Apple Factory Conditions

[blitzkrieg79]

Don't forget that the actual cost of an employee in the US is much higher than their salary. That $13.90 per hour will end up costing closer to $25.


Again, look at the big picture. The "cheaper materials" you are referring to have quadrupled in price in recent years. Steel prices began to shoot up 2 summers ago and hasn't showed signs of stopping. Oil, a prime component of rubber and plastic, is well over $70 a barrel. US auto makers do not want to move to Mexico. They are being forced to to keep up with overseas production facilities.

I guess the total cost of an average US worker might be a bit higher than average hourly salary but I know that a lot of high volume factories (here in NJ) pay $8-$12 an hour, have crappy benefits and health insurance that is so expensive that most workers end up not even buying it. Union jobs are expensive but I don't think that majority of jobs in US are protected by Unions.

 

[gwangung]

It's absolutely not acceptable for Apple to exploit people. I don’t care what the Chinese average income is -

Then you're being innumerate.

 

[081440]

Since they are an American company, they should have to follow American (Cali) minimun wage laws.

Hope your rich, cause if that happened you'd be working 24 hours a day just to stay out of debt

 

[topgunn]

And don't you think that all those American corporations owe something to the average American citizen who fought for the country that America is today only to see his job disappear to a continent with whom he fought 25-30 years ago? So again, corporate greed is the right word. If Apple wants to build factories in China let them be but all those products manufactured there should be only to areas which offer comparable hourly wages. Otherwise people in western world will starting making less and people in 3rd world countries instead of $40 per month now make $50 which isn't a big improvement either, they were poor and still are poor as I suspect that cost of living even in 3rd world countries is going up.

If Apple is putting the public before its shareholders, they are in breach of their fiduciary duty. Look it up. I am not saying its right but thats the way it is.

Otherwise people in western world will starting making less and people in 3rd world countries instead of $40 per month now make $50 which isn't a big improvement either, they were poor and still are poor as I suspect that cost of living even in 3rd world countries is going up.

Poor is a relative term. If I could increase my monthly income by 25%, I would be elated. So what if it is "only" $10.

 

[blitzkrieg79]

Oh absolutely... but in a previous post you had suggested dropping their prices 100%, which by definition would drop any price to $0.

EDIT: Sorry, just being sarcastically nit-picky.

Oh sorry I guess I made a boo boo, I meant drop 50%

 

[jaxstate]

doubt it

Hope your rich, cause if that happened you'd be working 24 hours a day just to stay off the streets1

 

[sigamy]

this is all due to the Nike + iPod partnership. They are bringing us down, man!

 

[blitzkrieg79]

If Apple is putting the public before its shareholders, they are in breach of their fiduciary duty. Look it up. I am not saying its right but thats the way it is.

Poor is a relative term. If I could increase my monthly income by 25%, I would be elated. So what if it is "only" $10.

Yeah but I had a discussion in some other post how moving of US factories to cheap labor countries helps American economy in a way that in this case Chinese help our economy by buying our products, I don't think that $50 per month will buy a lot of American merchendise.

 

[notjustjay]

I don’t care what the Chinese average income is - Apple is making billions of dollars of profit, some of this should be passed on to the people that make their products. Its good ethics.

Didn't we just go through this in another thread?

OK, suppose you're right. Apple feels sorry for the factory workers making $50/month, and decides to be generous and doubles their wages. Or, even better, as someone else suggested, let's pay them the American minimum wage... so let's say $1000 USD/month.

Suddenly Apple-contracted factory workers are the best paid workers in the neighborhood.

Prices for groceries, housing, and other supplies increase due to the sudden affluence of all these workers.

Apple factory workers become the new upper-class.

Crime increases, because Apple factory workers are paid better than the policemen and judges -- and can afford to bribe them to get their way.

Everyone else is suddenly that much poorer since they can't afford to pay the new increased prices for everything.

Workers at factory B stage a revolt, insisting that they, too, be paid the new going rates. Instead, they are laid off.

Factory C shuts down because it can't compete.

The value of the Chinese currency decreases.

Yup, great ethics. The American Way, for everyone!

 

[odedia]

So what do we have here:

1. Very bad publicity from this news.
2. Unbelivably low quality Macbook Pros.
3. Teaming up with Nike, the world's new slave leader.

Moving the plants to China was a big mistake on Apple's part. HP and Dell realise that, and that's why lots of their assembly lines are back in the U.S., only the components are bought from third part suppliers. Apple already understands that opening a support site in India is a bad idea (they just closed one, didn't they?). I think they will soon come to the same conclusion regarding their manufacturing. Not all that is cheap is also the best option, even if you're a publicly traded company. Stocks can plunge after news like this.

Oh well.

 

[1984]

Apple has used Foxconn for decades, strange that this is news now.

They are just picking on Apple because the iPod is so popular. The factory that makes the iPods is actually one of the best in China. In case you haven't noticed almost everything you buy is made in China and under far worse conditions than this. I find it amazing that this is news to anyone. People are acting like Apple is the only company to do this. All of them do. From computers to toothbrushes, mp3 players to lightbulbs. Everything is made there. People love to hate Apple. Some things never change.

That said I would be willing to pay as much as a 25% premium to have a Mac or iPod made in the USA. I really would. We rely far too much on other countries these days.

 

[jaxstate]

Prices of groceries, housing don't go up due to affluence of the people in the neighborhood.

Didn't we just go through this in another thread?

OK, suppose you're right. Apple feels sorry for the factory workers making $50/month, and decides to be generous and doubles their wages.

Suddenly Apple-contracted factory workers are the best paid workers in the neighborhood.

Prices for groceries, housing, and other supplies increase due to the sudden affluence of all these workers.

Apple factory workers become the new upper-class.

Everyone else is suddenly that much poorer since they can't afford to pay the new increased prices for everything.

Workers at factory B stage a revolt, insisting that they, too, be paid the new going rates. Instead, they are laid off.

Factory C shuts down because it can't compete with the new economy.

The value of the Chinese currency decreases.

Yup, great ethics. The American Way, for everyone!

 

[topgunn]

Yeah but I had a discussion in some other post how moving of US factories to cheap labor countries helps American economy in a way that in this case Chinese help our economy by buying our products, I don't think that $50 per month will buy a lot of American merchendise.

Quite right. Which is why our trade deficit is skyrocketing.

 

[gwangung]

Prices of groceries, housing don't go up due to affluence of the people in the neighborhood.

What economics do you believe in?

 

[Stridder44]

 

[DPazdanISU]

i've been to china, 50 to 150 bux goes a long way. And another thing, if you are concerned with the conditions at Apple's factories in China then you should be concerned with every factory in China cuz the conditions are the same in most of them, everything you see that says made in china was made by a laborer getting paid less that 100 bux a month

i'm not saying it's right i'm just saying they are picking on apple cuz they knew they would get alot of attention. In the 90s they would of said walkmans... see my point?

 

[jaxstate]

Trade and weather are the main factors in natural product. A bad season would effect groceries more than a rich neighborhood. In many low class neighborhood in America, the prices of groceries are jacked up. Due mainly to the fact that the people don't have any means of going anywhere else.

What economics do you believe in?

Demand is what drives the prices of housing.

 

[1984]

HP and Dell realise that, and that's why lots of their assembly lines are back in the U.S., only the components are bought from third part suppliers.

It's unknown if HP actually makes computers in the US as they wouldn't confirm it. They would only say they make some of their electronics here but refused the specify. Dell apparently makes some of their tower PCs here. However, most PC laptops are made on the very same production lines as the MacBooks and MacBook Pros.

Like I said, I would personally pay as much as a 25% premium for a Mac made in the USA though it would probably not be nearly that bad. After all, if Dell can do it...

 

[210]

However...

The article is from the Mail On Sunday. Along with the Daily Mail, the worst newpaper I have ever read. If you want your news from right-wing fundamentalists and buy in to their propoganda, this is the newspaper for you.

 

[simmonstwin]

I am truly starting to believe that most of the posters on this board are a bunch of naive 10 year olds . Do you really think that they aren't outsourcing the production of these ipods and computer for monetary reasons? I'm sure Apple like every other large billion dollar company is trying to squeeze every penny out of it cost of production, for the sharholders and their uppermangemant's pockets. They arent in the bussiness for the of fun, they aim to get rich and once that is achieved then they want to become richer. They could easily be billion dollar company here in the States, but thts the problem , they want to be a multibillin dollar company. And for those of you whom think that the workers over there arent being misused or abuse over there, you are sadly mistaken. It called "slave labor".

For me it's all about choicing the lesser evil, is Apple worse than windoze? Are they worse than Nike? I dont know, but I hope so...

 

[joseph2166]

For me it's all about choicing the lesser evil, is Apple worse than windoze? I dont know, but I hope so...

It's a hard comparison to make - Apple is a company, 'windoze' is an operating system.

I would be willing to pay as much as a 25% premium to have a Mac or iPod made in the USA. I really would. We rely far too much on other countries these days.

Typical American fealing - love it or not you're gonna have to get used to seeing 'made in china' labels increasing in number as china 'booms'. EVENTUALLY their economy will steady up, wages will rise and the big corporations will move onto the next up and coming nation to set up their factories.

Americans can sound scarily like Brits sometimes - complaining about manufacturing moving abroad etc. - but the difference is Britain doesn't have the world's largest economy. Last time I checked America did.

 

[jelloshotsrule]

for me, the issue is less about specific wages, as the case can certainly be made that they don't need (and some may say shouldn't make) the same wages as an american worker.

however, often times these workers are subject to abuse (physical and psychological). sometimes that abuse is in the form of unsafe working conditions (breathing toxic fumes from glue, etc without proper safety gear), sometimes it is physical beatings for not working efficiently enough. there are many cases of women working in these factories being raped and there are also instances of mafia like killings to put down any sort of worker resistance to some of the conditions/low wages.

those are the things that concern me, and hopefully they do not apply to the apple factories.

to the person who said "if you're upset about this, you should be upset about all the other factories in china where people also make <$100/month... apple is just getting attention because of the ipod..."

you're right, and many of us who are voicing our opposition ARE aware of the other factories, we DO make our best attempts at purchasing non sweatshop clothing and shoes (becoming harder and harder to do), and we DO object to companies using such factories, whether they have an apple logo or not.

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

Average salary in US is around $29000 which gives you about $13.90 per hour, even if it would take an hour to assemble one iPod (which somehow I know it takes a lot less time) the final cost of the iPod would be slightly higher than it is now. So again, it's just corporate greed, look at car manufacturers especially US moving some of the plants to Mexico, not only is labor cheaper there and not only are they starting to use cheaper materials but the final cost of the cars actually is increasing.

It`s just not possible to keep all the manufacturing in US or any other developed company. i m running a gold chain factory (with my dad) in India. Most of my labor consists of people from villages who come to city to make a living. I currently pay them appx 100$ a month. And each n everyone of them is more than happy with that money as they couldnt even make 1/3rd of that in their village. Plus they dont pay for food and room as I provide them free. So you can actually consider their salary to be 150$ on an average.

Now ITALY was supposed to be the best in Gold Jewellery manufacturing. But the person doing the same job in Italy will ask for atleast 500$ a month. More than 3 times compared to India. How will the italians compete? No wonder half of the factories in Italy are already closed and the rest are heading in the same direction(xcept for a few really big ones).

OK. !1000$ for a nano might be a bit too much. But If all the production is shifed to USA, I m damn sure you can expect atleast 100% price jump. Now some of you might pay the double price. But most will actually go for cheaper price if the difference in quality is not too much.

Apple is not greedy. They dont have any other way to survive. If they dont out source, they`ll be doomed definitely.

But given a choice I`ll go against outsourcing. I really hate China, India coz of their cheap labor. Thanx to countries like these, If a company needs to survive in todays world, then their no other way but to increase your output. Millions of iPods sold every year. Millions of PC/Macs sold every year. Millons of cars,AC,Refridgerators,Tubes,bulbs are sold everyyear. But there is just one earth. It took millions of years for our planet to create all these metals and materials which we are using at a pace to 100000 times faster than it`s creation. Someday we`ll run out of everything. I might not see that in my lifetime. Neither will my next few generations. But some day you`ll find yourself in the midst of a big desert called EARTH with nothing else but ..... actually nothing. Maybe black fog, without any water or food. Maybe without any human being.


But still I m running my factory trying to maximise the output each n every day coz I dont have any other choice left at all. Other than shutting down. Thereby leaving the 100 odd labor without any job until they find a new one. If i want to make money then I have to continue doing whatever I m doing. Even a 10 percent increase in margin from my side will result in loosing all my customers.

So my point is, it`s not Apple`s fault. If you want them to keep the business running, then they have no other option left but to outsource the work. To Apple`s credit, the Supplier Code of Conduct sounds really nice. I hope they are strict in following it.

 

[Dont Hurt Me]

$50 bucks a month to build Ipods? not very heroic of our company is it? still miss the California made PowerMacs.

 

[AoWolf]

Does this really surprise anyone? Most of the objects we use in our daily life are made in similar settings to the one described. Does that make it right? No. Will it likely change? I highly doubt it. I do think it would be fair to say that apple is getting attention just because the iPod is the cool modern gadget.