run, it doesn't matter who does the branding. Once you've been branded, life can get very difficult.
It's WORSE in companies that appear in the news to have a strongly preferred political ideology, because people are just EXPECTED to follow that ideology. Apple, Mozilla, Twitter, just about every so-called government pet project, etcetera.
In the old days, the equivalent was when they used to FORCE everybody to donate to the United Way, even if you had a valid religious objection. They would call you into the VP's office and tell you that you were going to make the company miss its donation goal of "100%" (meaning that 100% of employees were donating "something" out of their pay, which is a totally useless benchmark anyhow).
If you didn't respond favorably to that guilt trip, they would accuse you of not giving your "fair share", or letting down your fellow employees or the poor who lived in your town. It was sick and demented, and I'm sure that it violated a number of labor laws what they were doing. But even managers that I respected were all involved in this, and everybody had the tacit green-light from HR that this kind of pressure was not only okay, but was encouraged!
One co-worker told the guilt-layers that he couldn't afford to donate anything. He was not paid very much, was hourly, worked the night shift so that he and his wife could double-team and split parenting duties for the 4 or 5 kids he had to support. But management kept persisting, wanting that donation so that they could check a box. So he finally relented and said he would, under pressure, donate 50 cents from each paycheck. They told him that 50 cents wasn't enough because they would be LOSING MONEY with such a small donation.
He got fed up and finally told them either leave him alone, accept the 50 cents, or fire him right now so that he call his lawyer instead of going home to sleep before his shift that night.
I don't think they fired him. He was the lowest guy on every totem pole and nobody wanted to work his shift for that low of a pay. It was a crap job and he was the only person willing to do it for almost nothing in return. I think they ended up leaving him alone, but not before pushing him to nearly quitting his job over a donation that was SUPPOSED to be "optional".
Today, the United Way isn't strong-arming companies into strong-arming their employees like they used to. United Way had its own corruption and resulting bad karma to deal with. But companies like Google, Facebook, Twitter, Apple, Microsoft, Disney, and many many others are still strong-arming their employees into keeping quiet; just on other things. Men don't report abuses done to them. Women are told that they CAN report abuses, and sometimes when they do, it works out. Other times, upper management still closes ranks like they used to. Conservatives don't report workplace issues hostile to conservatives. Churchgoing folks keep quiet about their faith and even in some cases, feel that they have to hide who they are.
Inequities still abound. Except for the fact that most of us carry a smartphone with us, use Windows and Outlook to do our jobs, and work from home for a portion of our time, it could just as well still be 1987.
I wish that companies would just take all the damned politics OUT of their cultures. But I fear that it won't happen until long after I have retired from the workforce.
But nobody DARES bring it up to HR, because they feel very strongly that they would be branded for all time. Not necessarily by their direct manager, either. But in the long run, it doesn't matter who does the branding. Once you've been branded, life can get very difficult.
It's WORSE in companies that appear in the news to have a strongly preferred political ideology, because people are just EXPECTED to follow that ideology. Apple, Mozilla, Twitter, just about every so-called government pet project, etcetera.
In the old days, the equivalent was when they used to FORCE everybody to donate to the United Way, even if you had a valid religious objection. They would call you into the VP's office and tell you that you were going to make the company miss its donation goal of "100%" (meaning that 100% of employees were donating "something" out of their pay, which is a totally useless benchmark anyhow).
If you didn't respond favorably to that guilt trip, they would accuse you of not giving your "fair share", or letting down your fellow employees or the poor who lived in your town. It was sick and demented, and I'm sure that it violated a number of labor laws what they were doing. But even managers that I respected were all involved in this, and everybody had the tacit green-light from HR that this kind of pressure was not only okay, but was encouraged!
One co-worker told the guilt-layers that he couldn't afford to donate anything. He was not paid very much, was hourly, worked the night shift so that he and his wife could double-team and split parenting duties for the 4 or 5 kids he had to support. But management kept persisting, wanting that donation so that they could check a box. So he finally relented and said he would, under pressure, donate 50 cents from each paycheck. They told him that 50 cents wasn't enough because they would be LOSING MONEY with such a small donation.
He got fed up and finally told them either leave him alone, accept the 50 cents, or fire him right now so that he call his lawyer instead of going home to sleep before his shift that night.
I don't think they fired him. He was the lowest guy on every totem pole and nobody wanted to work his shift for that low of a pay. It was a crap job and he was the only person willing to do it for almost nothing in return. I think they ended up leaving him alone, but not before pushing him to nearly quitting his job over a donation that was SUPPOSED to be "optional".
Today, the United Way isn't strong-arming companies into strong-arming their employees like they used to. United Way had its own corruption and resulting bad karma to deal with. But companies like Google, Facebook, Twitter, Apple, Microsoft, Disney, and many many others are still strong-arming their employees into keeping quiet; just on other things. Men don't report abuses done to them. Women are told that they CAN report abuses, and sometimes when they do, it works out. Other times, upper management still closes ranks like they used to. Conservatives don't report workplace issues hostile to conservatives. Churchgoing folks keep quiet about their faith and even in some cases, feel that they have to hide who they are.
Inequities still abound. Except for the fact that most of us carry a smartphone with us, use Windows and Outlook to do our jobs, and work from home for a portion of our time, it could just as well still be 1987.
I wish that companies would just take all the damned politics OUT of their cultures. But I fear that it won't happen until long after I have retired from the workforce.
Some places just direct you to HR if you have a complaint about your pay. HR then shows you that you're being paid MORE than other people with your skills, experience, and performance. Even if it's not true.
It's seems a few tweets make people believe Apple has a "real problem". The real problem is dealing with pay equality across 50,000+ employees. Nobody is going to get a raise because people aired some grievances. However, hopefully Apple is looking into this and if there is an issue will over time remediate it.
Actually, talking to your direct manager is not always a bad thing to do, and may actually be your safest approach. "Line managers", that is, managers who's people are doing the crap jobs for low pay or working tons of extra hours for no more pay, they're not usually going to sink your career just because you observed some verbal poop-flinging in a meeting.
Really, do you think your direct manager wants to do YOUR crap job AND his/her own crap job at the same time until he/she can get permission to hire a replacement for you?
Your manager has way too much other stuff going on, like trying to explain why the project is going to be a week late or dealing with somebody else's artificially-created drama, dealing with a real sex harassment situation elsewhere in the department, or trying to find somebody to work the next 3 weeks because another team member just decided to take 2 weeks of mourning and add an additional week for a Norwegian cruise.
Hey, he's just the manager; he's not supposed to ask why that person is going on a cruise right after mourning the loss of a loved one!
The world is crazy right now, and it's no wonder why some people are wishing for that sweet sweet meteor of death! 🤪
So hard to compare pay with actual production. If you have two or more employees doing the same job, it should be possible to measure each employees production and vary the pay based on production factors if the factors could be agreed on. If they are not doing the same work, comparisons are more difficult. Often had concerns about how my pay grade corresponded to others and had serious disagreements with the way consulting firms guided management in setting pay grades.
Changing employers is a hard choice and no guarantee the new company does not have the same problem. That leaves complaining.
Changing employers is a hard choice and no guarantee the new company does not have the same problem. That leaves complaining.
Oh my God, you're right about that! My place of work is seeing that now. Lower chance of promotion or bonus. Out of one side of their mouth, they express concern for lack of employee loyalty. Out of the other, they talk about how it's going to be harder for everybody to get a high performance evaluation grade.
I just want to know why the employees feel they are entitled to more money.
I would love to see the actual facts, such as examples of the pay disparity (if it exists) like say one person making 10k or 20k more than another while having same exact job title, years of experience etc. can we see raw numbers? just because a few employees feel they should be making more money in the expensive Bay Area doesn’t actually mean that Apple is at fault. I reserve judgement until the facts are out.
I would love to see the actual facts, such as examples of the pay disparity (if it exists) like say one person making 10k or 20k more than another while having same exact job title, years of experience etc. can we see raw numbers? just because a few employees feel they should be making more money in the expensive Bay Area doesn’t actually mean that Apple is at fault. I reserve judgement until the facts are out.
1. I don't know what they're getting paid, how it compares with market expectation or whether that's low pay. Apple's quite competitive to get into and I'd assume there's a lot of people earning decent $$$ at Apple (based on what they have to offer).
2. Which staff are we thinking about? I mean you'd have engineering/testing, retail, admin, HR, IT support, accounting, legal, hospitality...etc staff working for Apple.
3. What's the 'AppleToo' movement about? A quick read of their website suggests that there's a lot of secrecy that's resulting in ethnic minorities & women experiencing a 'pattern of isolation, degradation, and gaslighting'. The scope of their activism seems to extend to 'Corporate, AppleCare, and Retail'. So... fair to say these are probably mostly admin/customer support/retail roles (which would pay less).
Side note... the CEO's salary (which is obviously gonna be very very high compared with a random sales person in their retail area) isn't really a fair point of comparison for junior staff. The transition from Jobs to Cook has been pretty seamless (although I've never warmed to Cook, he's warmed to a broader market). He's now being rewarded and his pay would have to go through board/shareholder scrutiny...etc.
My general rule with work is that nowhere's gonna pay me more money than they have to if I'm gonna be doing the same job. If I want more $$$ then I can either:
- Apply for a promotion elsewhere (surely leveraging Apple's good name isn't THAT hard)
- Sit it out because times are tough & I'm lucky to have a job (e.g. GFC and COVID times).
- Start training/networking so that I can secure the said transfer/promotion.