Apple Faces Another iPhone Lawsuit Over 'Programmed Obsolescence'

[Arsenikdote]

I understand you want to sound so bright and impress everyone in this blog but your argument is crap microchips and processors don’t age at exactly every 5 years this is planned obsolescence and i’ve been in the computer business since before you were standing on this earth so sit down boy!

Huh, sorry that whatever I said made you so upset that you would be rude and say things like "sit down boy". Elder or not, I was taught to treat people with respect. Someone who purports to be your age should have learned manors better than that, I know I did.

While I certainly don't want to sound dumb when I speak, you are incorrect about my motives. I mean I suppose I must have hit a button or something to get you worked up? You can't magically transport yourself in my brain, so you speaking to why and how I post is at best an educated guess based on patterns you have seen and at worst just an emotional reaction.

Either way, speaking specifically to your point about a "5 year" issue. I can understand if that is fact then it would seem like some scheme going on to force people to upgrade. However, being a business owner and having 30+ employees, we upgrade computers as the user has the need and move computers around within the company. We are a 90% Mac operation and we have computers 8+ years old running just fine. We have iPads running just fine. I don't think we have any super old phones, which I know is the point of the article. However, that is a personal item and not a business provided item so we don't have control over when people upgrade them. I just think it feels a little "conspiracy theory" to just talk about the "worst case scenario" point of an argument without acknowledging it and without giving any other balancing point. But that is just my opinion.

 

[2010mini]

The planned obsolesce stuff always gives me pause, given how many years Apple supplies updates for hardware. Feels like there would be more merit if this was more in alignment with what has happened on the Android side of the fence, where maybe you get 2 years of updates. Granted, that's improving now with the more recent commitments from Samsung (et al), but historically you'd get a couple years from Android manufacturers, and 2-3 times that from Apple.

That said, 100% on-board with a thorough investigation, and maybe some commitment from Apple to better test changes on older hardware if they're going to be included in said further updates. Even on the latest hardware, there have been some surprising bugs crop up from software version to software version.

My overall experience is positive, but everyone uses their devices differently, use different software load outs that may exasperate other problems more than others. Healthy to keep Apple in check.

Wouldn’t planned obsolescence be if they stopped supporting older devices?

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Because communal decisions lack proper structure and foresight resulting in more and more splintered offshoots as time goes on.

So, the process by which something actually useful and desirable is created requires the focus of a company structure, then. iPhone plus “these other features” are at direct opposition as one requires a company and the other requires individual input. And the individuals realizing they’ll never get what they want would like to see the government force what they want to happen (no mattter what the potential downsides would be). Interesting take, I’ll be giving this more thought.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Wouldn’t planned obsolescence be if they stopped supporting older devices?

Welllllll that would depend of if they PLANNED to stop supporting other devices or they just suddenly, to their surprised stopped supporting them… UNplanned. I don’t know any company that doesn’t have a plan to stop supporting something so every company is guilty

 

[hankito]

Do every Android handset maker next. Samsung first. Especially for the fact that a new phone may, may get 1 update and it’s obsoleted by the next model that may, may also get one update.

 

[Smoovejayy]

Your view of history

wrong but valid for the winner.

Please tell me how it is wrong.

 

[AppleShareholder]

It amuses me how Apple fans brag about software support on their Apple devices. What good are fast updates or strong CPUs when the next update acts like malware and craters performance? At least with android and Windows you have solid performance and battery life for 4+ years. I had an iPhone and Mac years ago. Now I'm back to android + windows and have no intention of going back.

 

[AppleShareholder]

Do every Android handset maker next. Samsung first. Especially for the fact that a new phone may, may get 1 update and it’s obsoleted by the next model that may, may also get one update.

Samsung has been good with updates in recent years. Their updates also don't slow down your phone and worsen battery life. I'm typing this on my 2-year-old S10 which just received a major OneUI update this week. No drop in performance or battery life.
Don't excuse Apple for installing malware on their customers' devices. Hold them accountable.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

I think this lawsuit is perfectly legitimate, for one simple reason—downgrading an iPhone to an earlier version of iOS is impossible.

If I install an update on my Mac, and I discover it makes my Mac too slow, I can go back to an earlier version of macOS! This may or may not be advisable—I may miss out on some newer features and security updates—but I have the option. On a clean install of the original OS, all hardware will run as quickly as it did when it was brand new.

But on an iPhone or iPad, you can't do that! If you install a new version of iOS and you discover it's too slow (and you're not within a very limited signing window), you're out of luck! Why?! Why can't I restore my phone to the state it was in when I bought it?

Step back for a moment. How am I ever really supposed to buy any product, ever, if it can change out from under me? Imagine if I was deciding between an iPhone and an Android phone, and I went with the iPhone because there was a specific 32-bit game I absolutely love, or because I liked the way Control Center worked in iOS 10. Whoops, along comes iOS 11, and the reasons I bought an iPhone are gone, forever! I can't get them back!

So it really doesn't really matter whether or not the slowness is intentional, or added for reasons that are good overall. Apple is changing the product you bought, after you bought it, and making it impossible to change back.

 

[AppleShareholder]

I completely agree with this. My mother had the first iPad Mini. It was perfect for her. She is in her 70's and doesn't care for speed, games or any other "amazing" stuff the iPad can do. She just wants to read her mail and browse a site or two.

Following the release of iOS 9, the iPad became useless. Slow to the point of ridiculous and basically destined for the bin. There was no way to downgrade by the time I got my hands on it as Apple stopped signing iOS 8, and we literally had to bin what was otherwise a perfectly reasonable device.

I've always wondered, why?

Yes, I know the device is old, but if it works, it should continue to do so. We live in a society where the answer is just "buy a new one"; because come on, $700 just grows on trees, right?

It's the thing that hacks me off with ALL of these companies. Apple is not alone in this.

Apple, Samsung, LG, Google...they are all in this together and frankly, it needs to stop, but how? Your guess is as good as mine.

The reality is we live in a landscape of very expensive throw-away items and people just sink further and further into debt to get the latest gear and companies like Apple absolutely encourage and enable this behaviour.

Low APR credit, free credit etc is thrown about like it's nothing driving consumers into debt. Do you think Apple gives a damn? Heck no. They thrive off it and earn millions dishing out the partnerships and even the credit.

And guess what. We lap it up and we also thrive upon it!

We are a sick society.

Samsung is not in on this. Their updates do not slow down your phones or worsen battery life. I'm using a 2+-year-old S10 that just received the newest OneUI update, and performance has been the same as it's been on day 1 - stellar. Battery life is indistinguishable from day 1 as well.
Apple is the only one doing this. Don't bring in other companies to try to excuse Apple's scummy behavior.

 

[AppleShareholder]

Planned obsolesence? How many of us have friends who are still rocking iphones and macbooks from 2015 and earlier? Apple gear remains useful for years longer than windows & android stuff, partly because of software support and partly because of better physical build quality. This lawsuit is frivolous.

The iPhones and macs from 2015 and earlier are all laggy turds. Their performance is even worse than the Droid phones I had back in 2010. Apple software is the malware.

 

[AppleShareholder]

I think this lawsuit is perfectly legitimate, for one simple reason—downgrading an iPhone to an earlier version of iOS, is impossible.

If I install an update on my Mac, and I discover it makes my Mac too slow, I can go back to an earlier version of macOS! This may or may not be advisable—I may miss out on some newer features and security updates—but I have the option. On a clean install of the original OS, all hardware will run as quickly as it did when it was brand new.

But on an iPhone or iPad, you can't do that! If you install a new version of iOS and you discover it's too slow (and you're not within a very limited signing window), you're out of luck! Why?! Why can't I restore my phone to the state it was in when I bought it?

Step back for a moment. How am I ever really supposed to buy any product, ever, if it can change out from under me? Imagine if I was deciding between an iPhone and an Android phone, and I went with the iPhone because there was a specific 32-bit game I absolutely love, or because I liked the way Control Center worked in iOS 10. Whoops, along comes iOS 11, and the reasons I bought an iPhone are gone, forever! I can't get them back!

So it really doesn't really matter whether or not the slowness is intentional, or added for reasons that are good overall. Apple is changing the product you bought, after you bought it, and making it impossible to change back.

Apple's updates are so bizarre. In all my time with non-Apple consumer products, updates never crippled my devices. My Windows 10 PC built 3 years ago NEVER had performance downgrades despite the number of major updates I received in those years. I haven't performed a single fresh reinstall since I built the thing. It's still running as fast as it was on day 1. The S10 I currently have didn't get worse with major updates. I just got one this week and aside from fancier UI elements, there's been no change at all to performance and battery life.
Even my old android phones like the Droid X I got in 2010 got better with each update. Tesla cars receive better range and acceleration after updates.

Why is Apple the ONLY case where the updates cripple your devices? It can't be coincidence. I know people with iPhone X and Xs who installed the newest iOS who are constantly talking about lag and stutter. These guys are still planning on buying the newest iPhones. As long as people like this exist, Apple will never stop their scumbag tactics. Too many Apple apologists in the world.

 

[darngooddesign]

I understand you want to sound so bright and impress everyone in this blog but your argument is crap microchips and processors don’t age at exactly every 5 years this is planned obsolescence and i’ve been in the computer business since before you were standing on this earth so sit down boy!

Settle down edge lord.

 

[AppleShareholder]

Settle down edge lord.

He's right. If you only owned Apple devices, you might not realize that performance degradation over time is an anomaly.
My 3-year-old Windows 10 PC performs as well as it did on Day-1 despite the numerous major updates I received.
My 2-year-old S10 performs as well as it did on Day-1 despite the 3 major updates I received including the new OneUI 3.1 update I installed this week.
My Tesla receives better range and acceleration in many updates.

Apple devices are the only odd case where updates cripple performance and battery life. That is not coincidence, and anyone who thinks it is needs to try non-Apple devices.
So what if more malware exists for Windows 10 and Android. In my eyes, Apple software is the malware, so 100% of iPhones and Macs are infected with malware.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

Why is Apple the ONLY case where the updates cripple your devices? It can't be coincidence.

Oh, but it's not just Apple! Windows 10 is constantly breaking things with all of their updates, which are apparently so important for security that they can't let consumers turn them off, even though they also can't let consumers opt for the security-only versions that are offered to enterprises on the LTSC changes.

I hate all of this so much. But at least on Windows you can do a reinstall and block the update server or some such. (Or track down a copy of LTSC...)

 

[AppleShareholder]

Oh, but it's not just Apple! Windows 10 is constantly breaking things with all of their updates, which are apparently so important for security that they can't let consumers turn them off, even though they also can't let consumers opt for the security-only versions that are offered to enterprises on the LTSC changes.

I hate all of this so much. But at least on Windows you can do a reinstall and block the update server or some such. (Or track down a copy of LTSC...)

I never said Windows 10 was bug-free. The first time I used my PC, there was an audio sync lag that was pretty annoying, as I watch plenty of videos. This was fixed in the next update.
Do you honestly think Microsoft adding that audio sync bug and then fixing it is an example of planned obsolescence? Why would they put in the effort to fix it in the first place if it was intentional?

 

[I7guy]

He's right. If you only owned Apple devices, you might not realize that performance degradation over time is an anomaly.
My 3-year-old Windows 10 PC performs as well as it did on Day-1 despite the numerous major updates I received.
My 2-year-old S10 performs as well as it did on Day-1 despite the 3 major updates I received including the new OneUI 3.1 update I installed this week.
My Tesla receives better range and acceleration in many updates.

Apple devices are the only odd case where updates cripple performance and battery life. That is not coincidence, and anyone who thinks it is needs to try non-Apple devices.
So what if more malware exists for Windows 10 and Android. In my eyes, Apple software is the malware, so 100% of iPhones and Macs are infected with malware.

My 5s on iOS 12 runs pretty spiffily. My Xs max on iOS 14, runs fast and tight. So like everything in life…YMMV.

 

[AppleShareholder]

My 5s on iOS 12 runs pretty spiffily. My Xs max on iOS 14, runs fast and tight. So like everything in life…YMMV.

And yet, Apple is the one with classaction lawsuits worldwide while there are none for the Samsung and others. Makes you wonder, huh?

 

[I7guy]

And yet, Apple is the one with classaction lawsuits worldwide while there are none for the Samsung and others. Makes you wonder, huh?

Yeah, with Apples revenues vs Samsungs revenues it makes me wonder why anyone would go after the company with the deepest pockets when it costs $250 to file a lawsuit and the lawyers work on contingency in hopes of a huge payday for the partners.

It sure does make me wonder as anyone can file a lawsuit for anything. Winning of course is another matter.

 

[AppleShareholder]

Yeah, with Apples revenues vs Samsungs revenues it makes me wonder why anyone would go after the company with the deepest pockets when it costs $250 to file a lawsuit and the lawyers work on contingency in hopes of a huge payday for the partners.

It sure does make me wonder as anyone can file a lawsuit for anything. Winning of course is another matter.

You make no sense. Lawyers don't just go after the biggest fish in the pond if there is an opportunity for a big pay-day.
If there was any evidence that Samsung installs malware into their products like Apple does, they, too, would be on the receiving-end of similar lawsuits. However, they don't. No one I know who owns a Samsung device complains about updates crippling their phones. They might complain about slow updates, but not about malware.

 

[I7guy]

You make no sense. Lawyers don't just go after the biggest fish in the pond if there is an opportunity for a big pay-day.
If there was any evidence that Samsung installs malware into their products like Apple does, they, too, would be on the receiving-end of similar lawsuits. However, they don't. No one I know who owns a Samsung device complains about updates crippling their phones. They might complain about slow updates, but not about malware.

The little ad-hom is adorable.

Lawyers absolutely do go after the biggest fish in the pond, especially if they feel there is wrong to be righted. Whether or not the "wrong" is really a "wrong". (Such as the facetime bug and others)

While I do agree some ios releases are better than others, this suit should go the way of the class action suit for the facetime bug. iphone 5s and 6s and above are all good on ios 12,13 and 14.

 

[AppleShareholder]

The little ad-hom is adorable.

Lawyers absolutely do go after the biggest fish in the pond, especially if they feel there is wrong to be righted. Whether or not the "wrong" is really a "wrong". (Such as the facetime bug and others)

While I do agree some ios releases are better than others, this suit should go the way of the class action suit for the facetime bug. iphone 5s and 6s and above are all good on ios 12,13 and 14.

Lawyers go after all fish if there is evidence of wrong-doing, not just the biggest one.
iOS is still a laggy POS after updates. I should know. I work with iPhone X and Xs users. Don't excuse Apple placing malware on their customers' devices.

 

[beanbaguk]

Samsung is not in on this. Their updates do not slow down your phones or worsen battery life. I'm using a 2+-year-old S10 that just received the newest OneUI update, and performance has been the same as it's been on day 1 - stellar. Battery life is indistinguishable from day 1 as well.
Apple is the only one doing this. Don't bring in other companies to try to excuse Apple's scummy behavior.

I will because I can.

(Before I begin, I want to start and say I've never had an issue with a 2-year-old iPhone. I will give Apple that. In fact, I replaced the battery in my 8 Plus 3.5 years after I bought it. Still a great device, but I decided to update to the 12 Pro mainly for the camera; However I digress somewhat....)

I have a number of old Android test devices which I used for product testing. I literally have to buy a new one each year as support for them dwindles after a year in some cases.

To be honest, I should point my finger at Android in general, but Samsung is complicit in this as they do not need to enable this behaviour. Hilariously, they even announced they decided to support major updates for 3 years.....yes. 3 measly years.....

Here's every Samsung device eligible for 7 major Android updates

Samsung has listed all the Galaxy devices eligible for long-term Android OS updates, including flagships, tablets, foldables, and more.

www.androidauthority.com

So what happens after that? Within 3 years or so, the phone stops supporting the latest OS. Then over time, app support gets dropped due to not supporting the older OS's anymore, etc, etc....Google doesn't offer older versions on the Play Store and over time, your phone becomes useless.

(Apple, where credit is due, have supported the original SE now for 5 years).

One of the worst offenders I have in my drawer is a bq (a Spanish mobile phone company I will never buy from again), which released a neat little budget Android device. I received updates for about a month before all notices showcasing the next Android update were removed from their site and they stopped replying to their calls, emails, etc....

bq, are not alone in this and it's widespread in the Android community.

So, my finger pointing at Samsung and ALL Android devices makers is very much, duly credited.

 

[AppleShareholder]

I will because I can.

(Before I begin, I want to start and say I've never had an issue with a 2-year-old iPhone. I will give Apple that. In fact, I replaced the battery in my 8 Plus 3.5 years after I bought it. Still a great device, but I decided to update to the 12 Pro mainly for the camera; However I digress somewhat....)

I have a number of old Android test devices which I used for product testing. I literally have to buy a new one each year as support for them dwindles after a year in some cases.

To be honest, I should point my finger at Android in general, but Samsung is complicit in this as they do not need to enable this behaviour. Hilariously, they even announced they decided to support major updates for 3 years.....yes. 3 measly years.....

Here's every Samsung device eligible for 7 major Android updates

Samsung has listed all the Galaxy devices eligible for long-term Android OS updates, including flagships, tablets, foldables, and more.

www.androidauthority.com

So what happens after that? Within 3 years or so, the phone stops supporting the latest OS. Then over time, app support gets dropped due to not supporting the older OS's anymore, etc, etc....Google doesn't offer older versions on the Play Store and over time, your phone becomes useless.

(Apple, where credit is due, have supported the original SE now for 5 years).

One of the worst offenders I have in my drawer is a bq (a Spanish mobile phone company I will never buy from again), which released a neat little budget Android device. I received updates for about a month before all notices showcasing the next Android update were removed from their site and they stopped replying to their calls, emails, etc....

bq, are not alone in this and it's widespread in the Android community.

So, my finger pointing at Samsung and ALL Android devices makers is very much, duly credited.

Receiving no updates after 3 years is far better than receiving malware for 5 years straight.
I don't care if I stop receiving more updates from samsung, as my phone continues to run flawlessly.
Can't say the same about leggy iPhones. I think my Droid x performs better than the iPhone x, xs and 11 on the newest ios.

 

[beanbaguk]

Receiving no updates after 3 years is far better than receiving malware for 5 years straight.
I don't care if I stop receiving more updates from samsung, as my phone continues to run flawlessly.
Can't say the same about leggy iPhones. I think my Droid x performs better than the iPhone x, xs and 11 on the newest ios.

That's just utter nonsense. You're just trolling now. Cheerio.