Apple Inks Deal With Volkswagen for Self-Driving Employee Shuttles

[69Mustang]

This in turn could reduce repair costs and city budgets for street repairs and improvements, such as expanding the number of lanes because of traffic volume.

I don't necessarily disagree with your assessment, but it does put the cart before the horse. Massive infrastructure improvements are going to be needed before widespread adoption becomes a reality. Our roads and bridges (US) are in dire need of improvements and it's going to cost a tremendous amount of money to fix. Infrastructure projects aren't sexy so they are usually ignored. That can gets kicked down road hoping someone else will deal with it.

 

[kanki1985]

Not the only company this can be said about, but Apple has lost its focus. This self-driving car baloney is evidence of that. Let the automobile manufacturers worry about vehicles, and let the computer companies focus on computers. Apple is stretching itself way too thin, with hands in multiple cookie jars: automobiles, media production, smart devices... oh, and maybe a couple of computers, if they have the time. It's greed and hubris, plain and simple; Apple's eyes are too big for its stomach.

Not to mention, no one has made a valid argument for what's so great about self-driving cars anyhow. For all the complaining people do about the dangers of humans behind the wheel, I don't see how computers are an improvement. The human brain is still light-years ahead of the most advanced electronic circuits in its ability to comprehend, adjust and integrate the multitude of information received when driving a vehicle (or performing any other complex task). For all its potential shortcomings, I'd trust my life to human judgement than a machine algorithm any day.

If all cars go self driving, I am sure it would be way better and less chaotic than the current scenario. I agree there has to be a ton of work to be done in this regards, but, I would be more comfortable in that than all idiot human drivers.

 

[falainber]

More vertical integration is great! What's next? Apple's own chicken farms to supply their cafeterias?

 

[Tech198]

Naturally, since Apple is building the self driving cars.

If they used regular cars to transport employees round the campus, it would stand out like a sore thumb..

There link would be broken in the chain.

I know Apple likes SUV's, but doing this on different cars models would be good too.

 

[cote32mt]

Until someone figures out how to do human intelligence properly, autonomous vehicles will only really be a type of "Intelligent cruise control" which is nowhere near "self-driving".

They have to be an order of magnitude BETTER than human drivers before the application becomes worthwhile. Otherwise it is a pointless exercise.

Your order of magnitude point may well be true. It seems to be the tipping point for other disruptions. The big question is: how long might it take to get there? Perhaps less than many think.

 

[trusso]

It could allow people who are unable to drive, for whatever reason, a way to stay in their homes instead of having to sell. Think of someone who has to move into an assisted living facility because they can't get to a doctors office. This usually destroys whatever savings that person had for retirement.

That sounds great, but if someone unable to drive (i.e., handicapped or elderly) cannot afford to hire someone to drive them, how would they afford an entire driverless car (or, for the sake of argument, even a modification to their current car)? We'd like to suppose that a family member or friend would be around to help, but it seems we're all functioning on the assumption that Grandma's been deserted by her children. See, the problem starts to become about deeper social issues than any particular technology can solve. The engineer who designs such products with the hope of solving these issues has a terribly simplified view of the world in his head.

I agree there has to be a ton of work to be done in this regards, but, I would be more comfortable in that than all idiot human drivers.

So we can't trust humans to drive, but we can trust humans to design algorithms by which computers drive? By your logic, I am better off trusting my life to a few hundred engineers whom I've never met (and who will most likely never face direct responsibility for potential failures of their design) than I am trusting the men and women driving next to me, who have as equal and vested an interest in our mutual safety as I do.

Look, I understand the ideals, and the purported benefits to society are noble goals. Unfortunately, new technology always creates as many problems as it attempts to solve, if not more. Moreover, whether our goals are good or bad, the unerring faith which many of us increasingly put on the shoulders of science and engineering is, in my opinion, very much misplaced.

 

[cycomiko]

All fans kept telling me Apple is the BMW of the tech world, and yet here they go with the peoples wagon.

 

[RogerWilco]

More vertical integration is great! What's next? Apple's own chicken farms to supply their cafeterias?

Henry Ford served sandwiches in his Detroit factory dining hall. As an experiment he ordered some made with grass clippings from the lawns that surrounded the office buildings. The workers ate them.

 

[macaddiict]

Henry Ford served sandwiches in his Detroit factory dining hall. As an experiment he ordered some made with grass clippings from the lawns that surrounded the office buildings. The workers ate them.

Did you forget the sarcasm tag on this one?

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Cool that Apple is using VW T6 vans. I wonder if they'll get the California model? It was always funny to me that the one place you couldn't buy a VW California van was ... California .
[doublepost=1527123136][/doublepost]

Interesting- was not aware the T6 was approved for USDM use...

Agreed. I wonder if they're only using them on non-public roads?

 

[acorntoy]

6 months in they’ll find a human driver tucked in a secret compartment.

 

[Tech198]

If all cars go self driving, I am sure it would be way better and less chaotic than the current scenario. I agree there has to be a ton of work to be done in this regards, but, I would be more comfortable in that than all idiot human drivers.

If self driving cars still have issues to work out where otherwise it would take humans to just know to avoid like puddles, and pot-holes, or even buses and merging lanes, how is that better?

Humans can react to these thing better. I see no time when self driving cars will surpass human thinking. This is why you still nee someone willing to manually take over what a self driving car *can't* do. rather then self driving.. Its just assisting most of the time..

"Assisting" is ok, providing there are no bugs. If there was self driving cars that adaptive, and leant their surrounding/corrections in real time, vs just pure "must push an update out" kind of like self-healing, then that would be something..

...and who knows. That even may be the NEXT big thing..

 

[hortod1]

Passenger: Hey Siri, take me to Hooker, California.

Siri: Prostitution is illegal in California so I will not take you to a hooker. I have locked you inside and have phoned the police. Please wait.

 

[FelixDerKater]

How is their reliability?

 

[Bone Ranger]

Haven't heard anything from Bob Mansfield in years. Isn't he in charge of this project?

 

[DeepIn2U]

They can’t even make my iPhone bug free. As if I’m ever going to trust their driverless car software.
(That goes for all tech companies and all driverless cars as well).

But you’d use their Maps while driving right? I wouldn’t say anything negative as it’s in a non-fast paced traffic area. Take note that while Uber had the lead in approvals and technology for driverless cars at least by 12 months they’ve been rejected while Apple has improved and increased their testing fleet numbers.

Ive been a VW driver since 1998. They took some well deserved heat from the diesel scandal as they should. But for the money I won't drive anything else.

And their cars get better and better.

Especially the Golf and Jetta lineup for parts stability and multiple zone impact safety. I’m on the look next year for Golf R!

Kinda strange they went with VW if their initial choices were Mercedes and BMW. You'd think they'd try with Audi, Lexus, Acura, or some other luxury brand. I've always seen VW cars as kinda vanilla. Not bad cars, but they don't really include the design/tech that you'd expect out of Apple.

Audi has two production vehicles on the roads for just as long as Tesla. In fact they’ve been the first to demonstrate full autonomy from parking to highway speeds changing lnes etc. Core telemetry for car components is still QNX yet the middle are and higher end tech up to the UI is something I’m not aware of. Acura I think has a partnership elsewhere but they’ve been shelved until major improvements due to Uber’s screw ups and some investors are thinking of backing Uber for flight transportation drones?! Did not these older execs recall NYC with Helicopters (featured accident that had many deaths featured a modified scene in 1979/80 Superman)??!!

 

[Wanted797]

Not the only company this can be said about, but Apple has lost its focus. This self-driving car baloney is evidence of that. Let the automobile manufacturers worry about vehicles, and let the computer companies focus on computers. Apple is stretching itself way too thin, with hands in multiple cookie jars: automobiles, media production, smart devices... oh, and maybe a couple of computers, if they have the time. It's greed and hubris, plain and simple; Apple's eyes are too big for its stomach.

Not to mention, no one has made a valid argument for what's so great about self-driving cars anyhow. For all the complaining people do about the dangers of humans behind the wheel, I don't see how computers are an improvement. The human brain is still light-years ahead of the most advanced electronic circuits in its ability to comprehend, adjust and integrate the multitude of information received when driving a vehicle (or performing any other complex task). For all its potential shortcomings, I'd trust my life to human judgement than a machine algorithm any day.

Apple has adapted in whatever way they wanted. It doesn’t matter what they do but why they do it and their philosophy. They started with computers, then music and MP3 players, then online music then phones. Why not cars?

Apple isn’t a “computer” company, they’re a “we wanna change the world company” they don’t have a set area. They’re looking at what could be the next big thing. Driverless cars have a high likelihood of that. In the future they’ll likely see human driving as a uneesssary risk.

 

[Scooz]

FAIL, like in Falo Alto?

I now can‘t even read anything else than an F if I look at this word. That letter‘s closing section just vanishes.

Who comes up with such acronyms that will haunt you once something goes bad in that project of yours in a sector destined to have things go bad at first?

 

[dotnet]

Did they have to go to jail during visiting hours to obtain the VW signatures, or are some VW executives with signing authority still at large?

 

[EdT]

I don't necessarily disagree with your assessment, but it does put the cart before the horse. Massive infrastructure improvements are going to be needed before widespread adoption becomes a reality. Our roads and bridges (US) are in dire need of improvements and it's going to cost a tremendous amount of money to fix. Infrastructure projects aren't sexy so they are usually ignored. That can gets kicked down road hoping someone else will deal with it.

Yes they are. In winter states I think additional sensors or markers will need to be added so the edges and center of a road can be detected even when it’s buried under snow, and that’s in addition to the cost of repairs that haven’t been done over the last 30 years.

 

[trusso]

Apple isn’t a “computer” company, they’re a “we wanna change the world company” they don’t have a set area. They’re looking at what could be the next big thing. Driverless cars have a high likelihood of that. In the future they’ll likely see human driving as a unnecessary risk.

I agree that Apple is a "we want to change the world" company, and unfortunately, therein lies the problem. They've lost a lot of their focus. Even if Apple were able to afford enough engineers to adequately work on all the projects under their belt, and give them the time to do so, the executive-level management of so many disparate projects would be almost unsustainable.

To put it a simpler way, would you like Ford or Toyota to design and manufacture your personal computer? I wouldn't, because it's not their forte.

If you wanted to get scientific about it, you'd find that in the biological world, evolution via natural selection generally favors mutations which allow the organism to adapt to its specific environment. Very few species can survive outside the narrow region they were designed for; even we humans are limited to a thin couple of miles within the biosphere, under a small range of suitable temperatures.

In other words, Apple can take on as much as they want, of course. Whether or not they can or should succeed in all these disparate endeavors, however, is a question that neither you nor I can answer.

 

[xero9]

Ive been a VW driver since 1998. They took some well deserved heat from the diesel scandal as they should. But for the money I won't drive anything else.

And their cars get better and better.

Personally not a VW fan. I've always questioned their reliability, but one thing I really can't stand about them is something as simple as a diagram for the fuse box. I had one as a rental and apparently it's common, but the location of the accessory port was prone to coins falling in and shorting it out. Not only does it not include a pair of tweezers to pull the fuses out with, they don't even provide any spare fuses (which most manufacturers do..). FINE, it's a rental, I'll borrow a fuse from something else.. But wait, there's no way to know what any of them are for because VW doesn't list it on the panel cover or owners manual. Couldn't even find it using Google. I resorted to randomly pulling out fuses looking for a blown one.

POS IMO.

 

[A MacBook lover]

They can’t even make my iPhone bug free. As if I’m ever going to trust their driverless car software.
(That goes for all tech companies and all driverless cars as well).

Well yes, of course. Tesla and other manufacturers really are only for adaptive cruise control and auto steer. It’s not meant to perform avasive maneuvers in sudden situations and requires someone to pay attention.

That being said, love the autopilot in the S - never has a single issue with it. All I need do is supervise.

 

[macduke]

For a while I was all-in on driverless cars but I think it’s a lot further off now than I originally thought. Considering how crappy their Siri AI is I can’t imagine them developing any sort of safe system that I would trust to haul my wife and kids from point A to point B. It’s just not worth the risk. Besides that, it’s going to be insanely expensive and sometimes I actually enjoy going for a drive. I get that eventually the roads will be safer without people behind the wheel but I don’t think Apple is going to be the one to push that change forward. They just aren’t good enough. It’s unfortunate but the sooner they realize that the sooner they can either focus on something else, buy something better, or start fixing it in some way. Apple doesn’t know how to do AI well.

 

[Aston441]

Personally not a VW fan. I've always questioned their reliability, but one thing I really can't stand about them is something as simple as a diagram for the fuse box. I had one as a rental and apparently it's common, but the location of the accessory port was prone to coins falling in and shorting it out. Not only does it not include a pair of tweezers to pull the fuses out with, they don't even provide any spare fuses (which most manufacturers do..). FINE, it's a rental, I'll borrow a fuse from something else.. But wait, there's no way to know what any of them are for because VW doesn't list it on the panel cover or owners manual. Couldn't even find it using Google. I resorted to randomly pulling out fuses looking for a blown one.

POS IMO.

I'll give you that. The lack of fuse info in VWs baffles me.

 

[drumcat]

Poor choice of acronyms.... #PAIL