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LizKat

macrumors 604
Aug 5, 2004
6,766
36,273
Catskill Mountains
Both MLK day and Columbus Day shouldn't be holidays. That's my opinion.

They could have given me a day off work for Alice in Wonderland and I would have taken it.

Shall we only have days off like "The fourth Monday in every third month starting in January, and 4 additional days to be arranged at the discretion of the employer"? :p Sounds like appointments for dental cleanings.

About honoring Dr. King: who knows where this country would be now if he and his followers of the time had not persevered in their insistence that we try harder to live up to the ideals of our Constitution. It's pretty clear to me that without Dr. King's work we would not have had the 1964 Civil Rights Act. There's only so long a nation can sustain itself on a huge gap between what it says it stands for and what it stands for. History around the world shows us that. We've narrowed the gap between what we say about equal protection and what we do to ensure it, but not enough to sprawl on the couch and figure "mission accomplished".

So I like the question posed on Apple's home page today. It's a reminder we're not done learning how to live together, how to close up more of that gap between our realities and our constitutional ideals.

(And as some members of the forum probably already know since I've posted about it from time to time, the holiday is also extra-special to me because sixteen years ago there happened to be a major blizzard on Martin Luther King day and it caused me to have to quit smoking cigarettes... "free at last"!!) :)
 

tgara

macrumors 65816
Jul 17, 2012
1,154
2,898
Connecticut, USA
Now maybe if they made their executive board a bit more diverse they could help continue what MLK started.

For the February 26 shareholder meeting, there is a shareholder proposal about this.

Here's the full text

RESOLVED :

Shareholders request that the Board of Directors adopt an accelerated recruitment policy requiring Apple Inc. (the “Company”) to increase the diversity of senior management and its board of directors, two bodies that presently fails to adequately represent diversity ( particularly Hispanic, African-American, Native-American and other people of colour).

Stockholder Supporting Statement

The tech industry, of which the Company is a part, is characterized by the persistent and pervasive underrepresentation of minorities and women in senior positions. The Company is at an advantageous position to be a leader in promoting diversity in senior management and its board of directors, based on its size, breadth and position as the largest company in the world.

Shareholders’ view of diversity – that everyone matters (irrespective of colour, race, sex, creed or religion) – recognizes the Company’s commitment to diversity and the uniqueness of experience, strength, culture, thought and commitment contributed by each employee; however, it does not ignore the Company’s senior management and board of directors diminutive level of diversity and its painstakingly slow implementation.

Overall, by its own public disclosure, the number of minorities holding senior management-level positions or board of directorship within the Company does not reflect the Company’s demographic data. According to the Company’s website, “Diversity is critical to innovation and it is essential to Apple’s future. …We also aspire to make a difference beyond Apple.” 1 Further, in January 10, 2014, the Company stated in its SEC Definitive Proxy Statement that it is “committed to actively seeking out highly qualified women and individuals from minority groups to include in the pool from which board nominees are chosen.” 2

Shareholders opined that companies with holistic comprehensive diversity policies and programs, and strong leadership commitment to implementation, enhance their long-term value; reducing the Company’s potential legal and reputational risks associated with workplace discrimination and build reputations as a fair employer. Equally, shareholders opined that the varied perspectives of a diverse senior management and board of directors would provide a competitive advantage in terms of creativity, innovation, productivity and morale, while eliminating the limitations of “groupthink”, as it would recognize the uniqueness of experience, strength, culture and thought contributed by each; strengthening its reputation and accountability to shareholders.

Therefore, shareholders ask the Company to assist investors in evaluating the company’s effectiveness in meeting its commitment to equal opportunity and diversity in senior management and board of directors, in any meaningful way that would not cause the company to breach the assurances of confidentiality and privacy that it has made to its employees.

We urge shareholders to vote FOR the proposal.

In the Proxy Statement, the Board urges shareholders to reject this proposal.

This proposal would require the Board to adopt an accelerated recruitment policy for increasing diversity


among senior management and the Board. We believe that the proposal is unduly burdensome and not

necessary because Apple has demonstrated to shareholders its commitment to inclusion and diversity,

which are core values for our company.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/01/15/technology/apple-diversity/


Not sure how I'm going to vote yet, but leaning against it.
 

KdParker

macrumors 601
Oct 1, 2010
4,793
998
Everywhere
Are you a journalist twisting things to make somebody look bad?

How about this journalistic marvel:

Why does Apple glorify a womanizer who plagiarized a lot of his doctoral dissertation and was under FBI surveillance (I'll leave it a that)

Apple is not aligning themselves.
They are simply honoring MLK on his day and using a very powerful quote!

That is at least the way I look at it.
Not sure where you are going with this?
 

npmacuser5

macrumors 68000
Apr 10, 2015
1,758
1,966
Yes, I can't believe in 2016 this is still an issue which requires MR to "protect" us.

FREE speech at it's finest!
Free speech is one part, social media, is another. People will write on social media what they would never speak in a conservation. Better to error on the side of caution. Good to honor those who have made significant contributions to our country, thank you.
 
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WarHeadz

macrumors 6502a
Aug 30, 2015
904
5,192
Long Beach, California
Free speech is one part, social media, is another. People will write on social media what they would never speak in a conservation. Better to error on the side of caution. Good to honor those who have made significant contributions to our country, thank you.
We shouldn't honor MLK. He wasn't politically correct enough and he didn't go out of his way to say nice things about white people and blames us for historical institutionalized racism in this country. He hurt my lily white feelings. :(

Those blacks though, they all need to get off their lazy asses and get to work and off the welfare! I'm not racist or anything, I have lots of black friends, I'm just not PC and I call it for what it is!

:rolleyes:
 

NachoGrande

macrumors 6502a
Mar 30, 2010
986
1,714
When is Abe Lincoln day? I guess you figure a national holiday devoted to MLK is also pandering. :rolleyes:

I'm absolutely amazed at how someone can twist the honoring of an American hero on the day of a national holiday devoted to him into "pandering".

Guess it's only pandering when it doesn't suit your agenda.
Nope but thanks for implying that. As I said he was a great man, but why only him?
When is Abe Lincoln day? I guess you figure a national holiday devoted to MLK is also pandering. :rolleyes:

I'm absolutely amazed at how someone can twist the honoring of an American hero on the day of a national holiday devoted to him into "pandering".

Guess it's only pandering when it doesn't suit your agenda.
I'm absolutely amazed at how someone could twist my post so badly to fit their agenda. You must have missed the part where u said he was a great man. Never once did I even imply differently. Abe Lincoln day used to be fen 12th. He kinda had a major role in ending slavery. Just saying.
 

WarHeadz

macrumors 6502a
Aug 30, 2015
904
5,192
Long Beach, California
I'm absolutely amazed at how someone could twist my post so badly to fit their agenda. You must have missed the part where u said he was a great man. Never once did I even imply differently. Abe Lincoln day used to be fen 12th. He kinda had a major role in ending slavery. Just saying.

You implied we shouldn't celebrate MLK on his national day of remembrance because Abe Lincoln begrudgingly freed the slaves...on some other day. But hey, as long as you threw in the obligatory compliment for MLK in the process, all is good! Yay for political correctness!
 
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npmacuser5

macrumors 68000
Apr 10, 2015
1,758
1,966
We shouldn't honor MLK. He wasn't politically correct enough and he didn't go out of his way to say nice things about white people and blames us for historical institutionalized racism in this country. He hurt my lily white feelings. :(

Those blacks though, they all need to get off their lazy asses and get to work and off the welfare! I'm not racist or anything, I have lots of black friends, I'm just not PC and I call it for what it is!

:rolleyes:
Could not have made my point any better then you just did. MR did the correct thing moving to this forum. Thank you.
 
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imageWIS

macrumors 65816
Mar 17, 2009
1,281
822
NYC
I hope the irony isn't lost on anyone that the first thing Steve did when he came back to Apple is completely dissolve ALL philanthropic endeavors. So much for 'doing for others'....
 
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szw-mapple fan

macrumors 68040
Jul 28, 2012
3,481
4,342
I don't have the knowledge and the resources to go around finding tax loopholes to avoid taxes. I go pay my taxes just like everyone. It is shame that these corporates do everything they can to avoid taxes while middle class pay their fairshare.

The point being, if you had a way of paying less taxes, you would also be doing it. The Irish government simply has the lowest rates right now. For example, if the government doesn't tax savings in bank A but heavily taxes income in bank B, and if you saved all you money in bank A, is that "avoiding taxes?" This "fair" share you are talking about – how do you define "fair?" Is giving up more money than you have to "fair?" Do you wake up one day and have a sudden urge to pay more taxes? Apple pays all the taxes it owns from domestic sales and is simply keeping the overseas income stored in other countries. If you want your "fair" share of that money, you need to create a "fair" tax policy, in this case, one than is competitive to Ireland's. While I do agree that Apple has more money than it needs, I think no person or corporation should give up any more assets than it absolutely has to.
 
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NachoGrande

macrumors 6502a
Mar 30, 2010
986
1,714
You implied we shouldn't celebrate MLK on his national day of remembrance because Abe Lincoln begrudgingly freed the slaves...on some other day. But hey, as long as you threw in the obligatory compliment for MLK in the process, all is good! Yay for political correctness!
Show me once where I said that. Not even close. You should get a comprehension tutor. The point was how many others has apple memorialized. If you don't think everything is scrutinized in a company this large you're crazy.

Yeah Lincoln begrudgingly freed the slaves. He lived in the north slavery for the most part was illegal. O and he died for it.
 

Thunderhawks

Suspended
Feb 17, 2009
4,057
2,118
Not sure where you are going with this?

Just answering to the criticism of Apple for honoring the man and bringing up other unrelated things.
(I think we can all agree that Apple are not choir boys)

Everything can be taken out of context, and thats what some posters here do, regardless of facts.

This line in a post a few paragraphs up sums up how I feel about Apple honoring MLK:

How simple is it to accept that apple is honoring a man who died for a cause that was everyone being treated equally?

PS: True to form in USA there are also plenty of dumb businesses advertising MLK sales , some top even my wildest expectations offering 20% etc. off everything black. LOL.
 
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thermodynamic

Suspended
May 3, 2009
1,341
1,192
USA
Apple should be doing more of these.

And for figures in, say, China, where that country uses child labor, slave labor, anti-suicide nets around worker domiciles, et cetera... thankfully some of those factories are going to be using robots so the workers will find other ways to prosper instead of jumping off of buildings.
 
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SqB

macrumors 6502a
Jan 14, 2008
543
499
Northern Colorado
And for figures in, say, China, where that country uses child labor, slave labor, anti-suicide nets around worker domiciles, et cetera... thankfully some of those factories are going to be using robots so the workers will find other ways to prosper instead of jumping off of buildings.

Yes, and how about it being one of very few companies that has actually gone to China to see the places where it's products are produced and demanding that the employers improve worker conditions and pay higher wages.

But by all means, if you think the best thing for our economy and all involved is to bring all manufacturing back to the US, like so many other misinformed individuals, you should work hard to make that happen. I'd recommend starting by logging off of this website and going out to get some poster-board and markers.
 

thermodynamic

Suspended
May 3, 2009
1,341
1,192
USA
So you mean as long as Apple does not align itself with good people, it is OK for them to be like Pfizer, Amazon, Google and pay as little tax as possible?

And the best philanthropy is done by doing it quietly, in my opinion.

For thousands of years, that was the preferred course of action. Even Religious texts agree and having re-read a few passages lately, some parallels are somewhat distressing but before I talk about something different, back to the original point: Nowadays it's one big ego sell, "Look at ME, I am donating (0.0001 of my net worth just like how each of you can donate a nickel while you criticize others who don't give as much as I do. Give ME praise!)"

Show me once where I said that. Not even close. You should get a comprehension tutor. The point was how many others has apple memorialized. If you don't think everything is scrutinized in a company this large you're crazy.

Yeah Lincoln begrudgingly freed the slaves. He lived in the north slavery for the most part was illegal. O and he died for it.

Yes, lots of people memorialize words. Nice thing to do. :)

Yes, it has been claimed Lincoln did his actions as acquiescing rather than having an actual value. People also claim he's gay and lots of other things, with the weakest of circumstantial evidence. Some even make internet memes using words he never said.

I think you also have a typo in your post, somewhere. I comprehend which word it refers to, though. "O" isn't a word, or rather it's not 1800 anymore, but the way English as a language has been devolving over the last forty or so years, often for shallow and hip marketing trendiness...

Just answering to the criticism of Apple for honoring the man and bringing up other unrelated things.
(I think we can all agree that Apple are not choir boys)

Everything can be taken out of context, and thats what some posters here do, regardless of facts.

This line in a post a few paragraphs up sums up how I feel about Apple honoring MLK:

How simple is it to accept that apple is honoring a man who died for a cause that was everyone being treated equally?

Words vs actions. Apple profits a lot from conditions that I sincerely doubt MLK Jr would stand for, or his family if they knew about what has been reported. It's tangential, but hardly out of context that lots of people see such a connection, so there's probably maybe even a little validity do it?

Are you saying all workers should be slaves, serfs, disposable commodities and so on, with your boldfaced last line?

I'm no choir boy for any single entity, though I agree, or at least admit, it'd be nice to be one.
 

Thunderhawks

Suspended
Feb 17, 2009
4,057
2,118
The point being, if you had a way of paying less taxes, you would also be doing it. The Irish government simply has the lowest rates right now. For example, if the government doesn't tax savings in bank A but heavily taxes income in bank B, and if you saved all you money in bank A, is that "avoiding taxes?" This "fair" share you are talking about – how do you define "fair?" Is giving up more money than you have to "fair?" Do you wake up one day and have a sudden urge to pay more taxes? Apple pays all the taxes it owns from domestic sales and is simply keeping the overseas income stored in other countries. If you want your "fair" share of that money, you need to create a "fair" tax policy, in this case, one than is competitive to Ireland's. While I do agree that Apple has more money than it needs, I think no person or corporation should give up any more assets than it absolutely has to.

You are preaching to people who do not want to understand how business works.
They pick to attack Apple, because they are popular and have lots of $$$.
How they got the $$$ is a combination of excellent products and smart accounting.

That smart accounting doesn't sit well with everybody, except NOBODY wants to pay more taxes than they have to. Quickly forgotten when it isn't their own money.
 
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