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I'll take your advice and not look at Android phones. They always look nice and tempt me into buying which ends up costing me a lot of money because Android is so frustrating and their resale value is **** when I try to sell to go back to iOS.
Do what you will. I am in the Apple ecosystem so I get it, but when I look at the technology gains in Android over the last year or two the gains have been rather significant; where Apple on the other-hand "feels" stagnant, and I'm not alone in feeling this way.
 
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Why would that be ridiculous? What benefit would I get from having a bunch more unused phone storage?

View attachment 962268




... also kinda unclear on just exactly what real world benefit that's supposed to provide to folks who aren't into action games?




Hello early battery replacement!
because maybe you can then store your information locally and not have to use their cloud services if you don't want to
 
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#2 - look on Alibaba - 5W USB bricks are available for around 60 cents each in bulk

Just a warning here. No-name chargers can be incredibly hazardous. People have been electrocuted by them when using the phone when charging.

Now, we are of course talking about the Watch, and few folks will use the Watch while it's being charged, I'm sure. But you still make electrical contact with the Watch and its charger, and if there's a fault...

None of this goes against OP's point, that Apple certainly at least risks the perception of cheapness in eliminating the charger. Maybe even worse: they risk an uptick in electrocutions if folks purchase poorly-designed chargers off Alibaba, Amazon or other vendors.

Check out that link-- it's a teardown and rather interesting on its own. You get what you pay for, and I expect Apple's pride in its green decision might be tempered by headlines that could come about folks getting hurt from crappy chargers they bought as a consequence.
 
You can't be serious. You touch that pouch for all of what? 3 seconds? What's the point of wasting money on fabric?
Some of us appreciate the aesthetic that Apple is known for and used to use as a way to set differentiate itself from others. It's not an accident, that's how Steve built the company...it's slowly being chipped away. It is what it is though, things change.
 
when I look at the technology gains in Android over the last year or two the gains have been rather significant; where Apple on the other-hand "feels" stagnant

Examples?

On Apple's side I see way faster processors, AI in silicon, significantly superior facial ID tech (mooted somewhat by the current mask-wearing situation), fantastic cameras, superior integration with other devices in their ecosystem including smartwatches and computers, and imminently LIDAR. As to the mask situation, the iPad's new fingerprint sensor embedded in its power switch probably suggests what we can look forward-to in the iPhone.

Some on that list involve industry-firsts. But Apple is also historically a great second-mover, allowing competition to try a technology first and then observing and improving upon it. They also have a history of rejecting tech and even market segments that their competitors were rushing to. (Remember netbooks?)

And please don't say "5G", which has not been a benefit in most markets-- quite the contrary given the drawbacks of early 5G modems and associated circuitry (power consumption, package size, etc). That will change in due course.
 
because maybe you can then store your information locally and not have to use their cloud services if you don't want to

Now I'm curious as to just what sort of "information" you're keeping on your phone that requires tens of gigabytes to put you over the 64GB threshhold?

Also sort of curious how you're keeping that data backed up on a regular basis, as well as keeping it synced across multiple devices?

My 99 cent a month icloud plan is mostly for photo storage/syncing across devices/computers, as well as backups. Worth it for the convenience and not having to think about / remember to back up my phone and photos. Still a good 12-13 gig unused in the plan.
 
Just a warning here. No-name chargers can be incredibly hazardous. People have been electrocuted by them when using the phone when charging.

You misunderstood my point. It wasn't to say those chargers should be used instead of Apple OEM chargers, so most of the rest of your post is moot in terms of my making any response.

The pricing on Alibaba is merely the best indicator I can find for what Apple's actual cost-to-produce might be for their 5W single port bricks. Given Apple's purchasing volumes and power, I think it is reasonable that they could get their costs in that vicinity even while producing better designed and more reliable chargers. Remember, those on Alibaba are the prices to buyers and include profit for the maker, as well as any advertising and other overhead costs that wouldn't necessary be involved with Apple's production of their chargers. Thus I feel it's reasonable to suggest, based on those devices, that Apple's per unit cost is likely well below $1 each, and quite possibly in the 50 to 70 cent range. Again, just an estimate, but one I feel is reasonably likely to be in the ballpark.

That estimate then is meant to show the speciousness of any expectations of Apple "passing on the savings" or even that the cost savings were significant enough to be a major driver in their decision to cease including the 5W brisk. Sure, across volume that does add up - but we're also looking at something on the order of a tenth of a percent of the watch price.

If you have a better potential indicator of what Apple's cost might be, and thus their "savings" of not including the brick, do please post it.

None of this goes against OP's point, that Apple certainly at least risks the perception of cheapness in eliminating the charger. Maybe even worse: they risk an uptick in electrocutions if folks purchase poorly-designed chargers off Alibaba, Amazon or other vendors.

You (and the OP) make the assumption that all watch buyers place value on having the brick included. I suggest, based on my own feeling and the observation of many of the other posts here, that many people simply don't put any value on having the brick included.

Across several watch and phone generations, I can't remember the last time I didn't leave the included brick in the package to later be resold with the device in a year or two or three. Or to go in a drawer if the device is traded w/o the brick. Thus, whether there's a brick in my Apple Watch box or not is immaterial from a received-value perspective simply because its inclusion provides ZERO value to me. I can't sell it for enough to be worth the bother.

In fact, I actually prefer NOT to receive useless to me single port 5W bricks with stuff. The more devices that eschew the practice the better IMHO. I could argue that there's more value to me in not having to deal with an unwanted and useless to me 5W brick.

You can see from others posts that many people have similar stories and perspectives. As such, I challenge that assumption.
 
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Now I'm curious as to just what sort of "information" you're keeping on your phone that requires tens of gigabytes to put you over the 64GB threshhold?

Also sort of curious how you're keeping that data backed up on a regular basis, as well as keeping it synced across multiple devices?

My 99 cent a month icloud plan is mostly for photo storage/syncing across devices/computers, as well as backups. Worth it for the convenience and not having to think about / remember to back up my phone and photos. Still a good 12-13 gig unused in the plan.
For me the cloud storage is a no-brainer.
For $3/month you get 200 GB which can be family shared.
This enables me to avoid the higher storage upgrades on two iPhones and two iPads, for a savings of $600.
$600 pays for 16 years of cloud storage.
Plus the convenience of accessing everything on every device from everywhere
 
1. The last band was three parts, which means it probably cost way more to produce than the single band they are selling now.
All but the fanciest metal bands probably cost close to nothing to manufacture.

Just assume the profit margin on every Apple band is astronomical.

Screenshot 2020-10-02 at 19.22.28.png


I would love to see the internal Apple spreadsheets showing these things cost like 26-cents to manufacture 🤣
 
All but the fanciest metal bands probably cost close to nothing to manufacture.

Just assume the profit margin on every Apple band is astronomical.



I would love to see the internal Apple spreadsheets showing these things cost like 26-cents to manufacture 🤣
and the packaging for the bands is easily twice that ;);)
 
Some of us appreciate the aesthetic that Apple is known for and used to use as a way to set differentiate itself from others. It's not an accident, that's how Steve built the company...it's slowly being chipped away. It is what it is though, things change.

I’d agree to an extent. Yes, there were certain characteristics that Apple does make more exclusive the Apple Watch, like the plastic box examples that I mentioned before. However, this isn’t Steve’s company anymore, and Apple isn’t expected to Do you want what they were all those years ago. That said, as long as Apple doesn’t cheapen on their hardware standards and they continue to put out quality watchOS, that’s all I could ask for. Not to mention, they value my privacy, which is a major factor about the Apple Watch. Now, if you could have name any other company that takes the extent that Apple does, I’d be interested to hear who can even come near them.

My point is, I can deal with the fact that they make some packaging material changes, as long as they keep their core standards as a priority as they always have.
 
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1. The last band was three parts, which means it probably cost way more to produce than the single band they are selling now. Its different and if you swim daily a cool thing but that would have dropped the price a bit. Even the packaging for the watch band is smaller.

I see these bands as being priced based on value, not just the raw cost of materials + manufacturing. Consider how one of the key selling points of watchOS 7 is sleep tracking. It didn’t hit me at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think this band is designed with that in mind.

What Apple has done is design a band that’s extremely comfortable to wear (important if you want people to wear it in bed) and easy to take off and out on (since you will be taking it off at least twice a day - before and after work to charge).

The end result is not just a watch hand, but a solution for people who want an optimised experience when it comes to fitting sleep tracking into their lifestyle. And the price reflects the process that led to its conception, as well as the value it brings to its users.
 
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I see these bands as being priced based on value, not just the raw cost of materials + manufacturing. Consider how one of the key selling points of watchOS 7 is sleep tracking. It didn’t hit me at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think this band is designed with that in mind.

What Apple has done is design a band that’s extremely comfortable to wear (important if you want people to wear it in bed) and easy to take off and out on (since you will be taking it off at least twice a day - before and after work to charge).

The end result is not just a watch hand, but a solution for people who want an optimised experience when it comes to fitting sleep tracking into their lifestyle. And the price reflects the process that led to its conception, as well as the value it brings to its users.
The lengths you go to to justify what Apple does is very impressive :rolleyes:
 
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I see these bands as being priced based on value, not just the raw cost of materials + manufacturing.

Yes, Non-commodity items are almost always priced on consumer willingness to pay, not on cost. This is even more true for luxury items, which e can probably agree is the category into which Apple Watches fall.

As you observe, Apple does also tend to aim for an overall solution rather than selling just an individual device. That is part of their value propositional the consumer.

Some folks will be willing to pay for that, some folks won’t be or do so unhappily.

In no event should mere observation be misinterpreted as justification, as seems to occur here at times.
 
They just did the same thing with the iPhones. No headphones, no charger, smaller packaging, less shipping cost, and not to mention the manufacturing savings on not having to make those items. They still cost the same price. I love apple as much as the next apple person but damn apple, give us some of the savings.

Its amazing apple doesn't slap us on the face and call us names as we pay for these things.
 
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They just did the same thing with the iPhones. No headphones, no charger, smaller packaging, less shipping cost, and not to mention the manufacturing savings on not having to make those items. They still cost the same price. I love apple as much as the next apple person but damn apple, give us some of the savings.

Its amazing apple doesn't slap us on the face and call us names as we pay for these things.

Oh I agree.. Apple has been slowly increasing margins at the cost of consumer experience for years now. Best part of that whole event today is "exciting news" (something like that) then cut to the environmental piece. Hey look, I'm all for reducing carbon footprints and being eco conscious. But omitting items and charging the same with their positive/eco spin to it is simply ridiculous. I've questioned this before, and I get the wrath from the Apple fanboys thinking I'm the problem and I just hate the environment. No, I'm a cost conscious consumer not someone roasting marshmallows in the wildfires.

I don't horde nor have a boneyard of past Apple products. I sell or hand my devices down when I upgrade. I have one extra backup iPhone 5S in case of an emergency. While there may be "billions" of Apple USB chargers, I own 2 that would be compatible. One for my watch and the for my iPhone X (lost the 5S's traveling).

- Waits for the "dude it's only 20 dollars" responses. -
 
- Waits for the "dude it's only 20 dollars" responses. -

Each to their own.

I have multi port chargers at key locations at home. Qi pad or stand, lightning cable, micro usb cable, USBC port and cable at a couple.

Cant remember the last time I’ve used an included cable or single port brick
 
Each to their own.

I have multi port chargers at key locations at home. Qi pad or stand, lightning cable, micro usb cable, USBC port and cable at a couple.

Cant remember the last time I’ve used an included cable or single port brick

Cool. More like each have their own use cases. And I’ve never purchased an electronics device in my life that I could not power up without buying an accessory.

Perhaps Apple and Tim could keep their increased margins er I mean environmental goals with incentives not to get a charger if not needed rather then omitting for all. I have a few ideas but probably would present some logistical issues with multi SKUs and retailers. It could be done.

Regardless the extra touches of buying a apple watch are being slowly eliminated. There are a whole list of them and the consumer value and experience have been compromised.
 
I’ve never purchased an electronics device in my life that I could not power up without buying an accessory.

Perhaps you haven’t yet, but the day will come.

I think current GoPros don’t come with bricks. Garmin Fenix6 has no brick. Last powerbank I bought has no brick. Same for Aftershockz headphones for running.

Lots of battery power tools come either without battery or charger, or come with them for an added cost.

It’s becoming increasingly common.
 
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Do what you will. I am in the Apple ecosystem so I get it, but when I look at the technology gains in Android over the last year or two the gains have been rather significant; where Apple on the other-hand "feels" stagnant, and I'm not alone in feeling this way.

My problem with Android. And it’s big. Google. I shed as much as I could from being in their ecosystem. Even changed from their DNS servers haha. YouTube still has a grip on me. However Android devices are really nice and ahead of apples in many ways.
 
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