Apple Files Appeal in Epic Games Lawsuit, Asks to Delay App Store Changes

[gaximus]

If the App Store is in a state where changes can lead to irreparable harm to consumers then Apple has definitely abused its position and needs regulating.

If I get screwed over by an app, I can request a refund from Apple (and I have). If I get screwed over by an app for a purchase I made outside the App Store, I wouldn’t be able to request a refund. This sucks for me as a user, and Apple because a lot of media will be blaming Apple for letting this happen on their phones. They need to figure a way to make this possible without anyone getting screwed.

 

[Homme]

This is what I believe what happened during 2008 App Store debut. Developers really should just charge iOS users 30% more than on android. They pay more on the phone, so does everything else. Apple’s “you can’t offer different prices” ruling is the one that needs to be abolished.

And/Or Take the Spotify Route which is a lot smarter and wiser by directing users to a website for purchases

 

[1284814]

This is ridiculous why is Apple not satisfied with how easy they got off.

 

[davidako]

This is what I believe what happened during 2008 App Store debut. Developers really should just charge iOS users 30% more than on android. They pay more on the phone, so does everything else. Apple’s “you can’t offer different prices” ruling is the one that needs to be abolished.

It needs to be explicitly stated. Like when you buy food from an app and it adds on the service charge or delivery fee. Apple should be legally required to add its fee on and show exactly how much they are charging (since the percentage sometimes varies).

 

[Kierkegaarden]

Seems perfectly reasonable. As they stated, Epic wouldn’t be suffering any additional harm if a stay was granted since they aren’t even in the App Store and won’t be for a while, if ever again.

 

[Shirasaki]

And/Or Take the Spotify Route which is a lot smarter and wiser by directing users to a website for purchases

This doesn’t work for games and many other. What should’ve happen is demolishing the ridiculous “you can’t charge different prices” rule.

 

[davidako]

If I get screwed over by an app, I can request a refund from Apple (and I have). If I get screwed over by an app for a purchase I made outside the App Store, I wouldn’t be able to request a refund. This sucks for me as a user, and Apple because a lot of media will be blaming Apple for letting this happen on their phones. They need to figure a way to make this possible without anyone getting screwed.

Your country’s laws apply to everything you buy, whether the store has an Apple logo on it or not.

 

[Shirasaki]

It needs to be explicitly stated. Like when you buy food from an app and it adds on the service charge or delivery fee. Apple should be legally required to add its fee on and show exactly how much they are charging (since the percentage sometimes varies).

But apple and many other businesses don’t want to add this so that customers can’t breakdown the price they pay and argue based on that, just like free shipping.

 

[Naraxus]

Tbh it should have been expected. Either way this verdict had gone it was going to be tied up for years in litigation

 

[Naraxus]

Apple is in this for blood, or so it seems. Their legal eagles, I'm guessing, think they have an appeal with some merit. Of course, there seems to be a lot riding on this particular point.

Apple has every right to defend their position and use all available appeals. This was definitely going to be appealed and it'll be a long time before we see the end of this

 

[topdrawer]

remember when epic had no chance in hell?

 

[dumastudetto]

Not everyone want a giant mega corp to have total control of his/her life and determine what decision he/she should make.

In fact, people have been calling out breaking up these mega corps because they are way too powerful.

Apple are different in that they look out for us, they protect our privacy, they keep us safe with the App Store, they deliver security updates to every supported device on day one.

Now if you are referring to the likes of Google and Facebook as giant mega corps that need breaking up, I'd absolutely agree with you.

 

[I7guy]

It needs to be explicitly stated. Like when you buy food from an app and it adds on the service charge or delivery fee. Apple should be legally required to add its fee on and show exactly how much they are charging (since the percentage sometimes varies).

When one buys a grocery item is the markup on the item known?

 

[dumastudetto]

remember when epic had no chance in hell?

I do, and then I remember the verdict that followed and they lost on every count that mattered to them. It was glorious.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

What about the Japanese and South Korea rulings? Are they also being appealed? As I understand it from media reports, while local in direct scope, they were said to effectively force Apple's hand worldwide and were more impacting than the Epic ruling.

Just like taxes are levied differently around the world (and Apple’s set up to handle that PLUS the currency rate changes involved), this change could also be targeted geographically. As a result, the SK ruling only affects SK.

 

[dwaite]

Apple is a long way from the 1984 commercial.

By that you mean, 37 years?

 

[Shirasaki]

Apple are different in that they look out for us, they protect our privacy, they keep us safe with the App Store, they deliver security updates to every supported device on day one.

Now if you are referring to the likes of Google and Facebook as giant mega corps that need breaking up, I'd absolutely agree with you.

Heh. If you believe everything apple wants you to believe, then I’d say good for you.

 

[XXPP]

thieves versus apple

 

[DocMultimedia]

Epic and Apple both appeal. Clearly no need for any changes.

 

[alchemistmuffin]

This is likely going to SCOTUS given how many appeals both parties will file.

Grab your popcorns. This is going to get ugly.

 

[dwaite]

This doesn’t work for games and many other. What should’ve happen is demolishing the ridiculous “you can’t charge different prices” rule.

Apps can _absolutely_ charge different prices, Spotify has done this for years, Epic did this for a while.

The problem is that Epic still saw that extra money being paid on each of the Apple transactions, and they think "damn that coulda been mine".

Or Spotify says they can't be price competitive on Apple devices, because people see the price on the in-app purchase and think "Damn, Spotify costs more than Apple Music".

However, from Apple's perspective having a storefront means companies are advertising _their_ digital products to _Apple's_ users, and that you can pay for that customer acquisition either through the purchase price or through in-app purchases.

When companies have said "wait, these are Epic/Netflix/Spotify customers already" Apple said fine, but you have to still support customer acquisition through the app where we get paid, aka you have to have In-App purchasing there (this has changed on and off over the years, because these companies make *significantly* more money if they can cut down or eliminate Apple's cut).

The ridiculous part of this is that Apple already said they plan to defend their cut. Start sending customers outside the store or do a third party in-app purchasing scheme? Prepare to keep audited records, because Apple is still going to put their cut into the contracts.

The whole anti-steering bit was because Apple wanted there to be a clear line between say a 100% Netflix-acquired customer and a 100% Apple-acquired customer. Just that the courts have ordered that line goes away doesn't mean that Apple isn't going to want to get paid, it means that defining that line is significantly harder, and in some cases companies may have to fight to keep from actually owing Apple MORE money than before.

I believe Apple is willing to lose _some_ money just to keep the line from becoming more ambiguous, so I have a few suspicions of this technical changes they are pushing for.

 

[Villarrealadrian]

CHANGE IT ALREADY!!

 

[lederermc]

Apple should at a minimum allow links like: "https://www.netfix.com" but links to the exact sign-up page... I'm not sure. And I don't think is really important. I hope that's not what all the mess is about.

 

[LeadingHeat]

So does this mean they risk the possibility of the 9 points for them being washed away if a retrial happens? Or are they able to just appeal the 1 against them? (The 10 points that they went over in the case)

 

[Macbookprodude]

Sounds like Apple wants to be a starter of wars with everyone. Sad